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6P14P Question (Read 138 times)
Ghostship
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6P14P Question
Yesterday at 14:23:02
 
I'm loving the sound from my office system SE84UFO2.1. I'm getting more tubes, and I need help with what I think I know, and what I don't yet know, and whether my reasoning is correct...

I like the 6P15P stock tubes, and I like the idea of the Hazen Grid (Christmas Came Early - CCE) mod. So, I am sourcing the EV version of this tube. But,

I know EL-84's are not compatible with the Hazen Grid mod, because unlike the 6P15P and EL-34, the suppressor grid is internally connected to the cathode.

I belive the 7189 is a higher-volt version of the EL-84 with a generally longer life (~10,000 hours). I have those in the amp now, and they sound great - better than the stock version 6P15P's.

Here's where I run out of steam... I understand there is a 6P14P tube, is this the higher-volt version of the 6P15P?

I understand the 6P14P can be wired either as a pentode or triode like the 6P15P, but I haven't researched enough to learn, does that mean the 6P14P is compatible with the Hazen Grid/CCE mod too?

Thanks in advance -
Michael
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CAJames
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #1 - Yesterday at 14:58:40
 
Quote:
Posted by: Ghostship      Posted on: Today at 06:23:02

...I understand the 6P14P can be wired either as a pentode or triode like the 6P15P, but I haven't researched enough to learn, does that mean the 6P14P is compatible with the Hazen Grid/CCE mod too?


Short answer is no. Longer answer is the 6P14P is the Russian version of the EL84, so no.

The longest answer, if you really want to go down the rabbit hole, is the CCE mod is great, everything else being equal, but things are never equal. You have heard that for yourself with the 7189 (with which I personally have no experience) that you found sounds better than the stock tube, even without CCE. Here is my experience, briefly, FWIW/YMMV.

Back when Russian tubes were cheap I bought a bunch of different 6P15P types. The test results were all over the map, as was the sound. For me, I found I preferred the 6P15P-ER (-EP in Cyrillic), but if you are buying on ebay I suggest buying several, of the different types and listening for yourself. Be prepared to throw out some/many that just suck.

What I found I liked even better is the EL822 tube, which needs an adapter (EL822->EL84). I used Chinese adapters for years and they are fine, but these tubes are also CCE compatible so eventually I got custom adapters made that maintain CCE. Turning on CCE was a small, but noticeable upgrade.

There is also the EL803S tube, which also needs an adapter (EL83->EL84), and is also CCE compatible. With certain combinations of input tubes and rectifiers these can sound better than the EL822, but generally these are my second string power tubes.

I have not had good results with EL84/6P14P tubes.

Good luck, and keep us posted as your journey continues.

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Ghostship
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #2 - Yesterday at 15:09:02
 
Awesome, thanks!
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Hearafter
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #3 - Yesterday at 19:05:43
 
Just to add in my experience. My Taboo came with the stock Decware 6P15P .  I tried Telefunken 7189 and they were a noticeable improvement.  Also I like an Austrian made Tungsram EL84 and even an EI EL84 over the stock tubes. Then I took James suggestion and bought EL 822’s from Langrex and custom adapters from Deyan and they sound the best to me and are staying put.
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Ghostship
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #4 - Yesterday at 21:30:28
 
This forum has saved me so much time, money, and frustration. I really appreciate educated opinions I can trust.

I'll grab some EL 822's with adapters, adding to the 7189's, the handful of 6p15p-EVs I ordered from Ukraine, the stock tubes, and eventually some Cryotones, and I'll be set.

Thank you all!
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LiquidBlue
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #5 - Today at 04:44:27
 
James turned me on to the EL822 as well and they’ve been in my amp ever since. I had custom adapters made that fit nicely in the amp and make use of the HG mod. Here’s a post with more info and a link to contact Deyan, if you need to reach him.
https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1755037018/0#0
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Lon
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #6 - Today at 12:07:33
 
I have to confess that the EL822 have grown on me over time and are great in my clone Zen amp. My adaptors don't do the Hazen Grid. . . that link to headfi doesn't really reach the Deyan builder, but I sent him a PM there and we'll see.
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #7 - Today at 15:15:23
 
Quote:
Posted by: Lon      Posted on: Today at 04:07:33

. . . that link to headfi doesn't really reach the Deyan builder, but I sent him a PM there and we'll see...


Apparently he no longer has his ad in the classified section, but it seems like he is still making adapters. Here is a link to his user page for anyone who wants to message him.

https://www.head-fi.org/members/deyan.515868/

You have to be a Head-Fi member to send a message.
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Ghostship
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #8 - Today at 16:38:51
 
Yes, he is still making adapters. In addition to the request for an aluminum version to ensure the 20mm clearance of the tube socket screws, I specifically requested EL-822 to 6P15P adapters where the suppressor grid (G₃) and cathode are brought out to separate pins rather than wired together like EL-84's.

His reasonable response was: "The last ones I did had the suppressor grid connected to the cathode. What pin-out did you want?"

What would be a better response than "I have no freakin' clue"???
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Ghostship
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #9 - Today at 16:58:17
 


Am I correct in instructing him that this is the preferred 6P15P pinout at the Amp end, with a standard EL-822 pinout at the tube end?
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Ghostship
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #10 - Today at 17:59:52
 
OK, this is what I've got...can anyone check my work?

6P15P Base Pinout                                EL822 Pinout
Pin 1: No Connection                              Pin 1: IC do not use
Pin 2: Control Grid (G₁)                        Pin 2: Control Grid (G₁)
Pin 3: Cathode (K) & Internal Shield            Pin 3: Cathode (K)
Pin 4: Heater / Filament (H)                  Pin 4: Heater / Filament (H)
Pin 5: Heater / Filament (H)                  Pin 5: Heater / Filament (H)
Pin 6: Suppressor Grid (G₃) (*)                   Pin 6: No Connection
Pin 7: Anode / Plate (A)                        Pin 7: Anode (Plate) (A)
Pin 8: (Do Not Connect)                        Pin 8: Screen Grid (G₂)
Pin 9: Screen Grid (G₂)                        Pin 9: Suppressor Grid (G₃)*
*  = (Internally tied to P1)                          * = (Internally tied to P6)
                                   
Adapter Wiring
6P15       to      EL-822
Pin 1  to    Pin 6
Pin 2       to      Pin 2
Pin 3       to      Pin 3
Pin 4       to      Pin 4
Pin 5       to      Pin 5
Pin 6       to      Pin 9
Pin 7       to      Pin 7
Pin 8       to      Pin 1
Pin 9       to      Pin 8
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CAJames
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #11 - Today at 19:19:46
 
Quote:
Posted by: Ghostship      Posted on: Today at 08:58:17

...Am I correct in instructing him that this is the preferred 6P15P pinout at the Amp end, with a standard EL-822 pinout at the tube end?


Yes, but 6P15P with no shield connection. He has made these for some of your friends.

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[Volumio | Jay's CDT2 MRK3] -> Denafrips Terminator 2 + Gaia
Sumiko Pearwood -> Mapleknoll Athena -> Luxman SUT -> Mapletree Phono 3E
STR-1002 -> Woo WA22 -> 2x UFO25s, balanced monos
Omega SAM , Hifiman Arya, Audeze LCD-XC
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Ghostship
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Re: 6P14P Question
Reply #12 - Today at 19:48:03
 
Perfect, thanks.
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