Forums - Hello and need feedback on ERR's

thehungryeye

Ex Member

Hello and need feedback on ERR's
10/27/09 at 17:33:59

First, let me say hello:) I'm new to the forum and very curious about the ERR speakers. I was about to place an order for a pair of Ohm speakers before I stumbled on this Decware design. Google brings up very little information about this speaker so I'd appreciate for anyone who has heard these speakers to comment on the sound - strengths and weaknesses. No speaker is perfect so please be candid with your comments, or if you prefer you can email me - thehungryeye @ yahoo . com. Also, for anyone who has ordered the ERR's, how long does it take to receive the speakers? I know the website says 6-8 weeks, I just want to know how accurate that window of time is and if it's possible to get them any sooner. Thanks guys.

Back to top

IP Logged

Lon

Seasoned Member

"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 24899

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #1 - 10/27/09 at 19:16:55

Welcome!

I'm as eager as you are to know about the ERRs.

I have had RL1s, RL2s and now the IT Radials (a new version for retail). All these were different in design in important ways, but all shared a family character of presenting a wide and deep soundstage that makes a very natural and convincing listening experience.

In this forum there are a number of posts about the ERR and the other Radial desgins that should give you some information until someone with direct experience contacts you or posts in this thread.

I would say that the 6 to 8 weeks is an accurate time frame for these products. I suspect Bob Z (Ziggy) will see this thread and give you detailed information "from the source."

Back to top

HR-1,ZBIT,ZROCK2,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod; Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD, DAC Mk II, P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls, Reference spkrcbls; Mapleshade SamsonV3; VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects, IsoPods; headphones: Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1

IP Logged

thehungryeye

Ex Member

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #2 - 10/27/09 at 21:56:03

Thank you Lon.

I've gleaned everything I can about the ERR's from this forum. Things I like are the evolution of the design, that the top end can be configured with resistors to adjust the sound for different rooms, cabinet shape and what appears very nice workmanship. What I haven't been able to find are comments about the midrange quality, timbre etc. It's fairly clear from what I've read here that the design excels at soundstaging which is a big plus for me but I'm hoping to get a little more in depth analysis of the sound these speakers are capable of. What would be really terrific is if someone who has heard the Ohm Walsh line chime in and offer their comments. I look forward to Bob's comments.

Back to top

IP Logged

Lon

Seasoned Member

"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 24899

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #3 - 10/27/09 at 23:52:41

Well, my generalization of the Radial speakers I've heard are that they are very open in the midrange, can have all the treble you want practically grain free (if your source and amplification will deliver that; the ribbon tweeters are very powerful and clear) and they're lean rather than warm in my listening rooms, but the bass is tight and fast as all get out. I'd say they're very accurate tonally, you really have to pay attention to placement, quality components, probably room treatment.

They'll challenge you to find the best sound and to listen and listen to music.

I'll let others chime in. It's hard for me to talk about sound in audiophile terms, I keep running into walls with others. For example, I find all Decware components I've had to have a sunny disposition, a bright character in comparison to other components, and Steve feels very strongly very differently. (And yet I have my ears and trust them.) So it's always with a grain of salt that I read them, and carefully that I speak them, because each room, each set of ears, and each brain can be so different.

Back to top

HR-1,ZBIT,ZROCK2,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod; Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD, DAC Mk II, P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls, Reference spkrcbls; Mapleshade SamsonV3; VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects, IsoPods; headphones: Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1

IP Logged

ZYGI

Seasoned Member

HR-ONE

Posts: 757

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #4 - 10/28/09 at 03:05:29

Welcome to the forum Hungryeye!!

I would love to reply in detail, unfortunately I'm so tired I can hardly type, If you would like, you can give me a call and I will gladly talk with you about the ERR's. I have had a chance to listen to several different Ohms, the newest model that comes close to the ERR's is I believe the model 3000.

I'll try to write more tomorrow, right now I'm heading off to bed...

ZYGI
828-729-7336

Back to top

All Decware amps and sources, Turning Point Audio speakers

IP Logged

thehungryeye

Ex Member

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #5 - 10/28/09 at 03:56:13

- Lon. Now that's probably the most detailed description of the different iterations of this speaker I've read yet. Thank you!

Obviously there are simply too many variables to ask a question like "how does this sound?" and expect an answer written in stone. Funny though that it's the question that comes up most often on all the audio forums. I know that ultimately I'll have to audition these in my room with my gear and my tin ears. I just wanted to know if the ERR's were in the ballpark of the kind of sound I want to achieve and from your description it certainly seems the case. An audition is certainly in order. Thanks again.

- ZYGI. Get some rest and if you have some time I would love to talk with you tomorrow. I'll give you a ring around noon.

Back to top

IP Logged

Gopher

Ex Member

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #6 - 08/03/11 at 02:35:25

Lon,

I've got a pair of loudspeakers that are outstanding (Zu Soul Superflys), but I'm battling room issues since a recent 're-organization' and am tempted to try these ERRs in an effort to mitigate room issues as from what I have read, this may be a golden goose for a tricky room (and let me get some of these GIK panels out of my den).

This line concerned me though: "you really have to pay attention to placement, quality components, probably room treatment."

I can't tell you how tired I am of inching my speakers around, listening for improvements--thinking I've got it, only to come back later and note some glaring deficiency...

Back to top

IP Logged

Doorman Seasoned Member "pouring from the empty into the void" Posts: 450	Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's Reply #7 - 08/03/11 at 03:02:18 I share your frustration re: speaker placement. I've given up on any speakers that require incessant tweaking-- toe-in toe-out, forward, backward on and on and--- -no matter how "good' they sound when the wind blows just right-- don
Back to top	Decware, Rega, Heybrook/Linn/Ortofon Goertz/Wireworld/cat-5/MarkAudio Alpair 10.2 drivers (eN) in DIY Mar-Ken cabs NHT SB3’s IP Logged

Lon

Seasoned Member

"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 24899

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #8 - 08/03/11 at 12:19:27

I wouldn't be too concerned. I for one don't fidget the speakers all around inch by inch. It's pretty easy to find where they fit best in the room. I don't do room treatment. The caveat about quality components is real, these speakers will show you all that you have, but you shouldn't have to worry about that, you have fine components.

Back to top

HR-1,ZBIT,ZROCK2,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod; Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD, DAC Mk II, P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls, Reference spkrcbls; Mapleshade SamsonV3; VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects, IsoPods; headphones: Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1

IP Logged

Pale Rider

Seasoned Member

Posts: 1285

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #9 - 08/03/11 at 14:51:12

FWIW, I find the ERRs less sensitive to the small adjustments like toe-in, etc. Not immune, just less sensitive. As Lon says, find the right basic location, and let them bloom for a while.

It's important to remember mine are still breaking in, and my use of 6 ERRs in one room is bound to have an impact, even when I am listening to just a single pair. But inasmuch as their sound is still settling in, I don't see much point for me in constant micro-adjustments, at least, not at this point.

I don't have any room treatment yet, other than that stuff my wife calls "furniture," some of which I suspect has an effect on reflections. I am about to add some, though, and I found some reasonably priced bass trap items here. The bass traps on the Decware site still seem unavailable, but Acoustimac seems to have a fair bit of choice. Anyone know these folks?

P.S. Doorman, how do you like your Transcendent preamp?

Back to top

IP Logged

ZYGI

Seasoned Member

HR-ONE

Posts: 757

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #10 - 08/03/11 at 17:37:59

Well here it goes....As if I knew what I was talking about!

If you had an empty room with all hard surfaces, the ERR's or almost any omni would sound better than a conventional speaker.

As far as placement, I've put the older RL1.5's as close to a chair you could place your drink on the grill without reaching or moving from the listening chair. Put people (several) into the listening chair blindfolded and when opening there eyes had them tell me which pair of speakers in the room were playing. There was a set of conventional speakers set up in the conventional position, to try to trick them just a bit. Either way, no one to date has picked any of the Decware omni speakers to date.

Most have said the music was coming from my diffusers which were on the wall covered with black speaker cloth. Of course once they knew where the speakers they were listening to were located, then it became apparient where the sound was coming from.

Before Steve came up with the DFR8 driver, the HDT's for instance would not have worked in a small room no matter how much treatment was applied. The vocals once your got the speakers dialed in as far as location, were 2 inches in front of your face. For me if it was Diana Krall this would be fine, if it was Rod Stewart it would be, well YUK!!! If you moved your head just a centimeter, the whole soundstage would just fall apart. With the new DFR8 driver in the HDT's I find this not a problem what so ever

In any case, with any speaker, room treatment will make a difference with the quality of the sound, the ERR's just do it better than most without.

ZYGI

Back to top

All Decware amps and sources, Turning Point Audio speakers

IP Logged

Parker

Verified Member

I love YaBB 1G -
SP1!

Posts: 48

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #11 - 09/01/11 at 05:12:44

I've owned ERR's for well over a year now and I can tell you a few things.

- yes, they have mid range and voice qualities up there with just about anything. I've heard systems well over $250k that don't sound any better in terms of "sounding like a human or live instrument"

- They don't need to be micromanaged like some speakers. I've built quite a few designs myself and many can sound rediculously good but the second you get your head out of position or things move around just a little bit it all falls apart. That's not something that I see as a benefit.

- These are NOT fatiguing in a way that some hyper-accurate speakers can be.

- They have plenty of bass, when you run them off a ss amp you'll notice a ton of bass. I get a lot less bass out of them when I use them with my Tori II but it has the right about and isn't so damb boomy like with my ss amp.

They'll get as loud as you need

- The source and front end will matter but the room will matter less compared to how finicky other speakers are.

My living room system is a Tori II with ERR's and my dedicated room is a CSP2 on a ss Orion Set up from Linkwitz Labs. Once you get out of the "monkey coffin" designs you'll never go back.

Back to top

IP Logged

stevef

Ex Member

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #12 - 09/26/11 at 17:22:29

Parker,

Boy did you hit the nail on the head. In your reference to "monkey coffins" ie conventional box speakers, you pointed out that once you got into other design types, there was no going back. Amen to that statement. No matter how much money you can spend on a conventional box speaker, it always sounds like the sound is coming from the box.

Omnidirectional designs (EER, Morrison/Hegeman, Ohm, etc) should always sound superior to the box. (Even with fancy labels like Wilson, Revel, Magico, etc) Diapole designs can have the same effect. Linkwitz Orions are amazing.

Perhaps the main reason people find panel speakers so attractive is their dispersion patterns. How else can speakers with limited dynamics (electrostatics) or uneven wave launch (planar) be so popular?

Exception to the rule, and there always seems to be some are those speakers that exhibit controlled directivity. Some corner horns can sound very good if they truly load the room evenly.

Steve

Back to top

IP Logged

Pale Rider

Seasoned Member

Posts: 1285

Re: Hello and need feedback on ERR's
Reply #13 - 09/27/11 at 21:56:17

+1.

Parker said it well. Getting out of the monkey-coffin straitjacket, speakers like the ERR are just amazing. As I may have mentioned elsewhere, I almost sprang for a set of Orions, but chose not to. I am glad I waited, and got my ERRs. Absolutely zero negative reflection on the Orions. I just love the ERRs. And while they remind me of my old Ohm Fs, they are what I love now. Not hearing them side-by-side, there is no way to say for sure they are better, but my memory says they are. And I wasn't listening to my Ohms through a Torii; [at the time, I believe I had an ARC pre-amp and amp, fed by an Ariston table, Black Widow arm, and AVA-mofdified Grado cartridge]. I have not put an SS amp on mine, though I might just for fun see how my rebuilt Carver M-1.5T sounds when I get it back. It's actually destined for my my DBK212 subs, but it would be fun to see how it sounds through the ERRs.

Back to top

IP Logged