Well, as usual it was another happy accident, but I discovered a proprietary process to get your favorite vinyl LP's onto disk, play back the recording on a good DAC and have it sound almost EXACTLY like your listening to a record!

I've been pondering it for years.  Recently after getting our ZDAC-1 and ZCD200 digital front ends to sound as good as possible on redbook CD's (16/44) I began exploring 24/96 downloads... like so many of us have.   While the selection of downloads is highly limited, it is growing monthly.  However, my favorite music is the classic rock I grew up with in the 60's and 70's when everything was analog.  In my lifetime I've yet to ever buy a Rock CD that sounded even close to right compared to the LP's.  And, when searching for 24/96 downloads you better be heavy into classical music because there is scarcely any rock to be found.

My craving for my favorite rock recordings in 24/96 pushed me to do the obvious - figure out a way to transfer my LP's to 24/96 recordings and have it sound like vinyl.  (yea right).

I've heard numerous attempts, both amateur and professional to transfer vinyl to CD and 100% of the end results sounded like CD's.

By understanding what makes an LP have it's incredible musicality - a result of years of listening and designing phono stages, I have accidently discovered an all tube system that captures the signature perfectly and was frankly shocked at the results.  Until this week I would have said it's fundamentally impossible to make a CD sound like an LP, good DAC or not.

Thank God I was wrong, because I have now been enjoying the impossible to not get lost in sound of LP's from my music server in 24/96.  First thing I did is get the hardest vinyl junkie I know who's ear is beyond reproach and sat him down for a listen.  I put a record on the turntable, cued it up, and pressed play on my ITOUCH remote to activate the DAC which was hooked up without of course telling him.  He sank back in the couch and smiled.

I informed him it was a nothing special cartridge so don't expect the world, but it's light years better than listening to CD's which he immediately agreed.  Then I took his beer away so he wouldn't hit me with it, and spilled the beans...  It worked, I had fooled him.

So I'm seriously considering test marketing this service at around $5.00 per song or $35 per album (one long track) or $45 per album (individual tracks) in 24/96.  I'd like to see if the completely DIFFERENT sound of these recordings has the same effect on everyone else as it does me.  Should I be right, I'll be leasing space somewhere to handle the traffic.

I'll try to figure out a way to put up some samples here soon.

The Zen Fest must have stimulated the audio gods because this is clearly another gift.  You can always tell the gifts because they always come as accidents.

Steve

We're comparing the price to other 24/96 digital downloads at 4.00 per song.  Which by the way are simply downloaded... zero work for the seller.

We have to receive your LP, unpack it, clean it, listen to it song by song while recording it, then burn the CD and send both back to you.    That's a lot for a mere dollar more per song.

At $35 per albumn (single long track) it is $5.00 cheaper than downloading a 24/96 CD, which is $40.00 on most high end sights.

Frankly this is just a starting point to test the market... and ourselves.  


Steve

You won't have to wait any longer than it takes to download a couple samples...  

I'll be posting them here soon.

Steve

Here are a few more short 16/44 samples from the LP.  No CD versions here for comparison, the first one above should have taken care of that.



https://www.decware.com/newsite/music/SteveMiller.aiff






https://www.decware.com/newsite/music/BozScaggs.aiff





And finally, when have you ever heard a Van Halen CD sound good?




https://www.decware.com/newsite/music/Van.aiff


It does now!


Enjoy,

Steve

I have ears of tin and even I can hear the difference on my PC.  The CD version sounds flat and 2D and the LP version sound big and deep.  

So, Steve, the first thing we need to do is provide the LP we want converted, right?  And this album must be as pristine as possible to avoid things like crackle and the kind of sounds you get from wear and tear, correct?

I am looking at a stack of LPs that haven't been touched in years and I'm wondering if any of these make proper candidates.

I guess finding a good LP for a source will probably be the tough part.
 
Now, where do I find a copy of Sweet's Desolation Blvd that would be worthy of such a transfer...hmmmmmmm.

It would seem that the Boston links are favoring Steve Miller ....thought maybe they were reversed, but the Boston sound links are the same, so not able to compare that album.  Guess there are extra opportunities to hear the steve miller band samples though...lol  

The Boz Scaggs sample seemed to be the best of the bunch...but that is simply related to the source quality of the LP recording.  I am using the Beyerdynamics DT 770 headphones with my laptop as the source for playback, not my audio system.

There is an obvious definition increase to depth and detail by the LP conversion standard, not only in lower frequencies, but in the seperation of the recorded material. What stands out the most is the amount of spacial properties that normally are missing from the digital compromise...that is what became immediately apparent to me.  This is nothing beyond what I am used to....without direct sample comparison on the system as I know, compared to my vinyl rig, it is non conclusive as to that direct correlation of course. I would not expect this to be on the same level as listening direct from my teres turntable using high quality LP's, but that is not the point.

The objective is bringing the digital standard up a few notches toward the LP counterpart.  With that in mind, it IS absolutely conclusive from this limited test set parameters that indeed, the improvement is much closer than previous situations concerning digital recordings.  It is enough to warrant the trouble of making the transfers from my obvious perspective.

I would only at this time measure that increase of fidelity toward standard run of the mill discs though.  I have a large selection of remastered digital recordings that although still digital in form....would not show this drastic level of improvement.  By keeping the focus on what it is....as shown here, this characterization shows worthwhile promise.  Just remember, no matter what we do....we can't turn sand into diamonds no matter how much pixie dust we sprinkle onto it....your ears will convince you of the outcome....interesting to say the least.

Regarding the LP quality, obviously the better condition the better the results, however, none of the samples I posted came from pristine records, in fact far from it.  

If the music is breathing I could care less if there are a few occasional pops and dust.  However if there is a scratch that shows up in more than one revolution, I skip the song.  My point is that slightly warn isn't a deal breaker and adds somewhat to the novelty.

This process is time consuming.  I find that myself, I just take the songs from each album that I really like vs. archiving the entire album.  Reason... I don't listen to them on the record so I probably won't listen to them on the archive.  So far I have done about a dozen of my classic rock albums, just a couple songs from each.  It ends up being about an hour compilation of some of the best sounding music ever...  and that seems to justify the time spent.

If I take it to the next step (accepting albums from customers) I'll have instructions that will include:

Sometimes we will reject your submission because of the quality of the LP.  

If we have to do a deep clean on your LP there will be an additional fee of $5.00

We'll create a form where you can write the name of the LP and what tracks you want from side A and side B.  

There will be a checkbox releasing us of any liability regarding possible damage to the LP and an option for insuring the LP (and CD or DVD that accompanies it) during return shipping.

Steve

Hi MoNelly,

Welcome to the forums!  I'll see what I can do about adding a 24/96 sample soon.

-Steve

John,

That would be a good comparison.  The process aka recipe is everything used between the tonearm and the ADC.  If I use my phono stage direct to computer input we still have 50% of my recipe in tact so it's not going to be a good comparison if I do it.

Perhaps you or someone else could do it so we have a potentially more striking comparison.

Steve

I have 2 copies of the Steve Miller song in my collection, one was ripped from CD and the other digitized from an LP using Audacity freeware, a 43 year old Garrard turn table (that listed for $75) with a newer $35 cartridge, a Dynaco Pat4 solid state preamp, and a Soundblaster Live sound card.  Both are in MP3 format.  I used Audacity again to edit the MP3 files down to the right part of the song, then exported them in WAV format (so the damage done by an MP3 format is a part of these files even though the edited samples are in WAV format).

I do not know how to (or rather where to) upload the files, but can email them to someone who could post them, or could follow directions as to how to get them posted.  They are worth listening to and comparing.


Dan

I tried image cabin...I get an error every time I try and upload a file (8 mB).  The modem indicates the file transfered, but imagecabin comes back with error 6.  Going 1 step further, I opened an account...when I log in, all I get is a blank page.

Dan

Cut it down to 8 meg.  You don't need to post the whole song, 10-15 seconds sould be enough.

John C.  

I am all for this! Here is why:

I buy vinyl from Acoustic Sounds at $30 each. However, I own a lot of vinyl from garage sales in very good condition (my parents garage sale and bring me vinyl all the time-some gems that make your day!).

A lot of it not available through Acoustic Sounds or the Elusive Disc. For example, I found a prestine copy of James Taylor, Dad Loves his Work. I absolutely love every song on this Album. However, each time I play it - I know wear and tear continues on this non-180 gram copy! Sending it to Steve to have this great involving sound properly done on Disc seems to be the way to go! Once again, I own a lot of vinyl you can't get through above mentioned....I want it on these Discs from Steve at a competitve price-which he is providing!

Furthermore, The JT record I would want whole, but take Gary Wrights Dream Weaver which I have a killer copy of....as suggested he would just burn the selections I want....Dream Weaver, Love is Alive & Can't Find the Judge. The LP is mind blowing the regular CD sucks! I have to have it done Steve's way!  'nough said!

Stone of Tone
PS-my Turntable runs in top shape-I live 15 mins from the Needle Doctor in Minneapolis and bring my Table in for Counter Top Service when needed.

OK, as per request, here is a very short 24/96 sample from the group called Level 42.  The LP was 45 RPM.  A cleaner record, higher RPMS, and the higher bit rate should make this sample sound significantly better than the previous 16/44 samples.

level42sample.aiff

https://www.decware.com/newsite/music/level42sample.aiff

Enjoy,

Steve

Anyone tried the 24/96 sample yet?

Indeed, these are test runs.  I'm not cleaning the records nor getting the perfect levels during the recording.  If I continue with this, I'll be cleaning the LPs and selecting ones that are in only great condition.  Be using the Teres table, and doing it over as many times as needed to hit the levels perfect.  No compression, normalization or anything is done, it's just a direct dump.  Makes getting the levels right a trial and error process for each song.

Steve

i can clearly hear improvement on the steve miller samples, even on the horrible headphones i have here right now.your process steve seems to get me deeper into the music without extra volume being required and delivers a much richer tone, i wonder if the engineers compressed the miller recording when they put it on cd? thats what it sounds like to me, like the mainstream cd is compressed, thin and recessed, whereas your new digital recording is open, full and thick.

id really like to buy a cd from you, put 8 great classic rock songs on a cd and ill give ya $40 for it.

I just saw this thread and noticed a great difference in the sound. One thing in particular is that the steve miller song sounds like the channels are flipped in comparing my mp3 to the file of the beginning of fly like an eagle. I'm currently downloading a vinyl and another cd torrent of the greatest hits to see if the quality can compare at all.

I agree that the vinyl versions seem to sound completely different and even on my average system I use with my PC the edginess is gone from the music. I didn't realize how much the cd takes away from the music. I've always thought that my speakers were doing that, lol.

Welcome Ricardus!