Quote:


That's a good question. Two thoughts come to mind. Not sure there would be room for all the additional caps even it is was possible, and not sure if the original 6V6 bias point would pull to much current or not. Many of the alternate tubs that can be used with the amp would likely no longer be usable.  

Nevertheless it is something that will need to be explored in the coming months.

Steve

Steve,

plans for going under the hood of Rachael with the 25th mods?

.....NOS tube rolling never gets old....to hear my favorite Input Tubes, using both halves of the triode driving a EL34, KT88 in your Triode or 6L6G/6PS3-E's.....in Triode is an exciting thought.

.....and the obvious parallel's of running for example/from my matched quads....KT88's & 6PS3-E's in both my ZMA and Rach'. 5.8/channel headroom too (for my Speaker's).

Listening to a 1991 tape from the tale end of analog radio.  NSC 101, 1991, Week 17

Rodney Crowell - Things I wish I'd Said  

Simply stunning as is pretty much the entire tape. I can't believe how many of these I sold thinking they weren't very good. Mistake.

What a game changer!

This amplifier is magic.

I can. I'm actually really enjoying lower power again. I'm going to get one of these new amps one of these days.

You know I'm kidding!

Thanks Steve, for putting the EL34 VR in perspective and how the new Amps run.

Lon, as we discussed, I think either/or, will power your HR-1's @ their 92.5 @ 1watt/1 meter.

Me personally, I want UFO3/25 Mono's.  I read you Palomino, what can I sell..... . Not my ZMA.....just want Steve's Pentode's in triode again.....and of course his new cap topology going on here. Never should have sold my SE84CS!

Will the 25 anniversary amp have an XLR input option?

I'm excited to keep up with the 25th Anniversary will it be the same foot print as my UFO select and will there be a mod for it?    I also like the idea of a more affordable amp for entry level  
the Kids need a new toy too!

Steve,

I assume you only have one 25th Anniversary Zen built.  I'm curious as to the sound of this amp bridged.  I have to believe others are equally curious.  

Do you foresee an opportunity to have a pair of these on hand to bridge and evaluate the sound product?

The big question for many will be ... anniversary upgraded Zen monoblocks? Or a bridged pair of 25th Anniversary amps for the extra output?  This is assuming high efficiency speakers as a constant.  

With my 97dB Omegas, I can do either.  But if the sound is comparable, I will bridge the stereo amps for the extra output and headroom.  

Well, I was curious about a bridged pair too, but decided that the Monoblocks would suit my needs and ordered a pair today. What the heck. I was obsessing over the choices and decided to go with the SE84UFO3 . . . I'm hoping that a treble cut circuit can be added and I want Type II Jupiter caps.

Yeah Jeff, you know that I won't be quiet about it when it arrives months from now. I think they will work well with the HR-1s. . . they're not that much lower powered than my Taboo Mk IV which works very very well for music with headroom with the HR-1s.

And in the meantime maybe I'll sell a few amps and preamps . . . hope so.

".......bridged stereo amps will set me back quite a bit more than the monoblocks."

Jeff, ...but as you said above...if this is going to be your end all. Why not?


To steep for me.....however, the Juicy Mono's....and I deleted a post earlier....I am considering the entry level one too. Knowing, it would  drive me crazy....wanting to hear the Mono's....I might buy both and after 6 months to a year....I:

1) can't part with either
2) sell one or the other.

NOTE: ZMA not for sale....I would bury it some where out along the interstate in its Pelican Case/well wrapped further an preserved.......before I would part with it.      

Like you said, no hurry and not in the cards for me in 2018.....alas till 2019....when I settle in to TX and my dedicated Electric Line too. Yeah, I will goofy ground it outside also...drinkin' the Kool-aid!  

Anyway, ....look forward to more from Steve in due time...about your bridging the Stereo Pair/question....more comparisons of the Mono's and the Stereo unit/single......and of course the Entry Level killer diller.

I'm looking forward to impressions on the new 25th Anniversary Amps but even more, I'll be watching for some UFO Monos on the used market...

I always buy new to support Decware....then have sold.

Mark? You can buy my Mono's!  

UFO325 purchased new by me, Jan/Feb/2019......you never know....late 2019 will come soon enough.... .

Yes, look forward to further words from Steve through this summer and reading others whom have purchased.  .......Lurkinnnnng........ .

Good to read Mark. ....and you paid a fair price for the Tubes....or I would not have sold them to you.

Me too/New:
SE84CS, Torii III, SuperZen CKC, CSP3 with Jupiter Caps, Decware PAC-S(ilver) & Zen Styx.
.....and of course New, ZMA & Decware ZDSD DAC / Recorder.

+, had in for audition EL34 Mono-blocks, ZR2 & one of Steve's earliest Buffers (and took the re-stock fee/shipping to and from hits). Also, purchased an nice wood case piece from Ziggi, for my SE84CS.
.....Monoliths....were the only used item, for me.





.......here is my order of Listening (keeping each scenario in one to two weeks at a time):


ZMA direct from ZDSD with Platinum Mullard pair (Cryo'd) 7308/E188CC ....as inputs/ZMA


ZMA direct from ZDSD with Platinum Ediswan pair (Cryo'd) CV2492/6922 ....as inputs/ZMA


Audio Research LS-2B/single Plat' Mullard 7308/E188CC (Cryo'd) to Plat' Tungsram pair PCC88/7DJ8 ...inputs/ZMA.




ZMA, updated with robust Western Electric Bias/Balance Meter's and new Resistor's ~ Feb/17




Listening Room:



Room Treatments from Michael Green & my Home Brew


Sony as Transport (DVP-NS57P)
Illuminati D-60 Digital Coax IC ~.5 meter


Shunyata Research Zitron Alpha Digital Power Cord to ZDSD {Significant}


Decware ZDSD DAC / Recorder
***************************************************************
W/Steve's Output Transformer's/kicking to the Curb quite a few superb DAC'S
***************************************************************
(@ -20 Ref Level, 0.0 Input volume and @ 16/192)


WBT RCA Kimber Select KS1030 ~.5 meter


Audio Research Stereo Line Stage Amplifier w/remote volume & mute LS-2B MkII
NOS Platinum/Mullard 7308/E188CC / Cryogenic


WBT-0102Ag RCA Kimber Select KS1030 ~.75 meter


Decware Zen Mystery Amplifier
~BIASED at *56* mA~
NOS/Platinum/Mullard E188CC/7308's in my A12 an B12 Input positions Cryogenic~NOS/Platinum/Telefunken 6922/E88CC for Inverter Tubes~NOS RCA 0A3's & matched Quad/Tung-Sol KT66's & 6PS3-E's

ZMA adjusted at  60-80% Gain ~ when ARC Line Stage is in, running via Remote Control



***************************************************
Kimber Select KS6063 Speaker Cable 8ft WBT-0681-Ag Spades
***************************************************
Kimber 8TC new/white & clear jacket/to remind me of how fluid/timbre correct and good the KS6063 are
Also Read.....the lowest noise floor you will ever witness....that a $5180 pair of speaker cables should have....and they do.....(I was fortunate to get them for $2680/Demo pair/mint, from the CableCo....worth every penny/extraordinary realism.....)



Acoustic Zen Adagio - Black Pearl (Modified)
.....enjoying from 8 ohm ZMA Taps
...........purchased New/and throttled the Monoliths...and sent them away...


Caintuck Audio Eminence Alpha 15" OB BASS Unit
at 53Hz, with my Velodyne CHT 130 watt plate amp and 0 degree phase.....at 1/6 volume on plate
Plate Amp....regen'd clean ~ plugged into P3
Auralex Subdude (a must)
(NOTE: Only needed when the recording calls for...Open Baffle Bass has been the best integration I have witnessed when needed and called on)







Acoustic Zen Adagio's x-over's Modified/Full Range with Mundorf MCap Supremes-single Cap to each Tweeter/4.5k cross
(Gutted: 3kHz/18dB/Octave, Linkwitz/Riley Crossovers....with all crappy parts = gone)


XLO Pro Power Cord to ZMA
PS Audio P3 Power Plant / Pangea AC-9SE from wall to P3
(Transport, ARC Line Stage and ZDSD, Regenerated/*120*~ Multiwave off...ZMA on High Current Output).


~NOS Platinum Tubes from Upscale Audio/Kevin:

(Great Britain) Mullard 7308/E188CC ~  2 pair (both pair Cryogenic)
(Germany) Telefunken 6922/E88CC ~ 1 pair (painfully expensive/worth it)
(US/Great Britain) Ediswan CV2492/6922 ~ 2 pair (one pair Cryogenic)
(Hungary) Tungsram 6922/E88CC ~ 1 pair
(Hungary) Tungsram PCC88/7DJ8 ~ 1 pair.

From Cryoset:
(Russia) 6N23N/P-EB ~ 2 pair

(Russia) 6N23P's ~ 2 pair/came with ZMA.    

I've been reading various comments about 16 ohm speakers and thought I would mention that when we went to the UFO output transformers, we set them up with a switch to select between LO and HI impedance speakers.  LO = 2~6 ohms  HI = 6~16 ohms.

As for running the SE84UFO25 in mono, I will have a pair of working amps this summer if someone needs to hear them bridged.  

-Steve

Steve, thanks for the great blogging on the 25th anniversary Zens. It's been a fun read and is definitely wetting my appetite. Can you clarify if the 25th anniversary tech will make its way into some of the other models? I thought I read up-thread that it would only work in the little Zens, but then it looked like you mentioned you would experiment with it in the higher-tier models as well.

The reason I ask is, I'm close to pulling the trigger on an a Torii Jr., but wonder if I should wait for an upgraded model to come out, if that would happen in the next year or so. I'll also mention that I definitely plan on getting a 25th anniversary Zen regardless of whether I get the Torri Jr. now or wait for a potential upgraded model to be released.

Input is in the front between bias and 7DJ8? Stepped or smooth volume controls?

Steve, I'm sorry if this has been brought up already, as i've not had time to be on the forums much and only skimmed the last page.

Is it possible for the VR tubes to share the workload? Instead of one VR tube handling that 25ma, can you parallel them to get 50ma for an EL34 setup?

I know that would be a crapload of tubes on the plate, but if it would make this technology stretch into the EL34 range it might be used in the Rachels and maybe the bigger amps?

So, I fired off a message to Mark Markel, owner of Analysis Plus.  After discussing my desire to bridge a pair of stereo amps into mono (25th Anniversary stereo), he came up with a solution I am happy with.  I use their Silver Oval-In interconnect cables throughout my system.  Not wanting to disturb their greatness in any way, he is going to custom build me two Silver Oval-In "Y-cables" to split the R & L interconnects to each pair of stereo input RCAs on the 25th Anniversary amps.  Same material, same construction, just split into two leads at the amp end of the cable.

This I can live with.  Ok, brring 'em on!

Sorry guys, it's way to early in the process to even attempt to accurately answer any of these questions beyond what I've already stated in previous posts.

Steve

THANK YOU STEVE!!.. for staying focused and keeping an eye on the prize - high efficiency speakers with a 2 watt amp.

The hardest thing to do is to maintain objectivity when considering high efficiency/low power.  I couldn’t for the longest time.  Even when my system presented undeniable proof of the possibilities of such a system I had the hardest time accepting what I was hearing.  At times I would walk away... and try to reconcile what I was hearing against my established conclusions, I had lost OBJECTIVITY!

I could’nt take the grills off of my Omega S3HOXRS for that reason.  Now, finally, I can and do without giving it a second thought.  I’ve regained my objectivity.  Which means that I can understand and accept both sides of the matter... High efficiency/low power and low efficiency/high power.

The thing for me is that I have tried both and have had to spend time and effort with both to achieve my goals and I’ve gotten a lot closer to my goals with high efficiency/low power than with the other.  So I’m not pitting one against the other in an effort to prove anything, but very few have taken the time and effort to work with high efficiency/low power and have spent far more time with the other, why?,  Because they came to a conclusion regarding high efficiency/low power and lost objectivity.    

There’s room for both.  There are reasons for both.  It’s great that your spending time to bring the 2 watt ZEN to the next level.

     Greetings All You music lovers this is my first post. I have been lurking in the background since I bought my zen select kit in 2002.
     I am the poor guy that Steve mentions in page 12 of post 580, well I was finally able to pry myself out of this black hole called a listener's seat and I am moved to speak up.
    Well just when you think things can't get any better Steve does it again! This time he hit this one out of the planet!! These amps are simply wonderful. I heartily agree with all his impressions of this amplifier. First thing I have a confession to make I am a polygamist I just cannot seem to be married to one amplifier they all have their different flavors. but these amps may change all that, my other amps in comparison are slow and unfocused although they may give a pleasant illusion. with the 325 Manos and good recording it is spooky real!! You're as close to real as I've ever heard it it's like your ears are hearing exactly what the microphones here you can easily hear if the balance is off either left or right with near field listening. Clarity  Focus  speed  it's all there! Hey they even make digital sound fantastic, and analog especially 50s and 60s tube recordings you know before transistor will take you to a higher level they can sound glorious. I can't imagine anything better!
  Okay you can change the flavor by playing with wires or tubes but right now I have no desire to, I am enjoying Steve recipe. I'd like to also mention like Steve that these amps sound more powerful than what they are in my room 10 and 1/2 by 19 ft set up on the diagonal. I get all the volume I need and M amazed at how they don't seem to clip I think my room overloads before these amp show any sign of distress amazing! And the base I get is all I need it is hard to believe all this is coming out of those tiny output Transformers. Thanks again Steve you are a Master Chef and I know you love your hobby as much as we do and want to share it with us and as a bonus you're able to make a good living doing it.
   Where else can you get this quality.! American-made point-to-point wiring and no circuit boards and a lifetime warranty Steve we all enjoy your Explorations and thinking outside the box going where no one has gone before.
 Well I got to go that black hole is starting to pull on me again.!

Thanks Poor guy!

Hi Steve,
I assume you will let us know when we can order the SE84UFO25. Timing still looks like Summer? What color do you use for backlit meters?

How about this for a new chassis design Steve?  Just having fun and sketched these out.

I got the basic idea from a pair of old Siemens 6S ELA 2427 tube amps which were kind of a narrow shoe box shaped chassis and then removed the tubes from the inside and mounted them on the top of the chassis so everyone can bask in the Decware Zen tube glow.



New interpretation:


I think you could basically use this design for almost all of your amps just needing to adjust them for size.  I can picture a set of 25 Anni mono blocks and a ZP3 all in the same style chassis taking up only one shelf on a hi-fi rack.