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To plinth or not to plinth (Read 8897 times)
Matchstikman
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To plinth or not to plinth
06/26/16 at 07:12:47
 
I have a very early version of the MG944s.  Somewhere along the time of production a plinth was added to the design.  Mine, they have no plinth.  I had a friend over to listen to some music and I was told that my loudspeakers would sound better if they had a plinth instead of just standing on tile.

They already sound good; however, to plinth or not to plinth?  I look around and a company called Mapleshade make a thick plinth but they aren't cheap.  

So, to plinth or not to plinth.  Would a plinth improve the sound?

Somewhere in my distant future are some HR-1, but for now I have these.
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mark58
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Re: To plinth or not to plinth
Reply #1 - 06/26/16 at 13:50:37
 
Here is your solution, for $120.  I have these under my speakers and Sub Woofer in my main system.  Do a search of this site and you will find much written about their benefits.  Two Sub Dudes will get it done.  Mark.

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/SubDudeII?adpos=1o1&creative=54989966161&...
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"The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not moved with the concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, deceptions, and spoils;
The motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Hell. Let no such man be trusted." William Shakespeare
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DBC
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Re: To plinth or not to plinth
Reply #2 - 06/26/16 at 21:22:47
 
I use the Subdude Isolation platforms as well. I think you will hear an improvement especially since your speakers are placed on tile. I find the platforms help especially with bottom ported speakers.
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Main System: Oppo BDP-105D, SE84UFO amp, Omega Super Alnico Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 15's (Low Frequency Open Baffle).
Room #2: Oppo BDP-83SE, SE84CS amp, Omega Super 3i Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 12's (Low Frequency Open Baffle).
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Matchstikman
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Re: To plinth or not to plinth
Reply #3 - 06/27/16 at 02:55:04
 
I may try these.

Thanks.

I just hope they don't suck the bass complete out.
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DBC
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Re: To plinth or not to plinth
Reply #4 - 06/27/16 at 15:16:21
 
Quote below can be found at this link: http://www.htguys.com/news/2010/12/5/auralex-subdude-video-review.html




Quote:
@Mr VI

Your question comes up all the time. I will answer it in two parts:

First, re: concrete - having a decoupling device in place absolutely makes a difference when you have a concrete floor! Many people are under the misconception that concrete is inert. Concrete is FAR from inert. Concrete moves and shakes. Typically, a concrete floor or walls will have more mass than typical wood-frame construction. So it takes more energy to get more mass to move. But when that greater mass DOES move, it actually transmits sound energy more effectively because it is a denser material. Ever seen that famous film of the concrete bridge rolling like a wave when a strong wind got it moving at its resonant frequency? Concrete is anything but solid and inert!

In your case, what might actually make the SubDude/ GRAMMA less necessary is your thick carpet. As I said, a thick carpet pad will already act as a decoupling device. The question is whether or not your subwoofer or tower speakers have managed to couple to the floor simply by crushing the carpet under their weight or if they have "feet" of some kind. If your subwoofer or speakers have "spikes", "cones" or "nubs" on the bottom, you can be fairly sure that those "feet" will sink deeply enough into your carpet that they will act to couple your subwoofer/speakers to the floor. If your sub/speakers have "feet", then the SubDude/GRAMMA will very likely still make a noticeable difference. If your sub/speakers do not have any "feet", then it is much harder to predict. The whole point though is to "float" your subwoofer/speakers so that they do not couple with the floor. If your carpet pad and carpet already achieves this "floatation", then the SubDude/GRAMMA won't make much of a difference. But any sort of "feet" will pierce or sink deeply, and just a very heavy sub/speaker might simply crush even thick carpet.

One easy way to predict: if you go into another room while bass is playing, can you easily hear the bass in that adjacent room? If so, your subwoofer is almost certainly coupled to the floor! As Ara said, with the SubDude in place, the "bleeding" of bass into other rooms is cut down dramatically! If your thick carpet is already effectively decoupling your subwoofer, you won't have this "bleeding" of the bass into other rooms to begin with!

Regardless though, concrete is never a reason to forego decoupling. Concrete construction will shake and decoupling makes a very noticeable improvement, just as it does with wood-frame or metal-frame construction.
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Main System: Oppo BDP-105D, SE84UFO amp, Omega Super Alnico Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 15's (Low Frequency Open Baffle).
Room #2: Oppo BDP-83SE, SE84CS amp, Omega Super 3i Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 12's (Low Frequency Open Baffle).
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Matchstikman
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Re: To plinth or not to plinth
Reply #5 - 06/27/16 at 15:40:02
 
Good info.

As I found out yesterday my loudspeakers are not only on concrete/tile, they wobble slightly.  Geez, how is that?
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Matchstikman
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Re: To plinth or not to plinth
Reply #6 - 06/27/16 at 15:50:05
 
ok, consider this.  How about a sheet of neoprene rubber, about 1/4 inch thick between the loudspeaker and floor?
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Archie
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Re: To plinth or not to plinth
Reply #7 - 06/27/16 at 16:28:54
 
If decoupling is the goal a sheet of neoprene alone wont do it since the frequency spectrum is so wide.  There have been a lot of systems/approaches discussed on this Forum based on personal preference.  They range from different footer types to platforms.  I favor a platform that uses springs under my HR1s.  The speakers will sway if they are bumped but they are effectively decoupled from the floor.  I find that the bass response is tightened and boom and mush is eliminated.  At first this can be perceived as a loss of bass but that is because a lot of what we hear as bass can be just feedback and noise.
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ZLC
Technics 1200G TT w/ Ortofon Jubilee MC cart
ZMC1
ZP3 (25th A Mods)
ZR2 (25th A Mods)
CSP3 (25th A mods)
ZMA (25th A mods)
Homemade Big Betsy Speakers (F15s)
Silver Cabling
DIY Isolation platforms under amps & TT.
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Matchstikman
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Re: To plinth or not to plinth
Reply #8 - 06/27/16 at 16:47:43
 
Archie, who makes the platform that uses springs that you use?
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Archie
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Re: To plinth or not to plinth
Reply #9 - 06/28/16 at 01:13:55
 
I made them.  I put all of my amps, TT and speakers on them.  Will, from the Forum tried one under his CSP3 and with some additional damping material found it improved his sound.  If you PM me your email I can walk you though building a pair to try.  It's an inexpensive and simple concept but you'll need a few tools.
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ZLC
Technics 1200G TT w/ Ortofon Jubilee MC cart
ZMC1
ZP3 (25th A Mods)
ZR2 (25th A Mods)
CSP3 (25th A mods)
ZMA (25th A mods)
Homemade Big Betsy Speakers (F15s)
Silver Cabling
DIY Isolation platforms under amps & TT.
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Matchstikman
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Posts: 759
Re: To plinth or not to plinth
Reply #10 - 06/30/16 at 01:23:42
 
I just got a couple of Subdudes and put them under the MG944s.  At first I thought the bass had been sucked out but then I started to hear things in the upper register.  Strange.  After a while I adjusted to the restrained bass.  I think before the bass had been bloated.

I played a few different things and everything sounds tighter than it was and not so wild.

So, it is all good.

Thanks for the tip.
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DBC
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Re: To plinth or not to plinth
Reply #11 - 06/30/16 at 15:58:03
 
Often with speakers coupled to the floor (spikes through carpet or hard feet on tile) this will cause the floor to vibrate and that vibration is transmitted out to the walls. In other words the floor and walls are creating added low frequency noise via the vibration. This increases the noise floor in your room which tends to obscure delicate bass notes as well as micro-detail further up in the frequency range (Not So Strange). Thus the Bass is tighter / more distinct and you can hear additional detail higher up in the frequency range.

Glad it's working out for you.
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Main System: Oppo BDP-105D, SE84UFO amp, Omega Super Alnico Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 15's (Low Frequency Open Baffle).
Room #2: Oppo BDP-83SE, SE84CS amp, Omega Super 3i Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 12's (Low Frequency Open Baffle).
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