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Augie Style OB Bass (Read 63722 times)
Tripwr1964
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #100 - 05/25/17 at 03:35:57
 
my name is trip, and i have an ob problem....

cancel future shipments of Kool Aid please.

note: i am giving away a set of 15" baffles on classifieds if anyone interested.
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CSP3 25yr, CAD 120s MKII, Sunfire Signature600, Sota Star Sapphire, SME309, Hana SL, JC3+, Schiit bifrost multibit, CXC, MG1.6QR w/ ext xo & mye stands, OB Augies. herbies iso, VH audio flavor diy pwr cords, Beden 8402 & Dueland IC's,
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Donnie
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #101 - 05/29/17 at 14:56:01
 
I just got thinking about everyone's experiences with OB bass drivers and am thinking that everyone has came to the same conclusion that thicker is better.
I'm at 1.5" thickness of MDF myself, plus a thin layer of veneer and a much thicker layer of shellac, lol .
Anyway, are we using the wrong material? Is there something else out there that would work even better? Granite, Corian, cast concrete, aluminum, or perhaps some sort of laminate?
Anyone have any ideas?
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Jeff of Arabica
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #102 - 05/29/17 at 18:04:37
 
I wouldn't discount density of wood.  Thickness is not wood's only measure for robustness.  The Bubinga wood in my Caintuck Augie baffles is like lead - heavy and dense.  I would surmise similar benefits as 1.5" cuts of less dense material.
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Canary Audio Grand Reference Monos//ZMA//Zen Ultra//Taboo MKIII//Waversa DAC3//ModWright Oppo UDP-205// PS Audio P20//Canary Audio MC-10//Van den Hul Colibri "Stradivarius"//FFYX T1803 TT//SonoruS Reel-to-Reel & tube playback preamp//Tannoy Westminster Speakers
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DBC
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #103 - 05/29/17 at 21:49:14
 
I think it is a balance between finding a material with Mass (that will not move independent of the driver cone) yet does not Resonate.

Resonant = to continue to produce a loud, clear, deep sound for a long time.

In the East (China & Japan) bells were made of stone in many cases. In the West bells are typically made of metal. In either case for their resonant properties.

I tired concrete shelves for my audio rack. It was like my gear was on a paint shaker. Concrete and steel (both are very dense) are great conductors of mechanical enery (vibration).

DBC
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Main System: Oppo BDP-105D, SE84UFO amp, Omega Super Alnico Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 15's (Low Frequency Open Baffle).
Room #2: Oppo BDP-83SE, SE84CS amp, Omega Super 3i Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 12's (Low Frequency Open Baffle).
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Jeff1
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #104 - 05/30/17 at 01:41:30
 
So here is a thought for the OB design. The baffle from what I have read contributes at least two ways. Thickness/density relating to vibration control. Width/size relating to responsiveness. Yes or maybe no I am not an expert in the design. What if the driver can be mounted or supported independent of the baffle. For example a 1/8" gap between the perimeter of the driver essentially a floating baffle. If the baffle has no other reason than supporting the drive why not eliminate it altogether to avoid the material issue. Or does a free in the air mounted driver loose something?
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Lin
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #105 - 05/30/17 at 03:52:30
 
"What if the driver can be mounted or supported independent of the baffle."

Paging Mr. Content from down under.

Not completely independent; but close.



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Jeff of Arabica
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #106 - 05/30/17 at 08:01:49
 
Quote:
I tired concrete shelves for my audio rack. It was like my gear was on a paint shaker. Concrete and steel (both are very dense) are great conductors of mechanical enery (vibration).


I can see where this could be a problem with audio hardware, but who is to say that categorically speaking, the conduction of vibration is a negative attribute to a OB speaker baffle?  No wood is completely immune to vibration.  Vibration will no doubt influence the sound but whether it has a positive or negative influence is to be determined.
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maddog07
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #107 - 05/31/17 at 22:29:24
 
I suppose there's a reason many a speaker cabinet has been made from baltic birch ply over the decades... My Betsy baffles are BB ply.  

I also use a very thick, nearly 3/4", closed cell foam gasket between the driver frame and the baffle.  Just using the "touch" method, the baffles don't vibrate much at all.  But they still do at a couple of frequencies.  I also have a back brace down the back center of the baffle.  I suppose the air born sound waves are still exciting the baffle a bit, even if driver frame motion is not.

I have not tried direct mounting the drivers to the baffles - yet.  Randy has, and I discussed with him - he said he could not detect much audible difference between gasket or no gasket.

It is possible that the baffle could resonate at some sympathetic/desirable frequency and actually contribute to the sound in a pleasing manner.
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stone_of_tone
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #108 - 08/16/17 at 17:18:53
 
Now, with 3.5 months on my:

Caintuck Audio Eminence Alpha 15" Open Baffle BASS Unit
at 53Hz, with my Velodyne CHT 130 watt/ch plate amp and 0 degree phase.....at 1/8th volume on plate
Plate Amp....regen'd clean ~ plugged into P3

(Open Baffle 15", not in use all the time....approx. 50% of the time.....the best integrated bass)

ONE OF THE BEST VALUE'S IN HIGH-END AUDIO!

.....close 2nd, is my ARC Line Stage LS-2B MkII......I only use about a 3rd of the time.....nice to have.

.....and of course, my ZDSD driven direct to my ZMA.....stomps everything.....IMO.

I use my OB, in a minimalist way.....just enough underpinning foundation when I want!
(For my Room size & Acoustic Treatments=dialed in).

My suggestion, buy one:

http://www.caintuckaudio.com/In_Stock.html
...Scroll to the bottom of the in stock page....I got the barrel shape for my 15", in walnut stain~very sweet.








Listening Room:



Room Treatments from Michael Green & Home Brew


Sony as Transport (DVP-NS57P)


Illuminati D-60 Digital Coax IC ~.5 meter


Shunyata Research Zitron Alpha Digital Power Cord to ZDSD {Significant}


Decware ZDSD DAC / Recorder ++
***************************************************************
W/Steve's Output Transformer's/kicking to the Curb quite a few superb DAC'S
***************************************************************
(@ -20 Ref Level, 0.0 Input volume and @ 16/192)


WBT RCA Kimber Select KS1030 ~.5 meter


Audio Research Pre w/remote volume & mute LS-2B MkII
NOS Platinum/Mullard 7308/E188CC / Cryogenic

(ARC Pre rotated in and out...approx. in, only 25-30% of the time)


WBT-0102Ag RCA Kimber Select KS1030 ~.75 meter


{ Tungsram PCC88/7DJ8.....in inputs right now~stellar}
Decware Zen Mystery Amplifier
~BIASED at *56* mA~
NOS/Platinum/Mullard E188CC/7308's in my A12 an B12 Input positions Cryogenic~NOS/Platinum/Telefunken E88CC/6922 for Inverter Tubes~NOS RCA 0A3's & matched Quad/Tung-Sol KT66's

ZMA adjusted at 20% to 30-40% max ~ from 0 Gain ~ w/ZDSD Direct
ZMA adjusted at  80-90% or 100% gain ~ w/ARC Line Stage, running via Remote Volume Control



***************************************************
Kimber Select KS6063 Speaker Cable 8ft WBT-0681-Ag Spades
***************************************************
Kimber 8TC new/white & clear jacket/to remind me of how fluid/timbre correct and good the KS6063 are



Acoustic Zen Adagio - Black Pearl (Modified)
.....enjoying from 8 ohm ZMA Taps


Caintuck Audio Eminence Alpha 15" OB BASS Unit
at 53Hz, with my Velodyne CHT 130 watt/ch plate amp and 0 degree phase.....at 1/8th volume on plate
Plate Amp....regen'd clean ~ plugged into P3

(Open Baffle 15", not in use all the time....approx. 50% of the time.....the best integrated bass)







Acoustic Zen Adagio's x-over's Modified/Full Range with Mundorf MCap Supremes-single Cap to each Tweeter/4.5k cross
(Gutted: 3kHz/18dB/Octave, Linkwitz/Riley Crossovers....with all crappy parts = gone)


XLO Pro Power Cord to ZMA
PS Audio P3 Power Plant / Pangea AC-9SE from wall to P3
(Transport, ARC Pre, and ZDSD, Regenerated/*120*~ Multiwave off...ZMA on High Current Output).

++ ZDSD DAC, kicked to the Curb: Auralic Vega, PS Audio PWT & PWD, PS Audio Direct Stream DAC, Chord Qute, NAD M51 (twice) & Schiit Yggdrasil.


~All NOS Platinum Tubes from Upscale Audio/Kevin:

(Great Britain) Mullard 7308/E188CC ~  2 pair (both pair Cryogenic)
(Germany) Telefunken E88CC/6922 ~ 1 pair (painfully expensive/worth it)
(US/Great Britain) Ediswan CV2492/6922 ~ 2 pair (one pair Cryogenic)
(Hungary) Tungsram 6922/E88CC ~ 1 pair
(Hungary) Tungsram PCC88/7DJ8 ~ 1 pair.

From Cryoset:
(Russia) 6N23N/P-EB ~ 2 pair

(Russia) 6N23P's ~ 2 pair/came with ZMA.        
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Room Treats-M.Green & mine
Sony TPort
Illuminati D60
Shunyata Z-Alpha DigPcord
Decware ZDSD DAC
Kimber Select KS1030
XLOProPcord
Decware ZMA/25th Mods
Kimber Select KS6063
Acoustic Zen Adagio/Modified
Kimber PK10 Palladian from wall
to PS Audio P3
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Palomino
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Posts: 2368
Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #109 - 08/17/17 at 15:01:20
 
BTW, I picked up another Crown for my cottage OB rig for an offer of $100.  I was in extremely good shape.  Looked like it had hardly been used.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/263135929405?ul_ref=https%253A%252F%252Frover.ebay.com%2...

This will replace a Dayton audio plate amp where I was summing the signal.

Use of this amp requires the construction of a magic cable, which is just an RCA plug a resistor and some wire.
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stone_of_tone
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Posts: 3217
Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #110 - 08/17/17 at 15:36:17
 
Hi Pal. I did read over this thread again. I should get away from summing with just my one plate amp. The Crowns are tempting. However, for my room size w/treatment.....my/Randy's OB is spot on and I'm happy with it. .....but one OB for each channel and stereo Crown...would be great, I know.

Pal, not to get off topic. But, what are those Russian input tubes you're enjoying and can I get them anymore? I'm Pat, with my System and enjoy rolling input tubes........... .

I have my, (Hungary) Tungsram PCC88/7DJ8's in right now as inputs.....wonderful tubes!
https://www.upscaleaudio.com/products/tungsram-pcc88-7dj8?variant=21828951877
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Room Treats-M.Green & mine
Sony TPort
Illuminati D60
Shunyata Z-Alpha DigPcord
Decware ZDSD DAC
Kimber Select KS1030
XLOProPcord
Decware ZMA/25th Mods
Kimber Select KS6063
Acoustic Zen Adagio/Modified
Kimber PK10 Palladian from wall
to PS Audio P3
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Palomino
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Posts: 2368
Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #111 - 08/17/17 at 16:18:42
 
Stone, here are two sellers on eBay.  I have purchased from both.  

http://www.ebay.com/itm/6N23P-E88CC-6922-6DJ8-MatchedPAIR-REFLEKTOR-SingleWire-S...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-x-6N23P-6DJ8-ECC88-PAIR-REFLEKTOR-Single-Wire-1975-Sil...

I do not have as much confidence in the first seller.  Tubes came without a box and the pins were not clean.  These were quite possibly pulls and not NOS.

The second seller's tubes came in box and the pins were clean.  Please note this particular auction is for 1975 tubes - supposedly the best year, but note the seller advertises them as weak.  Thus the low price.

Steve was gracious enough to allow me to test both sets and both tested OK, but the second seller's tubes were definitely stronger.

I would recommend that you follow the second seller or contact them to see if they have NOS 1975s or 1974s.  I am using 1974s right now from the second seller and they are very good.

You could also source them stateside but I don't see them come up very often.  Typically I see them used.  

The key is to get Single wire getter, silver shield, Reflektor from 1974 or 1975.   Also note that there are more pairs available from the '80s but I have read that these are more middle of the road.  Also, they come in a Grey Sheild variety but these are also not as good.
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stone_of_tone
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #112 - 08/17/17 at 16:30:24
 
Thanks Palomino. I will follow the 2nd seller jetparts going forward.
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Room Treats-M.Green & mine
Sony TPort
Illuminati D60
Shunyata Z-Alpha DigPcord
Decware ZDSD DAC
Kimber Select KS1030
XLOProPcord
Decware ZMA/25th Mods
Kimber Select KS6063
Acoustic Zen Adagio/Modified
Kimber PK10 Palladian from wall
to PS Audio P3
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Jeff of Arabica
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #113 - 08/17/17 at 16:35:59
 
I have purchased (9) '75 Reflektor's (Holy Grail) from the second seller.  NOS tubes, testing strong, generally go for $189 from this seller.  When I purchased my first pair they went for $169.  My last set purchased went for the $189.  I can fully vouch for the second seller.  I had a set that came in with one tube cracked.  I sent an image of the damaged tube and one with similar specs was promptly sent out.  

They do take quite a while to arrive - so if you do order from this seller, the transit time is close to 30 days, like many other overseas sellers.  

I have four '75's in my ZMA, four in my Ultra, and one in my Taboo.  The tubes live up to their reputation.  But, stock being limited, I am eventually going to have to find a replacement. I should be good for at least 2-3 more years based on my listening habits.  

I also have four of its sibling tube, the '74 Reflektor.  I use two in my Ultra and have a spare on hand.  They too are great tubes.  I have rolled them in my Taboo, along with the '75's, and they have a similar sound signature, but would give the edge to the '75.  It just does a little better in bass extension, treble clarity and sound staging.  Can't go wrong with either though.
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Canary Audio Grand Reference Monos//ZMA//Zen Ultra//Taboo MKIII//Waversa DAC3//ModWright Oppo UDP-205// PS Audio P20//Canary Audio MC-10//Van den Hul Colibri "Stradivarius"//FFYX T1803 TT//SonoruS Reel-to-Reel & tube playback preamp//Tannoy Westminster Speakers
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Jeff of Arabica
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Posts: 968
Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #114 - 08/17/17 at 16:41:04
 
Here is a very detailed, comprehensive review of these two Reflektor tubes, and many others, by a respected member of Head-Fi.  

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/6922-tube-review-17-top-6922-6n23p-e88cc-cca-730...
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Canary Audio Grand Reference Monos//ZMA//Zen Ultra//Taboo MKIII//Waversa DAC3//ModWright Oppo UDP-205// PS Audio P20//Canary Audio MC-10//Van den Hul Colibri "Stradivarius"//FFYX T1803 TT//SonoruS Reel-to-Reel & tube playback preamp//Tannoy Westminster Speakers
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stone_of_tone
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Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #115 - 08/17/17 at 16:42:10
 
Thanks Jeff. I am certainly going to try and get a pair and see how they fit into the rest of my NOS Platinum pecking order of tubes.
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Room Treats-M.Green & mine
Sony TPort
Illuminati D60
Shunyata Z-Alpha DigPcord
Decware ZDSD DAC
Kimber Select KS1030
XLOProPcord
Decware ZMA/25th Mods
Kimber Select KS6063
Acoustic Zen Adagio/Modified
Kimber PK10 Palladian from wall
to PS Audio P3
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Jeff of Arabica
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Name the greatest of
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Accident.

Posts: 968
Re: Augie Style OB Bass
Reply #116 - 08/17/17 at 16:48:21
 
It has been while so I went back in to double check my 75 purchases and I did actually get a pair from the first seller as well.  I can't recall box/no box or the condition of the pins, but I have that pair in use at the moment and they have not failed or caused any audible issues.  Performance wise, they are on par with those purchased fro Jet Parts (2nd seller).
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Canary Audio Grand Reference Monos//ZMA//Zen Ultra//Taboo MKIII//Waversa DAC3//ModWright Oppo UDP-205// PS Audio P20//Canary Audio MC-10//Van den Hul Colibri "Stradivarius"//FFYX T1803 TT//SonoruS Reel-to-Reel & tube playback preamp//Tannoy Westminster Speakers
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