Forums https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl AUDIO FORUMS >> D.I.Y. >> DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1625618023 Message started by Lolaworks on 07/07/21 at 01:33:43

Title: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Lolaworks on 07/07/21 at 01:33:43 Hello all,  I'm new to the site and just getting back to Audiophile equipment after a 40+ year hiatus.  I was recently given some very nice gear that was incomplete and needed work and the next thing I know I'm obsessed with Decware stuff and ordering my first items.  The problem is that I need higher efficiency speakers than the Spendor SP7/1's and Acarian Elons I was given.  I did inherit an Altec Voice of theater speaker from my mother, but it was for an early mono set up (Rek-o-kut turntable and Radio Craftsmen Amp) so I only have one. Although I am a complete knucklehead about electronics I spent most of my adult life as a furniture maker and cabinetmaker.  Consequently the cost differential between drivers and finished speaker has led me to decide to make my own. I ordered Lii Audio F-15's and am going to build baffless speakers a la Steve Deckert's design (with some styling modifications to personalize them).  I'm also making a couple of extra pairs for two friends. Next I want to make a pair of the Lii Audio Reference speakers using Lii Silver 10's.  I would like to pretty much duplicate their design as I have to assume the specific internal geometry is intentional and specific.  Does anyone have measured drawings and/or photographs of the interior of the factory cabinets? by the way, given the amount of labor required to make them, the retail price of the speakers is incredibly low--if you had them made here I suspect they would cost around 3 times the price.  My point is not that the cabinets are expensive, but with kids in college, I have more time than money so for me making them is the only option. Any drawings or first hand experience with the speakers would be greatly appreciated. Reed Karen Shelter Island, NY

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Brian on 07/07/21 at 03:31:40 Hello, Reed. I do not have the drawings you ask for, but I wanted to say hello and welcome. Brian

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Lolaworks on 07/08/21 at 22:10:09 Thanks Brian, I appreciate it. I emailed Lii Audio and they were gracious enough to send me measured drawings of their reference speaker cabinets for the silver/crystal 10's.  I am attaching the drawings as a resource for anyone else who is interested in building a pair.  I will leave the files large so that you have higher resolution if you want to print them.  I may have to post the second drawing set in a separate email. Reed

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Lolaworks on 07/08/21 at 22:27:46 Here is the second page of Reference speacker Cabinet drawing

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Donnie on 07/08/21 at 22:40:44 25.4 is your friend when converting Metric to Imperial measurements! There are exactly 25.4 MM to an inch. Just trying to be helpful.

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by DPC on 07/09/21 at 09:41:08 Could this be a future project for a DYI speaker builder in Central Illinois?

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Brian on 07/09/21 at 10:37:35 It is most generous of Mr Lii to share his cabinet measures and design with us. I am grateful. Brian

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Lolaworks on 07/09/21 at 12:21:37 Lii also sent drawings for a couple of simpler cabinets that would work with the 6" Silver or Crystal.  See attached

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Lolaworks on 07/09/21 at 12:24:14 Another Lii speaker drawing

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Lolaworks on 07/09/21 at 12:25:57  I'm afraid I have to post each one seperately because of the size of the files. This one has an anled internal baffle.

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Geno on 07/09/21 at 12:59:42 Either of these look a hell of a lot easier to build than the Lii reference! I guess it depends on how much of a challenge you want…

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Donnie on 07/09/21 at 17:11:12 This kinda makes me wish that I hadn't just dropped a zillion bucks on my speaker kit from Denmark. Oh well, there is always the next project, well at least until the inevitable.

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Shomei’a on 02/17/22 at 16:27:28 Lola works, thanks for posting the plans. I have excellent woodworking skills but I’ve never built a speaker and I have a few questions: 1.  The bracing. It obviously can’t be a shelf so, is it a circle with a cut out?  I don’t understand the drawing 2.  What is depicted in purple?  Is it foam? Some other dampening material? Thanks to anyone who can answer for me Gary

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Donnie on 02/17/22 at 18:10:51 I take the purple as the reinforcement bracing.

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Archie on 02/17/22 at 18:27:52 Look at both the plan and elevation drawing.  Yes, the purple are "rings" of reinforcing.

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by JBzen on 02/17/22 at 19:18:27 Wow this is a thread from last summer! Would love to collaborate on the reference cabinet. I was in the middle of the country on my road bike sweating my balls off heading towards Colorado on the Flint Hills Nature Trail facing a 30mph wind when this was posted. So please forgive my tardiness.   I built the Netherlands cabinets for a set of Crystals but still aspire to built the reference. I ask before on this forum if anyone had the volume of the cabinet without any response. I do know they have a frame made of steel and marine grade plywood is wrapped around the frame. The back forms into a vent. Can anyone plug in the dimensions into a program and come up with volume of the interior? Oh boy, oh boy, maybe here we go! BTW, Lil posts these plans on his site under speaker plans. They are top notch from China. John

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Shomei’a on 02/18/22 at 18:19:22 Thanks everyone. I doubt there is an “internal frame”.  I’m experimenting with the OB’s now (breaking in Silver 10’s with DIY Betsy’s made from Sassafras) but if I am not satisfied I will move to the reference. I’m thinking of two different ways to build the cabinets.  The first involves coopering; this method involves cutting the edges of a series of vertical pieces at specific angles so that they make a curve. This method would not work well with plywood but is well suited to solid wood.  The second involves kerf bending. In this method one builds a frame (that would then serve as the internal bracing). The plywood is cut with a series of non-through kerfs that allow it be to bent over the frame. In between the plywood and the frame, and glued to the plywood, one adds a layer of 1/8 inch bending plywood.  I’ve used this technique a number of times and it is very strong. It does leave small empty “voids” at the bottom of the kerfs. One could filll these with something (bondo glue?) but this would make the glue-up more difficult. BTW, the choice of glue is important for this technique. PVA glues “give” a little so not the best choice. Hide glue or resin glue is better. Is there any reason besides cost not to build out of solid wood?  Could use MDF but wold be very heavy. Would the voids present a sonic issue?? Any other ideas? Gary

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by JBzen on 02/18/22 at 23:28:33 Hi Gary, Here is a pic of how Lii builds-em. Pic is from Lii audio Facebook page. I would not use MDF. I like the cooper idea. Lot of plane work though. Also thinking of stacking form cut pieces. John

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by JBzen on 02/19/22 at 10:47:58 Looks like 5/8” marine grade plywood is used for the sides. I’ve done some coopering, limit forming, but mostly kerf bending in my life. After looking at what Lii done(did a search yesterday because I remember Lii talking about a steel frame in the reference when cabinets were upgraded), it would be the best route to get her done IMO. Has anyone done plywood sheet forming? Basically it is wetting the wood and pressing it around a form, let it dry and it retains the form shape. Wonder if it would be better to use two sheets of 3/8 as compared to one 5/8. Or, 3/8 and 1/4 on the top layer. I was thinking that if the plan was put in paint(if it is still called that in windows) it could be scaled and printed the actual size to use as a template to make the top and bottom forms and necessary forms for bending. John

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by JBzen on 02/19/22 at 11:36:27 With more thought that will probably get me in the office to get a template printed, did Lii use one sheet of MGP to form the four sides of the cabinets, then match tune the Crystals with vent blocking in the cabinet. Brings to mind what was first the chicken or egg [smiley=tunes10.gif] John

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Shomei’a on 02/19/22 at 18:35:45 This is very helpful!  If the bracing is as important as suggested then gluing up a few sheets of bending plywood over a form might be best. Unfortunately, this would require veneer for a pretty cabinet and this would be difficult as it would require a huge vacuum press.  So, either a painted cabinet made from multiple plays of bending plywood, or kerf bending. Still wondering about the effects of the kerfs on the sonics.  I just rapped on a 3 inch wide piece of kerf-bent, glued up remnant from a project; seems to have quite a ring to it. So, either coopering or bending ply. BTW, coopering should be easy if you have a table saw. Just calculate the angles Gary

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by JBzen on 02/20/22 at 11:53:50 Paper back lathe veneer can be used with contact cement and hand roller. This will leave a fine line on the edges. If done well the line is not noticable especially on these cabinets. Lii's bracing plays very important rolls in elimination standing sound waves of the interior and tunes the cabinet to a lower ringing frequency. The shape of the cabinet helps with diffraction and reinforces bass. It is truly a work of art that I would like to expand on. Coopering can be a great way to form odd shape wood perimeters but requires a lot of calculating and a quality table saw for efficiency. If a smooth finish is desired as is needed for this project there will be a fair amount of hand planing required followed by sanding. I still like the way Lii does it but am thinking of adding a dome top and treat the base a little differently. John

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Shomei’a on 02/20/22 at 19:11:15 I’m experimenting with OB’s right now. If I decide to build the cabinets this discussion will be so helpful. Paper backed veneer would be a good solution. I’m leaning against kerf bending but laying up 2 or 3 layers of bending plywood should work well. If a 3/8 inch carbide bit is used to rout the forms one would be left with both an interior brace and an exterior form ideal for the glue up. Coopering would not be hard. I don’t find the finishing concerning. The internal bracing would need to be built separately. Choice of wood could be important; probably want a species with good damping properties. Gary

Title: Re: DIY Lii Reference speakers measured drawings? Post by Dr3wman on 04/28/22 at 04:04:02 The “simple b “ option looks like it could be a pretty great options. As I have minimal woodworking skills, I’d likely be relying on the help of my father who has a wood shop and 50 years of hobby experience. There are still some vagaries in the plans, at least to my untrained eyes that does cause me some worry…the three circles at the bottom “92”… are those ports?

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