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Steve's TINY RADIAL project! (Read 160240 times)
Steve Deckert
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #50 - 03/30/20 at 03:59:00
 

So here is another shot of the finished enclosure design. †I have also been working on the variations for the top lens and the bottom plinth.




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Steve Deckert
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #51 - 03/30/20 at 04:16:08
 

For the bottom plinth, I learned it can't be made from soft woods like pine because it warps too easily. †This piece has to be perfectly flat and stay that way. †I tried 1/2 inch plywood which worked but it wasn't very heavy and looked too thick. †I tried 1/4 hardwood and learned that too can warp. †So right now the best look both visually and structurally is a hardwood block made from two pieces and then sliced like bread to 3/8 inch so the grain is vertical in the plinth rather than horizontal.



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Steve Deckert
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #52 - 03/30/20 at 04:19:47
 

You can see some of them laying on the bench with the enclosures. †The fancy ones are made from walnut crotch wood which I will take more pictures of when I do the final assembly.





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Steve Deckert
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Reply #53 - 03/30/20 at 04:29:36
 

Tonight I did a logo for the front.



As soon as get the binding posts I ordered I plan to put more of these together.

Steve

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Reply #54 - 04/01/20 at 02:21:00
 
These look like a great compliment to the TV.  You don't have to negotiate the living room decor with your spouse with these, but still have something you are willling to listen to while staring at the TV.

And you can still use them to actually enjoy music while using them.  This is a much better solution that a generic soundbar under the TV.

I do spend a fair amount of time in my study (working from home) and these would pair with my Zen amp rather nicely. I would still get to enjoy the details and complexity of my music without taking over the room (I've packed it with bookcases already).

Have you tried using them as speakers for gaming?  Another possible market to open would be for computer gamers if they image well enough to catch the "bad guy" sneaking up on them.
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #55 - 04/01/20 at 03:28:04
 



Plans have been finalized and will be available as soon as I create a place on the site to purchase them. I will post that link in this thread when it becomes available.

Just getting ahead of the curve here a little bit. Since I don't know the final price and or if there would even be a market for these I am just proceeding as if I did. What I do know, is that there's a market for the plans, so now they are done.



Here is a Buy it Now link for the Tiny Radial plans $19.95 instant download.

https://secure.ultracart.com/cgi-bin/UCEditor?merchantId=DIY&ADD=TRPLANS&themeCo...

The plans are a high resolution .pdf of the picture shown above.

-Steve
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #56 - 04/01/20 at 13:25:57
 
Makes me think of "Tiny Elvis", a bit on Saturday Night Live some years ago.
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #57 - 04/01/20 at 13:31:27
 
Funny, I just started to disassemble my implementation of the Tang Band T2-2136SA to finish as a center channel for the Charoit and took a break to look at this thread.

Nice progress on the design. Looks like the Tiny Radial will be added to my ever growing todo list for a set of computer monitors. Looks good Steve!

John
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #58 - 04/01/20 at 19:44:09
 
Please help me out here as I am new to Decware and tubes; what kind of system would you suggest I assemble if I were to use these Tiny Radials in my home office or bonus room? Specifically which one of Steve amplifiers? DAC, streamer? CD player? Are there other necessities or nice-to-haves?

thank you!

~Andy~
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Steve Deckert
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Reply #59 - 04/01/20 at 20:13:04
 

Welcome to the family!

If you hi-pass these speakers at 80Hz, they could probably get reasonably loud in a small room, So far I have been running them full-range with our 2 watt amplifiers and find the pairing ideal for low volume listening.  I honestly don't think the speaker would handle much more than that without getting distorted.  

These speakers are great for desktop in-your-face listening with just a couple watts at which point they will get plenty loud, or for relatively low level background music in an office, kitchen, living room, bedroom, etc. with the same power.  If you wanted to push them, you would need an 80Hz hi-pass crossover and more power.

As for DAC, Streamer, CD player, and so on, I would recommend a dedicated streamer/usb DAC combo like the Cambridge Audio CXN series.  That way you have it all covered.  If you want to play CD's you can get their CD player, or use one you already have as a transport feeding the streamer/dac.

Nice to haves is a ZBIT so that you can run the balanced outputs from the streamer/dac  into the amplifier.  I have tested this combination and found balanced outputs feeding a ZBIT to be better than the standard RCA output.  In fact the difference is so great, that even with a ZROCK2 connected to the standard RCA output the ZBIT output will still usually win.

Steve

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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #60 - 04/01/20 at 22:41:10
 
Steve,
Nice prints, they look as good as any of my Cad Monkey's work.
I might scale these up to use some 4" full rangers I have stuck in a garbage can.
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Steve Deckert
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #61 - 04/02/20 at 01:22:07
 

Here is a Buy it Now link for the Tiny Radial plans $19.95 instant download.

https://secure.ultracart.com/cgi-bin/UCEditor?merchantId=DIY&ADD=TRPLANS&themeCo...

The plans are a high resolution .pdf of the picture shown earlier.

-Steve
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #62 - 04/02/20 at 02:25:33
 



The binding posts I wanted to try arrived yesterday, so I installed them tonight in the antique cherry pair. †

These posts accept banana or a bare wire or a small spade. My wife's pair are similar and it didn't take long before the banana terminated speaker cables got ditched for some small black wire cut to length. She has them on the kitchen counter with her Zen amp.

My thought was that they are smaller than the full size ones I used on the first pair and still allow for bare wire. Any thoughts on which look better?

Steve
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Reply #63 - 04/02/20 at 13:17:20
 
If it's just looks it's not these. The white doesn't do it for me on the beautiful wood. Size is a factor but color is the biggest problem for me. I like the ones used on the Traps. Not sure if they would work on these. I don't have my pair close to look at the moment.
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Reply #64 - 04/02/20 at 13:55:21
 
I agree with Showme, white looks cheap....how about gold or silver or faux wood?
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Reply #65 - 04/02/20 at 14:04:10
 
Steve,

Maybe something like these: https://www.parts-express.com/mini-gold-plated-insulated-5-way-binding-post-bana.... Not sure how they sound but better looking.

HK
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #66 - 04/02/20 at 20:03:54
 
Ditto on what HK posted.  I think the clear posts would be the best option, my second choice would be a black or a darker post.  The white just doesnít do it for me.

Dominick
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #67 - 04/02/20 at 20:37:03
 
What I think would be neat is if these Mini-Radials could be constructed to be mini-mid bass units such as HSU I think used to make. Stick them out of sight and fill in that range.
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #68 - 04/03/20 at 00:57:33
 
Steve, these little things look awesome! Can you please take a few more pics of the walnut ones. What finish are you using on these.
Thanks,
John
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Reply #69 - 04/03/20 at 02:08:58
 

Appreciate the feedback on the binding posts, which confirms my thoughts as well. I have ordered some regular full size, but in black instead of gold. Also some pricey ones for the walnut pair.

Yes, I will take several more pictures as we go along.†On this walnut pair, I am using high gloss lacquer. I'm on about coat 10 so far, and have a long way to go before it starts looking like something.

Sadly I gooned myself last week. I accidentally created a perfect pour-on finish on this cutting board. No way to do this on a speaker because it only works on horizontal surfaces. But... now that I've seen this, everything else just looks like shit ; )




So far the first three pair I have finished in satin lacquer, which is the standard Decware speaker finish, and it looks great. The high gloss walnut pair is likely to be a one-off.  

So far my favorite wood and my favorite finish is the Sapele with Linseed oil. There is just something richly satisfying when you hold the natural oiled wood in your hand. Not only the way it looks but the way it feels. The oil works well with the Sapele.

Steve
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Reply #70 - 04/03/20 at 20:07:45
 
Thanks for posting the plans!  Time to get back out into the gargae.  And to get some 2" drivers.

and try scaling up to some 5 1/2 I pulled out of the DNAs since I just upgraded the drivers in those.
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Reply #71 - 04/03/20 at 20:11:02
 
thisd might also bbe the time where I point out that my wife is really getting tired oif seeing invoices from parts express and Decware.

I point out that it could  be worse.  I could be collecting amplifiers from here too.


I'm just glad the parts listing for the zen amp kit is so outdated that I can't find all of them or I'd be seriously racking up the bills.
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Reply #72 - 04/03/20 at 20:19:37
 
Rich,

The ZKIT1 parts are readily available. I just built the kit last month with the stock listed parts.

Yeah, I feel like Steve is just one step ahead of our desires in audio...a demon if you will! But in a good way!

Enjoy

John
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Reply #73 - 04/03/20 at 20:33:19
 
oh great.  this time searching for the GXSE10-6-8K results in me finding them.  *thannks* for that.

I'm going ot have to do some serious sucking up to be allowed to blow more money.  As it is I am waiting for another shipment already from PE for 8" and ribbon tweets.


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Reply #74 - 04/04/20 at 09:57:19
 
Quote:
I'm going ot have to do some serious sucking up to be allowed to blow more money. †As it is I am waiting for another shipment already from PE for 8" and ribbon tweets.


It is always good to have a throttle with indulgence of this hobby. Years ago, I gave up a nasty habit of smoking and directed that money not spent on cigarettes to another less nasty habit of audio. This led to acceptance of my spending by the better half. She never complains of my spending and I keep that spending inline with my old one pack a day habit. Win win all around Grin

Once the ZKIT1 was built and broken in, my first decware amp, it brought out the short comings of my system. So this led to a cartridge upgrade...to a phono stage upgrade. On and on, the amp is very revealing. So be prepared for a good defense to 'blow' more money! Or better yet create a good offense Wink

John
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Reply #75 - 04/04/20 at 21:24:19
 
I gave up smoking without a plan in place to funnel that money into a hobby.  I've also rpetty well stopped drinking so my "ghood bottle of burmon" fund has dried up too.  Clearly I am doing it wrong.  I have failed to properly negotiate the terms of my surrender.   But that was 30 years ago.  She still puts up with me.

I will build some speakers first.  Then I get to try to explain why I need to build another amp so I can run mono blocks.  At which point I get a new source.  I like to think I have the  long game figured out but I know better.  She seems to be one step ahead of me every time.

When I am allowed to go get more MDF, I'll post pictures of the build(s) to the proper forum.
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Reply #76 - 04/05/20 at 23:42:59
 
Another question on binding post ....you have a nice sleek streamlined speaker ....itís sides are sleek, with a slight angle....almost like a little
majestic block ... instead of the binding post sticking out, is there any type, that would be somewhat flush to outside surface ? †...something that has all the guts on inside...maybe small enough to accept a dual banana plug that people can use, if they have only wire?... I know its in back, but Iíve been around speakers and you always see a little glimpse of the back..especially if you would like to use them on each side guarding a big screen tv..the back would look as sleek as sides with only cable ends showing in back
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Reply #77 - 04/06/20 at 01:04:22
 
I like these that I put on my F15s. †The do stick out but to me, they are aesthetically pleasing.

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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #78 - 04/06/20 at 02:44:20
 
Steve,

How about Solen  Binding Post? www.partsconnexion.com/SOLEN-51541_ss43741.html
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Reply #79 - 04/06/20 at 03:40:31
 

The Solen look like great candidates, depending on the quality.  I ordered some to see.  Thanks!

Steve

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Reply #80 - 04/06/20 at 03:43:07
 
Hi Greg, welcome to the forum! †I like your idea, but isn't that what this is?




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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #81 - 04/06/20 at 10:49:14
 
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Reply #82 - 04/06/20 at 18:43:30
 
The Solen look like great candidates, depending on the quality. †I ordered some to see. †Thanks!


Steve, I hope the "Tiny Radials Speakers" reach final production. I'm interested in owning a pair.
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Reply #83 - 04/06/20 at 21:30:06
 
...yes Steve ....I like those much better then the larger, more protruding pair...they are such a small handsome speaker with a sleek flair that anything large and protruding would draw your eye away from the beauty of the wood and shape...I feel that a pair of these on the side of a big screen would complement a pair of ERRx ....they are the same shape and could be the ERRx little brother
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #84 - 04/07/20 at 05:36:51
 
Hey Donnie,

I had forgotten about those binding posts. I have used them, and they work well. It's about as close to flush as you can get to the back of the speaker cabinet. Here they are in an open-baffle mockup that I did a while back (obviously before I converted to the Betsy shape).
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Reply #85 - 04/13/20 at 02:22:31
 

Soon, I should have another†selection of binding posts that I ordered weeks ago at which point I will do the finally assembly on the enclosures I have built. I will post finally assembly pics of each of those. I am looking forward to making some more, now that I have all the jigs made. Getting jigs right is time consuming. If you are only going to ever build a single pair of these for yourself, you don't need jigs. †

Steve


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Reply #86 - 04/20/20 at 05:55:22
 

I found a piece of Zebrawood I didn't know I had, and it was just big enough to make a pair of Tiny Radial cabinets.  I'll be putting these together soon.

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Reply #87 - 04/20/20 at 06:00:02
 

I am still waiting for binding posts to arrive, however I did receive the more expensive pair I ordered for the fancy walnut pair I made for myself... and today there was some sunshine so I could catch some of it with the phone camera.

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Reply #88 - 04/20/20 at 06:06:00
 

I am still waiting for binding posts to arrive, however I did receive the more expensive pair I ordered for the fancy walnut pair I made for myself... and today there was some sunshine so I could catch some of it with the phone camera.





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Reply #89 - 04/20/20 at 06:06:59
 



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Reply #90 - 04/20/20 at 06:09:06
 

It will take either my real camera and lights, or a video to appreciate how this grain flips when you angle it in the light.  I'll get to that.

Steve
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Reply #91 - 04/20/20 at 14:03:52
 
That wood is beautiful! I love when wood has character like that.
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Reply #92 - 04/21/20 at 00:10:33
 
If appearance means anything they are still too large. The first ones are still the best. I would go bare wire to reduce the size if need be although I do like bananas.
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Reply #93 - 04/21/20 at 00:17:59
 

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Reply #94 - 04/21/20 at 03:20:10
 
Steve...the pic in post # 89 is absolutely beautiful!! It reminds me of a tiny version my Err speakers with the  Bubbinga Wood veneer.  Congrats on the speakers...they are a winner!

Dominick
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Reply #95 - 04/21/20 at 04:00:47
 
Steve, now the last pic. If they were black to match the top and bottom you would nailed it for me.
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Reply #96 - 04/21/20 at 15:57:08
 
I wonder what you will charge for these Steve.
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #97 - 04/21/20 at 16:08:47
 
The walnut ones look absolutely stunning.  How many coats of lacquer are you using?  Sorry, I realize we are now talking about the finish on the cabinet rather than he sound quality, but when thinking price, you are going to need to consider how must time is spent on the finish too.  It has been a couple of decades since I have been to the shop, do you have a finishing booth too?

I'm awaiting the upgrades to my anorexic build before I star in on the home version of these.  I really need to get one right/working before I start the next project.
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SE84b/c Obsolete Decware spkrs and some DIY DNA horns.
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Steve Deckert
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If the 1st watt
sucks why continue?

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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #98 - 04/22/20 at 06:33:26
 

Hi Rich,

I sprayed about 18 coats of lacquer sanding between each coat until there was no more grain.  Then I shifted to 800 grit wet sanding and linseed oil.  There is no wax yet, and in real life it looks pretty close to water, like the cutting board I did.  But to your point, it is a stupid amount of work, so don't expect to see too many of those and they would likely be double the price.  

It has taken me  about an entire day to make each of these prototypes so far, but here at the end I am getting the time down to doable numbers.  

I am doing another pair now, so far it has taken me about an hour to create the 5/16 panels, an hour to cut the panels to shape and an hour to assemble the panels, followed by an hour to finish the panels, and finally, an hour to do the final assembly with  the binding posts, top plate and bottom plinth.

Just because they are small doesn't mean there are any less steps.

Steve

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Rich Evans
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Re: Steve's TINY RADIAL project!
Reply #99 - 04/22/20 at 13:51:17
 
smaller means tighter tolerances and less room for mistakes.  The only think you are reducing is material cost. Considering that the real investment is the intellectual property of the design, the reduced lumber is not significant in the picture.

Your intellectual property, 4 hours of labor, plus materials to get a pair of desktop speakers/background sound is going to be a tough price to crack.  FWIW, $499 would be my guess for a price point on these guys.  I'm going off my past experience with the results you have produced on when you chased an idea, because I've not listened to these guys.


That finish is stunning. You've done an incredible job with them. I will eventually make a pair to see how thy sound, because I bought the TB drivers.  They fell into the cart when I was purchasing the wrong x-over caps for my other project.
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