Yay! I got shipment notification today.  Estimated arrival by Friday.  Gonna be hard to get out of the house this weekend

Got them in just now.  That is the most serious job of packaging I've ever seen!  

You know I'm gonna throw them bad boys in the HDT's... like tonight!

fun, fun, fun....

I'm gonna break them in and do all auditioning without having my ribbon tweeters hooked up.  I want to become fully accustomed to the sound of the DFR8's before I ever listen with the tweeters. That way I can tell better if the tweeters make the DFR8's sound better, worse, or if they are just not needed at all.

Yeah, Chris, You're prob right.

Btw, many that's quite a speaker collection you have...
The MG944's, Hawthorne SI's, and Ed's Horns.
I know what the Horns sound like, but how do you like the SI's and MG's in comparison?

thx, -Brad-

Hey Brad,
Yes my speaker list is growing.
While the Horns do some amazing things in imaging and midrange they are not my favorites at this point. The MG944's do just about everything right but maybe not as "clinical" as the HDT's. I do want to have HDT's in the house also. The SI co-axials are a very nice sounding speaker but I have yet to get them in baffle so there is not much I can say. Down on the floor though they cast a tall deep image/sound stage, and that makes a strong case for JohninCR's diminutive "Joint Chiefs" project. I do have another pair of prototype speakers that have the 6" Fostex drivers (2 per side) and they also have a wonderful presentation and presence that none of the other speakers have. I like em all. The Horns are for sale though. MG's and SI are keepers.
I still have a long way to go especially with my source..

BTW brad would you be kind enough to PM me (or post) the link to the case you selected for your "Charlize" amp?

Here are some DFR8 pics.
While I had the drivers out I made a small cabinet change to help reduce cabinet resonances. I added a small piece of Deflex panel dampening sheet just behind where the driver sits.  Not sure what   audible effect this really has, but it can't hurt and it only costs ~$15 for both speakers - one 12" deflex sheet cut in half.  The picture was taken before I put the foam back in place - the piece that goes just below the driver. The black gunk left over from the driver sealant/putty-stuff is easily cleaned.  Btw, my drivers didn't come with that driver sealant "rope putty" - luckily I had a couple in my box of audio junk that I never throw away.  The ribbon tweeters sitting on top of the cabinets are not hooked up.

Hi Brad
I did the foam surround mod only on the black FE206EM's about 10 days ago.
Straight back into the box I heard
1. Increased bass punch
2. The little bass bloom at 20hz ( that appears in the article graphs) is gone so that made the sound lean at the bottom. Installing the alternate tuning extension tubes bought the bass back up nicely and made the whole bass presentation much more even.
3. Good recordings are better. Bright and edgy recordings are worse
4. The lower mid-range is glass clear and more detail is apparent.
5. The upper midrange is brighter and vocal sibilance is now more pronounced. Some recordings are now borderline listenable. Getting rid of female vocal sibilance is why I got out of solid state and complex speakers.
6. The brighter sound has helped my vhf tuner which sounded a little laid back before
7. The brighter sound has not helped my njoe tjoeb when a bright cd is playing
8. I believe that the brightness has decreased about 10% since I first installed the polyether surrounds. Perhaps it will continue to improve?
9. I've tried various bits of damping around the phase plug and whizzer but they seem to affect other things so I've ended up taking them out.
10. With good source material the clarity of the new driver is very good. If you only played top notch vinyl then you'd be laughing.
11. Are they better speakers? My only concern with the HDT's has always been their amazing clarity ( It has helped me when modifying the Zen ) and slightly forward upper midrange. This is not unusual in FR drive units. Everything else about the modded drive units is better except the bright upper mid-range, which now appears much brighter.
12. All of this needs to be veiwed in the context that I installed the surrounds myself. Therefore my implemetation may have affected the result.
13. On any given day when you fire up the speakers from cold they change markedly over the first 45 mins.
14. When all is said and done these are High Definition Towers! We got what we asked for, we may not like all of it.
Cheers
Steve

Get your CSP into the chain. I have mine working again, so I am listening to my charlize with tubes now. Inital impressions are a smoother presentation, but all my tube are new, so I will give it a couple of days before I listen critically

Mr C

Thanks for that info Brad. I am going to Modd the thing, I am now developing a plan of upgrade, but I want it to include a better source switch, volume control and better RCA's, or maybe a different type of connection for the IC's. With your cap upgrade did you notice a detail level increase?

Mr C

Thanks Brad. I will start with the caps. I stick to one thing at a time, to better gauge the improvement.

Mr C

Thanks for the heads up Brad. I have your pics saved already, I have been thinking this over for some time.

Mr C

Well, the DFR8's seem to be breaking in nicely already.  Everything is slowly getting smoother and less bright.  Even with using my new chip amp.  I still haven't gotten my TABOO back to try. I'll let y'all know when I do.  Maybe this is helping the breakin though. Sometimes when I go to work I'll leave a CD playing - cranking pretty loud.  I can do this with the chip amp and don't have to worry (it runs on 12 volts) like I do with my tube gear - plus it's more than twice as much watts.

Sure. Btw C, have you ever thought of adding a super-tweeter to your B200's?  I bet the Aurum Cantus G2Si ribbon tweeter I'm using would improve things for you quite a bit.

No.  But you have to cross it high enough to keep it from messing up the main driver.  If not you're liable to get peaks in lower treble and a potentially bright sound.

Besides the obvious benefits to drum cymbols and plucked instruments I noticed a big difference on bowed instruments, particularly cello.

[quote author=RobLikesTubes  link=1146262918/15#26 date=1147952246]
I  had a  set  of the Russian Military  6N15Ns, and liked  them  so  much I bought a case of  50 @ $2.16/tube. [/quote]

You MUST send them in for a good Cryo treatment - it brings these tubes to a completely different level.  We did a group Cryo  buy/treatment a while back on these forums. Everyone really liked them including Steve.

Quote:


Yes, I have.  There is less of a need for the tweeter with the DFR8's to my ears.  The ribbon still adds something, but with the DFR8's I don't miss the tweeter when not hooked up as much as I did with the FE206EM's.  It may have to do with the fact that the DFR8's don't seem to need felt around the phase plug to mellow out brightness the way the EM's did.  

The DRF8's (and my chip amp) are breaking in nicely.  The brightness initially heard is mellowing out.  Bass is still lacking - it could be it takes longer for the surround and spider to break in.  But again, can also be largely due to my "live" room.  More time will tell.

[quote author=gnat leader  link=1146262918/15#27 date=1147971484] [/quote]
You MUST send them in for a good Cryo treatment - it brings these tubes to a completely different level.  We did a group Cryo  buy/treatment a while back on these forums. Everyone really liked them including Steve.


I  have  16 of  them  being  treated  as  we  speak  :)



Another interesting  thing  you  might  want to  try:  
Mount the  ribbon  facing the  rear, and  wire it out of  phase.

I'm  sure  this  'rear  ambience'  effect  would  work  better if  it  were  mounted  IN the  cabinet,  but  I  like the  effect  a lot.

[quote author=RobLikesTubes  link=1146262918/15#29 date=1148039910]

Another interesting  thing  you  might  want to  try:  
Mount the  ribbon  facing the  rear, and  wire it out of  phase.

I'm  sure  this  'rear  ambience'  effect  would  work  better if  it  were  mounted  IN the  cabinet,  but  I  like the  effect  a lot.

[/quote]

What value cap are you using on the tweeter?

That's silver foil in oil, yes? I've got some of those in my TABOO.

Here:  http://www.cryoplus.com/audio.html
$5.00/tube

Wow Brad. Interesting looking. Where did you get the salad bowls  :) Come-on explain. What differences, what about dispertion? ???  ;D

Mr C

It sounds great!  A little more efficient, more midrange detail (as if there wasn't enough already!) while still sounding smooth and not bright, midrange is more "juicy" for lack of a better word, and a hair better bass. Only downside I can see so far is you lose allot when not seated unless you're clear accross the room.  Putting something under the fronts to tilt them back could help that.

While these are not large enough for a "true front bass horn" I think they are helping the mids my compensating for some baffle step loss.

The "Target bowl" tweak is reversible/non-permanant. I used double sided aggressive out-door tape (the kind to stick address letters on a house) to affix them.

Btw, you might think I'm goofy, but this really does improve the midrange quality and "juicy tone".  I'd love for somebody with a less live (better treated) room to try this and let us know how it sounds - especially the imaging.  For me I don't lose anything, but my room is not the best for discerning imaging details.

I am game to try it. I will see if Target in Oz carries them. If not I will have to get you to post a couple over to me Brad.
Its a great hobby, lots of things we can try.

Mr C

C, sure I can send you a couple if you can't find them over there.
But what is the size of your OB?  If they are pretty wide/big, you might not hear much of a difference with the TB's.  Unless there really is some horn action going on.  But even if that's the case, they are too small to be adding much bass, so It's a crapshoot if they will make things sound better or not.  In any event, they're cheap enough to try just as a fun experiment.

You may already know this... ideally you want curved walls not straight. I think you can get honky/resonances with linear "horn" walls or walls curved the wrong way (bowl as apposed to bell shaped).  

Btw, this should be a separate thread. Really not specific to DFR8 drivers.

cheers, -Brad-

Well, I may have unintentionally just sold a pair of HDT's for Steve and possible and CSP to boot.  Steve, where my commision?

My buddy Steve and I had a mini listening session. He already had my CSP hooked up to his Art Audio Carissa amp. I brought my HDT's over his place today and left the for a while.  We gave a listen to a few disks on different combination of equipment.  The disks were good quality recordings, not awesome, but just good.  I forget the album names but Steve pulled out Natilie Merchant, Aimee Mann, while I had brought some of my current favorite Marcio Faraco (Brazilian jazz) 'cause I thought Steve would like him, which he did.  We had limited time so we focused on changes in equipment and listening mostly to Faraco.  Equipment listened to:

Speakers: Decware HDT, Reference 3A Royal Virtuoso
Amps: Art Audio Carissa, Decware TABOO, Charlize DIY chip amp
Preamp: Decware CSP
Source: Sony 9000ES w/Modwright mods
cabling: All cables were expensive looking snake-like beasts - I didn't enquire about their brands.
Room: No treatments, approx 15'x15', listening at approx 8' triangle, toe'd in pretty much directly at the listener.

Sorry for the quality. I snapped them with my phone... thought some of you might find them interesting...