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AUDIO FORUMS >> General Discussion and Support >> Decware at Axpona
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Message started by Palomino on 02/13/23 at 13:03:21

Title: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 02/13/23 at 13:03:21

I see that Decware will be at Axpona this year in the Wathen Audio room. I've always wanted to see how a Decware amp would be received at such a high end event.

My advice? With that amp, at that price, with those tubes and that crowd, place your Sarah order before the show begins.

I wonder what speakers they will run?

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by CAJames on 02/13/23 at 14:49:37

Quote:

...place your ~~Sarah~~ Decware order before the show begins.

FIFY. I predict another bump in the wait list.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 02/13/23 at 14:55:14

Yeah, probably more accurate.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 02/13/23 at 15:53:10

I have it on my calendar as the 14th - 16th.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by thevinoman on 02/13/23 at 15:55:32

Sorry, my mistake. Deleted my post.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Kamran on 02/14/23 at 00:02:24

Tom, I recall wondering about the same thing when Steve originally announced this. I too expect a significant boost to the orders and waitlist post the event. Good call to remind members (who might be on the fence) to pull their respective triggers prior.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Steve Deckert on 02/25/23 at 18:30:29

The Sarah 300B amplifier will be at AXPONA this year!

Don Thomas of Wathen Audiophile / Cyrotone will have models SEWE300B and TORII JRv2 in their room.

The room number is 612.

It is right across from the elevators and around the corner from LTA.

Among the Wathen speakers will be the Inertia Cubes and the new CryoTone Dipole flagship speakers. Both sound fantastic with Decware equipment.

Sarah and Veronica may also pop in and hand out coupons to attendees for the new amplifier!

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Steve Deckert on 02/25/23 at 18:43:17

For those who don't know, Wathen Audiophile is Cryotone.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 02/25/23 at 23:14:16

Are you going Steve?

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Steve Deckert on 02/26/23 at 01:31:40

Yes, we will be there scoping out the competition.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by JBzen on 02/26/23 at 09:53:48

What competition? Is there any, really? I find it hard to believe there is when a business has a kickstart or gofundme model.

Not to be negative...just some thoughts.

John

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by JBzen on 04/12/23 at 13:45:04

You know your position Steve. Enjoy your time at Axpona!
John

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/13/23 at 13:24:59

I went through the Axpona vendor list. I may just be out of touch but I didn’t recognize as many names this time around. Still I have about 20 rooms to visit.

While I heard a lot of Decware at the fest, I’ll be stopping by the room to get a listen early on before the crowds build. My system is sounding better than ever lately and I can only attribute it to the Cryotone input tube breaking in. Im thinking about picking up a few more.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Kamran on 04/13/23 at 14:32:48

Tom,

Unfortunately making AXPONA isn’t on the cards for me this year but I’ll be very interested to hear your impressions on the PAP Duets in particular.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/13/23 at 14:55:23

What are they running these days in the Duet? I have heard them a few times in the past and once it was the Tang Band 1808 and then a lower level voxativ. There was also a year where they had some kind of horn playig mids.

I remembered liking the speakers and thought their proprietary bass drivers sounded better than the A15s. The voxativ I wanted to like but it sounded thin to me.

There is an old thread around here about how PAP inspired one of my initial OB builds - the tongue in cheek "Palomino Audio Project." I still have the baffles and the drivers.

Then Steve discovered Lii Audio and the rest is history.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Zork on 04/13/23 at 20:43:47

Voxativ AC-1.6 is the default driver now.

Over the years Voxativ full range drivers won their position as the ‘gold standard’ among full range drivers. The Ferrite magnet / light Japanese paper cone AC-1.6 driver is a ‘classic’. It’s built quality is top-notch and sound is realistic, smooth, full-body, transparent, with all the clarity, resolution and a beautiful sonic finesse. This driver is a natural match with the Duet15 design.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/13/23 at 20:50:54

I'll give them another listen. I've heard them in a couple of different speakers and thought they were thin and brittle sounding.

Probably just me or maybe the room. Both times were at Axpona in less than ideal settings. They seem highly revered in the audio world.

I did go to the web site and see they still offer the Tang Band 1808. I still have those drivers and the Alpha 15s. Maybe even the crossover Kamran...

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Kamran on 04/14/23 at 00:11:20

Thanks Tom. At the heart of my question is whether these drivers are sonically that much superior to those of Lii Audio to justify it’s $6K starting point. Another thing that bugs me is that there aren’t too many reviews of the Duets floating around the net, besides Guttenberg and Alvin from Denafrips. But perhaps, OB is still a niche category within our industry that perhaps it shouldn’t be too surprising.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/14/23 at 00:18:45

I’ll try to give them a good listen. That’s a big price differential. I’d expect something special for that. The thing is, generally speaking, nothing sounds that good in these hotel rooms.

Audio memory is a weird thing but I’m hoping I can retain enough of an impression to compare them to the p10s once they arrive. It will be apples and oranges though because I think a big reason why I like my system so much is the room treatments. But maybe I’ll get enough of an impression to know.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by BlackBess on 04/14/23 at 13:06:32

I’m hoping to read some positive impressions concerning the CSS Audio Typhon speakers being introduced at the show. Jay Lee’s pet project.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Kamran on 04/15/23 at 02:06:19

BlackBess: I’m also curious as to how these will be received.

Watching the videos pouring in today from AXPONA and yet to see the Cryotone/Decware room being covered.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by beowulf on 04/15/23 at 07:55:01

Palomino wrote on 04/13/23 at 13:24:59:

Hey Pal, if you get the chance can you check out Cube Audio (single drivers from Poland)? Been hearing some amazing things about them and the build quality alone looks phenomenal!

They're supposedly showing in two rooms:

VPE Electrodynamics - Booth: 502

Refined Audio - Booth: 572

Thanks!!!

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/15/23 at 14:12:30

I don’t have a ton of places on my list and this sounds like it’s worth a stop. I haven’t found a lot of open baffle vendors yet other than PAP. Triangle art has some as well. Wathen will be playing their new offering.

A lot of what I go for is to find new music. I create a playlist of each years finds. It also helps me evaluate my system when I get back home. I play the memorable tracks and critique.

I’ll also be doing some clandestine Decware marketing…”did you hear that Decware 300B?”

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Ghostship on 04/15/23 at 15:05:02

Quote:

I’ll also be doing some clandestine Decware marketing…”did you hear that Decware 300B?”

Nice [smiley=icqlite16.png]

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Steve Deckert on 04/15/23 at 16:50:47

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/15/23 at 17:29:06

It’s early but it’s one of my favorite rooms so far.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Matchstikman on 04/15/23 at 18:11:15

It looks like Chocolate Chip Trip is becoming a goto track for demonstrating percussion. Steve mentioned that he tested the 300b with this track, too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lk7EwDerhxg

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/15/23 at 18:54:41

I checked out the cube audio. I’ve only heard it in a cabinet but I was impressed. It has a triple whizzed cone which I haven’t seen before. Nice mids and highs. I didn’t feel the need for an additional tweeter. Probably better than the C10s I am running now at home.

I also went to pure audio project. The first song I heard I reminded me of the first time I heard them with the voxativ driver. Pretty thin. But I think it was more the song because the next track sounded more full.

I actually liked the OBs in the Wathen room more than PAP. I was a bit biased going in because of the metal baffle but they produced a nice soundstage and both the highs and lows were nice. Lows were tighter and more controlled than PAP.

Overall lack of soundstage and bass control have been the two killers of most rooms. Tough in these hotel rooms.

The most impressive large scale setup so far has been the big PS Audio speakers. I didn’t bother to even see what they cost but they filled the massive room with very punchy detailed dynamic sound. Good soundstage to boot.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/15/23 at 18:58:41

Oh, and the Border Patrol 300B did not compare well to the Sarah. Could have been the speakers they were paired with but I found the sound to be dull. Just kinda flat and lifeless.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/15/23 at 22:49:56

Another Axpona (aka Patricia Barber-fest) in the books. I covered a lot of ground. I only stayed in a room if the music was captivating and/or the sound was good.

Some notes or rooms:

Vinni Rossi. I don’t know what he does but he always has good sound. I don’t even know what speakers he was running but he had a good soundstage and control of the bass. He also played the best music I heard.

Linkwitz. Provably spelled that wrong. I’ve always wanted to hear his speakers. I know he’s passed but they are still building/selling them. Anyway I liked them even though the bass was way too loud. It rumbled the room.

English speakers. For box speakers I liked Mission, Tannoy and warfdale. I don’t know what it is about them but they just sound smooth and inviting to me.

I tried to hear the cube audio speakers in the open baffle but failed. Went back 3 times but no dice. But I liked what I heard in the horn Configuration.

Wathen. I am probabaly just a biased fan boy but the Decware amps on both speakers effortlessly produced a good soundstage. I liked the little cube speakers as well. They had a similar sound signature to the open baffles.

I went to the other PAP room. I’m not sure what the middle driver was in the trios but again, just not my cup of tea. Sounded flat and almost muffled.

I picked up a few good tracks but not as many as I wanted to. I guess years of Shazamming audio show videos has left me with all the audio show standards already in the stable. I’ll sort though them and post those I think were new/good.

I guess that’s it. I always come away from Axpona thinking I’ve done well given what I’ve invested. It’s tough to really tell though given the hotel room limitations. I have a deep soundstage, pinpoint imaging and great tight bass. Maybe that is not achievable in a hotel room setting.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Kamran on 04/15/23 at 23:48:34

Had a friend take some pics of the room

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Dominick on 04/16/23 at 14:34:18

Pal,

Sounds like Axpona was a good time and lots to explore. Like yourself I actively seek out new music to evaluate my system.

Last week I attended the New York Auto show on press/media day. I get the pass through my national car club and it’s a great way to explore the show since it’s not open to the general public on that day.

Over the years the quality of the show has degraded so each manufacturer have looked for creative ways showcase of vehicles. Much to my surprise over at Jeep… they had a full-blown McIntosh System set up for guest to relax and enjoy music. I have to say that even in a wide open setup with no dedicated room….the sound was very good…it was very detailed and focused…just no big soundstage due to the open space.

Two songs that stood out that I Sound Hounded were Cyrus Chestnut’s “ Grandmama’s Blues” and Chris Jones “ No Sanctuary Here”. Give them a try in your system. No Sanctuary Here was my favorite.

On a separate note… I finally had a few friends over since having my house rebuilt. They were all blown away with my setup since none of them have ever seen or experienced a tube system. The ERR’s work well in my room….even though I have yet to tackle room treatment…which I know it needs. These are Sonos guys…so running Roon and having the video of the artists and song lyrics piped onto my TV was the icing on the cake. Some haven’t experienced vinyl in over 30 years…so spinning my limited Japanese imports and first pressings was fun and really got them engaged in the music.

I’ll work on uploading the pics and video clip from the Auto Show.

Dom

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/16/23 at 15:05:48

Thanks. Listening to Grandmama’s Blues now. Great track. I know the no sanctuary track. I like the faster version.

My Axpona playlist is 93 songs long right now. A mix of everything.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/16/23 at 15:10:13

For you Tidal people:

https://tidal.com/browse/playlist/212e4695-eabb-4f12-a538-6edb06f4abd8

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Dominick on 04/16/23 at 15:30:41

Cool…thanks for sharing the playlist. Definitely gonna give that a listen today. 👍

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Kamran on 04/16/23 at 15:34:24

Very familiar with No Sanctuary Here—on my playlist for 2 years now. I’ll check out your other rec soon—thanks!

It’s funny—what Tom was doing live—I was doing remotely while watching all the YouTube coverage for the past two days and similar to Tom, there were mostly playing songs, that I was already familiar with.

Speaking of coverage, one thing that really annoyed me was the fact that none of the YouTubers (primarily Jays Audio Lab and Audiophile Junkie) seemed to cover the Wathen/Decware room. I finally found a 12 second clip of the room through another YouTuber (see link below and fast forward to 6 min 20 sec), but he didn’t even know what he was looking at and didn’t even focus on the amp.

https://youtu.be/8vQ8pWnE5jc

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/16/23 at 15:51:42

Yeah, its hard to get any attention there. Lots of bling, big signs, big rooms, etc. Wathen was in a small room without any pre-show hype so I didn't expect much traffic. There was a waiting line at 10:00 to get into the room though and it seemed to always have traffic when I stopped by.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/16/23 at 16:01:52

99% of the songs on that playlist I didn't have on another playlist yet.

I made fun and called it Patricia Barber-fest. Good demo music but I bet a dozen or so rooms were playing her stuff. On one floor I went into three rooms in a row all playing from the same album. Two were playing the same track.

Some songs I didn't see coming:

Roundabout - Yes. I didn't even recognize the song when it came on. The guitar infro was Very captivating on a good system.

I will remember - Toto. I was never a fan but this track sounded great.

Tears in Heaven - Eric Clapton. The large scale system I heard this on really captured the emotion.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Dominick on 04/16/23 at 16:30:39

Firing up the playlist now.

Here are the pics from the Auto show. The video is gonna take some time to upload.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Kamran on 04/16/23 at 16:30:47

Thanks, I plan to check out these tracks as well as the playlist. For some reason, Patricia Barber is yet to grow on me. She came highly recommended, but didn’t grab me the way Diana Krall, Melody Gardot, Eva Cassidy or Chantal Chamberland did.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by HockessinKid on 04/16/23 at 16:49:45

Dom,

That's quite a M(a)c stack.

HK

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Dominick on 04/16/23 at 17:05:57

Roger,

Yeah it was impressive. Talk about great marketing for having this setup at the auto show. The rep must have been floating around …so I took the opportunity to turn the volume a tad up to help with the background noise. Working on uploading the video clip…it was damn good.

Dom

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by 4krow on 04/16/23 at 17:10:04

But, I don't see any cars at the audio show.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/16/23 at 18:03:47

By the way Kamran, Steve Guttenberg was there, kooky shirt and all. I gave him a nod and he nodded back even though he doesn't know me from Adam. I was hoping maybe he would stop by the room and make a public comment.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Sean on 04/16/23 at 18:14:44

Thanks for posting that rack a Mac. Brings back a memory from about 40 yrs ago. My dad took me to the Listening Post, a local high end shop at that time. I was 11 or 12. Anyhow I wasn’t into stereos at the time, but they had a Mac room and a couple racks set up like that. The meters and the colors and the heft of those components mesmerized me and have stuck with me. Never owned a Mac, maybe someday.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by beowulf on 04/16/23 at 18:20:53

Hey Pal, thanks for the notes and take aways on the Cube Audio stuff! The Wathen stuff looks to be excellent as well!

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/16/23 at 19:30:52

Beo, I don’t know if they sell those drivers individually but they would make an interesting build. The open baffle speaker using them was a Nelson Pass design with a huge Eminence Kappa driver pointed into a small flat base cabinet with slot port. I wish I could have heard them

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Dominick on 04/16/23 at 21:23:58

4Krow….My post of the McIntosh system was a sidebar for telling Palomino about songs I heard at the NY Auto Show through the Mac system that was on display.

It was such a great setup that I just wanted to share it.

Here are the YouTube links of the video clips I took of the Mac system…

https://youtube.com/shorts/Yv-ygfB9DPM?feature=share

https://youtube.com/shorts/hoQgoSKnimg?feature=share

Dom

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Kamran on 04/16/23 at 21:29:43

Tom, love the nodding game with Guttenberg. Yes, I knew he was going to be there (he was going to give a talk on the first day) and was also hoping he would stop by the Wathen/Decware room. Vids from the third day are still pouring in, so who knows we may get a last second whiff.

Here are two tracks I shazammed and liked so far:

Jay Jah Know by Groundation
Mad World by Alex Parks

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by LiquidBlue on 04/17/23 at 00:24:36

Man, I'm lovin' this playlist so far, Palomino. Molly Hatchett is playing right now. A song I haven't heard in decades... And suddenly these memories are flooding my brain, of strutting down the halls of my high school with friends at my side, with all the swagger, attitude and freedom of youth. Good stuff!

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Matchstikman on 04/19/23 at 18:29:15

I'm interested in attending AXPONA next year.

What is the price tag for this show?
Do I need to be a vendor or someone established in audio? Can I just be a guy off the street?
How does the process work? Do I get my tag and then run amok?

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/19/23 at 18:35:30

$30 I think. Bought my ticket so long ago I do t remember. Open to the public. Run amok.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Showme on 04/20/23 at 22:20:52

Tom, thanks for the playlist. I have it playing now. Lots of new to me music to listen to. I have one of your earlier endeavors saved as well.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Palomino on 04/20/23 at 22:30:27

You are welcome. I wish there was a way to export the song list - or even better - translate a playlist from Tidal to other streaming services.

Steve Guttenberg published his youtube review of the show. I was hoping for a tip of the hat to the Wathen room but no such luck.

We did have some overlap in the rooms we liked so that was good to hear.

Title: Re: Decware at Axpona
Post by Dominick on 04/21/23 at 07:04:15

Tom,

There is a way to convert a playlist from one streaming platform to another. I did it years ago and it worked very but it wasn’t totally foolproof. If I remember correctly… There was a minor glitch where a few songs weren’t able to transfer over.

Check out Soundiiz.com

https://soundiiz.com/

Give it a try and let us know how you make out.

Dom