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Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project (Read 20425 times)
Lonely Raven
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Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
02/02/17 at 15:20:51
 

I figured instead of cluttering up the CDApS thread, I'll start my own. I'm putting it here in General because (as we all know) this is the most viewed section. Plus, this is part DIY, part Home Theater, part Members System, and of course with me it's lots of Sound Treatment. LOL  So General it is. I may go do specific things in other areas, but for now I'm going to post pictures and think out loud in this thread.

So to gather and rehash - my room is kind of a cluster. It's not quite a dedicated listening room, as it's my only decently large room in the house which is my living room - which is L-shaped. The main part (if I remember correctly is 25' long, and 15' wide, with only 8 foot ceilings. The front right opens into a small dining room area, and I have a large cutout in the right wall that opens into the kitchen. Behind the couch are stairs to the front door and long hall to the three bedrooms. So very less than ideal - and when I bought this house and setup this room, I was engaged and taking a break from two channel audio.  Now I'm single, and audio is as much a part of my life as anything else, this room needs a bit of a revamp.

What prompted this update was my trusty 8 year old Mitsubishi HC5500 projector  died after many thousands of hours of binge watching TV shows, movies, and Movie Nights with friends. I really don't have a "TV", so it's projector or nothing (or small computer screens I guess).  So with a new, 2017 model projector on order, I realized it's probably time to update to an "acoustically transparent" screen, and getting my home theater speakers up and off the floor giving my reference speakers (the very last Decware MG-944) room to breath.

This is kind of an extreme example as I was "testing" lots of different equipment, building speakers, subs, and testing some vintage speakers, plus (again, single living LOL) putting diffusers all over since I'm building and testing those as well.




Lots going on here - RPG diffusers and absorbers on the ceiling with the old projector nestled in. EPS foam and custom DIY diffusers and various absorbers and corner trap around the room, Five(!) pairs of speakers all fighting for space up front. Two(!) glass and aluminum low slung gear shelves side-by-side between and behind the speakers...what a complete cluster! But, I still manage to get some great sound out of this...even Palomino was surprised as how good it sounded with this hodge-podge going on.




Overall goals:

New Projector with BIGGGGGER "acoustically transparent" screen.

Move HT L-C-R speakers behind the screen freeing up some space.

Sell off, store, or repurpose unused gear, freeing up more space.

Figure out something to do with the glass and aluminum audio racks and gear (vertical rack off to the side? Blacked out panel under screen? different room and long cables??) Also freeing up space.

Finish building 2nd 18" sub - figure out issue with 21" sub, and work on better placement of all three.

Front of room should be nothing but speakers in use and sound treatment.

Sort through and sell off or repurpose sound treatment not in use. Of the sound treatment I'm keeping, repaint, frame, and/or mount to walls. Also come up with a quick diffuser deployment scheme for critical listening (AKA CDApS meets) for in front of screen, or possibly behind screen.

Get REW and measurement microphone working, relearn the software and take measurements to properly tune the room as best as is possible with a non dedicated room.

Phew, that's a lot...I'm a bit overwhelmed and I'm the damned fool who put the list together!  I might add/remove/adjust things as I make progress on this list.  Speaking of...

Adding: figure out better lighting and lighting controls for room.  
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stone_of_tone
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #1 - 02/02/17 at 15:27:01
 
Totally cool LR. Look forward to reading and getting some tips on improving my modest Listening Room....Acoustic's.
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Lonely Raven
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #2 - 02/02/17 at 15:28:43
 

Crazy panoramic photo of the room - you can see diffusers scattered all over, a couple bass traps in corners, my big cherry stained oak "space invader" looking diffuser diffuser on the back wall (middle of image). Stairs and hallway behind couch. Hard to wrap your head around if you've not seen the room before, but it's all there.  :)

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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #3 - 02/02/17 at 15:34:37
 
Cool LR. Very nice perspective of your passion too.

Off to work I go. Geez, my 29 hours a week is almost more work than my real job was! Anyway, I digress.

Look forward to more on this LR............. .

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Lonely Raven
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #4 - 02/02/17 at 15:47:36
 
Diffusers and absorbers on the ceiling. Diffusers have been sold and are coming down tonight to ship. New projector will have to be moved back about 2.4' to accommodate future 2.40:1 screen




Current Speaker Lineup - The Klipsch will go up and behind the screen (unless I can finder something better/smaller and swap them out). Blue Zu speakers are up for sale, and the venerable MG-944 speakers are staying. El Camino speakers are still occasionally put into rotation and will be put off to the side.




Current screen setup - I built this 120" diagonal screen 8+ years ago. It's literally a lightly textured white melamine counter top material I bought in a roll from Menards, that's stapled to a 2x4 frame, edged by window casing (trim) covered in Joanne fabrics black velvet. Comparable to a $1200 screen, for under $200!  Note: the vertical blue tape on the wall is the size of the future screen(!).  To get the Klipsch speakers behind the future screen, I'll have to float it 12"+ off the wall. I'd much rather find some smaller, but equally dynamic HT speakers than have the screen protruding into the room that much...I need to find something or deal with what I have - but budget is kinda non-existent.





New projector came in a day early - spent a few minutes last night (2-1-17) getting it setup in the old projector's mount/location. The new one is clunky with manual (twisty knobs) lens adjustments, zoom, and focus and all that...I didn't realize how high end my old projector was with everything being done via remote and little motors...8 years ago!  I wasn't too impressed with the projector at first, but then two things struck me #1, I realized I was watching with most of the lights on! Something I couldn't do without washing out the image before. And #2 as the bulb started to break in, the blacks got blacker and the image settled down and just looked so much nicer. Supposedly a projector lamp loses 25% of its output in the first 500 hours, then tapers down slowly after that.





Tonight I take down diffusers sold (box them up and ship), and move my fleet of diffusers to another room to give me space to work.

A phrase I never thought I'd ever say, but....I have $90 of spandex on the way!  (for my future screen)

More Later - I have to do this work thing now.
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Lonely Raven
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #5 - 02/07/17 at 19:41:25
 
I haven't been super motivated, but I haven't been idle either. Minor update.

$90 worth of spandex arrived (LULZ)




Pulled the "mobile diffuser lab" out of the room and parked it in the spare bedroom (later this year when I have more projects down, this room might turn into a dedicated 10' x 10' x 8' Zen amp chamber - man that's going to be a huge challenge). This is about half of my current diffusers.




Man down, man down!!
A friend gave me a couple tubes from a big box he picked up at an estate sale - I was planning on using them for an art project...yeah, this one got away.





Went to the local (decent) lumber yard and picked up some *really* long boards. I was considering laminating a bunch of 1/2" thick poplar 4" wide to make the 151" long 1" x 4" box frame for the spandex screen.  But managed to pick through a big pile of 14' long 1 x 4 poplar and found THREE good, mostly straight pieces!  I wish I had the materials to make a nice, light weight square aluminum tubing frame...but I don't even know where to start finding and buying 151" lengths!  






I'm getting the feeling my subwoofer is a little bit big to be used as a side table in this corner like I was thinking...hmmm.




All the gear is pulled, glass and aluminum audio racks have been moved out, and pet hair from dogs and cats that no longer live here as been vacuumed  out...it's kinda trippy - this space hasn't been empty like this in 9 years!







I need to get off my butt and build this frame, which is going to be about 62" tall (might stretch the spedex a little taller if I can) and about 151" wide. Then wrap, staple, and hang...then figure out how and where to reassemble all my gear that was in the middle of the room.

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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #6 - 02/07/17 at 20:30:05
 
I'm thinking you already did make an art project, that's a nice pic of the broken tube. Could be a motivational poster or a perfect sadness emoticon for a tubehead.

JD
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #7 - 02/08/17 at 04:30:34
 
LR....that is one nice setup!!  The panoramic view is a great shot.  

Question.....what projector did you wind up going with?  I am going to be gutting my house in the upcoming year, and will be in the market for a new Projector.  

Unfortunately the dedicated listening area will probably be in the new loft with a back balcony setup. Talk about the worst place to pick, but I don't think the wife will allow me to setup shop in the living room where diffusers and absorbers will be deployed.  

Luckily I got the green light to put a 4 post lift in the garage to house the sports car.

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Lonely Raven
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #8 - 02/08/17 at 07:14:00
 
Quote:
I'm thinking you already did make an art project, that's a nice pic of the broken tube. Could be a motivational poster or a perfect sadness emoticon for a tubehead.


(looking back at image) damn, that's a great idea!!  Anyone have any caption ideas??

Quote:
Question.....what projector did you wind up going with?  I am going to be gutting my house in the upcoming year, and will be in the market for a new Projector.  


I went with the Epson Home Cinema 3100. I probably should have gotten the 3700 considering how WIDE I'm going (more lumens on the 3700, otherwise pretty equal projectors), but my goal was to try and stay around $1000 and just have *something* to hold me over till 4K projectors come down to a price us mere mortals can afford.  

Looks like the price went up on both of these! I paid $1179

https://www.adorama.com/iespl3100.html

https://www.adorama.com/iespl3700.html


If you can swing it, and want something more serious, I'd be looking at a projector in the $3000-$7000 range that has motorized lens adjustments, and lens memory, and maybe even laser instead of a traditional lamp.  

I did a lot of research and got what I think is the *best* projector in the just over $1000 range - it's powerful (bright), and has (manual) lens adjustments, and decent contrast. It's good all around. And the 3D really surprised me with how good it is, and I don't even care much for 3D.
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Lonely Raven
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #9 - 02/08/17 at 07:19:04
 
I didn't get far building the frame for the spandex screen tonight. All the poplar I got warped between the lumber yard and me starting to cut it. I had to get creative with how to cut the pieces to size to try and trim out as much warp as possible...and where it wasn't possible to trim out, I put the warp in a direction that gravity will pull flatter once it's hung.

So, I was hoping to have the frame assembled and first coat of black on it tonight, but I only got as far as cutting, pocket holeing, and put three sides of the frame together before the poplar split and I jammed a big ass splinter into my hand. I decided to take a break...well, go to bed since it's 1:18am and I need to be up in a few hours. Goodnight all!
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #10 - 02/10/17 at 15:44:47
 
LR take a look at 2020 Series Aluminum Extrusion. Its not as long as you need but they sell all kinds of adapters/corners to put them together and make frames out of them. These are used for CNC tables and enclosures.
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #11 - 02/10/17 at 16:24:23
 
I don't know.  I think I'd separate the home theater from the listening setup.  Maybe the HT on one side and the listening at the other end but not together.

It makes me wonder what kind of reflection noise happens with a huge monitor between the loudspeakers.  
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Lonely Raven
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #12 - 02/10/17 at 16:55:52
 

You mean 80/20?

I've been using that for projects for years, and was my first choice...but the cost would ruin this project.

I am however working on an 80/20 extrusion gear rack experiment that I'm building - but that's put on pause to build diffusers for Axpona.
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #13 - 02/10/17 at 17:05:19
 

It's been a crappy couple of weeks. Projector died, then my microwave died, and now my dishwasher died. I'd think I'm having power issues and it's killing off my appliances...but the truth is just bad timing. The projector was from 2008, the Microwave from 2002 and the Dishwasher from 1999. LOL

Anyways, no real progress made because I've been replacing and repairing stuffs. I needed a distraction so I threw the receiver, blue ray, cable box and P10 on a small oak equipment rack that I've had since 1993 or so, and setup a real basic surround sound to watch some TV.

Note: the picture isn't usually this washed out - I had to bump the brightness to show the gear. Also, I picked up some inexpensive in-wall speakers from Monoprice that I'm considering putting in really shallow boxes behind the future screen, so I don't have to have the projection screen 13" off the wall in order to fit the Klipsch 8.5s The in wall speakers sounded terrible on the floor, but I just slapped this together to watch The Magicians and The Flash.  ;)




This is more like it!




I just hope the spandex screen looks as good (when I finally get time to build it).
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #14 - 02/10/17 at 19:13:35
 
Yes the 80/20 stuff. I think the 80/20 is the company but 2020 is the size. I know there is also a metric and standard version under different numbers. I think the 2020 is the metric version. The stuff is expensive but would be perfect for what you need it for.
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #15 - 02/10/17 at 22:43:27
 

Quote:
I don't know.  I think I'd separate the home theater from the listening setup.  Maybe the HT on one side and the listening at the other end but not together.

It makes me wonder what kind of reflection noise happens with a huge monitor between the loudspeakers.  


I really need to hit the road, so I can't elaborate as much as I'd like, but I simply can't separate the two. At least not yet. Maybe if i can afford to compltely renovate my basement, I can move the audio setup down there, but the really low ceilings would be crushing to the sound.

Also, yes, the solid surface screen sucks, as does all the gear between the speakers. I tried to mitigate this as much as I could with two tricks I came up with (And Steve approved LOL). I tilted the bottom of the screen out slightly, so it wasn't parallel to anything, and reflections were directed up to the ceiling diffusers. I also lined the whole back of the panel with acoustic blanket, basically making it sort of a big loose but absorbent drum. It surprised me how much it changed the bass in the room, but that's not always a good change.

The future screen will be "acoustically transparent", and the front wall (behind the screen) will be lined with 2" acoustic blanket, and I will have easy to deploy diffusers I can prop up (or hang) in front of the screen during critical listening sessions and put away when done. All the gear between the speakers is getting moved off to the side somehow. But that's turning into such a big issue as all the outlets and cabling were run to the middle of the wall, not the sides. It's going to add a lot of time to this project if I have to open up the walls and crawl into the attic to move the outlets and in-wall speaker lines and HDMI around.

Quote:
Yes the 80/20 stuff. I think the 80/20 is the company but 2020 is the size. I know there is also a metric and standard version under different numbers. I think the 2020 is the metric version. The stuff is expensive but would be perfect for what you need it for.


The audio rack I'm building I bought some B-stock 4040 for. I got it at an amazing deal, so I bought eight 48" lengths!  I've also used the 1" 80/20 to make a frame for a brass and bullet tumbler that I cobbled together from a blower motor to a furnace, and john deere tractor parts for belts and pulleys, and a PVC tub with screw on end caps to hold the media and brass to tumble.  I'll post a video if I can find it...I'm really proud of my McGuyver job.  :)
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #16 - 03/27/17 at 21:48:37
 
Finally got time to make some progress. I had a friend over who was tall enough (and agile enough) to help me take down the old screen and hang the new screen. So I spent some time putting the new "acoustically transparent" screen together, and we watched a few movies this weekend!

It's hard to tell from this photo, but the screen is HUGE. 150" across, 63" tall, which gives it a Cinemascope diagonal of about 163", or a 16:9 (HD) screen size of 129".  Basically I'll be using the zoom feature on the projector to fill the screen when I have a Cinemascope movie, and everything else standard HD I'll just fill the screen height, and maybe make black borders to block the extra width.  (this will make more sense once I get it fully setup and show the photos)

Yeah, doesn't look that big. I used Poplar 1x4 for the outer frame, and oak 1x2 for the vertical braces  



Did some Flat Black paint - used some good quality spray, and had two coats knocked out in less than an hour. Don't want anything to reflect back through the screen.







I got the tall girl to help carry the frame out of the garage into the driveway, then up the front steps, into the kitchen, then swing back into the living room. The Kreg pocket hole jig is pretty amazing, just some glue and screws and I had this giant, but lightweight frame strong enough to easily carry around the house. Laid it on some black Spandex, and started stretching and stapling in place. The material was 60" x 4 yards long. I realized after stapling it up, I could easily have made this screen another few inches in each direction(!) but seriously, it's big!



After getting the black spandex on, I put the white spandex over it. The theory being that the black spandex helps contrast at the cost of a few lumens, and also blocks any stray light from reflecting off the frame or speakers to be hidden behind the screen. While it was upright, I leaned it in front of speakers while music was playing, and the high frequency attenuation was very slight - probably a good thing considering I'm planning on putting some Klipsch L-C-R behind it.



Whipped up some french cleats from some 4 x 4 cedar I had left over from another project.






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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #17 - 03/27/17 at 22:11:28
 

And here it is hung - I boosted the brightness to give you an idea of it's scale. The movie on the screen was Passengers, which is a Cinemascope movie - you can see how the shape of the image will match the screen, but I have to move the projector back about 2' (including the mount, power, HDMI and all that run through the ceiling) to get it to zoom out correctly to fill the screen. In it's current position, this was as large as I could go. The old screen was 120" diagonal to give you an idea of the size difference!!




Here is more what it looks like during movie watching. The contrast looks so much better, though some brightness was lost compared to the old screen...the newer projector is so much more powerful though - with the old projector, I had to have every light shut off, but with this one I could keep some lights around the seating position on without messing up the viewing...which is great, because I got tired of people (**cough**ex-fiance**cough) complaining about eating the dark and living in a cave.



On the To-Do list:

I *need* to move the projector back about 2 feet to fill the screen. That's going to be a PITA with the cabling, but I'll figure it out.


I need to make bigger french cleats to float the screen a few inches further off the wall in order to clear my DIY Supertrap bass trap in the left corner, and be able to fit some decent sized speakers behind the screen. Right now I'm still using my MG944 and Klipsch Center Channel - I'd really like to have a full set of Klipsch (or whatever) behind the screen. Unfortunately my Klipsch towers are 12.5" deep, and that's a bit far off the wall - so I'll  probably be selling them and getting some dynamic bookshelf speakers of some sort that will do the same job.

Part 2 of the above, I want to add some wood blocks to the back-bottom of the screen with screws to adjust the stand-off from the wall - that way it gives me another method to square up to the projector, since my walls aren't straight by any stretch.


I also need to put some absorption material behind the screen. While the old screen was a sheet of countertop laminate and very reflective, I had the backside of it completely lined with 2" acoustic blanket left over from my Decware CWAL builds from...like 18 years ago. LOL Now that the old, heavily damped screen is gone, and the new "acoustically transparent" screen is in place, I hear a whole bunch more echo in the room, at all frequencies!  I need to clean that up!  The theory being that I will deaden everything behind the screen, and the immediate ceiling in front of the screen for movie watching, then slide some giant (but hopefully lightweight) diffusers in front of the screen for critical listening....adjust as needed.


Then the rest is putting the two channel audio side of the room together and tuning...all of which could be a whole nother post by itself!

I'll post more photos once I get the projector moved later this week!




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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #18 - 03/27/17 at 22:14:31
 

Oh yeah, added project/bonus points - I'm seriously thinking about putting some RGB LED strip lights behind the screen to accentuate how it's floating  off the wall. They would be WiFi enabled and controlled by my phone of course.  ;)

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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #19 - 03/28/17 at 00:31:17
 
DAMN, LR! You need to put in a popcorn machine, and start selling tickets.

Just a thought about speakers for behind the screen - Martin Logan Frescos are only 5" deep, and are fairly dynamic. The have wall mounts, too. Or maybe I should say HAD wall mounts, since they aren't in current production anymore. I still see them fairly often on Craigslist, though, and they really aren't very expensive. $2-300. each. I sold my L&R, but I still have one that I use as a center channel in my secondary HT setup. May not be the ultimate in HiFi (they don't go down very far into the bass region), but they are clear, and shallow front to back.
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #20 - 03/28/17 at 17:26:51
 
Looking good LR.  Time to spin some good concert footage with an awesome sound stage that I am sure you will achieve.
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #21 - 03/29/17 at 17:28:55
 
After my 3 hour drive home from work, I had a bee in my bonnet to make some progress. I pulled *everything* back out of the front of the room, and made a plan on what to do with the wiring. In order to *fill* the bigger screen, I needed to move the projector back. I spent over an hour taking measurements of the room (damn, my walls are off by a full inch from one end of the room to the other!!) the screen and how it hangs in the room, and the projector mount to get an idea of where I was, then started measuring out where the current projector needs to be. Wow, about 3 feet back!  Crawl up into the attic and try to pull cables and see how much slack I left myself. Looks like I need to re-run one speaker cable, and build a longer power cable for the projector to get everything running...but I'd also really like to move the audio gear off to one side, and the home theater gear off to the other. That could mean tearing into the wall, running conduit, moving (dedicated) power outlets etc. (sigh) The things I do for my "art". I even went as far as to pull my supertrap bass traps out to get the screen aligned better, and will probably recover them with different material and re-deploy.




So I got the projector mount moved...I had to crawl into the attic and toenail in a 2x4 between the 2x8 so I had something solid and reliable to mount my Epson projector to!. I ghetto-rigged a computer power cord to the end of the current 25' projector power cord, but it looks like I'm needing to buy and run a longer one as I can't stand rigging something to work, even if nobody sees it but me. HDMI had just the right amount of slack and easily made the adjustment. But as I said, one speaker cable was short for moving the HT gear off to the side - so it looks like I may be re-running everything. In for a penny, in for a pound.

At this point it was 3am and I needed to be up for work in 3 hours and 15 minutes, so I snapped a couple quick photos after doing a basic alignment of the screen and projector. It's off by 1/4" here and there, and the screen has a hint of warp to it after all this man-handling, but it's all instantly lost and forgotten once that 12.5 foot wide image comes up!  

Some iRobot and Force Awakens action, then shower and bed.  I'm hoping I don't get too embroiled in this project right now, because I have some electrical issues in the house to suss out, and I still need to build diffusers for Axpona. So it might just sit this way till the end of April so I can focus on diffusers.









Sorry for the slight tilt in the images - I was very, very exhausted at this point, and fixing the tilt in the computer results in slight image quality loss that drives me a little nuts.  ;)


Thanks for those speaker recommendations - I like the idea of 5" deep Martin Logans! There is a (cosmetically) damaged center channel up on eBay right now I might grab to see what the fuss is about. Right now though, I'm super broke, and I really should just sell my Klipsch *before* I start putting anything else on credit cards! LOL

Oh yeah, one final note - I just quickly slapped everything together, and used my Dad's old Alesis Studio One Monitors as my L and R with my giant Klipsch center, no adjustments to the system, no subwoofer, and it simply sounded amazing! I'm not sure what changed, or maybe I was just so exhausted I was hallucinating, but it was simply stunning sound in these two movies for the few minutes I watched!

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stone_of_tone
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #22 - 03/29/17 at 18:02:45
 
Wow, very nice/impressive. I, Robot with Will Smith never looked better!
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Room Treats-M.Green & mine
Sony TPort
Illuminati D60
Shunyata Z-Alpha DigPcord
Decware ZDSD DAC
Kimber Select KS1030
XLOProPcord
Decware ZMA/25th Mods
Kimber Select KS6063
Acoustic Zen Adagio/Modified
Kimber PK10 Palladian from wall
to PS Audio P3
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JD
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #23 - 03/29/17 at 18:20:47
 
Damn,

I wish we were neighbors!  That looks tremendous.

JD
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Bottlehead
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #24 - 03/29/17 at 18:52:50
 
YeeHa! Party at The Raven's!
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Lonely Raven
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #25 - 03/29/17 at 20:20:50
 
Quote:
YeeHa! Party at The Raven's!



Back in the day I used to host movie nights every other week, or at very least Monthly at my place. We'd do cocktails, popcorn, and kick back and enjoy a movie.

I really miss those days. That, and the fact that I cracked my old solid surface screen while moving it, and my projector died back in January...all prompted me to rebuild better and cleaner than it was and start hosting again. Except it's a bachelor pad now so...

I like to think of it as: Netflix and Chill - Grandmaster Level  ;)

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Bottlehead
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Re: Raven's Haven Cinema and Listening Room - Project
Reply #26 - 03/29/17 at 20:52:34
 
I like it! You should change your handle to "Grandmaster Chill". (Or if you don't, somebody else should)!
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