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https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl AUDIO FORUMS >> D.I.Y. >> A journey with Betsy https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1622485066 Message started by CJinArcadia on 05/31/21 at 19:17:46 |
Title: A journey with Betsy Post by CJinArcadia on 05/31/21 at 19:17:46 I'm not certain where I first read about the Betsy driver by Wild Burro. It could have been here on Decware, maybe on Randy's Caintuck site, or somewhere else on the web. But I was intrigued by the idea of these open baffle speakers, especially with Randy's low barrel design. I still remember, some 30+ years ago, hearing a pair of giant Martin Logans, and being blown away by the airiness and soundstage. Could these, little full range speakers deliver some magic? I decided that I had to dip my toe in to see. I've had a few sets of speakers in the past 40+ years. Avid, Klipsch, Monitor Audio, and Thiels. The Thiels I've been most satisfied with and have had them for 12 or so years. But last year I got the bug for something a little "different". Thus, the journey. My journey started with a plain Betsy, using glued and clamped 1/2" mdf so that the baffles were 1" thick. A string and pencil gave me the arcs for a pair that were about the size of Randy's (mine were 22-1/2" tall by 18-1/2" wide). Cut the arcs with saber saw, speaker holes with a home made router jig, mount a base, spray some paint, mount the drivers, and hook up some wires. I wasn't concerned too much with WAF at this point; these were first prototypes to see if I liked the sound. And did I! (Especially with them pulled away from the wall a few feet.) But then I wanted just a bit more reinforcement on the lower end. Through this site I came across the old Betsy & Buck idea from Caintuck Audio. I went back and forth between the B&B, or a Lii 12" or 15" driver. The B&B won out due to aesthetics (WAF) with using the 10"Alpha 10A drivers. (And a compromise on probable low end versus the 12 or 15" Alpha drivers. Since these are in my living room, looks are critical.) Prototype 2 was again 1" thick mdf, but I took more care on the construction. The arcs this time were cut with a router jig, changed the design to rear mount the drivers, and I used a roundover bit for the front edges. And of course made them taller (24-1/2"tall by 18-1/2" wide). Based upon input from Randy (Caintuck) and Doug (Wild Burro), I initially ran these with a separate small amp with built in crossover. In my system, I wasn't thrilled with the results and ordered a pair of 10mH chokes to try passive mode on powering the 10" drivers. I was extremely happy with the resulting sound. Here's prototypes 1 and 2. " alt="" border="0" /> Since I was so pleased with the sound, time to make an even nicer set. This time from 6/4 cherry from a local custom lumber yard. I decided to make them slightly larger (25" tall and 19-1/4" wide), and altered the side arcs to more of a slight "tulip" shape where the base is slightly wider than the top. I used a larger roundover bit for the speaker holes, and bought some super Q chokes with heavier guage wire. So far, I and my wife, are both thrilled. Yes, the upper and low ends aren't the same as my older Thiels, but the airiness and soundstage have exploded. " alt="" border="0" /> " alt="" border="0" /> " alt="" border="0" /> With the music that I primarily listen to: jazz, vocals, acoustic (guitar, piano, Irish Trad), classic rock, with a touch of music from up in the hollar (I'm near the NC hill country after all), these speakers in my system deliver. The speakers disappear. The sound stage seems like it sometimes goes outside the room. Both male and female vocals sound "right". And with the bit extra provided by the 10" Alpha, things like standup bass come across with the right authority. Next up: What happens when I replace the plain ol Betsy with a fancy Alnico version? I can't wait to find out. After That: How do things sound when I replace my old PSE amp with one from Decware? Chris |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by Geno on 06/01/21 at 04:00:21 Hi Chris. I was anticipating being able to see the pictures. I see you have them shown in the “members systems” section. Very nice! The Betsy’s are very special drivers, and Randy is responsible for starting the whole open baffle craze on this forum. You and us other open baffle folks are lucky to have found both. I loved the Betsy’s, and then switched to the Alnico’s. IMHO, they are worth the extra money. They add something “extra”😉. And speaking of “extra”, you are in for a real eye (and ear) opener when you get a Decware amp - a perfect match! Best, Geno |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by CJinArcadia on 06/01/21 at 14:00:46 Hmmmm. I’m not sure what happened to the photos . They were there when I looked yesterday. I can see them now when using the computer, but not my phone. |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by Dana on 06/01/21 at 22:14:37 Rats, I can't see them on my computer... just blue boxes. |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by Dana on 06/02/21 at 06:15:24 Those came out nice! What a clean build. Thanks for sharing |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by Coyote on 08/29/21 at 21:48:05 Congratulations. Very nice yesssss. I am about to have some Betsy with Lii F15 built in anticipation of the UFO2 Steve and his team are building. Cheers, a. |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by Steve Deckert on 08/30/21 at 02:45:31 Very nice build! Steve |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by Brian on 08/30/21 at 03:51:31 They came out beauties! I have always liked this two way version of the open baffle. Randy wrote great things about the sound when it was first introduced. How do you like the Gerry Curtis pentode amp? I almost never come across anyone who has one. Brian |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by EdwardT on 08/30/21 at 14:00:21 That makes me want to copy your design with some 10/4 white oak I have drying in my shop. Very nice build, I’ll bet the sound is wonderful. |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by HockessinKid on 08/30/21 at 22:48:24 Yes, those alnico Betsy drivers are special. Enjoy. HK |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by EdwardT on 08/31/21 at 00:48:45 Do I guess correctly that the inductor is inline with the Eminence driver to limit its response to under 125 Hz? |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by CJinArcadia on 08/31/21 at 01:47:23 That’s correct about the choke. I’m using a 10mH. The two drivers are in parallel with the choke in-line with the 10”. |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by Brian on 08/31/21 at 03:52:54 I thank you so much for the report on the Jerry amp. I remember when Jerry was a correspondent here in this forum, and have long wondered what his amps are like. Brian |
Title: Re: A journey with Betsy Post by CJinArcadia on 08/31/21 at 11:49:34 Unfortunately I have very little to compare his amps to since his is my first tube power amp. |
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