Forums - Print Page

Forums
https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl
AUDIO FORUMS >> General Discussion and Support >> Teac UD-503 as pre-amp
https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1548712740

Message started by Showme on 01/28/19 at 21:59:00

Title: Teac UD-503 as pre-amp
Post by Showme on 01/28/19 at 21:59:00

I'm currently using a UD-503 as a pre-amp with my 25th Anniv amp and DNA speakers. I was planning on the purchase of a CSP-3 to replace the UD-503 and continue using it only as a DAC. I've gotten spoiled by the remote though. The DNA's require a pre-amp. I wasn't using one with my Betsy's before as they didn't seem to need it. My question is how much is the sound compromised with the Teac vs a CSP-3 Anniv? Thanks, for any input.

Title: Re: Teac UD-503 as pre-amp
Post by HockessinKid on 01/28/19 at 23:00:29

I have the Decware modified TEAC NT-503 and CSP3-25 in my system. No degradation is sound quality - preamp adds additional density and signal boost. I am using a Sophia Aqua 274b rectifier, 6N5P and a Mullard 7dj8 tubes. Crystal clear.

HK

Title: Re: Teac UD-503 as pre-amp
Post by Dominick on 01/29/19 at 06:15:24

If you are looking to add gain to you system with a signal boost, you have a few options from a ZSTAGE being the cheapest solution putting out the least amount of gain between 0-15v; the CSP3 sitting in the middle with 0-30v amount of gain, to the ZTPRE being the most expensive putting out the most amount of gain between 0-35v.

I will be buying the new Teac NT-505 within the next month, so my advice here will be limited. I can say that my ZSTAGE does a nice job of adding some gain to my system, and is fairly quiet. But with that being said, I have heard from guys here that the ZTPRE is DEAD SILENT. If cost is not an option, then maybe the ZTPRE is the way to go.

At Decfest this past year...I heard the combo of Teac 503 being fed into ZTPRE and a ZBIT, into a 25th Anniversary and the DNA2’s.....all I can say is WOW!! It was truly amazing.

Here is s quick video clip I took on my iPhone X of that combo to give you an idea. Keep in mind we are talking about a cell phone captured event (plus YouTube’s audio/video compression didn’t help either). In person the aforementioned combination was magical.

https://youtu.be/tu7xMWi0Ipw

Guys like Lon and the Lonely Raven will give you a more detailed answer....so definitely take their advice when they chime in. Hope this helps.

Dom

Title: Re: Teac UD-503 as pre-amp
Post by Showme on 01/29/19 at 14:21:52

Dom, we heard that combo sitting on the couch at Decfest. Yes it was sweet.

Title: Re: Teac UD-503 as pre-amp
Post by Lonely Raven on 01/29/19 at 18:30:22

I think Lon will give you a better answer than I would, but I can share my experience and thoughts.

I'm a bit of purest. Back in the day, before the ZTPRE was finished, Steve kept telling me I needed a Preamp to get that extra density (that was the theme then, especially after Reel to Reel masters showed us what density really was). I like density, it brings you close to the music, but I kept feeling like anything we added to the chain took me a hair away from the purity of DAC to Amp. Steve sat me down with the Magic Box (now called the ZBIT) and his best Preamp at the time. I felt that both added something, but also took me a hair away from purity.

I dislike this phrase "it's like a veil was lifted". It seems overused, but in my example, it's the reverse - it's like a veil was added between me and the speakers. But I'm talking like a microscopic, made from spider silk veil and only someone as nutty and tuned into a system would notice (looks at self in mirror - yep). The trade off was more density (though I didn't hear it that much that night), and being able to ride the gain to get your system to "wake up" which is sounds like you need.

Since then Steve has made great leaps and bounds with the 25th amps and mods, and the ZTPRE has been released and I've honestly not revisited this test to see if the current amps with the current pre takes me that microscopic step back from "purity". I believe some others have said they couldn't be without the new Pre, and here I am still running my (admittedly) low voltage Direct Stream or NT-503 directly to my 25th modded Zen and 25th Modded ZMA and I'm still blown away by how close to the music and engaging this is.

Also note, my ZMA has had the XLR inputs added, which is basically a ZBIT built in, and I do use it sometimes because the Decware amps just love having that extra voltage on the front end. And I don't feel like I need the gain for my speakers, so my needs are different.

I'd really like to bring a ZTPRE home and revisit this purity vs density with current amps and current pre in my home setup and see how this changes my mind. Pretty much everyone says it will - but I'm stubborn and need to see it myself. Especially since I can't afford a ZTPRE right now. :P

Anyone in the Chicagoland area with a ZTPRE wanna come over for late night listening session and split some hairs...or spider silk with me??

Title: Re: Teac UD-503 as pre-amp
Post by Lon on 01/29/19 at 19:15:41

My two cents. . . I need to say up front that I have not heard the Teac unit in question, either unmodified or the Decware version. Teac cd players I heard in the past I didn't like much so I went in another direction and ended up following the transport/DAC route from PS Audio, first their PerfectWave duo, then their DirectStream Duo. I never went further up the Decware Teac line than their first cd player.

First off: were you to choose to use a CSP3-25 that preamp has so much gain I don't see why if you were using the Teac remote you couldn't play with the gain and have settings quite sufficient that you could use the Teac remote with the CSP3-25 preamp at a fixed setting.

Secondly, for a long time I was like Lonely Raven in that I felt that something was "in the way" with a preamp before the amps. That was before I tried a ZTPRE. The combination of using the balanced output of my DAC into the ZTPRE and then into a ZBIT and into the amp(s) was both transparent and also adding something that didn't feel in the way, felt like an improvement: body, dynamics, texture. With the 25th Anniversary Monoblocks the ZTPRE is a magnificent preamp that needs no apologies. I then tried the CSP3-25 and it too is very transparent and in comparison to the ZTPRE perhaps even more transparent (or perhaps it's just that you have a tubed rectifier there to roll and enhance certain playback aspects). Again, more added and none of it bad. I went back to the ZTPRE in the system though (will be using the CSP3-25 in a second system soon to be installed). The CSP3-25 with its Anniversary power supply was so dynamic and so open sounding that I found myself just wanting to listen to the best recordings, whereas with the ZTPRE I didn't have this tendency and my musical needs were met by content not recording quality to a larger extent. As I have so many mediocre recordings this suits my needs better.

The bottom line is that I don't feel you will be losing anything by putting a preamp between the Teac and the amp. The sheer adjustability of the preamps mean you can find just the right gain settings to suit your system and I don't doubt take it to the next level.

Title: Re: Teac UD-503 as pre-amp
Post by Showme on 01/29/19 at 21:48:03

Good, helpful responses guys. Thanks.

Title: Re: Teac UD-503 as pre-amp
Post by tocnaza on 02/06/19 at 09:24:39