Forums - Assistance with voltage drops

Fireblade

Seasoned Member

Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 1046

Assistance with voltage drops
02/04/15 at 12:16:00

I'm now finally convinced I need additional AC power support beyond my faithful Trip-Lite 500 Isolation Transformer. The reason is, at peak demand times the mains voltage seems to lower and my SPL decreases proportionately. The difference with non peak times is very evident.

I usually try to skip the high peak hours when listening, but fairly recently my schedule forces me to do otherwise with the described results.

I do not want to spend much in this, so that right there is a constraint. But, I would be willing to pay for something that works (say, eliminates 80% of my current voltage variations during peak hours), and which has been already tested hands-on by members of this forum probably sharing similar conditions.

I also need an affordable, but good enough brand name (not audiophile sophisticated) power cord to feed my DAC.

In the past, I've been reluctant to invest into power conditioning due to limited resources (still limited) and other system's priorities. I think Steve's essential recommendation of an Isolation Transformer is right-on for most of our needs, and I think mine works just fine, except that I though it would better handle voltage drops like the ones I'm experiencing at home at peak hours.

I would prefer to keep my Trip Lite in the path, so it would be nice to add something in series with it that hopefully creates some power control synergies. My Trip Lite is quite silent, BTW.

Any realistic suggestions would be more than welcome. Thanks!

Back to top

Toshiba-Foobar2K-ASIO Direct-WD 2.0Tb HDD-Schiit USB cable-Schiit Yggdrasil DAC-Decware Silver Ref IC's-Decware Mini Torii SE-8PR Kimber Kable spkr cbls-Decware DM945's-Tekton Lore 2-Velodyne DLS 3500 SUB-BJC SUB Cbls-Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf-Jellyfish S

IP Logged

DBC

Seasoned Member

Posts: 423

Re: Assistance with voltage drops
Reply #1 - 02/04/15 at 13:32:03

Fireblade,

I also use the Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Transformer. I don't have the swings in voltage that you describe but see Tripp Lite makes an inexpensive device that also provides voltage regulation to combat brief dips & spikes in voltage.

http://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-LC1200-Conditioner-Outlet/dp/B0000512LA/ref=sr_...
http://www.manualslib.com/manual/182970/Tripp-Lite-Lc1200.html#manual
http://www.manualslib.com/manual/333260/Tripp-Lite-Lc1200.html#manual

I have no personal experience with this device but generally I find Tripp Lite products to be of quality and perform as advertised. Looks like this is rated for 1200 watts and would be more than sufficient to feed your 500 watt isolation transformer.

With Amazon, if it does not help your situation then simply return it for a refund. Just a thought.

Back to top

Main System: Oppo BDP-105D, SE84UFO amp, Omega Super Alnico Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 15's (Low Frequency Open Baffle).
Room #2: Oppo BDP-83SE, SE84CS amp, Omega Super 3i Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 12's (Low Frequency Open Baffle).

IP Logged

Lon

Seasoned Member

"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 23606

Re: Assistance with voltage drops
Reply #2 - 02/04/15 at 13:37:20

I would recommend the Analysis Plus Pro power cord as a nice budget cord for sources. I have these in use for source components in the system I have at my girlfriend's. I even use this as an amp cord in one of my smaller guitar amps. Works quite well, and the prices are good (they are available cheaper than listed here on the product page).

http://www.analysis-plus.com/categories/pro-power-oval/

As for power conditioning. . . I would sound like a broken record if I were to say that I was not satisfied with the Tripplite isolation transformers and went on a search for better power treatment that ended with a PS Audio Power Plant Premier and then PS Audio PerfectWave P5 Power plant. Regeneration is what has worked best for me to give me consistent power round the clock and transformed sound quality, but I know the price is high. The only non-regenerator conditioner I've used with success is the PS Audio Dectet. It too is not cheap, but seems to have eliminated most of the sound quality changes from power company supply fluctuations if not all of them.

I began to trust PS Audio the way that I trust Decware and haven't a lot of experience with other brands and types.

Back to top

HR-1,ZBIT,ZROCK2,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod; Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD, DAC Mk II, P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls, Reference spkrcbls; Mapleshade SamsonV3; VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects, IsoPods; headphones: Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1

IP Logged

Fireblade

Seasoned Member

Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 1046

Re: Assistance with voltage drops
Reply #3 - 02/04/15 at 18:16:21

DBC,

Excellent suggestion. I just wonder if it would be acceptable to have both components connected in series, i.e., Isolation > Voltage Regulator and if this double stage would not in any way limit the amp's sudden current demand when needed.

The reason I want to keep my Isolation T in the chain is because I believe it really helps with the sound and protects the equipment. I think I will write to them and see what feedback I get. The price seems quite affordable indeed.

Lon,

I know you are really into power treatment and theoretically I absolutely agree with the Power Regeneration concept. But, as you already know, these are expensive solutions. Your suggestion of the Dectet is something I've considered in the past also, along with another made-to-order product that now I can't even recall the name and which has also its followers (I briefly googled it but have not been able to find the reference as of yet).

The power cord is also a very nice suggestion. MSRP seems somewhat expensive, but looks to be well done and thought about ... I'll consider it seriously if I can get a lower price offering. BTW, PS Audio AC 3 Power Cord is about the same price (USD 149) at Music Direct. What is your opinion on that vs the Analysis Oval Pro?

Thanks to both for your valid pointers.

Back to top

Toshiba-Foobar2K-ASIO Direct-WD 2.0Tb HDD-Schiit USB cable-Schiit Yggdrasil DAC-Decware Silver Ref IC's-Decware Mini Torii SE-8PR Kimber Kable spkr cbls-Decware DM945's-Tekton Lore 2-Velodyne DLS 3500 SUB-BJC SUB Cbls-Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf-Jellyfish S

IP Logged

DBC Seasoned Member Posts: 423	Re: Assistance with voltage drops Reply #4 - 02/04/15 at 18:39:26 Fireblade, I think you would want the 1200 watt voltage regulation in front of your 500 watt isolation transformer. If you feed your isolation transformer with a clean stable voltage then the isolation transformer output voltage should be very stable also.
Back to top	Main System: Oppo BDP-105D, SE84UFO amp, Omega Super Alnico Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 15's (Low Frequency Open Baffle). Room #2: Oppo BDP-83SE, SE84CS amp, Omega Super 3i Monitors, Twin Custom SLAB 12's (Low Frequency Open Baffle). IP Logged

Ace-Tone Seasoned Member 8+ years with Decware gear and Loving it!!! Posts: 775	Re: Assistance with voltage drops Reply #5 - 02/04/15 at 18:48:34 Fireblade, I use power cords from Riteaudiocables.com. I am happy with them and the prices are very reasonable. good luck Al
Back to top	SE84UFO25, ZP3, Zstage, ZR2, ZSB, DM947, HERESY iii VPI-Traveler2 +SS Zephyr MKIIIes. Cambridge CXC. Schiit Bimby DAC IC's Audio Envy, Decware, RAC-PC's, Mapleshade Dbl Helix+Spkr wires & jumpers Blue Circle PLC FX2X0e, Herbies, GIK, PI Audio DIY treatment IP Logged

Palomino

Seasoned Member

Posts: 2478

Re: Assistance with voltage drops
Reply #6 - 02/04/15 at 19:14:47

At the suggestion of others here, I went the power regen, PS Audio route, but went for used equipment.

This may still be a budget buster for you, but I now have an older PowerPlant Premier that I paid less than a grand for and a P300 which I think was less than $500. I think they serve the lower powered Decware amps especially well.

I too used the Triplite and there is just no comparison. I pulled the Triplite completely from the system.

Back to top

i7 Mac Mini with LPSU/SSD running Audirvana 3.5, Uptone Audio Regen on LPSU, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+, Ven Haus DIY Silver ICs, 25th Ann. Zen, PS Audio P5 Power Supply, PS Audio Power Cords, GR Research Speaker Wire, DIY Big Betsy and Crystal 10 Open Baffle Speakers

IP Logged

Lon

Seasoned Member

"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 23606

Re: Assistance with voltage drops
Reply #7 - 02/04/15 at 19:18:17

Regenerated power is worth it imo. 800 to 1000 will get you a used Premier and that would be something you could have in a system as a total solution. Possibly one of the earlier Power Plants for less. But I understand, it's a lot of money. But I would not go back to other power treatment systems.

I paid about 90 to 100 for each of my Analysis Plus cords (got mine via guitarcenter.com) and I think they are a bit more "neutral" than the PS Audio PerfectWave AC-3 which add a bit of warmth to my ears, which may or may not be welcome. Both are good cords for the money, the Analysis Plus is a bit easier to work with (more flexible) and I think just a bit more accurate. (I had an AC-3 but didn't keep it; I have all AC-12s in my main system, but in my system at my Dad's I have one AC-12, two AC-10s, and an AC-5 and a Premier SC; the Premier SC sounded better than the AC-3 to me.)

Back to top

HR-1,ZBIT,ZROCK2,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod; Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD, DAC Mk II, P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls, Reference spkrcbls; Mapleshade SamsonV3; VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects, IsoPods; headphones: Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1

IP Logged

Archie

Seasoned Member

Posts: 2731

Re: Assistance with voltage drops
Reply #8 - 02/04/15 at 20:10:15

Palomino,

Your dedicated line seemed to make a huge difference even with the power conditioning. I wonder if with the dedicated line you'd make the same equipment choices? I might have very clean power already since nothing I've done on that end has been noticeable to me. I just run a Triplite but I don't even hear an improvement with that in the chain.

Rural Colorado, who would have thought! I suspect that the larger the metropolitan area, the greater the power variations.

Back to top

ZLC
Technics 1200G TT w/ Ortofon Jubilee MC cart
ZMC1
ZP3 (25th A Mods)
ZR2 (25th A Mods)
CSP3 (25th A mods)
ZMA (25th A mods)
Homemade Big Betsy Speakers (F15s)
Silver Cabling
DIY Isolation platforms under amps & TT.

IP Logged

Fireblade

Seasoned Member

Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 1046

Re: Assistance with voltage drops
Reply #9 - 02/04/15 at 23:23:49

DBC,

Interesting suggestion, you may be right. I was thinking the main duty of the IT is to de-couple the mains from my components. Then, any persistent uncontrolled voltage behavior in its secondary could well be ironed out by the regulator before going to my system. If we do this the other way around, there would not be a real de-coupling of the mains since the IT will only de-couple from the VR. I confess I don't have much of a clue, so I just sent an email to the Tripplite people to see what they have to say. Thanks!

Acetone,

Interesting cable alternatives, seemingly useful but devoid of overly sophisticated (and snake-oil prone) offerings, which I like. It's a shame not even one photo is displayed in that site. Buying without looking at the ítem (even if it may not make real difference), makes it more of a gamble. If you can attest to their integrity and sound, I'm almost convinced. Thanks!

Palomino,

I see what you're saying and I have to agree, but limited budgets are inflexible. If/when I have a larger investment in my modest system like most of you guys have, it would be a no-brainer. I just need to have a balanced investment distribution. In future, I may upgrade to the next stage, who knows. But, thanks for your valid thoughts!

Lon,

I see. Thanks for the tip. $100 is even more palatable. I only require 3 Ft of length, so maybe the cost would be even less. The choice will be between these and the Rite cables, then. I'll check on that online guitar store.

Back to top

Toshiba-Foobar2K-ASIO Direct-WD 2.0Tb HDD-Schiit USB cable-Schiit Yggdrasil DAC-Decware Silver Ref IC's-Decware Mini Torii SE-8PR Kimber Kable spkr cbls-Decware DM945's-Tekton Lore 2-Velodyne DLS 3500 SUB-BJC SUB Cbls-Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf-Jellyfish S

IP Logged