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CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video (Read 47225 times)
Steve Deckert
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CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
03/18/22 at 17:56:26
 



We had a wonderful thread started about these tubes and I accidentally deleted it so we must start over.

For years we have gone on about New Old Stock tubes and fancy boutique bottles from China but both have a fairly high risk of having issues albeit for different reasons, and consequently these already expensive tubes become even more so when they pre-maturely fail, or develop noise or other issues. This is why I am thrilled to announce I have personally found tubes that sound superior to both and have none of the quality control issues that we've put up with from China and or New Old Stock tubes from eBay.  

This lead to some long phone conversations with Don Thomas who created Cryotone Tubes. We have decided to work together to bring you these tubes.

The first step is to try them and see if they are for you.  To facilitate that we have this forum, and a 10% coupon to get you started.

Additionally, we will be working with Don to create Cryo treated complete tube sets for our amplifiers which will be available on his site when complete.


You can visit their website at https://www.wathenspeakers.com/wathen-cryotonetrade-tubes.html and use the promo code:
 
DECWARETUBES   to receive a 10% discount on your entire order.


Steve



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Steve Deckert
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #1 - 03/18/22 at 18:26:39
 

I should like to add to the above that I have these tubes in my own amplifiers and they sound profoundly different than everything else due to his tedious Cryo process and the careful grading of tubes before they ever enter the process.  I can honestly say I haven't heard anything better regardless of cost, brand, current production or New Old Stock.  Since I've purchased, installed and tested over 100,000 tubes in our amplifiers and tried every new brand that pops up on the market which has been hundreds over the past 20 years alone, I am uniquely qualified to know and hear the difference in tube quality.

These are the real deal.  They will let you hear the full potential of your Decware gear and they last longer than other tubes which helps offset the price.

-Steve


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Geno
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #2 - 03/18/22 at 19:03:45
 
Steve,

I sure hope there is a hard push for them to start selling the 6P15P-EV. Have we heard anything else about that?

Thanks,

Geno
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #3 - 03/18/22 at 20:14:18
 
Stale SUSHI?
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Steve Deckert
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #4 - 03/19/22 at 00:45:32
 

Yes, we have plans to offer the 6P15P-EV as well as all other Decware tubes.  It's a process and will take some time.  I'll report progress in this thread over the coming months.

Steve

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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #5 - 03/19/22 at 01:31:27
 
This is great news. We can put away the dice.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #6 - 03/20/22 at 01:11:46
 
Just ordered a pair of 5ar4’s. If they can get me to stop hoarding nos Mullards I might be able to retire one day!
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #7 - 03/20/22 at 20:42:21
 
After selling most of the remainder of my stupidly purchased bellowing big huge fat antique tube stash off and on over the past 2-3 yrs. like a paranoid screaming banshee on meth, and spending way way too much because of it, though net sales $$ is still in the black, its all way too much effort and so the following applies:

1. I've heard enough already from credible folks on the practicality and even more important the sonics of Cryotone tubes.

2. So.....I've just outfitted the CSP3 with a 5AR4, two 6SN7's, and an ECC88. The results are no question whatsoever significantly superior to the any of the AZ1's, 6SN7's, and any input tube I've had and that's been pretty many.

3. Like I mentioned, I've held on to a few pairs of [very expensive] prime examples of the best of yesteryear in a couple rectifiers and input tubes....for nostalgia reasons. As for real use, its Cryotone from here on out. The Torii MK 5 is going to be expensive which is why I'll just start with the ECC88 upgrade. With the many thousands in $$ received already and will receive in the future until most everything is gone, I will still pocket several $$ over the cost of going Cryotone. The point I'm saying is that the issue of practicality alone is overwhelmingly significant...I'm a living example of it, LOL

Don Thomas, Steve Deckert, or other members here like JOMAN are NOT LYING when they tell you even their beloved NOS tubes or fashionable flavor of the day can't hold a candle to the Cryotones in practicality nor performance.
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Geno
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #8 - 03/20/22 at 20:50:28
 
That is good news. Like you, I’ve been waiting for a few brave souls to try these out. Sounds like it is unanimous that these are the way to go.

I guess the only question now is longevity. Only time will answer that one.

Best,

Geno
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #9 - 03/20/22 at 20:57:09
 
Heyyyyyyyy Geno! Smiley
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #10 - 03/20/22 at 21:25:34
 
Wink
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #11 - 03/20/22 at 22:25:07
 
Brad!  Great endorsement from you, John and of course, Steve!  I am enjoying mine on the UFO25th, CSP3 and the ZR2.  Curious as well on life of these tubes.
Bob
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #12 - 03/21/22 at 14:38:44
 
Hey Kulafu, which rectifier did you install in your UFO25th, the 5U4GB or the 5AR4?  (Or maybe there's no difference.)  Thanks.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #13 - 03/21/22 at 14:58:46
 
I have the 5AR4 for the UFO25th.  I am getting the 5u4G for the CSP3.  The 5u4G gives you more sag.
Bob
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Doug
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #14 - 03/24/22 at 17:25:28
 
Having no need for additional tube inventory, but having read, with much interest, the numerous testimonials about Wathen tubes, I ordered a single 6SN7 on Saturday March 19th.  The tube will be used in the input stage of either my CSP3 or my Cary 300B integrated.  

The expected arrival date was Tuesday the 22nd, but the tube was a no show, so I shot off a quick email to Wathen asking for a shipping update.  No email reply was received by early Wednesday afternoon, so I sent another email suggesting that my order may have been misplaced or some how lost, but again no reply from Wathen.

I called Wathen this morning a few minutes before 10:00 and left a message requesting a status update on my order. Within 5 minutes, Don Thomas, himself, called me and we had a delightful 15 minute conversation. Not one time during our discussion did I sense that he wanted to end the call.  My impression is that he was quite pleased to be conversing with another music lover about his business and the processes he is using to produce the best sounding, longest lasting tubes in the world.  Toward the end of the call I asked him if he had any plans to offer large directly heated triode tubes—the 300B, specifically—and he surprised me by saying that he has mastered the cryo process for a particular 300B and that he would be happy to produce a pair for me.  It seems there’s way more work going on at Wathen Audiophile than Don’s website indicates.  And bottom line…….Don seems like a super nice guy.  He reminds me, in a numbers of ways, of Steve Deckert.

My missing tube?  Don had been replying to my emails, explaining that the 6SN7’s are on back order and scheduled to arrive at his place in a couple of weeks.  For some reason his emails are not landing in my inbox. The communication issue was not with Don; it is with my iPad.  

I was just pondering……it might be wise to order a few more tubes, knowing that there are three 6SN7 tubes on my Cary integrated and another three places where 6SN7’s  can be used on the CSP3.  We’ll see.

I didn’t ask about tube life, but Don detailed for me how two different music mastering plants have each been running ten of his Cryotone tubes, 24/7, for more than three years now.  He went on to say that none of these tubes seems to be getting any weaker, even though they have been used none stop for several years.  I think that’s pretty cool!

Sorry I have no feedback on Cryotone sound quality, but this type of feedback may prove just as valuable.

Doug




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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #15 - 03/24/22 at 20:49:15
 
Yeah, apparently they are balls to the wall all the way to failure, which is very different than anything I ever heard of. Normally a tube just gets weaker over time as sound quality degrades, then its kaput one way or another....unless of course you have blanking China-CCP shit-garbage and its fireworks early.

My NOS days are pretty much over. I keep a couple of the pre-60's very expensive and now obsolete in terms of practicality Mullard, Telefunkens, Amperex, etc. in the second system [along with a few spare pairs for nostalgia only and will sell them years from now for a tidy sum], which is purely non-critical/casual listening, until they fart and die....then Wathen replaces them.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #16 - 03/26/22 at 05:54:53
 

We see a very bright future with Cryotone Tubes.  Coming from the city where Caterpillar Tractors are built, and Cryogenic treatment was invented to strengthen tractor parts, mostly engine parts in the rotating assembly, I knew that it's not about freezing something to absolute zero, it's about how you ramp the temperature over time. Different metals have different ramps. Finding all the ramps with trial and error takes time, and is expensive.  You only do it when you are serious about finding the best possible outcome. After talking with Don and Roger who make Cryotone tubes, I knew straight away they were the real deal. I listened to the tubes they sent me and compared them to my collection of Cryo tubes from other companies who will remain nameless, and it was so obvious.  It's the real deal. I have little to gain and lots to lose with a bogus recommendation.

The most fascinating part is that if you grade tubes and pic the good ones and Cryo treat each one with it's own recipe, like these guys do, then it doesn't matter the brand, how much it cost, if it was NOS from the Blackburn plant or exotic asian tubes for giant money, they will not sound better.  They can't. They Cryo process is real. It molecularly changes things. You can hear it.

-Steve
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #17 - 03/26/22 at 13:06:30
 
Well, I've been tempted to order for a few weeks now. I was going to order power tubes, but I just don't want to go EL84 and will wait until Steve's tubes are available through Cryotone. So . . . I succumbed to temptation and ordered a pair of 6SN7 WC. We'll see if they are actually more to my taste than the RCA Gray Glass good old ones I've been using in my Monoblocks and CSP3.
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Steve Deckert
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas
Reply #18 - 03/27/22 at 04:54:30
 



https://youtu.be/lnv_eemleBk

Here is a video I did to demonstrate the dramatic difference Wathen Cryotone Cryo-treated tubes make in our amplifiers against not only our hand selected standard, but also against boutique Chinese super tubes.

-Steve



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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #19 - 03/28/22 at 23:32:50
 
When the "High Resolution Sushi" thread was accidentally deleted my post was as well regarding the results when I rolled the Cryotone tubes into my UFO25 and ZR2.  I was going to wait to post again after I get the Cryotone tubes that I ordered for my CSP3-A.  But after following this thread I felt that I should post specifically regarding the Cryotone EL84.

This is not intended to convince anyone to get the Cryotone instead of the 6P15P-EV.  Rather it's to suggest strongly that you do not stereotype the Cryotone EL84 as just another variation on the EL84 theme, so to speak.  I assure you it isn't!  If you do you will be doing yourself a disservice.

I had the original Svetlana tubes in my UFO2 and preferred those to the 6P15P-EV.  In my UFO25 I preferred the 6P15P-EV to the Svetlana hands down.  I also tried the TAD EL84STD in both amps and preferred the 6P15P-EV and still feel that it's a very good option.  I did not try the Cryotone EL84 because I was unhappy with the 6P15P-EV.  I tried it because of what Steve initially posted.  

The Cryotone EL84 is a different experience from all of the above, so much so that I wish we would not have to use the EL84 designation for it.  Is it an experience that you would like? Can't say, only one way to find out.

I'll add that when I replaced all of the tubes with the with the Cryotone  the result was such that they are still in the UFO25 and I consider the price to be a deal.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #20 - 03/29/22 at 03:46:12
 
Quote:
Posted by: JOMAN      Posted on: Yesterday at 23:32:50
 
...The Cryotone EL84 is a different experience from all of the above, so much so that I wish we would not have to use the EL84 designation for it.  Is it an experience that you would like? Can't say, only one way to find out.


At a hundred plus dollars a tube (and I need four) that is probably a cliff I will not be looking over. Of course I said that about hundred dollar fuses too and now I have 3 three of them....
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #21 - 03/29/22 at 04:09:10
 
Quote:
Of course I said that about hundred dollar fuses too and now I have 3 three of them....


Oh that nasty audiophile itch!    ;D
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #22 - 03/30/22 at 23:27:37
 

Oh that nasty audiophile itch!

I had to scratch mine. I just ordered two ECC88’s. The plan is to use them in my modded CXN, since I use it with both my tube and SS amps 🤔
 
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #23 - 04/06/22 at 14:52:14
 
How long has it taken folk here to get an order? I ordered two tubes 11 days ago and haven't received anything other than an acknowledgement of my payment, and no answer to an email sent two days ago.

Not tremendously impatient, just thought I would hear something by now. TIA.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #24 - 04/06/22 at 15:51:02
 
Hi Lon,

Looking back over my notes, it took about 3-weeks between my CryoTone tube order and delivery.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #25 - 04/06/22 at 16:01:08
 
Thanks Tony! Good to know. I can adjust my expectations.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #26 - 04/06/22 at 21:40:14
 
I received an email today saying a batch is being finished this Friday and are looking to ship on Monday.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #27 - 04/06/22 at 23:34:27
 

I received an email today saying a batch is being finished this Friday and are looking to ship on Monday.

Ditto!
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #28 - 04/07/22 at 00:23:17
 
Well that's nice. I just received a message saying mine are on backorder. Sigh.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #29 - 04/07/22 at 00:49:02
 
Lon, which ones did you order?
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #30 - 04/07/22 at 01:15:54
 
A pair of 6SN7.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #31 - 04/07/22 at 01:25:27
 
Lon,

Will the 6SN7s go in your CSP? I know you like that tube in that pre-amp. If so, what will you put in the third location?
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #32 - 04/07/22 at 01:32:04
 
I'm using 6NS7 with converter bases in all three signal positions in my CSP3 with the Anniversary mods, my CSP2+ with the Anniversary mods (just put back into play replacing the PS Audio GCHA in my headphone system) and as the input tubes in my SE84UFO3 Monoblocks with the Anniversary mods and in my Taboo Mk IV with the Anniversary mods.

With the converter bases they work anywhere the 6N1P or 6922 or 6DJ8 etc. would and imo they sound fantastic (RCA Gray Glass being my favorite). The Cryotone when eventually arrived I want to try as the input tubes in the Monoblocks (my main system amplification).
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #33 - 04/07/22 at 02:00:44
 
Looking forward to your comparison Lon.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #34 - 04/08/22 at 03:48:23
 
I’ve chatted with Don a couple of times over the past week regarding my 6SN7 back order.  The 6SN7’s are sitting on a container ship.  He expects to see them within two weeks, but there is no specified date.  

Cryotone ECC88 tubes are in stock.

On a side note, Cryotone 300B tubes are special order and run $966 per matched pair, which is $534 less than WE 300B’s.  At these prices, Western Electric’s five year warranty and incredible reputation speak loudly.  My new WE 300B’s should arrive on Monday or Tuesday!  
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #35 - 04/08/22 at 12:49:43
 
Ok, I am a bit confused.  Reading their website, they state under Quick Facts, "Wathen products are designed, and handcrafted in Houston , TX." Yet Doug's post says, "The 6SN7’s are sitting on a container ship."  Are these tubes made in USA then cryotreated or made outside USA, arrive at their facility then cryotreated, then rebranded to Wathen?

Thanks

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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #36 - 04/08/22 at 13:57:14
 
The latter. They do not manufacture tubes. Most of the type of tubes Wathern offers are NOT made in the USA. . . at all. So they are foreign tubes treated in their facility to their special cryo thang.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #37 - 04/08/22 at 18:07:45
 
I gather that most—maybe all—of Don’s tubes are sourced from JJ Electronic in the Slovak Republic.  None are sourced from Russia.
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ZROCK2 25th Mods
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PAP Quintets with Voxativ 1.6
First Watt J2 or Cary 300SEI
driving Voxativs—no crossover
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #38 - 04/14/22 at 03:27:21
 

We are going to be sending a hundred lot of 6P15P-ER tubes and a hundred lot of 6N1P-EV tubes to Don next week for them to add to their inventory.

Steve

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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #39 - 04/14/22 at 10:34:37
 
Great news Steve!
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #40 - 04/14/22 at 17:15:50
 
Any 6N5P?
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #41 - 04/14/22 at 17:18:20
 
Any 6N5P?
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #42 - 04/15/22 at 20:03:02
 
Anyone with a pending Cryotone tube order heard from Don the past 8 days?
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Jay’s CD2T-Mk3
Denafrips Pontus II
ZROCK2 25th Mods
CSP3 25th & Custom Mods
PAP Quintets with Voxativ 1.6
First Watt J2 or Cary 300SEI
driving Voxativs—no crossover
LFD NCSE driving 15” Woofers
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #43 - 04/15/22 at 21:05:37
 
Yes, mine are on the way.  Last I talked with Don he was waiting for a shipment and then had to cryo treat them.  So they'll probably be on the way to everyone soon.

The ones that are en route will be going in my CSP3-A. So all my components will have the Cryotone tubes.  I'll also be rolling the 12AU7 Long Plate in the input position of my CSP3-A and comparing it with the ECC88W.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #44 - 04/19/22 at 02:21:02
 
Received my Cryotone tube order this afternoon.  To make a long story short here's what's in my system now:

ZR2-A:
Cryotone 12AU7 Long Plate

CSP3-A
Cryotone 12AU7 long plate w/adapter for the input
Cryotone E88CC-W for output
Cryotone 5AR4-W Rectifier

UFO2-25A:
Cryotone E88CC-W for the input
Cryotone EL84 for output
Cryotone 5AR4-W Rectifier
Raytheon OC3W Input VR
Raytheon OA3 output VR (short/medium GT bottle)

Early report after 4 hours... simply put the system now kicks a** BIIIIG TIME!

The tubes in the amp and ZR2-A are not going anywhere and I doubt that the tubes in the CSP3-A will go anywhere either.  I'll confirm after next weekend.

Oh yes, for those who may be wondering about the bass???  With the Omega Vintage 8HO and this tube set in a 2.3 watt amp... unreal!  What started me on this path was Steves comment about the sound coming from the system that he had the Cryotone tubes in being the best yet - something to that effect.  He wasn't kidding!


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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #45 - 04/22/22 at 04:41:46
 
I'm very happy to say I received and installed my first Cryotone tube in my system. It's a 12AU7 long plate that I added to ny Zstage. I noticed an immediate difference in attack, and micro detail. after an hour the system transformed into this beast of beautiful sound. Deeper and much wider soundstage. Space of instruments, and vocals has taken on another dimension onto it's own. Everything has more timber and reverb. it's is if the music were a living being There is a new smoother easiness to the sound. I loved the sound of my system prior to this update, but wow. And yes- off of one tube. Now I'm going to upgrade the input tubes on my ZMA. This is cool!!!
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #46 - 04/22/22 at 05:00:01
 
I need to clarify that the smoother easiness to the music by no means anything is rolled off. If anything everything is extended, with an added  sharpness, but not brittle, or bright. Cymbals have a new shimmer and much more metallic sound. All I can say is the more listen the more I want to thank Steve for brining our attention to these beautiful audio jewels.
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #47 - 04/22/22 at 06:34:57
 
PDXDrew,

Sounds good! I wonder what the tube you changed from was?

Thanks,

Will
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #48 - 04/22/22 at 12:24:14
 
Ditto to everything that PDXDrew said, emphatically so.  

Something else that should be kept in mind, IMO.  I now have all Cryotone tubes in my system but I rolled the tubes one or a pair at a time and listened  before moving forward.  

Certain tubes like the 12AU7WCL-Long Plate and the EL84 made quite a difference, but the real magic started when all the tubes were rolled.  This is the real deal (someone else said that as well).
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Re:  CYROTONE Tubes by Don Thomas - New Video
Reply #49 - 04/22/22 at 14:40:21
 
Hi Will,
The tube I had in before the Cryotube was an NOS-12AU7-CT 12AU7 RCA Clear Top, which was a step up from the stock tube. And wow did I stayed up late last night.  :)
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