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Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here? (Read 4560 times)
mattwardpictures
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Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
02/28/23 at 19:27:15
 
Hi there Decware forums! I'm Matt and this is my first post here.

I'm interested in feedback from Decware customers who have Klipschorns, or have any of the larger Klipsch Heritage speakers (La Scala, Cornwall), or speakers of comparable efficiency. (>99dB/W/m)

I intend to bi-amp my Klipschorn AK6s with one SE84UFO2 per speaker, the L+R channels on the amps feeding the high and lowpass terminals on each speaker. Perhaps I could get away with using only one amp, but I want to be sure.

What is the word from other Klipsch Heritage listeners on these forums? Did you end up using one of the larger amps, or was 2.3W/ch more than enough for your use case?
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #1 - 02/28/23 at 20:32:05
 
Welcome! I have no real experience with these speakers so I can't help but I'm sure others will chime in soon.
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mattwardpictures
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #2 - 03/01/23 at 00:44:15
 
Thanks Lon! Smiley
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MikeinMontana
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #3 - 03/01/23 at 16:40:22
 
Looking forward too! Eventually hooked up to Klipsch Chorus II's. Supposedly~ 101db 1w 1 m.  Almost on page two of the 'list'  [smiley=icqlite20.png] Our son ordered a week or two after us, his will be hooked up to his new Klipsch Forte IV, 99db. I think we're all going to be in business! ..and welcome Matt! [smiley=beer.g
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mattwardpictures
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #4 - 03/01/23 at 18:04:30
 
Thanks Mike, pleased to be here!
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #5 - 03/01/23 at 19:20:29
 
Welcome to Decware

How big is your room. your speakers are very efficient ( like my La Scalla's ) so the next issue is how much space you need to sound pressurize.

Both of our speakers are great in big rooms and can fill them with sound. they also sound great in smaller ares like a more typical living room.

I just received my Torii Jr V2 with 20 watts and it is more than enough to drive you out of my room

Room
17X20
10 ft sidewalls with another 4 feet to a rounded ceiling.
and I set about 12 feet from my speakers

Hope this helps and enjoy the music
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mattwardpictures
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #6 - 03/01/23 at 20:31:03
 
Thanks for replying JMeader!

"I just received my Torii Jr V2 with 20 watts and it is more than enough to drive you out of my room"

I have no doubt! And congrats on your Torii Jr V2!

My room is 15D, 25W, 8.5H, with the speakers set up on the long wall. I sit about 17' away from each speaker (if I've got my Pythagorean theorem right!), very near the back wall.

I'm currently driving them with a Willsenton R-800i integrated 300B/805A tube amp, which makes 48W/channel. I cannot turn the volume up higher than 9:00 (knob begins at roughly 7:00) with anything other than chamber music or high-dynamic range orchestral, or else I'm blown out of my chair. Rock or fusion music played with the volume knob 9o'clock can easily hit 87dB+ at my listening chair (so my Apple watch tells me) with a balanced source. And the power meters barely move!

So 48 watts is overkill, and I predict the 20 provided by the Torii might also be. Which is why I'm taking a chance with the 2.3W/ch SE84UFO2, plus an extra one because I feel like I need it. Grin

What kind of preamp or linestage are you running? (I'm sure it was probably in your signature but it doesn't show up on the compose page.)
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #7 - 03/01/23 at 23:12:23
 
I don't have Khorns but the SpeakerLab SK clones which should be close.  I bought them with the thought of upgrading them with the Volti corner horn upgrade kit.  I too thought I would biamp them.  My listening space is huge.  It's a large L shaped room with a staircase that comes up midway thru the bottom of the L. From the front wall to the back is approx 30ft.  The speakers are about 18ft apart and I sit maybe 13ft from the front wall.

I was truly amazed what a SE84UFO could do by itself.  87DB is loud and clear with no perceptible strain.  The back part of the L opens up into a kitchen an it still sounds good even in there.  

After hearing them in place I haven't pulled the trigger on the Volti kit.  I'm just not missing anything.  I do have two small MK sealed subs to fill in the bottom but I'm a deep bass head and it's more of a fun impact thing than a true sound thing.

I'm running the PSAudio DirectStream MK1 DAC directly into it and using the  DAC remote volume control and inup switcher as a preamp.  

I just went to a stereo store and tried to listen to their box speakers.  I couldn't do it.  The corner horns is so open and unrestrained they sounded like the sound was coming from a box

In my mind conrner horns and tube amps are the ticket. I just swapped out my SE84UFO with a dyankit ST70 which does provide a richer sound but I haven't seitched back to hear what I gave up to get it.
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mattwardpictures
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #8 - 03/02/23 at 03:49:10
 
Hi Dana!

I googled SpeakerLab SK's---they are very close, at least on the outside. I'll assume that their efficiency is comparable.

It's great that you said that the SE84UFO (the original?) was able to drive your corner horns so effortlessly, and in a large listening area. It must be nice to have assembled a system and feel like you're missing nothing. (Except perhaps, more music!)
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #9 - 03/02/23 at 14:15:21
 
Hello Mattwardpictures,

I've been using Decware amps with a pair of 1978 Khorns, AA crossovers, for several years now and it's been a blissful experience. The Khorns are set in the corners of the 20 x 14 x 8 living room, separation of 20 feet. The current amp is the UFO25 with typical volume controls turned to 9-10 oclock. The Khorns don't need much to fill a room this size to capacity. I've used the UFO2 and Dennis Had Inspire amps as well with equal success. You're in for a treat.

Mike
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #10 - 03/02/23 at 15:37:57
 
Hello there.

I had an SE84UFO connected to Cornwall IIIs.  They had a great sound, but then I plugged in my old, old, old blue Torii, and I liked the sound of that better.  The 12w blue Torii had a more profound impact with the Cornwalls than the SE84UFO did.  That's my experience.  I think it is a matter of taste.  Over the years I've used a vast array of amps and through all of that I still have and play that old blue Torii, but it is now connected to my second office system.

The SE84UFO25 will definitely work with just about any Klipsch, but will you like it?  That depends on you.

My 2 cents.  
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mattwardpictures
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #11 - 03/02/23 at 16:23:16
 
Hi there Mike.
I'm glad you're getting great results with the ZTA, and in a room of comparable size to mine. What kind of music are you playing through them?
I'd spring for two of the UFO25, but the price jump from the UFO2 makes that not a realistic option for now. (Although I've got plenty of time to change my mind and/or save up in the interim.) Is the '25' really that much better?

Hi Matchstikman!
As efficient as the Cornwall III's are, I'm sure their conventionally loaded 15" woofers liked the extra juice.
Was the difference between the SE84UFO and Torii more than a matter of impact? Is there a 'house sound' to the Decware amps, in that they all have a similar character about them?

Thanks to all for your comments so far!
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #12 - 03/02/23 at 18:06:26
 
Hi Matt,

I play a pretty broad range of vinyl and CD, everything except for opera on one end and rap on the other. As for comparing the 25 to the 2 you've got quality with both at different price points. I was very happy with the ufo2 and for a while had both the 2 and the 25 with stock tubes that I could swap in and out of the system. I preferred the 25 so when I decided that only one could stay I sold the 2. Simple as that. When the Sarah 300B arrives I may put the UFO25 up for sale, just have to see.

Mike
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mattwardpictures
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #13 - 03/02/23 at 21:39:38
 
Woah... keep us posted on that Sarah 300B, Mike!

I considered the Sarah as well, because I already have a couple pair of 300B tubes on hand for my current amp.

The larger reason I want to move from an integrated amp to separates, and two power amps in particular, is to close the distance between the amps and speakers, to keep the speaker cable runs as short as possible.

I experimented with different furniture arrangements to try and make things more convenient in the living room, using cable lengths from 12' to 30' in my trials. The longer the speaker cable runs got, the less dynamic and lively the sound got; and it couldn't be cured just by turning the volume up either. It was kind of a slap in the face to the Klipschorn's very reason for being---their visceral impact and immediacy.

With an integrated amp, the shortest cable runs I can achieve are 12' in my room, and there is very little slack in them. So I'm committed to the plan to run my K-horns with two amps. (Two stereo amps, for bi-amping reasons as aforementioned in an earlier post.)

Two Sarah's would be sweet, but I still have to set aside dough for a good preamp.
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #14 - 03/02/23 at 22:38:16
 
"Two Sarah 300Bs" Yes Indeed, now you're talkin'! I'm curious about the bi-amp arrangement offered by the AK6 as opposed to filtering between the preamp and amps with an active crossover unit or even a passive filter. Are you able to adjust slopes and crossover points or is it fixed?
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cxc>tubadourIIIse>cj pv-1>firebottle kt-88>78 khorns; Sarah 300B on order
sme15/309>eq-500>D. Had 6flv-v>lii audio silver 10
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mattwardpictures
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #15 - 03/03/23 at 03:52:48
 
Active equalization, room correction and time alignment of all three drivers is the Holy Grail, and if the DDRC-88A from MiniDSP wasn't sold out due to semiconductor shortage, that's what I'd be shooting for. The DDRC-88A really is designed to be an active crossover for custom 3-way main speakers plus stereo subwoofer system. (If I happened to get stereo subs at some point.)

The MiniDSP SHD (still currently for sale) can time align and room-correct for four channels (Highpass L/Lowpass L, Highpass R/Lowpass R), so that might be a viable option if I'm sure subs won't be added in the future.

But for now, I'm happy to make do with passive bi-amping.
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #16 - 03/03/23 at 04:12:16
 
I am using a UFO2 with a pair of Heresy IV's, and I love the sound. They are more than enough for my small room. This is my first experience with horns, and I couldn't be happier.  That is until the next pair...
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #17 - 03/03/23 at 12:58:10
 
I currently have Jubilees bi-amp'd with Ufo2s.  Jubilees require 4 channels of amplification so bi-amp was mandatory.  I started with Fortes moved to AK6 then to the Jubilees.  I also have a tolerant wife.

I drove the AK6s with a single Ufo2 and was very happy with he result.  I was on a path to the 300B with the AK6s when I received an offer I could not refuse on the Jubilees.  Too spendy for me to bi-amp with 300Bs.

If the concern is volume of the AK6s with a single 2.3w Ufo2, I found that I could make that combo uncomfortably loud if I wanted to.
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mattwardpictures
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #18 - 03/03/23 at 14:13:17
 
Hi Danny Boy,
Congrats on the performance with the UFO2 and Heresy IVs! Sounds like a fun combo. I came to horns from Maggies, and I doubt I'll be going back any time soon. So what if absolutists relegate me to the status of a mere 'music lover' rather than audiophile? Every time I visit my local audio store to 'recalibrate' my ears on their many Wilsons, I go home and find I'm not wanting for much, because thanks to horns' efficiency at coupling of drivers to air, they can do dynamics like nothing else outside of ludicrously silly money and concomitantly silly stupid wattages.

Kirk...
I have to tip my hat to you sir, you're at the Klipsch Heritage summit my man. But good to hear that you got good performance driving AK6s with a single UFO2.

However, the Clarkson on my shoulder says I still need two. Grin
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #19 - 03/03/23 at 15:40:37
 
Yeah, I totally get the Clarkson on the shoulder whispers.  Not sure what your room logistics are and what the cabling plan is, but I located the ufo2s close to the speaker with the sources some distance away.  The ufo2s have xlr input available as an option so I opted for that.  End result was short speaker cables with longer xlr interconnect runs.  Worked out well.
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mattwardpictures
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #20 - 03/03/23 at 16:52:12
 
Quote:
The ufo2s have xlr input available as an option so I opted for that.  End result was short speaker cables with longer xlr interconnect runs.  Worked out well.


Exactly my plan, Kirk!
Ideally I'd like to get the rack out from in front of the fireplace (!!) and along the adjacent wall. This would mean XLR runs of 30'+, but that's why balanced connections exist.
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #21 - 03/03/23 at 17:19:39
 
Set-up, distances etc etc.. can be a real pia. Especially for those of us that don't have a dedicated room. Ours is the living room, as most are. We got lucky with our home many years ago. Even looked for one that we knew would work for our system..to include the surround speakers. Being from an area in the sticks, we got very, very lucky finding a home at all...especially one that would work a bit easier for gear placement. Great post Matt and responses too. Awesome, helpful and knowledgeable folks here..  [smiley=icqlite20.png] ~Mike
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mattwardpictures
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #22 - 03/03/23 at 19:56:19
 
Good day Mike! (Soon-to-be briefly blustery day for us in MI, however)

My system is in the living room as well, and being the only practical area in the house to set up a hifi, really influenced what speakers I wanted. They needed to be tall enough to sing over the furniture and seating.

I look at Klipschorns, or any corner horn to be a perfect living room speaker; tight corner placement means that they allow the room to be... a room, and not an electromechanical obstacle course. Tongue

I'm really enjoying everyone's responses! You've all been very helpful.
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #23 - 03/04/23 at 14:30:41
 
Awesome Matt. Completely agree. And having the speakers over the tops of chairs couches etc..surrounds included.  [smiley=icqlite20.png] Stay warm over there in Michigan. A little nippy at times here too. Pretty 'nice' March morning though.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPKs2Quk6Ts
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #24 - 03/04/23 at 19:56:49
 
I've been wanting to upgrade from CW2 to either Klipschorn AL6, La Scala, or Volti Rival. I only have 31" from corner to an exterior door.
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #25 - 03/06/23 at 13:39:47
 
Hi Joey,

I haven't auditioned the Volti Rival or La Scala, and all I can say about the latter is parroting other people's reviews and opinions.

However, if you have the cash and the right size/shaped room to place them in, Klipschorn AK6 is an endgame speaker. Cornwall IV's aren't bad either! (I don't know if you've heard of Paducah Home Theater TV on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/@PaducahHomeTheaterTV/videos), but if you want to get a sense of how different Klipsch speakers compare and contrast to each other, they're one of the best resources online.)

As for the doorway, is it on an adjacent wall or the front wall? I was worried that I'd have an attenuated bass response because I've got an archway on the right side of my living room that my right channel speaker sits inches from. Perhaps this can be confirmed with measurements, but in the year and a half they've been in my house, I've been having too much fun to care that much.

YMMV, as they used to say. I'd predict that the distance from corner to doorway (31") would not matter that much, since the speaker is going to be tightly wedged in the corner anyway. Or with just enough clearance to be able to adjust toe-in to your listening position.

Hope this helps!
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #26 - 03/06/23 at 16:42:34
 
Thanks Matt. BTW, my se84ufo2 coupled with the zrock was fantastic in my 25 by 30' room with the CW2s. Ceilings sloped from 9-13', not a small space at all.
I'm using the Aric audio 300B now and it's even better but I still have the zen in a smaller space and fwiw this little 2.3 wpc beauty will never be topped. I had the 25th but liked the ufo2 better.
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #27 - 03/07/23 at 13:42:04
 
Joey,
In what ways is the Zrock complementing the character of the SE84UFO2? And how did the 25 fare against that combo?
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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #28 - 03/07/23 at 20:49:26
 
The 25th compared to the ufo2 surprised me in that while the 25 may have been a bit more precise, the ufo2 (with 25th mods) had more weight and low end information. I got the ufo2 here used so I think it was more seasoned? I'm not sure but I feel like it's the greatest amp Steve ever turned out, I know that's not the case but it surely seems so to me.

The zrock2 just enhances the whole spectrum of tones, lower mostly but well into upper mids also. Once you put it in, you cannot unhear it. This is assuming that high quality tube is employed of course. For digital it's especially useful if you need to tame poorly recorded material.

My decision to sell the 25th was also based on being able to gather over twice the $$ vs the ufo2. With the Aric 300B plus the WE tubes alone costing 8k+ and the wife factor,,I had to do what I had to do.lol

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Re: Any Klipschorn/Decware amp owners here?
Reply #29 - 03/07/23 at 20:56:19
 
It is amazing what years of seasoning does for these amps: after years of heavy use they are better, no question in my mind.
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