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Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help! (Read 13331 times)
Dave1210
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Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
08/08/16 at 22:20:26
 
Has anyone had a problem with Radio Frequency Interference?  If so, what did you do to solve it?

I live in an apartment building in the city and have neighbors all around me (it seems like I can pick up wireless signals from everyone in the building).  I have systematically shut off my circuit breaker in an attempt to find the offending circuit/device(s), but I haven’t found anything, so I think the source might be external.  

Many of my electronic devices pick up the RFI including my stereo, guitar amp, powered monitor speakers, etc.  The RFI is least strong/offensive with my Decware stereo, but I can hear the interference if I get close to the speakers and there are times when I can hear it from my listening position.  In general, music sounds great, but I’m still bothered by this and wonder how much better music would sound if I could block the RFI.  

As far as I know my interconnects/speaker cables are not shielded, but I’m not sure shielding would help.

Thoughts?
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Lon
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #1 - 08/08/16 at 22:40:50
 
Shielding will help with the stereo, that's how I fixed my RFI issues when living in Austin. I then had issues with guitar amps, but the best cables I had in a box must have also had some shielding, anyway they cured it.
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Donnie
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #2 - 08/08/16 at 22:53:42
 
You could make a Faraday Cage from some window screen material. Make sure that it isn't plastic!
We had RF problems at work once, Making the cage fixed it right up.
Not the prettiest thing, but they do work.
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Dave1210
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #3 - 08/08/16 at 23:43:50
 
Thanks for the quick responses guys.

Lon...the guitar amp is particularly bad...I will try a shielded cable there, which should be a much smaller investment vs stereo cables.

Donnie...I'm sure my wife will love a Faraday Cage...she might think its appearance an improvement over some of the room treatments I have.  
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Rraymond
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #4 - 08/09/16 at 22:27:44
 
Guys I've had this noise problem since day 1 I've been battling. It's essentially the Rega RP3 tonearm picking up noise from both the Zp3 and Torrii JR. In my room it's difficult to get the TT far enough away to significantly reduce it. Does anyone know what type of noise this may be and how to shield the TT tonearm from picking it up?  Also does anyone think this noise is contributing to the sonic issues that I'm hearing(mainly midrange vocal distortion)?
Thanks,
Rick
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Lon
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #5 - 08/10/16 at 00:39:25
 
Interesting, as I don't find my tone arm picking up noise, but I did have more noise than I thought I should from the phono in the past. Careful routing of power cables fixed that for me.

In my system midrange vocal distortion and/or "recessed vocals" have been aging tube problems.
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Archie
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #6 - 08/10/16 at 00:58:58
 
Toward the bottom of this link there is a good trouble shooting guide.  

http://www.kabusa.com/setup.htm
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Dave1210
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #7 - 08/10/16 at 01:49:54
 
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Dave1210
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #8 - 08/13/16 at 20:05:35
 
I just tried some shielded XLR microphone cables as interconnects and they did not help.  I can still hear some RFI if I get close enough to the speakers.    Interestingly, qualitatively the RFI is louder on the left speaker vs. the right.  Not sure what is going on there.
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Palomino
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #9 - 08/15/16 at 23:30:35
 
Dave, you sure it's RFI and not some other gremlin?  The  channel difference has me wondering.  I had this buzz going on and tried a lot of stuff only to find out it was actually the left RCA jack on my Dac. Anyway just a thought.
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Corey
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #10 - 08/16/16 at 02:46:30
 
Dave,

Few possible solutions:

Guitar amp : Since you mentioned this is the most obvious, let's start here. I would suspect (3) sources here:
Guitar, amp or cable in that order of importance IMO.
1.Guitar : The magnetic pickups are very susceptible to picking up RF noise and depending on the design, they may be noisy themselves if you have a no-hum cancelling single coil like a Strat. What guitar do you have and what is the pickup configuration? Are you pickups single coil or humcancelling? I play an original 97' maple body Parker Nitefly which originally had an S/S/H pickup configuration in the pickguard. I played a Dimarzio HS-3 for years and wired my guitar to only use the neck pickup. I installed an on/on/on switch and can play the pickup in series coils, parallel coils or split the windings for true single coil. As soon as I split the coils the noise factor goes through the roof. It is so bad I never play the middle position, just series or parallel. Then I discovered this:

http://www.wdmusic.com/parker_nitefly_m_pickguard_nfm_8228bk.html

WD music makes a H/H configured pickguard for my guitar. I immediately ordered a Seymour Duncan Pearly Gates neck pickup and kept the on/on/on switching. I then ordered (4) of these :

http://www.partsconnexion.com/spoints-70605img.html

1 sheet applied to the entire back of the pickguard, then another part of a sheet for the bottom of the electronics cavity, and then the sides of the cavity. I would recommend a PEC 250K pot, carbon and silent then star ground(common) everything; bridge, pickup selector switch and output jack to the volume's grounding lug. Use a test light and check for continuity through the bridge(and subsequently the strings)...
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Corey
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #11 - 08/16/16 at 03:00:12
 
Guitar continued...

Next comes the amp. Same idea. Use the ERS noise RF/EMI sheets and wrap one(trimmed for size) around the power transformer of your amp. These sheets are of a special design and don't need to be grounded, unlike most regular copped foils or mu-metal compounds. You can also by the ERS strips and wrap the input leads going into the preamp :

http://www.partsconnexion.com/spoints-66632img.html

What guitar amp do you have? Is it all tube? Should be easier to work inside if it is.

Next comes the guitar cable. I suspect this isn't the source since most guitar cables are shielded. Nevertheless I would spend some cash and build your own to make sure. It will sound better as well. I recommend the Cardas Reference musician's cable which is a good sounding cable and easy to make up. It is on sale right now and is basically $10.00 per foot so drop a hun and make up 10 feet :

http://www.partsconnexion.com/79370.html

Use this same cable in your guitar cavity to go from the volume control, to the output jack, I recommend the Switchcraft output jacks for your guitar and the mono-jacks for your cable :

http://nextgenguitars.ca/products/switchcraft-11-1-4-mono-jack.html

http://nextgenguitars.ca/products/switchcraft-280-1-4-mono-straight-plug.html

They also have 90 degrees :

http://nextgenguitars.ca/products/switchcraft-226-1-4-mono-right-angle-plug.html...

...
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Corey
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #12 - 08/16/16 at 03:12:19
 
Next the stereo. Do you have a turn table? Start there. Definitely go with a shielded co-ax type of interconnects with you phono-stage.

Basically the same principle applies. I wouldn't be afraid to spend $300.00 dollars and buy a dozen of the ERS sheets and line everything. Go to town on all your gear. Personally, any manufacturer that is charging $1500.00 or more for a piece of audio equipment should be using these sheets completing their entire chassis before they put a single component in there IMO. If they have to charge an extra couple hundred dollars, I would gladly pay it. A metal chassis is simply not enough of a shield and faraday cages are unsightly and really not needed if you do your homework. Hope this helps!  :)

Happy troubleshooting!

Corey
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Corey
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #13 - 08/17/16 at 00:24:01
 
I read that you or somebody else got hum in one channel only on their hi-fi system. Most likely this is the channel closest to the power transformer and wrapping the transformer with an ERS sheet and/or all leads with the ERS shield strips should be all that's needed.

Corey

P.S. Tweek Geek also has these sheets if you live in the US :

https://www.tweekgeek.com/stillpoints-ers-rfi-killer/
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Dave1210
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #14 - 08/17/16 at 01:11:14
 
Hi Corey.  I really appreciate all of your help!

To answer a couple of your questions above 1) my guitar is a Gibson Les Paul 2) my amp is a Fender Deluxe Reverb.  I typically use a Hot Plate to attenuate volume so I can drive it to tube break up without going deaf, but my speaker cable went bad and I haven't yet replaced it.  In theory, I should be in better shape due to the humbuckers.

I tried switching interconnects left vs. right and that doesn't shift the noise in my hi-fi.  I then unplugged my interconnects and I can still hear the noise in the left speaker, but not the right.  I should have done the latter first, which would have saved me from interconnect exploration.  That said, a happy discovery is that the shielded mic XLR cables I am now using sound excellent.  They are Canare Star quad cables.  Anyway, back on topic...

Next step is to switch my speaker cables (left vs. right) and see if the noise switches sides.

I will report back.  
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Dave1210
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #15 - 08/17/16 at 01:51:09
 
Ok...making progress...

I switched the speaker cables at the amp and have successfully gotten the noise/interference to move from the left speaker to the right speaker...

I like to have the amp on for about 20 minutes before I turn it off again...so I am waiting...



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Dave1210
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #16 - 08/17/16 at 02:13:11
 
Corey...I have two of the ERS shield sheets (8x11) and wrapped them around the transformers.   No impact on the noise...
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Dave1210
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #17 - 08/17/16 at 03:03:29
 
Replaced the ZMA with the CKC and the left/right channels appear to be the same.  I don't think I'm hearing interference in either channel.  If I turn the amp up loud enough, I do hear a slight hum when I get very close to the speakers and the character appears to be the same in both channels.  That said, I need to take a break and come back to this tomorrow...to ensure my ears aren't playing tricks on me...

Also, I will switch the left/right tubes in the ZMA tomorrow and see what happens...
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Corey
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #18 - 08/17/16 at 17:20:56
 
"I then unplugged my interconnects and I can still hear the noise in the left speaker, but not the right."


Probably isn't your source, pre-amp(if you have one) or cables then, that`s good!  Seems to be your amp. Take it apart and wrap the power transformer with a single sheet of ERS trimmed up. Cost you $25.00  :)

Corey
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Corey
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #19 - 08/17/16 at 17:29:21
 
Corey...I have two of the ERS shield sheets (8x11) and wrapped them around the transformers.   No impact on the noise..

I would suspect the pre-amp leads inside the amp then. Especially if its focused on one side. I would leave the full size ERS sheet around the transformer(unless you want to use both inside your Les Paul) and buy some ERS strips and wrap all leads :

http://www.partsconnexion.com/spoints-66632img.html

I would rather have a completely silent guitar set-up than hi-fi. I find buzz really throws my focus off when trying to pick fast runs. I can relax in a chair and listen to hi-fi and tolerate some noise because I don`t have to do anything besides tune it out and the music covers it up usually.
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Dave1210
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #20 - 08/18/16 at 14:13:13
 
I switched all of the left tubes with the right tubes (including the OA3's) and the noise didn't move.  It appears to be something with the left channel on the amplifier.

I wouldn't feel comfortable opening up the amp, so I think it's time to give Steve a call to discuss further.  

Corey...RFI from the guitar setup is very annoying.  Regarding the hi-fi, such beautiful music flows out of that system it bothers me it's not perfect.
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Re: Radio Frequency Interference (RFI), Help!
Reply #21 - 08/18/16 at 22:09:32
 
This happened quite a bit to me at the old place that I lived at ... actually in the literal sense ... I usually leave my PC on 24 hours a day and only reboot it every once in a while.  It was late one night I had turned the lights off and ready to go to bed, you can imagine my surprise when my computer started talking to me ~ I about jumped out of my pants ~ it was just these random numbers, at first I thought OMG my ship has come it and these were the winning lotto numbers (I was going to buy one of everything Decware makes), but then I realized that it turned out to be some guy on a ham radio and that somehow my PC had picked up the signal and was broadcasting it through my bedroom.

Grin
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