Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Decware Audio Forums
04/23/24 at 21:00:33 




Pages: 1
Send Topic Print
DSD Upsampling in Audirvana (Read 23826 times)
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
08/23/16 at 03:04:52
 
I went in to change some of my settings in Audirvana and noticed that they now have DSD up-sampling.  Just trying it now, but it sounds pretty good.  My DAC is limited to DSD64.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #1 - 08/23/16 at 11:55:06
 
I noodled around the web.  Reaction has been positive.  

I did find that my CPU runs a little hotter.  I tried nearly all the filters and didn't notice much difference.  It loads songs fairly slow given its crunching as it loads, but only once did it not keep up.

The only thing I didn't like is that I lose volume control (I do on all DSD material).

Definitely worth a try.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
stone_of_tone
Seasoned Member
****


Listen Often/Listen
Deep

Posts: 3217
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #2 - 08/23/16 at 13:35:30
 
Gives me the bug to make some more DSD Recordings......(ZDSD). Cool.
Back to top
 
 

Room Treats-M.Green & mine
Sony TPort
Illuminati D60
Shunyata Z-Alpha DigPcord
Decware ZDSD DAC
Kimber Select KS1030
XLOProPcord
Decware ZMA/25th Mods
Kimber Select KS6063
Acoustic Zen Adagio/Modified
Kimber PK10 Palladian from wall
to PS Audio P3
  IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #3 - 08/23/16 at 21:13:53
 
By the way, it also has a Tidal interface now with a 3 month trial.  I'm not much of a streamer, but I will check it out this winter.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Ellsworth
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 120
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #4 - 09/01/16 at 02:48:06
 
I just launched this version of Audirvana today and am now upsampling to DSD.  This is very nice - I can see what the fuss over DSD is now.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #5 - 09/06/16 at 21:19:47
 
Yesterday I launched it and it keeps crashing.  It could have to do with my drive not delivering the data fast enough.  I fear it is on its last legs.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Ellsworth
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 120
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #6 - 09/07/16 at 02:33:48
 
I'm not sure if this will help but I read on CA that the A filters are a bit easier on the CPU than the other ones.  I am still surprised that upsampling to DSD made such a big impact on the sound.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #7 - 09/07/16 at 02:42:41
 
I read that too.  I changed filters and no problems.  Not sure I understand because the other day I ran all of them with no problem.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #8 - 09/09/16 at 15:49:57
 
DSD playback has become my standard despite some quirks.  Its the closest to analogue that I have experienced in my rig.  I don't even like going back to PCM now.

I am interested now in hearing Eric's ZMA again on my speakers playing DSD.   DSD playback seems to eliminated the last bit of digital and/or single driver glare.

What is interesting is that I have native DSD material that does not sound a smooth???

By quirks, I mean the crashing situation.  It happened again last night.  It definitely has to do with the song load not keeping ahead of playback.

I think it has to do with what drive I am reading off of.  I have an internal SSD and an external spinning firewire drive.  Load seems far slower with the SSD which seems odd.  The Audirvana program is actually being read from ramdisk.  I upped the ram available to Audirvana but that didn't seem to have an impact.

I will check the thread on CA to see if anyone else has this issue.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 3567
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #9 - 09/09/16 at 17:44:47
 

You busy this Sunday? Maybe it's time for another mini CDApS meet?

I still want to build a Windows PC for you to try out - I wonder if there is a software that does the DSD up-sampling on the Windows side?

Again, now you're seeing what I've seen in the DirectStream for the past year. Good DSD is the closest thing to Analog, and somehow seems to smooth out CDs and draw out more information!

I just wish more people got it.  :)
Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #10 - 09/09/16 at 17:52:17
 
I am tied up for a few weeks.  Not sure we can get this done before the fest.  Last year didn't work out, but we should try to get some time together at Steve's.

I also heard a Sony player that up-sampled everything to DSD at Holm Audio and was impressed.  It was only about a grand but a closed end system and didn't have that big a hard drive.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 3567
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #11 - 09/10/16 at 07:44:48
 

I'm flying solo this next Decfest. I have my room reserved and everything.

I'll bring some of my home brew mead to try out.  :)
Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #12 - 09/11/16 at 13:54:36
 
Well I figured out the crashing issue.  It only crashes when the sync to music library is happening.  Unfortunately this is on auto and takes a little while.  I'll have to read the manual and see how to make it manual.

Raven, let's put some demo songs together: PRaT, Bass, soundstage, female vocal, etc.  just a couple of songs in each category.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
beowulf
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1447
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #13 - 09/11/16 at 22:44:54
 
Make sure to get the Rolling Stones 2003 remasters in DSD.  I have a lot of great stuff on DSD, but these in particular really stand out to me and show what the DSD format is capable of.  They are my go to DSD samples when I want to impress somebody and even sound great on non DSD capable DACs converted to PCM through JRiver.

Yeah the remastering has a lot to do with it, but the combination of attention to detail and the DSD format itself is pretty freaking awesome IMO.

Talk to LR ... he should have some of them. Wink
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 3567
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #14 - 09/11/16 at 23:45:03
 

Which of the Rolling Stones version are the "best" though. Those ABKCO remasters were done in CD, Hybrid-CD, SACD, and HD-Tracks has them as well.  Any particular version I should seek out?

Pal, I'm up for putting together another demo set, but I really don't have a lot of new stuff that I felt is as good as the same tracks I've been using for the past 2+ years. If you have any suggestions, I can go to my "sources" and seek them out as well.

Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #15 - 09/12/16 at 01:59:39
 
I am mostly putting it together based on tracks I have as well.  I have some new stuff that I got from axpona.   Also some stuff I heard on the radio.

Here are my cartegories so far:

PRaT
Bass
Soundstage
Female vocal
Sense of room

The idea is without geeking out to much I'd like to evaluate each setup with a common set of songs.  Maybe just one per category.  

Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Matchstikman
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 759
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #16 - 09/12/16 at 02:05:20
 
Speaking of DSD; just when I'm getting my head around it I am starting to read about MQA.  What is up with that?
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
beowulf
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1447
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #17 - 09/12/16 at 09:52:46
 
Lonely Raven wrote on 09/11/16 at 23:45:03:
Which of the Rolling Stones version are the "best" though. Those ABKCO remasters were done in CD, Hybrid-CD, SACD, and HD-Tracks has them as well.  Any particular version I should seek out?


The SACD/.DSF ~ there should already be some in your collection as I sent them to you.  Specifically you should have the following:

1966 - Got Live If You Want It!
1969 - Let It Bleed
1971 - Sticky Fingers
1972 - Exile On Main St.
1974 - It's Only Rock 'N Roll
1976 - Black And Blue

There are more out there, but that's all I have in my collection.  They were re-mastered by ABKCO sometime between 2002-2003.  You can tell a lot of work went into them and I'm sure even the CD versions sound good, but if you can get the .dsf's ... stick with those!

Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 3567
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #18 - 09/12/16 at 17:01:26
 
I've listened to some you've sent my way - I don't recall it being that many albums. I'll have to double check now to see what I have.

Thanks again for that - I remember one of those albums really blew me away.
Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #19 - 09/26/16 at 01:57:16
 
OK, I have figured out the crashing situation and now pretty stable playback.  It's really only on the first song in an album/playlist where the trouble appears because it loads continually into memory so subsequent songs are fine.

Anyway, the DSD playback has really helped the single driver sound.  I don't think I had so much shout as I had digititis in my playback that was made more apparent with the single drivers.

I have been rolling various input tubes and those deemed too bright before are fine now.  Really enjoying the single wire getter 6n23ps now where I could not listen to them before.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #20 - 10/01/16 at 13:31:52
 
I am officially hooked on DSD up sampling in Audirvana.  If you are mac based, it is a night and day difference.  Songs I could not listen to before are sublime.  You lose digital volume control which is a big deal for me, but you gain analog sound.

I may break out my rolling mini setup again and bring to the fest this year to get other people's take.  If I set it up it will be late Friday night/early Saturday morning.

Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Ellsworth
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 120
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #21 - 10/03/16 at 16:12:32
 
I am of the same opinion with the DSD upsampling.  Having tried it, I cannot go back to standard PCM.  The only issue is that I get occasional stutters and once in awhile my left channel completely drops out.

The noise from the computer is also a drawback.  I may look at a solution to get a computer with more power and also get it out of the listening room.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #22 - 10/03/16 at 16:19:19
 
Hmmm.  I haven't experienced those symptoms yet.  

Have you seen a thread where people are mentioning issues?  I looked when I was experiencing the crashes and haven't found any.

I am hoping he fixes some of the stability issues because this is a keeper.  I compared to LP last night and granted, I don't have a very good vinyl rig, but it compared very well.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Ellsworth
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 120
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #23 - 10/03/16 at 17:00:03
 
I see occasional mention of stutters over at the long thread on CA.

This DSd upsampling is so good that it is making me consider trying a HQPlayer/m Rendu combination.  That seems like an awful lot of work but getting rid of the computer in the listening room would be great.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 3567
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #24 - 10/05/16 at 12:50:49
 

If you can use a PC - I have some decently powered laptops and Tiny Form Factor desktops for sale really inexpensively. Used business grade Lenovo machines, and the TFF desktops are literally about the size of a mousepad! I've been building them up as audio PCs for myself for about two years now. Message me if you want to experiment on the PC side.   Grin
Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 3567
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #25 - 10/05/16 at 12:52:27
 
Oh, I forgot to add - Palomino, I've been busy with family issues, but I'm getting those tracks you wanted tonight. We can chat about how to get them to you later if you'd like.
Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #26 - 10/18/16 at 21:37:44
 
I have been playing with this trying to figure out exactly what is going on.  

I installed an app that allows me to monitor CPU usage in real time in the toolbar.  Seems during the initial crunching, I am near or at 100% of the CPU.  Once the track is loaded, the CPU usage drops down to 6% during playback.  It's just on the initial load where there is danger of the crash.

If I wait a bit on the load of the initial song, it seems to play well the rest of the playlist.

Seems my old 2010 Mac mini doesn't quite have the processing power.  Although I have read of people running DSD upsampling with less.

I am going to try a few things but I might end up buying a used mini with a higher powered processor (like an i5 or i7) and then swap out my power supply, RAM and SSD from the old mini.

A hassle, but worth it to me for the SQ.  I won't go back to PCM - at least with my current speakers.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 3567
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #27 - 10/19/16 at 16:29:10
 
Pal, I'm going to be delving into the DSD upsampling as well. I'm going to be building an i5 Tiny Form Factor PC and running HQ player out to my DirectStream DAC. I'm also considering picking up a used TEAC or TASCAM unit for the computer desk/spare bedroom system that I pretty much have all the parts for. If you feel like switching to the dark side, I do have these great Tiny Form Factor i5 processor machines for sale cheap!

Also, speaking of digital audio - I sent Steve a message, and while I know we all tend to haunt the General forum here at Decware, Steve was nice enough to create a Digital Audiophile section for us to start populating! I'm going to start posting some links and neat info I'm finding while doing my research - and it would be a great place for us to post our digital exploration expeditions.  ;)

I totally missed Matchsticks question about MQA above, so that's going to be one of my first posts over in the new section. I'm hoping we can keep this new forum going, since there seemed to be quite a bit of Digital Audiophile talk during the last Decfest.  :)

Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #28 - 10/27/16 at 18:23:45
 
I have been eyeing a new mini with a faster processor over on ebay.  I may pick it up for my birthday.  Crashes are too frequent on my 2010 mini and the sound is too good to go back to PCM.

While the dark side intrigues me, I will stay with the mini because I have the SSD and linear power supply, ram, etc.to juice it up.

Somehow, I fried my external firewire drive, so I am running completely off SD cards and that is sounding pretty good too.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Ellsworth
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 120
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #29 - 10/28/16 at 03:17:30
 
I am in the same boat as far as not going back to PCM.  I should not have spent the money but I just picked up a new 2012 mini with an i7 processor.  Like you, I have been running a 2009 with a LPSU.  I'm looking forward to running 128 or 256 with the new Mini

Eventually, I will put a PSAudio LANRover or Sonore MicroRendu in the chain.  Digital can sound really good that's for sure.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Palomino
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2474
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #30 - 10/28/16 at 04:03:18
 
That's what I am looking at.  Anxious to hear if it has the horsepower.
Back to top
 
 

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers
  IP Logged
Ellsworth
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 120
Re: DSD Upsampling in Audirvana
Reply #31 - 10/30/16 at 15:15:51
 
I will report back in a week or two once I get it up and running
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Pages: 1
Send Topic Print