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ZSTYX shielding (Read 101 times)
JHC
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ZSTYX shielding
Today at 14:41:55
 
I have read some very good things about the zstyx speaker cables. I am having some issues with RFI—my current speaker cables (Signal Cable Silver Resolution) are acting like an antenna and it's driving me crazy. I love the sound of them, but I am starting to explore some alternatives.

For those using Zstyx, let me know how the operate in terms of shielding. Or, if there are other options particularly suited for SET amps and are well shielded, please let me know. Thanks!
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CAJames
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Re: ZSTYX shielding
Reply #1 - Today at 15:18:27
 
I have ZSTYX cables. Technically, since Steve is nice enough to provide the part number, I bought a remainder roll of the cable and made my own, but it is the same stuff. And they have no shielding at all.

I live in a very "RF live" area myself, and my solutions to the problem are these: since I have UFO25 mono blocs, I have them very close to the speakers and my cables are only a couple of feet long. Also, my system is balanced all the way to the speakers, and that reduces the common mode noise caused by the surrounding air force base.

Balanced isn't an option for you but depending on your geometry, and your willingness to cut down the cable, or get Decware to build you short cables, or find your own, you have the option to move your amps and run short speaker cables. Which wins in more ways than just reducing RFI.
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Lon
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Re: ZSTYX shielding
Reply #2 - Today at 15:41:33
 
My speaker cables are not shielded and are long and not able to be easily shortened but I use interconnect cables shielded by a copper and silver shield and I believe that helps with noise interference--that may be one avenue to experiment with.
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MM
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Re: ZSTYX shielding
Reply #3 - Today at 15:57:47
 
I have been using zstyx for both my mains and subs for years and love them. I switched to SRA Takshaka for both IC and speakers and made myself keep them for a year but found the Decware cables every bit as a good, and sold the SRA’s. I’m not sure if I live in a high RFI area but I’ve found the zstyx to be a tremendous value.
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Lon
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Re: ZSTYX shielding
Reply #4 - Today at 16:23:40
 
I used them for a while but never really settled into them--ultimately too bright for me. . . moved on to Mapelshade Helix Plus which I liked more (now in my audio/visual system) and PS Audio Reference xStream which I use in the main system.
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MM
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Re: ZSTYX shielding
Reply #5 - Today at 16:51:01
 
I could see that. They do have a slightly brighter top end than the previous cables I had used (Blue Jeans, Belden 9497, and a variety of DIY) but with it came a bigger sound stage and better bass definition. I know the brightness is generally an issue for you, Lon.

Not to detract from the original question. I’ve moved a lot and lived in both city and rural areas. Speaker cable interference has never been an issue for me and a majority of cables aren’t shielded. Interesting that it can be an issue for others.
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JHC
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Re: ZSTYX shielding
Reply #6 - Today at 17:50:18
 
Thank you all for this. I might need to do some more tests to make sure there isn't some interference leaking in from an interconnect or even a tube, which has happened before. My whole system is balanced up until the preamp to power amp. I know for sure it is something after the preamp that is causing the noise. I was confident it was the speaker cables, but feeling less so now.

In terms of cables, I will also look at the MS cables. The grounding wire weaving looks interesting and that alone might be the solution.
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Hearafter
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Re: ZSTYX shielding
Reply #7 - Today at 19:07:31
 
I, like CAJames, use a DIY version of the same ZSTYX cables on both my systems without any RFI interference.  They are fantastic cables once broken in.  They were a tough listen due to brightness initially but settled down in my systems.  Also, I have used them on my AE monos with no issues.  Like CAJames mentioned they are an unshielded cable so not sure if you will get improvement.  I also think moving your AE Monos close to the speakers and getting some nice shielded IC’s would bring the best result.  Here are some pics of my ZSTYX cable in white.   Good luck
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will
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Re: ZSTYX shielding
Reply #8 - Today at 21:36:06
 
I used Styx for some years early in my Decware journey... maybe around 2009? I liked them better than the DIY ethernet cable wire formula I used that was popular at the time, inexpensive, but a lot of work to make. They were decent, but I liked how the Styx blended silver qualities with copper fairly transparently, creating a more complex, immediate, dynamic, and big sound.

But finally, after some years of experimenting with them, especially since I need pretty captivating balanced and complete sound across most of the recordings I have, the sound was just too big and forceful for me. Quite beautiful on many recordings, but on others, just too much signal intensity, concentration and density making the bass/mid-bass/low-mids lean into full and slowish on recordings leaning that way, and the mids and upper-mids, also strong, tending a little too close to the edge of bouncing into sharp, hard and rigid on peaks, again, especially with some recordings. I used them for a long time though, liking a lot about them, but always working on relaxing them, I realized they were just overstated for me.

And really, it is all so system/room dependent along with varying goals/tastes.... My needing, across the spectrum, very refined speeds, fine resolution, space and complexity, all within the fine lines of musical spectral balances.... while being just focussed and dense enough to sound real, and not throw off these complex balances @#$%^&* challenging! So far for me, this takes a particular average where all musical balances support one another, sounding like well recorded music in a good room, and that feeling conveying to my room. Then, with various recording styles, I need good gain riding tools that can adjust the signal intensity one way or the other "off" this carefully found "average," to optimize varying recordings. For these goals, in my settings, the Styx were not an ultimate reference.


Relative to EMF/RFI, and your cables JHC, I found the following from Brave Browser's AI search summarizer, which can sometimes feel overly general, and sometimes lacking in nuance, but I find surprisingly useful a lot of times, and it shows links it references, allowing cross checking and deeper searching. A long time ago now, after lots of experiments making cables with nice materials, finding the right gauges and blends, solder, etc, I found using relatively subtle and particular "twisting" and crossing wires could help me find the fast, resolved, and musical balances I needed. Along with these, though I did not know the term, I have been using "cross linking" for a long time too, helping me discover my favorite home-made cables. A big part of what makes all this work together, as far as I can tell, is a lack of noise and smearing, which also results from making them quiet. For this, geometry became as important as quality ends, wires and particular wire gauges and blends.

So I copied this from your cable design writeup for a search: "Geometry - Internal Twisted, Cross Linked speaker cable" adding "effect" at the end:

"Internal twisted and cross-linked geometries in speaker cables primarily reduce inductance and cancel electromagnetic interference to improve signal integrity.  The twisted pair configuration forces the positive and negative conductors to spend equal time near external noise sources, creating a common-mode signal that amplifiers cancel, often shaving 15–20 dB off 60 Hz hum.  Additionally, twisting the conductors lowers loop inductance while slightly increasing capacitance, which helps maintain a steady impedance (within ±0.2 Ω) and preserves bass punch and transient response.

Cross-linking or cross-field layer geometries (such as those used in Townshend Audio or Cardas cables) arrange conductors to minimize magnetic field interaction and dielectric absorption.  This geometry is designed to match the characteristic impedance of the cable to the speaker load, reducing micro-reflections that can cause brightness or hardness in the sound.  By using separate tubes or air dielectrics for twisted pairs, these designs further lower the effective dielectric constant, resulting in lower dissipation factors and more transparent, detailed sound reproduction with better spatial cues.

Inductance Reduction: Twisting conductors allows their magnetic fields to oppose each other, reducing self-inductance below that of straight parallel wires.
EMI/RFI Rejection: The geometry ensures equal exposure to external electromagnetic fields, allowing the receiver to subtract induced noise.
Impedance Matching: Cross-linked designs aim to align cable impedance with speaker impedance, minimizing signal reflections and transient smearing.
Dielectric Improvement: Using air or specific insulators between twisted pairs reduces energy loss and distortion.
Crosstalk Reduction: Twisted pairs keep crosstalk low (under 0.5%) when multiple cables are bundled, ensuring channel separation."


I can't say these points are absolute, not being expert, or a measurer except from listening. But this summary seems to point to pretty tried and true concepts for many, while implying your cables have already incorporated good ideas for a clean/unsmeared signal.

Also, like CAJames' solution suggests using styx, if it is an antennae affect, shortening the antennae makes sense.

Also, seems some consensus, as you suggest, that with extreme magnetic field interference, shielding can help.

I avoid traditional shielding myself if I can, finding it can seemingly consolidate and rob very fine information, sounding like a subtle smear when I have heard it. I am guessing it is from the interaction between the shield and signal wires, and a result is a reduction of very fine information that can make the music seem more real, something I depend on. This surmise came from my experience when I started weaving wires around cotton rope for interconnects to avoid interaction, where I thought separating and crossing the wires just so left the signal more complex in resolution and speed and space, more "pure." So when it looked like I needed shielding on some of my Torii internal cables, I covered the geometry I had liked with oversized pure copper shield cable, separating it from the signal wires more than the usual. This resulted in what seemed to me a quieter, yet still nicely resolved and fast sound.

Finally, it all is so variable, and everything effects everything, so I hesitate to comment on these questions... just too many "truths" out there that are based on, to me, often too narrow a context to be as absolute as the person suggests a lot of the times. But when I have some experience from my own experimenting that seems to corroborate some of the consensus, I guess I feel OK about telling my tale...

I wonder, if after testing tubes, and adjusting your cables to be more sure they are not interacting, like separating cables as much as possible, and things like ICs crossing power cables rather than parallel, and the like...If still an issue, as a relatively low cost speaker cable shielding test, I wonder about wrapping some aluminum foil around your speaker cables with the spiral edges overlapping, and leaving enough foil at the amp end to fold into a "connector" that could be connected to the chassis of your amp for ground (assuming the chassis is grounded?)...this might be telling?
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