Forums - Zen SE84C+ Sisters

Dominick

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Still like that old
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Zen SE84C+ Sisters
05/10/23 at 03:29:46

After 9 months of avid searching for a second white SE84C+ to run as monoblocks, I finally landed a second one from an original owner. Many thanks to Mike Clark for giving me the opportunity to buy his beloved white SE84C+ that was very well cared for. These white amps are very hard to come by these days, and the quest was a bit daunting.

I just got the amp yesterday, so I just started to give it good listen. Due to an issue with my first Zen amp…it had to be sent in for repair. So while it was there…I gave it all of the upgrades to bring it up to spec with the current SE84UFO.

So now I have one fully upgraded amp, and one bone stock amp. I plan to run them as mono’s in the upcoming days, but based on my initial listening session, there is a noticeable difference in the amp with the UFO transformers. While it’s too early to tell, it seems like I’m going to wind up sending in the second amp to have it fully upgraded as to have them match.

My wife and daughter are stoked…and my daughter has now nicknamed them the Zen Sisters. Ironically enough they are only like 12 serial numbers away from each other.

Here is a shot of them in the new setup…

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CAJames Seasoned Member "I've run every red light on memory lane." Posts: 2447	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #1 - 05/10/23 at 03:47:59 That’s awesome Dom! Great that you found a matching amp. Having come this far I think you really ought to send the second one in for the updates.
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Dominick

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Still like that old
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Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters
Reply #2 - 05/10/23 at 03:53:44

Thanks James!! Yes it’s been one heck of a journey!

Yes….I had spoken to Steve while the amp was in transit….so yeah it will probably get sent back to the mothership within the next few weeks. Like you said…I’ve come this far and I already know that the difference in sound between both channels will just bother me. Need to swap out the volume control knob with the black chicken head.

I had already done some advanced planning…so I have a second set of socket adapters, the Decware RCA Y splitters, and the Orange fuse in house and ready to go.

Thanks!!

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HockessinKid Seasoned Member Posts: 1247	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #3 - 05/10/23 at 12:20:53 Congratulations Dom. Glad you were able to land a second amp, best wishes for the upgrade. Zen Sisters indeed👍. HK
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CAJames Seasoned Member "I've run every red light on memory lane." Posts: 2447	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #4 - 05/10/23 at 15:24:50 Since you've joined the "mono bloc club" note that you'll need to start buying tubes in pairs and quads . It is worth it!
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Dominick

Seasoned Member

Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

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Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters
Reply #5 - 05/10/23 at 16:58:25

HK…..thank you! Yeah the full upgrades are not cheap…esp. when you add in the warranty transfer which requires a new factory tube set. It’s actually cheaper to just buy a new one. But the white SE84C+ was what I always wanted….plus it keeps the wife happy with the new decor.

CAJAMES….yeah Mono Block Club” is going to keep me busy with buying pairs and quads. Luckily I had already started buying them when I bought my Teslas from our friend Jan. 😉

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Lon Seasoned Member "Love without guts is worthless!" Philip K. Dick Posts: 25750	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #6 - 05/10/23 at 18:02:02 Congrats Dominick, I know you've been waiting for this opportunity. Getting the two to match is an expense on top of the purchase price, but will pay off in sonic precision and I think you'll love the resulting sound.
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Sean Seasoned Member Posts: 363	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #7 - 05/10/23 at 20:32:46 I love it. Cool history to boot!
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Dominick

Seasoned Member

Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1422

Re: SE84C+ Zen Sisters
Reply #8 - 05/10/23 at 21:27:55

Lon….yes the added expense for the upgrade is going to sting a bit….but as I saw with the first amp it was well worth the expense. Sadly I had to pass up buying your white CSP2 which I would have loved to have…but it was the right decision in an effort to obtain the second amp.

Sean…the story it an interesting one for sure. I don’t think it gets much better than having a pair of SET amps for your music listening. Wait….the new Sarah is probably the best of the best with the 300B tubes. I would really love to hear that amp someday.

Just got a notification the Decware DSR3 Y cable is back in stock for those out there that are part of the “mono block club” (as CAJAMES puts it). Luckily I snagged a used pair from a forum member last month when they went up for sale in the classified section. So for those of you out there who were contemplating them..I would snag them before they go out of stock again.

Dom

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charles hidalgo Seasoned Member Posts: 522	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #9 - 05/19/23 at 20:42:48 Beautiful! 8-)
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Dominick Seasoned Member Still like that old time Rock and Roll!! Posts: 1422	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #10 - 05/21/23 at 21:38:00 Thank you Charles! Coming from you and your amazing setup….I’ll take that as a huge compliment! How I wish I had the physical space and your impressive setup. If I ever visited your house, I would never want to leave. 🙂 Dom
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Dominick

Seasoned Member

Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1422

Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters
Reply #11 - 05/27/23 at 08:47:15

Today I finally got the chance to wire up the Zen Sisters as monoblocks after much anticipation. I decided to go directly to vinyl because I felt this would have the most impact. Ironically I had also received Eddie Money and Aerosmith’s greatest hits in the mail from Elusive Disk today…talk about timing!!

The good: The extra increase in power was a great welcome. I was listening to Aerosmith at more than normal listening levels and not going past 3 o’clock on the volume knob. I still had power in reserve and never came close to clipping the amps. I know that when I throw on digital, I’ll probably be at like the 1 or 2 o’clock position on the volume knob.

The not so good: I can totally make out the difference in tone with the fully modified amp vs. the bone stock amp. The UFO amp throws out more bass and it’s tighter. The UFO also plays louder… not by a ton but it’s noticeable in comparison. So this means that the stock one will most definitely be going back for the full upgrades. The cost is not cheap…but I knew this going in, so I’m not complaining.

For those that want to experience great SET sound…..running a pair of SE84UFO’s in a mono configuration pumping out 6 watts a piece is the golden ticket; as long as they are paired with a good set of somewhat efficient speakers.

Here is a pic the Zen Sisters in action.

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Geno Seasoned Member Without music, life would be a mistake. Posts: 2219	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #12 - 05/27/23 at 14:41:47 Nice Dom!!! I know it sounds fantastic! I’m at about 107 on the waitlist with my second UFO. Hope to have it sometime in July. Best, Geno
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Lon Seasoned Member "Love without guts is worthless!" Philip K. Dick Posts: 25750	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #13 - 05/27/23 at 14:50:48 I'm #93 for an SEWE300B and am thinking more like August or later. We'll see. Congrats Dom! I figured that the differences in the capacitors etc. between the amps would be audible. At least now you know the benefits that having two matched amps will bring!
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CAJames Seasoned Member "I've run every red light on memory lane." Posts: 2447	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #14 - 05/27/23 at 14:57:23 That's great Dom! I'm really looking forward to your impressions after you get the second amp upgraded. I just checked the wait list and I'm at the top of the second page so hopefully I'll have my UFO25s in October/November.
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Dominick Seasoned Member Still like that old time Rock and Roll!! Posts: 1422	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #15 - 05/27/23 at 21:56:22 Lon, Geno, and CAJames….thanks!! Yes I really can’t wait to get the second amp up to date to have a matched pair. All of you guys have great news with getting your new amps in the upcoming months….Congrats to that!! I will definitely keep you up to date and post my impressions when I get the upgrades completed. Dom
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HockessinKid Seasoned Member Posts: 1247	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #16 - 05/27/23 at 23:46:51 Congratulations Dom. Man, I bet the mono setup sounds sweet. You're in the zone now. HK
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Dominick

Seasoned Member

Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1422

Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters
Reply #17 - 05/28/23 at 06:09:16

Roger,

Yes the mono setup does take it to another level for sure. When I only had the one SE84C+….. it was fine for the majority of my Jazz listening sessions or for background music. It was only until I wanted to play some rock music and crank it up… the one amp would run out of steam with my ERR’s. Now with the two amps… I don’t have that problem. 😁

When I’m entertaining, playing movies, or want a different flavor….I’ll switch over to my Torii. Luckily the Torii is hooked up to my Pinnacle bookshelf speakers, so there’s no speaker cable swapping involved.

I do like the mono block setup where each channel has its own independent power supply. The Sarah however is a completely amp, is way more complex, and in a different league compared to the SE84UFO’s. I know you are waiting for your Sarah to come in….so Congratulations!! One day I need to hear the magic of the 300B tubes, so if I’m ever in your area expect a visit!!

Knowing now that 6 watts of power in my space is the minimum needed to push the ERR’s above normal listening levels with all genres of music…..I would possibly be inclined to sell my Torii and use that money to fund a Sarah someday. That would ONLY be if I totally fell in love head over heels with the 300B tubes. I do love my Torii….so that would be very hard decision.

Hope all is well with you. When are you expecting your Sarah? Please keep us posted once you get it home, I really want to hear your impressions.

Dom

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HockessinKid Seasoned Member Posts: 1247	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #18 - 05/28/23 at 09:41:42 Dom, You're welcome to visit anytime. I'm around 950 on the wait list, so it's still going to be a fairly long wait. Hopefully under 2 more years? HK
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Dominick Seasoned Member Still like that old time Rock and Roll!! Posts: 1422	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #19 - 05/28/23 at 15:46:04 Thanks…I will definitely take you up on that. And of course if your ever in northern NJ, you have an open invitation as well. I waited about 1.5 years for my ZROCK2, so 2 years for your Sarah is no big deal in retrospect. Dom
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Dominick

Seasoned Member

Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1422

Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters
Reply #20 - 02/22/24 at 01:48:44

The Zen sisters are now reunited together once again. They are now finally twins and are both matched with the same internals, having the full Anniversary mods with the Miflex bypass caps with the UFO transformers.

The prior issue with the volume knob making a scratching noise when the volume knob was rotate is now gone. Luckily the wiper just needed to be cleaned.

There is such an improvement with now having the matched internals. I can definitely tell the difference with the right channel sounding a bit tight by comparison.

I decided to switch out my speakers, so now I am back to running the Zen mono’s on my Err speakers, and the Torii is now powering my Pinnacle speakers. I have had so many recent changes with both speakers having new caps and resistor changes, that I now have to really start to do some critical listening. But for the time being, I am really enjoying just listening to music.

Dom

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Lon Seasoned Member "Love without guts is worthless!" Philip K. Dick Posts: 25750	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #21 - 02/22/24 at 02:50:36 FANTASTIC!
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CAJames Seasoned Member "I've run every red light on memory lane." Posts: 2447	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #22 - 02/22/24 at 21:19:01 That's awesome Dom! This has been quite a journey, it must be nice to get to the finish line.
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HockessinKid Seasoned Member Posts: 1247	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #23 - 02/22/24 at 21:53:03 Damn fine Dom. Enjoy your music. HK
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Dominick

Seasoned Member

Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1422

Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters
Reply #24 - 02/23/24 at 02:48:08

Lon, HK, and CAJames…thank you!! Yes it’s nice to finally hit the finish line with acquiring both amps over a two year period and to now have them upgraded and matched. I had received a PM from forum member Phil who works at Decware, and he said that the tech who was doing my upgrades was admiring the white amp. I must say that I really do love the mono block seup.
Acquiring the Grado 1000’s on a stellar deal was just the icing on the cake!!

Dom

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Lon Seasoned Member "Love without guts is worthless!" Philip K. Dick Posts: 25750	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #25 - 02/23/24 at 10:03:59 And that preamp has a killer sound to join them together with!
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Dominick

Seasoned Member

Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1422

Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters
Reply #26 - 02/23/24 at 14:20:23

Lon….I have to say that your old preamp has really added great versatility to my system, as opposed to my ZSTAGE. The increased gain gives me more flexibility with tuning my gain stages in conjunction with my ZBIT and ZROCK; especially when going back and forth between my mono’s and my Torii.

Now having just acquired my Grado’s, the CSP2+ is now the workhorse of my system. I’m still running the same tubes when I acquired it, minus the rectifier, but I plan to give it a fresh set very soon, or at least check the condition of the tubes that are in there. I just acquired a NOS Telefunken 5AR4, so I really want to see how that sounds.

Plus…..the matching white preamp just puts a huge smile on my face.

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HockessinKid

Seasoned Member

Posts: 1247

Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters
Reply #27 - 02/23/24 at 15:20:09

Dom,

Glad to see you're enjoying the added versatility of the CSP2+. There is even more to be gained through tube rolling, so enjoy the journey. FWIW, I have settled into the following configuration:

Rectifier - Sophia Electric Aqua 274B
Output Tubes - Walthen Cryotone E88CC-WC
Input Tube - NOS 1950 RCA 6SN7GT Smoked Glass w/ adapter

Best tube combination I've found. Great detail, tonality, and holographic as hell. Enjoy the music.

HK

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Tony Seasoned Member "Life without ..music is inconceivable" A.Einsteln Posts: 744	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #28 - 02/23/24 at 18:27:04 Hi HK, I read your CSP 2+ configuration of tubes and thought "I've got them!" I will give that set a chance to perform this evening in the system that I'm using the CSP 2+.
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Sean Seasoned Member Posts: 363	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #29 - 02/23/24 at 18:42:17 Dom, love the setup, looks great! X2 on the CSP2+ being the workhorse. I've had mine just a few months now and can't even imagine living without it now. I love the ability to fine tune from record to record. So much media is recorded in so many different ways the CSP really levels the playing field.
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Lon Seasoned Member "Love without guts is worthless!" Philip K. Dick Posts: 25750	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #30 - 02/23/24 at 18:52:15 Yes, the three look as if they were made for each other. And that particular CSP2+ that has all the mods added by Steve is just a stellar sounding preamp, so glad it's in your good home.
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Dominick

Seasoned Member

Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1422

Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters
Reply #31 - 02/23/24 at 22:19:34

HK…thanks for the recommendation on the tubes. I’m running the RCA 6SN7 smoked glass on the input stage of both mono’s. I do have another smoked glass RCA 6SN7 VT-213 I got from Kamran, so I think I may have to give it a try once I buy another adapter. Yes I’m looking forward to starting to roll tubes in CSP2+.

Sean…I agree with you in regards to vinyl. The CSP2 + really helps with sub par recordings. I also find myself tweaking the ZROCK2 sometimes more than the CSP2+.

Lon….yes it does look like they were made to go together as a trio. It’s a well seasoned piece of gear that really helps to feed and squeeze the best out of the Zen’s. I got a whole new respect for the the CSP2+ the minute I plugged in the Grado headphones.

Dom

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Lon Seasoned Member "Love without guts is worthless!" Philip K. Dick Posts: 25750	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #32 - 02/23/24 at 22:24:38 Yes, that particular CSP2+ was perhaps the very best headphone amp I've ever heard for cone-driven headphones. Special!
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Kamran Seasoned Member Sarah Posts: 1178	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #33 - 03/16/24 at 07:23:42 Beautiful setup Dom and would love to hear the Zen Sisters in the near future! Did you get to use the RCA VT-231?
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Dominick Seasoned Member Still like that old time Rock and Roll!! Posts: 1422	Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters Reply #34 - 03/18/24 at 02:18:08 Hey Kamran…. Thanks. Your setup was absolutely stunning today!! I’m going to post a comment in the upcoming day in the Reflecting on Sarah topic. I just got the converter base in 2 days ago, so I plan to try the VT-231 this week on my day off.
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Dominick

Seasoned Member

Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1422

Re: Zen SE84C+ Sisters
Reply #35 - 06/01/24 at 02:57:32

Well the journey has now reached a new plateau with the recent addition of a newly acquired white top ZP3. The Zen sisters now have their matching counterparts and look is intoxicating. Much thanks to Kamran for getting me lead an the ZP3.

I finally got a chance to get the ZP3 up and running after a once over with alcohol and DeOxit on all the metal contact points as well as the supplied tubes. The white top was given a once over with the Magic Eraser and it looks great.

Now for the sound….the noise floor has dropped and the black backgrounds take on a new meaning. This unit is dead silent. At first I expected there to be a bit more gain, but this unit sat s for sometime and needed time to open open up. While my Rega Fono MKV was good, the ZP3 is smoother with a more natural tone. The Rega unit seems more aggressive and edgy by comparison. It feels like a veil was lifted and the sound is more organic and analog. Instruments sound more true to form, and I feel like they are playing in my room. Right now I’m just playing my regular jazz albums…but plan to break out first pressings from Japan in the upcoming days after I put the ZP3 through a few good workout. I’m looking forward in the upcoming days to swap out the stock tubes with others that Lon graciously sent my way. I thought that with the amps being so close together that I was going to run into a hum issue, but so far it’s quiet

Here’s a few pics of the new setup.

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Rasp. Pi 4 [Roon], Schiit Bifrost True Multibit DAC, ZBIT, ZROCK2, My Audio Cables Ultra Silver+, ZSB, CSP2+ 25th, DAG Cables, DHC1, Torii MKIV 25th /2 White Zen SE84C+ 25th mono’s, Rega P2 Turntable, White top ZP3, Velodyne Dual Firing Sub, ERR’s [Bubbinga Wood]

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