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Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b (Read 183 times)
Morph
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Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Yesterday at 11:50:36
 
I hope this post finds everyone well.  

Thank you in advance, I was hoping for a little guidance.  When I first ordered my Decware amp I chose the Zen Mystery amp.  My system has changed significantly since then and I now think that either the SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b would be more suited to my system.

On a Decware amp, I’d mainly be listening to vocal jazz at low to moderate volumes, either streamed or from my turntable.  I purchased a cheap Chinese 3W amp to test and the volume this produced at 60% maximum volume from my preamp was more than adequate, so the power of either of these shouldn’t be an issue.  So mainly it would be the voicing of the two amps.  Living in Australia, I haven’t had the opportunity to listen to any Decware products.

I know it’s an impossible question, but I’m just wondering which would be better for vocal jazz.  The system is an Antipodes Oladra into a T+A DAC 200 into a solid state preamp and driving quite sensitive custom open baffle speakers.

Thanks!
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kulafu
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Re: Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Reply #1 - Yesterday at 12:54:14
 
I listen to vocal jazz as well.  I have both and I would recommend the Sarah 300b.
Bob
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Lon
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Re: Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Reply #2 - Yesterday at 13:45:54
 
I'm a huge jazz fan, instrumental and vocal. I had SE84UFO3 Monoblocks with all the mods for five years, then moved to the SEWE300B. I don't think you would go wrong with EITHER amp if your speakers can handle the lower wattage of the SEUFO25. My speakers could (HR-1) BUT the SEWE300B drives them with a sense of ease and authority I could not imagine before. And with the SEWE300B after a spell I realized my sound was better WITHOUT a preamp and I was able to remove a fully modded CSP3 from the system and have even better sound.

I'm no help in comparison to the Mystery Amp--I have never heard one, I never wanted an amp with that much power--plus I had Torii Mk IIIs for years, and found that I hankered for and preferred the SET sound to the push-pull.
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HR-1,ZBIT,ZROCK3,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod; Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD, DAC Mk II, P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls, Reference spkrcbls; Mapleshade SamsonV3; VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects;Stack EQ; headphones: Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1
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CAJames
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Re: Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Reply #3 - Yesterday at 17:27:35
 
I don't think one amp is necessarily better for a particular kind of music, it is more about the kind of sound you prefer. I think the bottom line is you can't go wrong with either but here are a few things to consider.

If you have very sensitive speakers then hum is more likely to be an issue with Sarah than a UFO25.

Do you love your preamp? I think the UFO25 benefits greatly from a good preamp. With Sarah a lot of people seem to like either a passive autoformer/transformer based pre or none at all.

If you chose Sarah you are committed to buying 300B tubes.

If you haven't already I would strongly suggest reading the Sarah and UFO25 development threads in their respective fora.

For me, I have a pair of UFO25s configured as balanced monoblocs. I wouldn't trade them for anything but of course that is just me. I haven't heard the Decware 300B amp but have lived with a different one recently. My comments are mostly based reading posts over the years, there is a lot of wisdom on this site and time spent reading will be rewarded.
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Lon
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Re: Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Reply #4 - Yesterday at 18:23:23
 
I agree that not one amp is better for one type of music in general. . . but if one were wanting to blast party level rock, funk, etc. then the Mystery Amp is a better choice. But for vocal jazz, he can't go wrong with either the 25 or the SEWE300B, imo.
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HR-1,ZBIT,ZROCK3,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod; Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD, DAC Mk II, P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls, Reference spkrcbls; Mapleshade SamsonV3; VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects;Stack EQ; headphones: Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1
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Tony
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Re: Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Reply #5 - Yesterday at 22:22:13
 

I have two Decware amps, the SE84UFO25 and 300B, which I play daily at different times in different rooms.

My relationship with the Decware 300B is truly ambivalent. At times, it delivers audio that takes my breath away, offering a level of detail and clarity I've rarely experienced. Yet other aspects, namely its annoying hum, frustrate me, creating a push-and-pull dynamic that's hard to ignore
My relationship with the SE84UFO was love at first listen, and that continues.
I have talked with Steve (monthly), and he acknowledged that the 300B hums. The big question is, can you hear it from the listening position when listening to music? In my case, it depends on what tubes I'm using.
I found that different 300B tubes affect the pitch of the hum. WE 300B and Shuguang 300 B-Z hums are easier to tolerate, while the Sophia Electric tubes are not.
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Lon
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Re: Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Reply #6 - Yesterday at 23:23:13
 
There is certainly no denying there is inherent hum in ANY 300B amp. But . . . I've had hum in other Decware systems of my past. . . after about 28 years of it I don't let it bother me. With any of the tubes I've used in the SEWE300B amp I've never had a hum that I couldn't mitigate by gain settings etc. that was audible at the listening seat and in that respect it was no more "misbehaving" than UFO and Taboo and Torii amps I've had. And the sonics of the SEWE300B has been the pinnacle for me--this is an amp that I can futz with with real enjoyment and sound I can sink back and be enveloped in for hours and hours on end.

The Monoblocks I could as well. . . I just futzed with them less. Exploring/futzing has become a real satisfying past time for me. Futzing has led me to two great output tube choices, and to discovering how much beauty there is in mixing rectifiers with each.
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Hearafter
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Re: Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Reply #7 - Today at 03:57:39
 
Interesting…I am sorry to hear the Sarah has a hum. The good news is that the hum can be minimized where the amp can be fully enjoyed.   A few months back I made the move from my Torii Jr to a non-Decware 300B SET amp. My speakers are in the Mid 90’s efficient and the amp is dead quiet no matter what volume or tubes are used.  The amp has a separate power supply which may play a role…or not.  I was planning to buy a Sarah but my 300B SET amp kinda fell into my lap at a nice discount plus I didn’t have to wait the 3 years…good luck with your selection both are great choices.
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Kamran
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Sarah

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Re: Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Reply #8 - Today at 05:23:12
 
Interesting—Not discounting Steve’s acknowledgment but after 1.5 yrs of owning Sarah—can’t say I have a hum issue at the listening position. In fact, the amp has never sounded quieter, especially as of late.
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Morph
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Re: Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Reply #9 - Today at 10:19:49
 
Good evening

Thank you very much for your kind contributions, I really appreciate your knowledge.  It’s given me a few things to think about.  I think the general consensus is though that both amps are great.

It’s such a great community here Smiley
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Gilf
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Re: Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Reply #10 - Today at 13:57:43
 
Welcome. Like Tony and Lon, I have both. I think the speakers would be the deciding factor for you. If you are in love with your current speakers you may want to consider the UFO. People that are bothered by Sarah’s hum tend to have higher efficiency speakers (>upper 90’s), myself included. Especially since you like vocal and solo instruments, you may find the hum in quiet passages too much. Also if you have a room mode in the same frequency as the hum, which is common, it will amplifiy it. You can do a lot of fiddling and tweaking to reduce it, but highly sensitive speakers will always reproduce it.  

Likewise, with highly sensitive speakers the 2 watts of the UFO will be more than enough, and you will save a lot over your relationship with your amp in terms of tube costs.

Another consideration is the Sarah has a little more oomph in her and can drive the lower frequencies of your open baffles a little harder. I had to adjust my sub crossover much lower with Sarah, and only when I am really critically listening do I even feel compelled to turn my subs on. Most of the time the single driver in open baffle is enough, whereas with the 25 they were switched on with every power up. Some is the power of the amp, some is the tube choices, and some is the inherent sound of the circuit.

Sarah certainly can be captivating but you may have to work for it. Like many have said here, both are great amps and it is a personal decision how much you are willing to chase the sound and modify your system to accommodate.

Can’t agree with you more what a great community we have here.
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CAJames
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Re: Advice: SE84UFO25 or Sarah 300b
Reply #11 - Today at 15:55:04
 
I think one of the many frustrations with hum is it's unpredictability. It can be inherent in the amp but also caused or exacerbated by tubes, power, environment, interaction with other parts of your system or maybe just black magic. Steve talks about owners sending in an amp because of hum but finding it quiet on his bench. I think the only thing you can say for sure is the more sensitive your speakers the more likely you are to have a hum issue.
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[FOOBAR2000 | Jay's CDT2 MRK3] -> Denafrips Terminator 2 + Gaia
Sumiko Pearwood -> Mapleknoll Athena -> Luxman SUT -> Mapletree Phono 3E
STR-1002 -> Woo WA22 -> 2x UFO25s, balanced monos
Omega SAM , Hifiman Arya, Audeze LCD-XC
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