Steve, how much difference do you think the handle material makes?  I ended up with 7" long handles that I got at Home Depot. They are not solid metal, but made out of some type of composite material that can be broken if hit very hard. There were a few in the stack for sale that were already broken in half.

Geno, we will wait for your report to see if you notice the difference.

Steve

I thank you, Steve for the answer on the shape of the base. The nuances of this speaker fascinate me. Little things I would not have suspected make such an important difference to the sound.  As you said: signatures of the Gods.

Brian

I agree, the nuances are fascinating.  The shape, the density of the wood, the types of wood, all behaving like a musical instrument not a speaker box.  The baffle is extending the wavefront of the speaker cone to match the exact size and shape of the baffle, just the way a musical instrument does, like a Piano, or violin.

I find similar nuances when woods are used as tone woods for stringed instruments, both acoustic and electric, . It can take time to differentiate, but there.

I was running the more aggressive bias setting and a more aggressive input tube with the big Betsy’s.  Both amplified the pop of the F15 driver.  For the last 5 days I have been listening the the crystal 10s and went to the lower bias setting and a less aggressive input tube.

With some hours on the crystal 10s and the less aggressive setup I am starting to hear the magic of the crystal 10s.  I will likely keep both speakers because of what they each do.   But the simplicity and the musicality engagement of the F15 driver plus the cost make it the easy favorite...for now.

And of course you know where this leads...

https://youtu.be/mrB8IthgoRQ

Here is a comparison of three of the worlds best grand pianos, A Steinway, A Fazioli and a Bosendorfer.  I know the speakers are at a point where they are more than worthy of rendering the comparison being driven by the 25th Anniversary Zen Triode... so let's just see which one sounds best shall we?

What I am hearing is the Steinway is beautifully disciplined and soft, almost boaring.  Its midrange and top end sound too much like the pianos I played when I was young. I now realize had I got to play a Bosendorfer I would still be playing it 50 years later, today.

The Fazioli has a wonderful lower mid bass that I really like, but otherwise the entire mid band and top end shorts me out.  

The Bosendorfer is the best sounding piano I've ever heard. It has glorious texture, tone, timber with the most spiritual top end I've ever heard, and if I could have one I would probably trade my stereo for it, and start making music instead of listening to it. So it would be in all of your best interest to keep such a compelling distraction away from me, because I would literarily just set at it and compose music until I die.

These three pianos have completed different sounds, so what would be your favorite?  I can tell you that these medium and large baffles make a grand piano feel completely real.  No other speaker quite does this so well.

Happy listening.

Steve

P.S.  Despite the choice and reasoning of the guy who played the pianos, going only on the sound, I stand firmly by my opinion.  Also, to hear what two of these pianos sound like in a large space, played by someone else, to gain a wider perspective, here is another comparison video: https://youtu.be/T2GYYV8JSqM. Again, the sound of it just melts me.  The other two pianos are nice, but not in the same league.  It really is fascinating how something like this could create such a strong opinion.  Hehe, I know sound is subjective, but to me the difference is pretty massive while others will choose what I hate.

It's true about the age of the pianos. My favorite piano I've played in person is a very old Steinway that an in-law had. I do like Bosendorfers but haven't played one in person, though I've heard them in person. I have a cycle of Beethoven piano sonatas on SACD performed on a Bosendorfer recorded very well that I really enjoy (even though they were composed on an earlier form of piano, and especially not with the extra octave the Bosendorfer has on the keyboard).

I would believe it. When my first wife's aunt passed we were offered another Steinway in that family, a player piano from the 'twenties, that was in her home in Chicago since she was a kid. I wanted it so bad, but had to agree with my wife there was nowhere we could put it in our small home in Austin. I bet that was a fantastic instrument as both a player piano and to play personally.

As you can see I'm getting really close now! The web page is 90% done for the model ZF15L (large) and I am pleased to say that we will be offering them in your choice of 16 different 2 inch thick solid hardwoods! The type of wood is what determines the price. On the low end with shipping they will land right at $4000 for the pair! On the high end with shipping they will land right around $6000 for the pair, such as the model shown above.

I hope to have this model online for orders next week sometime!!!  

The ZF15M (medium) will be exactly the same price, but will be able to ship for less. So far as I can tell the basic performance of the two sizes is nearly identical, so just go with what fits your room best.

Steve

Had I not built a pair of these I'd be astounded at the price.  But they are deceptively complex to build and given the price and quantity of wood needed, c'est la vie!  Every time I see these beauties I'm tempted to order up some 8/4 hickory and build a better looking set than my Darth Vader pair.  

Beautiful. Those things are GIANTS. I couldn't get them to work in any of the rooms I have. But they look wonderful and I'm sure sound even better than they look.

For me, this may be the most beautifully toned piano I have heard that reviewer play.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KFSX79E6pd0
1907 Schiedmayer Grand Piano

Add this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9L6VUV9dW8
Wilhelm Schimmel  Baby Grand  wonderful rich tone

Brian

I have more time on the ZF15M baffles that I made from Birch Plywood.  The reason for making these was to make sure this smaller size as well as a DIY version of this is actually going to be sonically viable.  Now that the speakers are past the initial break-in I can safely say they sound great, and so I'll be making a pair from solid hardwood next to be photographed for the web site.



That means this pair will be for sale in about a month to anyone wanting to audition them in person and take them home with them.

Steve

-SOLD-

These look great Steve.  The smaller size should surely expand the market.

I also appreciate you sharing your findings on material, bracing, footer, etc.  I believe these concepts carry over to other designs.  I have two other pairs of open baffles and I will likely bring some of this technology over to them.  Just yesterday I was looking at the bottom of one pair and thought to myself I am giving up bass response by not having it properly weighted/braced.

No brainer alert!  If you have a two watt zen and want to hear fully what it is capable of, buy (or build) these.

Buy the 25th!

In the words of Ferris Bueller  "It is so choice. If you have the means, I highly recommend picking one up."

I’ll have to strongly look into that as an option for my household, bunch of enablers you fellas seem to be (lol!).

Quote:


No, an enabler would be telling you that you need a pair of them to run as monoblocks at 6W!  

Steve, Archie and Pal,

I got the cast iron handles today, put them on, and am very pleasantly surprised with the results. So much so, that I’ve been listening to music for 3 hours straight. I keep listening to music I know well to listen for the improvement. That fact that I can compare before and after the handles has been a revelation. Hard to believe that they could make this much difference. I guess that ‘More Focused’ would be the best description. I’m trying to understand the science of it. Explanations?

I think so. He and Steve both come from a galaxy far away😎

I don't hear the stark difference with the handle that you guys are hearing.  Not sure if it's the baffle material or the brass weights I placed on the back of my baffles.  Or just me.

I was watching a video review of the Tannoy Autograph mini from Upscale Audio.... and they talked about the construction of the speaker.  In those speakers they use a combination walnut over birch.  The density of the wood absolutely plays a critical role in the speakers tone.  Hers the link of the review...

https://youtu.be/JR7pGgbKjag

Fast forward to like 4:54 where he talks about the construction.  

While expensive...I really love the look of those monitors.  Unfortunately they are only 85 dB and with me looking to buy the 25th Zen amp, they probably wouldn’t cut it...unless they were strapped into mono.    

Tonight I have started glueing up a solid cherry pair of ZF15M baffles to replace the plywood ones!

Steve

Interesting Steve.  Somewhat counter intuitive but I get what you are saying.  I wish we could have had two or three of these baffles at the fest and the time to listen to all of them.

Hello Vooraphile

On Randy's page http://www.caintuckaudio.com/
He says:  "The standard dimensions of the speakers are 22 1/2" high and 18" wide - the base is rear mounted and 12" deep."

This is for an 8 inch speaker.

Randy could probably answer questions on his forum page https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?board=randy

Brian