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Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers (Read 44560 times)
JBzen
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #100 - 10/29/22 at 09:37:37
 
That is a bummer Kamran. Hopefully Lii will sent out a new pair ASAP.
That reminds me an item that was ordered and shipped with UPS has not arrived here after being delivered to the local hub over 3 weeks ago. I need to call the supplier. I think UPS is hiring some folks with sticky fingers!

John
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Kamran
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #101 - 10/29/22 at 18:05:48
 
Yes, Lii Audio was very quick to respond and offer to send out another pair via air.  They also seem to be very frustrated with UPS and wondering whether they should switch to FedEx.  

It’s really amazing that it took a phone call (and then an extra 20 min to secure a human being on the other side) for UPS to admit that they had no idea where the drivers were, once their truck broke down on the 25th.  I was like there must be hundreds of packages on that truck—are you telling me the company just lost them all?  I mean c’mon, you’re a logistics company and when a truck (which they call a feeder for some reason) breaks down, you’d expect them to have contingency plans in place to send another truck —swap the contents—and continue bringing the packages to their final destination.
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Kahuna Jack
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #102 - 10/29/22 at 18:23:40
 
My Lii drivers were lost in a black hole also ( but during Covid ) and Lii Audio eventually reshipped another pair so they are extremely honorable.

They must be losing large profits in our sloppy shipping companies. My experience is that Fe Ex is the worst of them all and they use to be solid years back when it was my go to choice. In my area FedEx hires sub contractor delivery drivers only.

You wonder how flea market vendors have full cases of unused current name brand products. Soap,toothpaste,cleaning supplies , home decor etc etc.
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Same Old DD
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #103 - 10/29/22 at 22:54:31
 
JBzen wrote on 10/29/22 at 09:37:37:
That is a bummer Kamran. Hopefully Lii will sent out a new pair ASAP.
That reminds me an item that was ordered and shipped with UPS has not arrived here after being delivered to the local hub over 3 weeks ago. I need to call the supplier. I think UPS is hiring some folks with sticky fingers!

John


I sometimes hesitate to be a spoiler type, but I know someone who works for UPS. Hands on at a hub and many coworkers wear ankle monitors.

This used to not be the case, but in today's hiring climate, they still need people willing to do the work.
Some relaxation of standards has occurred.
No win scenario, but we are there.

Sorry to hear about you guys having things lost in shipment.
I really hate dealing with that stuff!
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Same Old DD
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #104 - 10/29/22 at 23:00:49
 
Kamran, I hope the solution works out in a timely manner.

Last thing I had lost in shipment was a birthday present for my daughter last year. Navaho abused woman shelter center selling crafts to support the efforts.
I had ordered a huge hand woven pancho and it arrived four months late, but at least they found the thing eventually.
Angry

Good Luck!!

Seems like Lii Audio is doing an upstanding job for you.
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ProggRob
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #105 - 10/29/22 at 23:20:46
 
Hey all, haven’t been here in forever but I got my Fast 15 yesterday and have been playing them continuously for 24 hrs.  Happy to post updates as I go along.

Rob
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Kamran
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #106 - 10/30/22 at 02:45:39
 
So we have some first pictures from the wild 9 (courtesy Randy).  What caught me off guard is the decidedly yellow outer ring.  I was expecting it to be beige…similar to the inner ring — consistent with what was advertised on their website.  Plan to e-mail Lii Audio about that. Just curious.  Randy is listening right now, so hold for first impressions.

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Kamran
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #107 - 10/30/22 at 02:48:06
 
Listening room pic…
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Kamran
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #108 - 10/30/22 at 02:49:56
 
Sorry….can’t get these pics to size right…but if you click on the jpg link, it will open in it’s full glory.
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Kamran
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #109 - 10/30/22 at 02:57:07
 
Quick first impressions from Randy:

“I will have to mount the original F-15 drivers in some baffles tomorrow to do a proper A/B, but from the first couple of notes I can already tell that the Fast-15s are more detailed and extended on the top end. The bass is a bit deeper as well, but kind of loose.
Based on my experience with Lii Audio drivers, it will tighten up with some break in.
I'm guessing that these drivers are keepers.”
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Kamran
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #110 - 10/30/22 at 03:04:40
 
Another tidbit from Randy—totally agree with his call here:

“ BTW ... I am listening without the W-15 bass baffle and the ZROCK is turned off.
I want to hear what the Fast-15s sound like on their own.
One more thing ... they are very open sounding and fast, lots of "air".
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Donnie
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #111 - 10/30/22 at 03:28:44
 




Resized!
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Kamran
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #112 - 10/30/22 at 03:38:53
 
Thanks for re-sizing the pics Donnie!
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ProggRob
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #113 - 10/30/22 at 04:24:13
 
Agree with Randy’s air and detail comments.  I listened to the standard F-15 exclusively for over two years and it’s pretty obvious.
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Kamran
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #114 - 10/30/22 at 04:56:17
 
Thanks for your feedback as well ProggRob. If you don’t mind, can you share a picture of your baffles with the new drivers installed—especially if it’s a diffferent wood type compared to Randy’s. Trying to set a baseline of how it looks in different settings. I’m now a little less confident about the two tone wood arrangement as there will be too much going on with yellow as a third color within the driver itself.
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ProggRob
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #115 - 10/30/22 at 05:13:56
 
Thanks Kamran, and understand your concern. I thought the yellow was pretty cool but I have homemade painted red baffles made from doubled up 3/4” premium birch plywood.  I have the ability to change color if I don’t like the appearance.

I’ll get pics up soon.  I’m going to install some decoupling material between the basket and the baffles (from Herbie’s Audio Lab) before final install as I read an interesting study on this that I want to try.
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JBzen
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #116 - 10/30/22 at 10:55:41
 
This is all good news! After listening to Randy's rig at the Zenfest this year, I do respect his opinion. The only distraction was the drivers are so low to the ground in the original Besty baffles that it placed me in the balcony looking down at the performers. The present set up with the Crystals in Leon's folded horn cabinets places the performs at level albeit a tad high because of the extended horn mouth.

The new Fast 6s have the same color outer cone as Randy's FF15s.

ProggRob what size are your baffles?

I really need another project...yeah right! This is so tempting. Someone please stop me!

John
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Randy in Caintuck
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #117 - 10/30/22 at 16:57:27
 


Initial impressions .....

Last night, I spent about two hours listening to some familiar music via the new Fast-15 drivers that were mounted in some "quick and dirty" baffles that I threw together for testing purposes.
I recently sold my personal F-15 baffles to a customer and haven't had time to build another pair .... so, I will have to make a similar pair of baffles for the F-15s to do a direct A/B comparison.

As shared by Kamran, my initial thought was that the bass was a bit "loose", however after the amplifier (my trusty and musical SE84UFO) warmed up, the bass tightened up considerably.

All listening was done with the W-15 bass baffle disconnected and the ZROCK2 was in bypass mode.

My experience with all other Lii Audio drivers is that they require quite a few hours of break-in to "mature" and sound their best ..... so I'm pretty sure that this will also be true of the Fast-15s.
Most of the other Lii Audio drivers start sounding good after 100 to 200 hours of playing time, but one of my customers (who has good ears) tells me that his F-15 drivers continued to improve until they hit 500 hours.

I'm looking forward to the A/B comparison with the F-15s, but based on my (imperfect) sonic memory, the Fast-15 drivers are better in the following areas -
Better high frequency extension
Better detail ..... including "low level" detail
Better separation and spacing of vocals and instruments
A larger soundstage
Deeper and more tuneful bass
Improved "realism"

Translating from one language to another is usually an imperfect art, at best.
However, here is the statement from the Lii Audio website concerning the Fast-15 drivers -
"Since creation of F-15 we have always been thinking about all possible upgrades, after years of development and experiment, we can now proudly present to you Fast-15, a new member of Fast series. This model is optimized in detail and soundstage, giving a more present imaging and fuller sound body. The bass is deeper and more elastic that the energy can be released and pulled back quickly and easily. This model also has high end extension that rolls off up to 18kHz, giving a more vivid and swift sound experience. It uses the same basket as F-15 and can be direct upgrade by replacing the driver unit."

Based on my initial impressions, I can find no faults in this description.

I hope to have a pair of baffles ready for the F-15 drivers in a day or two and be able to share some additional thoughts.
Although neither pair of drivers will be fully broken in, they will have enough playing time to be able to make a valid comparison.

Happy listening,
Randy

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Randy in Caintuck
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #118 - 10/30/22 at 17:05:51
 


JBzen wrote -
Quote:
The only distraction was the drivers are so low to the ground in the original Besty baffles that it placed me in the balcony looking down at the performers.


Hi John,
It has been my experience that this perspective is related to the distance between the baffles and the listening position.
If you are too close, this is what you will hear.
Moving back a few feet raises the soundstage to what I refer to as a "private concert" perspective .....

If you can move the listening seat ten to twelve feet from the baffles, the speakers just disappear and the performers are "hanging in the air" above the baffles.

Some owners of the low-profile baffles place short spikes or cones under the fronts of the baffles to raise the soundstage.

Best wishes,
Randy

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Palomino
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #119 - 10/30/22 at 19:55:57
 
I’ve always been amazed by the floating soundstage and heard it again at the Fest.  One of the mysteries of hi fi.
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Same Old DD
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #120 - 10/30/22 at 22:22:50
 
I know it's not the same driver, but I am approaching or maybe just there at the 1000 hour mark of constant play and my original F15 drivers are still changing.

They sound wonderful!!
I would expect the same from this manufacturer with most other driver configurations.

Good to see you around, Randy!

... our demigod.  (you know you'll NEVER live it down)
Grin

I have tried angling upward by a small margin and found improvements. I'm a DIY kind of fellow, mostly.
Can you talk more about how some additional lifting and even spikes might offer further improvements? Is this something you've looked at?

OH, I'm using a scaled down version of Steve's Master at 36" height and loving every moment of it.

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JBzen
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #121 - 10/31/22 at 11:27:17
 
Randy your not really helping here. Only need to get through today before the free shipping lure passes Wink

The few times setting in your room at Zenfest was in the back row right near the door. A decent sound stage was present along with detail. I guess my ears were around 10' from the small baffles. Not sure the distance between the back curtain and back wall, but it is suspected to have limited my perception.

Palomino, enjoyed your pizza!

Are you talking about recordings with Q.  Probably not. Q can make that floating sound stage on just about any system. It is those special systems when all the stars align, when the music blossoms suspending the listener in passages of dense body absorbing bliss. If so, I can relate Smiley

John
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Bottlehead
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #122 - 10/31/22 at 22:30:51
 
Hey JB (and other Fast 15 lurkers like myself),

The Lii Audio site now shows that since the first batch sold out, the free shipping deal has been extended to 11/10.

Randy
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HockessinKid
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #123 - 10/31/22 at 23:20:08
 
Randy,

Thanks this is good news! May have to spring for a pair as an early Xmas present.😉

HK
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Kamran
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #124 - 11/01/22 at 01:53:33
 
Update: So while I wait for Lii Audio to give me a new FedEx tracking number, UPS had some interesting updates after the loss was filed.  An investigation was opened but it was also on it’s way to Horsham, PA on Oct 30th.  Copying their updates below.  There is a glimmer (emphasis on glimmer) that I might it get it this week.


10/31/2022
5:55 A.M.      Investigation Opened
We've begun an investigation to locate the package.

10/30/2022
7:27 P.M.      On the Way
Arrived at Facility
Horsham, PA, United States

10/25/2022
4:41 A.M.      We were unable to dispatch the trailer on time. This may cause a delay.
San Pablo, CA, United States

10/25/2022
2:44 A.M.      Departed from Facility
San Pablo, CA, United States


On another note, I seem to be the only one slightly displeased with the yellow of the outer ring.  So much so, that I had Randy change my baffle wood combination to better match the driver.  I had reached out to Lii Audio about this and had sent them the picture of the baffle in Randy’s workshop as an example (just told them it was from a friend who received his baffle recently) and they countered with sending me a picture of the drivers in Randy’s listening room.  Here’s their response:

“As for the color of surrounding, actually the mass production indeed has little color difference  but it's a question of light when taking photo, here-below are pictures taken by Randy of Caintuck Audio, of a same open baffle in different light condition”.

I get it…lighting does effect it, but still I think the picture of the driver on their website, is a bit misleading. I didn’t belabor the point though.
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Kamran
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #125 - 11/01/22 at 03:20:57
 
Latest update:

10/31/2022
9:54 P.M.      On the Way
Departed from Facility
Horsham, PA, United States

Hopes rising…
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Kamran
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #126 - 11/01/22 at 04:24:51
 
I don’t want to jinx it but I think I’m getting the drivers tomorrow.  As of 11 pm EST, they have finally arrived at the local township hub of UPS, which is basically my neighboring town.
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #127 - 11/01/22 at 05:17:26
 
I’m not crazy about the color either.  I see it used from time to time on other drivers but not a fan. I know it will go with some peoples baffles.

The color of the C10s would be nice.
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Randy in Caintuck
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #128 - 11/01/22 at 05:29:56
 


Same Old DD wrote -
Quote:
... our demigod.  (you know you'll NEVER live it down) https://www.decware.com/yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/grin.gif


I have tried to convince Lon that I sold that title for five dollars and a four pack of Guinness Pub Draft ..... but he doesn't believe me .....

In addition ..... I am a dyed in the wool monotheist, so I do my best not to invoke the displeasure of the one true God .....

Best wishes,
Randy

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JBzen
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #129 - 11/01/22 at 12:16:34
 
I'm weakening with a deuce of Randies steering Smiley

Revisiting the Lii audio Facebook post of the FF15s playing the track of "Sky Burial" from Dadawa's "Sister Drum" album the post does not do the artist justice. Pulling the album up on YouTube and playing it with the same headphones as played from the post, there is so much more detail with the YouTube version.

Surely not definitive of the new F15s but more of how it was recorded on the Facebook post.

John
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #130 - 11/01/22 at 13:36:22
 
Randy in Caintuck wrote on 11/01/22 at 05:29:56:
Same Old DD wrote -

I have tried to convince Lon that I sold that title for five dollars and a four pack of Guinness Pub Draft ..... but he doesn't believe me ..... https://www.decware.com/yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/wink.gif

In addition ..... I am a dyed in the wool monotheist, so I do my best not to invoke the displeasure of the one true God ..... https://www.decware.com/yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/smiley.gif

Best wishes,
Randy


Grin
I think the joking nature of the "title" and use of all lower case lettering will allow us some romping room and the One True God will let this one slide.
I'll drop it, though.

Tell us more about spiking and lifting the baffles, if you have looked into this.

My floor is ceramic tile glued to a concrete foundation, with some jute pad and a poly/fake wool rug.
Any suggestions?
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Palomino
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #131 - 11/01/22 at 14:04:06
 
Hey Randy, this is OT, but I am liking your diffusers.  Have you posted any recent shots of your listening shed in other threads?

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GroovySauce
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #132 - 11/01/22 at 15:09:57
 
That's exciting Kamran!

I'm not a fan of the color scheme.
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Randy in Caintuck
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Tube be ... or not
tube be ... it's a
no-brainer.

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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #133 - 11/01/22 at 16:36:44
 


Same Old DD wrote -
Quote:
Tell us more about spiking and lifting the baffles, if you have looked into this.


I know that some owners of the low-profile baffles are using spikes, cones or other devices under the fronts of the baffles ..... or they are using three or four under each baffle to raise the entire speaker.
One of my customers uses the Nordost Sort Kones and swears by them.
In my experience, it depends on the room and the distance between the baffles and the listening position as to how well this works.
My suggestion is to experiment to know what works best in a given room.
The one caution I would offer is that "coupling" with the floor definitely affects the tonal balance of the speakers ..... so raising them too much might have a negative effect ..... as in all things audio related, your mileage may vary .....

Best wishes,
Randy

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Randy in Caintuck
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Tube be ... or not
tube be ... it's a
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #134 - 11/01/22 at 16:47:14
 


Palomino wrote -
Quote:
Hey Randy, this is OT, but I am liking your diffusers.  Have you posted any recent shots of your listening shed in other threads?


Hi Tom,

Those diffusers were built from plans that were previously offered on the "old" Decware Forum.
From what I understand, the plans are no longer available.
They work very well in my room, based on the good sound that I am hearing.

Nothing changes very much in my "audio he-shed" ..... except that I recently had the exterior painted and a gutter and downspout installed on the front side .....

The photo that Donnie resized is the most recent one of the interior.

For a fact ..... this is my "happy place" .....

Best wishes,
Randy

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HockessinKid
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #135 - 11/01/22 at 16:57:45
 
FWIW,

I use a pair of these rubber-cork vibration pads under each front side of Randy's baffles to listen to my F-15's. They work well, raising the baffles about 1" and are cheap. YRMV.

https://www.supplyhouse.com/DiversiTech-MP-3C-Rubber-Cork-Anti-Vibration-Pad-3-x...

HK
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #136 - 11/01/22 at 18:25:09
 
that hard yellow surround is harsh and doesn't really reflect the vintage spirit of full range drivers .

maybe they need to see a full rack of Kicker speakers at WalMart to see things more clearly.
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #137 - 11/01/22 at 19:05:15
 
I've seen some higher end drivers use yellow, but the Walmart image is what first came to my mind.
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PaulInWA60
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #138 - 11/01/22 at 20:52:29
 
There is a thread on diyaudio.com where a poster noted that the graph for Frequency Vs SPL that Lii posted for the Fast-15 is actually dated Jan 3, 2015 which is disturbing. https://www.lii-audio.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Fast-15-4.jpg

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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #139 - 11/01/22 at 22:22:25
 
Yeah, I noticed that as well.  

I usually do rely on these charts too much.  I think Lii is a little loose on what they use for their marketing materials.

I rely more on what people with ears I trust say.
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PaulInWA60
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #140 - 11/01/22 at 23:12:29
 
"Loose" seems a little polite for what feels more like blatant lying.
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #141 - 11/01/22 at 23:52:14
 
I’m a polite guy Smiley

I use them as guidance not absolute.

Their drivers all sound pretty good to me so I don’t spend as much time on the “specs”.
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #142 - 11/02/22 at 00:33:11
 
A lot of Lii's charts are miss dated. It seems that the computer needs a CMOS battery. At boot,  if the battery is dead or missing it will default to a preset date usally the 1st of the year.

Me thinks that Lii is very busy making quality products while being short handed and short on real estate. Not worrying about a stinking battery or setting the date in CMOS. No falsehood just real life struggles.

John
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #143 - 11/02/22 at 00:55:47
 
Quote:
My floor is ceramic tile glued to a concrete foundation, with some jute pad and a poly/fake wool rug.
Any suggestions?


That concrete slab forming your foundation is a big diaphram that will react with generated sounds. It seems stiff and hard but it is a plastic mass that most likely sits on a chipped stone bed sprinkled over clay. It will vibrate right along with long sound waves.

So it is best to first physicaly decouple the speakers and any other music reproduction equipment from that concrete diaphram. Then as Randy suggests keep the baffle close to floor so it can acoustically couple with the that 4" plastic concrete slab strengthing bass.

John
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #144 - 11/02/22 at 01:42:52
 
The picture is uploading upside down so I deleted it, but good news…I received the drivers and have set them up against my Klipsch speakers temporarily.  More detailed thoughts tomorrow but very promising out of the box.

Many thanks to Randy for the quick pointer on the spring loaded input terminals, which confused the heck out of me at first.  Now if he would just hurry up with my baffles….jk!
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #145 - 11/02/22 at 01:51:06
 
Congratulations!
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #146 - 11/02/22 at 01:55:25
 
I also noticed the discrepancy two weeks ago with the measurement dates and didn’t make a big deal out of it chalking it up to a typographical error.  Not necessarily a specs guy either.  The original F-15 sounds sublime.  We all know that.  Lii Audio claims, this is an upgrade and I took their word for it.

That said, this was blowing up in the Facebook group as well, so Lii Audio just responded saying that this was measured in an anechoic chamber and that the computer inside isn’t connected to the internet.  I will try and post a screenshot…hopefully, it doesn’t upload upside down.
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IMAGINE WHIRLLED
PEAS

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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #147 - 11/02/22 at 05:46:08
 
For some reason, this does remind of a Cayin integrated amp that I bought many years ago. It had a rectifier tube right on the top of the unit with the other tubes, BUT what would you think if I told that you could pull that rectifier tube out, and the amp just kept playing? Fact was that the amp HAD a SS rectifier as well! The tube rectifier just made it look cooler I guess. I thought that was deceitful. No mention of it anywhere in the literature.
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #148 - 11/02/22 at 13:07:38
 
Thank you Randy for your input.
I am still working on some room treatments and running into the "availability" issues, common now, almost every time I decide on some pathway.
I am not suffering, though. Things are sounding really good right now.

JBz, I live in Indiana and the basic "floating" foundation must be significantly more deep than some just due to local codes taking into account freeze depth lines.
Even still, I understand your analogy of the diaphragmatic plastic properties in reference to "solid concrete."  
Thank you for the insight.

  Smiley
Still learning.
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Re: Lii Audio Fast 15 drivers
Reply #149 - 11/02/22 at 15:28:21
 

Would those rubber/cork pads (referenced above) effectively physically decouple and acoustically couple the baffles?
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