Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Decware Audio Forums
03/19/24 at 09:57:39 




Pages: 1
Send Topic Print
ZSTAGE with a high-output DAC (Read 11944 times)
alper_yilmaz
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 349
ZSTAGE with a high-output DAC
01/19/17 at 14:33:24
 
Hi,

I have a DAC (Cambridge Audio's DACMagic 100) with 2.3V output.  I drive the TABOO mkIII with this and I was thinking of using a ZSTAGE in between the two, to function like a preamp.  However, from various discussions on the Forum, I understand that any source with an output around 2V would limit the use of ZSTAGE as it would leave very little space before clipping.  Would you agree?

Should I look for a preamp like CSP3 instead of ZSTAGE?  I really want it simple, so I am so much inclined towards the ZSTAGE!  :)

Any ideas?  Best,

Alper
Back to top
 
 

Mac Mini
Audirvana
Rega RP6 w/ Ania Pro & Rega Fono MC MK4
Rotel RCD1070
Hegel HD30 & Copland DAC215
Fezz Audio Mira Ceti 300B, Decware SE84UFO25, Decware SE34I.2+ & Copland CTA405
ProAc D28, B&W DM630 & Rega RS1
Stein & BlackNoise filters
DH Labs cables
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 23260
Re: ZSTAGE with a high-output DAC
Reply #1 - 01/19/17 at 16:10:16
 
In my opinion a preamp may be a better choice. And I really don't think the CSP3 is much more complex than the ZStage; I could be wrong.
Back to top
 
 

HR-1,ZTPRE,ZBIT,ZROCK2,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod,Taboo MkIV;Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD,P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls,Reference spkrcbls;Mapleshade SamsonV3;VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects, IsoPods; headphones:Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1
  IP Logged
alper_yilmaz
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 349
Re: ZSTAGE with a high-output DAC
Reply #2 - 01/19/17 at 16:26:44
 
Hey Lon,

Thanks for the quick response.  I try to keep the signal chain as simple as possible and I assume the ZSTAGE is simpler than the CSP3 which has many more controls than the earlier versions.  Also, CSP3 might make me itchy to try different tubes; more than the ZSTAGE!  But yeah, it is likely that I will end up with a CSP3!

Best,

Alper
Back to top
 
 

Mac Mini
Audirvana
Rega RP6 w/ Ania Pro & Rega Fono MC MK4
Rotel RCD1070
Hegel HD30 & Copland DAC215
Fezz Audio Mira Ceti 300B, Decware SE84UFO25, Decware SE34I.2+ & Copland CTA405
ProAc D28, B&W DM630 & Rega RS1
Stein & BlackNoise filters
DH Labs cables
  IP Logged
will
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 2913
Re: ZSTAGE with a high-output DAC
Reply #3 - 01/19/17 at 17:31:21
 
I don't recall the details, it has been so long, but when I changed from a standard output voltage DAC to my DAC with 2.2-2.3v out, I had some earlier clipping issues with the Zstage. I think I had to turn down the software player volume by 2 db or so to solve early clipping. I tried some attenuator plug thingies that were supposed to be quite transparent, and could hear them too much to use them. But I could not hear sound issues with the software volume at those attenuation levels. I think I was using Pure Music then.

Since then, using a CSP3 in my main system now, I have grown into using software EQ broadly for fine-tuning system/room synergy. Some bumps in some frequency areas are pretty high energy, and can cause clipping (particularly with certain recordings), in this case, the software player/computer clipping, so I regularly run my player down about 5 db these days. The software is so good, I can't hear this except as attenuation.

Point being, if you are using a software player, or a DAC with transparent volume, and if the voltage is a problem with your system, you can probably solve clipping with the Zstage....that is, if this is still a potential issue.

Why not call Steve and ask. May be different now. Or maybe he can build (or mod) one with a different resistor value or something like that if necessary. Also, not sure what cap is being used now, but mine had Auricaps and Jupiters were a notable improvement for me....more complete, more spacious, more detailed, and very natural sounding.
Back to top
 
 

All Modified: Balanced Transformer-DIY Strip/Shunyata Defender-RevolutionMacMini/Amarra-KTE Singxer/Gustardx20pro-ZBIT-CSP3-OldChen 300B/845, Torii IV, Simple Wave 300B-HR1/SVS Micro3000sub-Pi PCs-DIY PCs, ICs, USB, I2S, Speaker-SR and aluminum w ball bearing feet
  IP Logged
mark58
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 5647
Re: ZSTAGE with a high-output DAC
Reply #4 - 01/19/17 at 18:12:58
 
Alper, just get a CSP3.  You won't regret it.  It adds far more flexibility than a Z-Stage and you can pick up a good deal used if you're patient.  But it's worth every penny new...Mark.
Back to top
 
 

"The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not moved with the concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, deceptions, and spoils;
The motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Hell. Let no such man be trusted." William Shakespeare
  IP Logged
alper_yilmaz
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 349
Re: ZSTAGE with a high-output DAC
Reply #5 - 01/20/17 at 14:01:06
 
Dear Will, Mark,

Thanks for your contributions.  Yep, I believe I will end up with the CSP3!  :)

Best,

Alper
Back to top
 
 

Mac Mini
Audirvana
Rega RP6 w/ Ania Pro & Rega Fono MC MK4
Rotel RCD1070
Hegel HD30 & Copland DAC215
Fezz Audio Mira Ceti 300B, Decware SE84UFO25, Decware SE34I.2+ & Copland CTA405
ProAc D28, B&W DM630 & Rega RS1
Stein & BlackNoise filters
DH Labs cables
  IP Logged
SonicSeeker
Seasoned Member
****


Listening to the
music not the
equipment

Posts: 417
Re: ZSTAGE with a high-output DAC
Reply #6 - 01/21/17 at 19:30:13
 
I can't comment on the differences between the pre and the ZSTAGE, but I understand the purist approach. I built my system in this regard.
I use a ZSTAGE in my system and I like what it does for me.
Phono to ZP3 to ZSTAGE to TORII JR. simple.
Back to top
 
 



  IP Logged
pursuitofnow
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 449
Re: ZSTAGE with a high-output DAC
Reply #7 - 05/31/17 at 06:11:35
 
Specs on the website:

Gain: Adjustable from 0 to 15 volts with a 2 volt source (17.5dB Gain).
Input voltage: 5 volts max

This would lead me to believe that you shouldn't have a problem with clipping at 2.3V output. It would probably sound quite good.
Back to top
 
 

VPI Classic Signature | Koetsu Urushi Black | Bob's Sky 20 | ZP3 | Swiss Digital Fuse Box
DirectStream DAC (APS nickel transformers, Vocm mod)
ZTPRE | ZBIT | ZROCK2 | SE84UFO3
Omega Super 3 HO XRS | Deep 8
Zenwave D4 | PCR-11 | PI Audio Uberbuss
---
ZR 3
  IP Logged
alper_yilmaz
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 349
Re: ZSTAGE with a high-output DAC
Reply #8 - 05/31/17 at 17:23:50
 
It actually does sound pretty good and I have not had much clipping problem unless I crack the volume of the ZSTAGE all the way up.  But I recently ordered a Copland DAC 215 which is a DAC + tube preamp which might replace the Cambridge Audio DacMagic 100 and ZTAGE.  

I will comment on how the Copland sounds in the system once I receive and start using it...

Best,

Alper
Back to top
 
 

Mac Mini
Audirvana
Rega RP6 w/ Ania Pro & Rega Fono MC MK4
Rotel RCD1070
Hegel HD30 & Copland DAC215
Fezz Audio Mira Ceti 300B, Decware SE84UFO25, Decware SE34I.2+ & Copland CTA405
ProAc D28, B&W DM630 & Rega RS1
Stein & BlackNoise filters
DH Labs cables
  IP Logged
pursuitofnow
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 449
Re: ZSTAGE with a high-output DAC
Reply #9 - 06/01/17 at 02:41:54
 
Thanks for the update. I had not heard of the Copland, but from a quick search it appears to be really nice. It'll be interesting to hear how it compares to the Cambridge/ZSTAGE, especially given the $1k spread.

Back to top
 
 

VPI Classic Signature | Koetsu Urushi Black | Bob's Sky 20 | ZP3 | Swiss Digital Fuse Box
DirectStream DAC (APS nickel transformers, Vocm mod)
ZTPRE | ZBIT | ZROCK2 | SE84UFO3
Omega Super 3 HO XRS | Deep 8
Zenwave D4 | PCR-11 | PI Audio Uberbuss
---
ZR 3
  IP Logged
Pages: 1
Send Topic Print