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DECWARE 300B Amp development thread (Read 137503 times)
JBzen
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #850 - 01/14/23 at 13:20:19
 
A thought...those signal caps at the input...why loop and solder to the lugs? Create a sesspool of eddy current? Would it be better to tube and tie?

Smiley

John
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Steve Deckert
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #851 - 01/18/23 at 01:38:47
 
Great Question!

The reason it's done is for strength during shipping.  These Miflex caps have wonderful leads that make certain things possible in this type of wiring that a thinner leaded cap couldn't do.  

My experience with eddy currents is that they in themselves are not an issue, it's when eddy currents from different sources intermingle in the same piece of steel.  Even then it's not the end of the world, look at how things were made in the 50's and 60's with the chassis itself being the ground for everything.  Of course those amps didn't sound like these either.   Eddy currents are hard to understand since you really can't see them, so it's always better to avoid the issue altogether.  We don't have eddy currents in this situation really, just an enlarged field that doesn't mix with anything else and is in 3D space with enough air around it to have no effect on anything.

Steve



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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #852 - 01/18/23 at 01:53:53
 

Tonight I am still breaking in this sample, but you'll be happy to know that production has started on the first one #001 and that amp will probably be finished by Wed and then we will start #002 and so on.

Back in the early 1990's when I got the bug for audio from working in a hi-fi store I had the pleasure of working with a gentleman named Tim Hagen whom I became friends with.  Now 30 years later we have reunited and are doing weekly listening sessions.  Tonight we listened to this new amp on the House Speakers.  The amplifier was using Cyrotone output tubes, input tube, and rectifier.

The sound of this system is just sick. And I mean that in a good way ; )

Here is a track that left us both dumstruck with this combination.  As far as recording/mastering quality and imaging this is an 11 out of 10.



Any Decware amp can do it, so if you have the time to trip on what is possible in a sound stage than you'll like this track.  :)

-Steve




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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #853 - 01/18/23 at 02:33:54
 

The Sarah 300B amplifier will be at AXPONA this year!  Don Thomas of Wathen Audiophile / Cyrotone will have models SEWE300B and TORII JRv2 in their room.  


The room number is 612.

It is right across from the elevators and around the corner from LTA.

Among the Wathen speakers will be the Inertia Cubes and the new CryoTone Dipole flagship speakers. Both sound fantastic with Decware equipment.

Sarah and Veronica may also pop in and hand out coupons to attendees for the new amplifier!  



























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Kamran
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #854 - 01/18/23 at 03:05:41
 
[quote] The Sarah 300B amplifier will be at AXPONA this year! [/unquote]

Wow! I see the waitlist exponentially increasing again!

Is this Decware’s first time at an audio show like this?
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #855 - 01/20/23 at 00:18:33
 

We are simply supporting Don at Wathen Audiophile / Cryotone by adding some amps to their room.  So we're not doing the show, so to speak, and yes we have done a show with our own room in the past and while it went great the Twin Towers were blown up on the way home and everyone forgot about audio for awhile.  We decided after that that we would be money better spent to host our own show and that is when DECFEST started.

We plan to make some coupons for show goers that would apply a discount for either of the two amps that we will be sending. Don will have them in his room.







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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #856 - 01/20/23 at 01:06:23
 

As you know we have the Western Electric coupons in hand, but equally compelling is that Wathen Audiophile / Cryotone has just completed a tube bundle for SEWE300B amp like they have been doing for all of our amplifiers.





https://wathenspeakers.com/store/p133/Decware_CryoTone_Tube_Bundle_for_the_Zen_S...


It's my job to roll tubes in this amp, so I listen to lots of combinations and everything is good.  I have my favorites like anyone and in the top 2 or 3 pics you'll always find Cryotones in my stash and that's when you just put a few in the amp.  Doing a complete bundle is in fairness the only way to really hear the maximum potential of the Cryotone process.  

So far with my collection of Cryotones tubes across our many products the common denominator is a sound that tends to be bolder, slightly more forward, richer and with a bit more punch and blacker backgrounds.  As wonderful as this sounds it isn't for everyone, and some system/room combos would be less tolerant of it while others would thrive because of it.

I am just thankful that while many of todays N.O.S. tubes are actually yesterdays rejects because we're getting down to the bottom of the barrel that we have a new option, Cryotone.  Something new, and hand cherry picked and tested seven ways from Sunday before you ever see it, not to mentioned real human phone support by the guy that can do something about it... kinda like you when you call me at Decware.











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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #857 - 01/20/23 at 21:17:22
 
Steve,
I hope this isn't a stupid question... can a SEWE300B be ordered from you without tubes and then order the bundle from Don @ Wathen and have that bundle shipped to you during build phase to be tested with the amp ?
Just wondering if you would approve of this if logistically it can be sync'd up.
Thanks,
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #858 - 01/20/23 at 22:22:37
 
Steve may add more to this, but looking at the online order form, you can purchase without tubes.
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #859 - 01/21/23 at 00:06:16
 

The amp can be purchased without tubes, yes  

Having Cryotone tubes shipped here and unpacked, stored, tested in the amp, repacked and reshipped is not needed because Don of Cryotone cherry pics the tubes before he sends them to you. We wouldn't be promoting these tubes if it were any other way.  Having Don grade and test these tubes is the same thing as having me do it.

If you want tubes tested in your actual amplifier you'll have to buy the stock tube compliment from me.  Also, anyone planning to invest in an amplifier like this should have a full spare tube compliment on hand for troubleshooting and backup. If a backup tube compliment is out of your budget then probably so is the amp. This would be true for all tube amps.

98% of all amp troubleshooting phone calls and emails are the result of tubes acting up and are from people who don't have any backup tubes. Usually the calls and emails number at least two or three of each and several days or more before new tubes are purchased and then the problem goes away.

It is possible for new tubes to fail weeks or months into the game. It happens. It is also possible for new tubes to just one day develop a noise, a hum, a pop, or any number of other symptoms. When you have a spare tube set and you know this going in, you solve you own problem without but a few minutes of your time, no emails, no phone calls, no surprise expense because you already own them.

We are trying to build 2000 amplifiers right now and doing things that generate more emails and phone calls wouldn't be ideal.


-Steve
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #860 - 01/21/23 at 00:43:24
 
"When you have a spare tube set and you know this going in, you solve you own problem without but a few minutes of your time, no emails, no phone calls, no surprise expense because you already own them."  

Steve Deckert

**Anyone who is considering ownership of a vacuum tube amplifier, needs to consider the cost of ownership. {Replacement Tube Sets}
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #861 - 01/21/23 at 00:55:14
 
I can relate to that. When my KT77’s went noisy, I just switched to KT88s so there was no drop in service so to speak (and i have at least two different pairs of 6V6 tubes for further protection).  At this point, I don’t intend to buy spare tubes for my current amp given how I’m line for the 300b, but will ensure have spare sets for the future amp.  For the 300b itself, my spare will be the cheaper Chinese version.
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #862 - 01/22/23 at 16:44:47
 
Breaking in these red-tipped 6N6P tubes has been fun. They are a near perfect tube for my Monoblocks, just lacking a bit of body to the bass sound.

I bet that will not be the problem in the SEWE300B. Looking forward to trying them out in that amp! I have many other pairs of excellent tubes that could be a contender in those spots. I suspect that the SEWE300B will be as much as a chameleon in tube-rolling aspects as my SE84UFO3 Monoblocks are. I can create so many "sounds" with these.

I have many tubes that can serve as "spares" for me in the SEWE300B, the only tubes of the full complement I won't have duplicates of are the 300B tubes themselves. I have one pair ready to go, and if I can't swing a pair of WE300B for a while I
ll get a cheap pair of 300B as spares (which I probably won't need).
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #863 - 02/13/23 at 16:25:03
 
A lot of SEWE300B activity going on in the "factory"!

2021-07-14 15:20:37      Glen H.      MN      1      SEWE300B      African Padauk      120V      Stock Unit - No Options      Quality Control

2021-07-15 16:22:25      Dr. Benjamin W.      Switzerland      1      SEWE300B      Walnut      230V      Stock Unit - No Options      Quality Control

2021-07-16 09:21:19      Malcolm P.      VA      1      SEWE300B      Walnut      120V      Stock Unit - No Options      Quality Control

2021-07-18 04:34:52      Todd F.      HI      1      SEWE300B      Walnut      120V      Stock Unit - No Options      Testing

2021-07-18 19:14:33      Scott V.      OH      1      SEWE300B      African Padauk      120V      Stock Unit - No Options      On Bench

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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #864 - 02/16/23 at 23:24:20
 

The first few SEWE300B amps have been built.  Things were going along swimmingly...



We came up with this idea to print a map of the tube layout on the transformer since the silk screen company failed twice to get things centered.



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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #865 - 02/16/23 at 23:31:41
 


I was pretty happy with the final result.  Then we suddenly couldn't get the same end bells for the transformer and the new ones wrap around the core making it impossible to print the map on the top without shrinking it way down and even then it looks crowded...

That set my mood for a good part of the day.  Since the foreseeable future holds no chance of the original end bells becoming available, we have to find a way to make the new style work.

The only way to make the new style work is to change the printing.  Delete the map, go back to the logo.






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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #866 - 02/16/23 at 23:40:28
 




So this what they look like now.  The first few, including the one for the AXPONA show and the one for Steve Gutttenburg, will become rare collectors pieces.

This one, with the new logo makes the wrap around end bells visually work... but that got me to thinking what would happen if instead of trying not to see the wrap around end bells they became the focal point?

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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #867 - 02/16/23 at 23:45:25
 

So I came up with this...



And I will be adding this pricier version to the shopping cart as an option on the amplifier in late March.  When we get one built with this, I'll post the pictures here and then update the web site.

Steve





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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #868 - 02/16/23 at 23:46:46
 
Sorry to hear about this development.

How about including a poster with each Sarah 300B amplifier. Use the picture of the amp with Sarah's reflection on the rectifier on top and the tube layout design on the bottom. Heck I'd pay some extra coin to put that up in my listening room. Just a thought.

HK

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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #869 - 02/16/23 at 23:52:55
 
I have only tiny bit of experience with not so much silk screening, but laser engraving. The person that I use makes me wonder just how or why she decided to get into this business. I try to lay out everything so there is no trouble and talk briefly about my expectations, just to do a head slap when it is done.

 Steve, I don't know much about this new amp, but I have mostly appreciated your design skills in the way of making something look special. This one is really a winner. Th layout looks to be perfect for me. When I build stuff that is part of the task, and some of my stuff really needed to be on the bottom shelf of a system where it couldn't be seen well.
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #870 - 02/17/23 at 04:32:44
 
Those shiny caps are really sharp looking! 

Are they made of highly polished copper?
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #871 - 02/17/23 at 10:03:46
 
Steve, that is a real winning design, if only you could have done it on my UFU-2 !!
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #872 - 02/17/23 at 18:28:23
 
How about an option for no printing at all?  I prefer a clean simple look myself.
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #873 - 02/23/23 at 02:32:36
 
Missed the last month of updates—totally forgot that this thread was moved. And here I thought I was going to revive it….

Comments:

It’s a real bummer that the tube schematic cannot be printed on the transformer—that did look pretty cool.  Not quite sure how I feel about the alternative solution just yet.  Need to visualize it on a completed amp with all tubes inserted to have a better grasp of the overall look.

Speaking of completed amps…has any unit shipped to a customer yet?

Also, it would be fun to know when the review unit ships to Guttenberg—so we can gauge how long he takes to review.  That may actually elicit more orders than the unit destined for Axpona.


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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #874 - 02/23/23 at 03:16:29
 
My preference would be to have a plain transformer without any logos or writing.

As for Guttenberg's review, I had a brief conversation with him back in 2018, and he said his reviews usually take 3-6 months depending on what it is, other equipment being reviewed at the same time, other obligations, etc.  Hopefully he still has his Cornwalls for the Sarah to drive, or at least his Pure Audio Project open baffle speakers if they're sensitive enough.

One thing's for sure, if he publishes a positive review the amplifier waiting list is going to get a lot longer.  It's already at 2 years give or take.  I'm glad I already ordered mine  :)
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #875 - 02/24/23 at 00:27:55
 
Kamran, it seems at least one SEWE300B has been shipped to a customer, this week.
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #876 - 02/24/23 at 14:46:29
 
Thanks for the update Lon—exciting times!  Hopefully, we will get to hear from the lucky first customer soon!
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #877 - 02/24/23 at 15:32:33
 
Before I contact Decware, does anyone know if the 10% is refundable in the event something unforeseeble happens?
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #878 - 02/24/23 at 15:36:32
 
The refunding was known to happen in the past, but reading the info on the site now I am not certain that is now the policy. I would contact Decware for the best answer.
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #879 - 02/24/23 at 15:39:25
 
Yep, two retail units have shipped and four more are built and in the Testing or Quality Control phase. One of those may be delayed...I really have a thing for copper, and those transformer endcaps make it damned sexy...
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #880 - 02/24/23 at 23:31:19
 
Thanks Lon, I found the answer to my refund question under the terms and conditions.  Order placed.  Now for the lonnnngggg wait!
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #881 - 02/25/23 at 18:08:25
 



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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #882 - 02/25/23 at 18:12:39
 


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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #883 - 02/25/23 at 18:12:58
 




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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #884 - 02/25/23 at 18:13:41
 



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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #885 - 02/25/23 at 18:13:57
 



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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #886 - 02/25/23 at 18:14:20
 



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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #887 - 02/25/23 at 18:15:02
 



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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #888 - 02/25/23 at 18:37:38
 
Wow!  But...you forgot to put Sarah's reflection in the bottle.  What's the cost for that option?
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Posts: 53
Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #889 - 02/26/23 at 16:51:47
 
It's. so. BEAUTIFUL! I'm not sure if it's possible, but can you imagine how amazing this would be with a black top/base!? Shocked

I've always been a sucker for black and copper/gold/rose gold. Say it's possible, Steve!
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VPI Prime, Ortofon Bronze/Black, ZP3, ZROCK2, Rachael (SE34I.5), Caintuck Audio Lii F-15 Open Baffles
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Kamran
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Posts: 939
Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #890 - 03/10/23 at 02:52:00
 
Steve Guttenberg has Sarah in for review…and he showed it off.

https://youtu.be/igwSyIuYbGg
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Innuos Pulse-Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE R2R-Ic0n4 Autoformer Passive Pre-Sarah 300B SET Amp-ZBIT-Project Carbon Debut TT-Schiit Mani Phono-GIK Room Treatment-Caintuck Audio Magnum Baffles—Li Audio Fast 15 Drivers-P.I. Audio MajikBuss & Puritan PSM 156 Conditioners
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Kamran
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #891 - 03/11/23 at 16:46:57
 
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Innuos Pulse-Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE R2R-Ic0n4 Autoformer Passive Pre-Sarah 300B SET Amp-ZBIT-Project Carbon Debut TT-Schiit Mani Phono-GIK Room Treatment-Caintuck Audio Magnum Baffles—Li Audio Fast 15 Drivers-P.I. Audio MajikBuss & Puritan PSM 156 Conditioners
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jec3504
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #892 - 03/12/23 at 01:46:44
 
Steve Guttenberg is rolling tubes. Cryotone tubes in, that amp is never leaving Brooklyn.
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Kamran
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #893 - 03/14/23 at 00:22:16
 
https://youtu.be/or607VzkxEw

6 minutes in—-he drops another sneak peak and says “Phenomenal Amplifier”!

My spidey sense is screaming that the full review is imminent.  

jec3504– I concur and have a strong suspicion Steve has fallen head over heals and ain’t sending it back…
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Innuos Pulse-Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE R2R-Ic0n4 Autoformer Passive Pre-Sarah 300B SET Amp-ZBIT-Project Carbon Debut TT-Schiit Mani Phono-GIK Room Treatment-Caintuck Audio Magnum Baffles—Li Audio Fast 15 Drivers-P.I. Audio MajikBuss & Puritan PSM 156 Conditioners
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Kamran
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Posts: 939
Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #894 - 03/18/23 at 01:28:45
 
So after refreshing Guttenberg’s YouTube feed like a thousand times (even though I had notifications on), he finally posted a new video, but it was about Viewer Systems. Sigh…

I couldn’t contain myself and finally asked him when the Sarah reviewing was dropping and he replied:

“A few weeks”

So the wait continues, but the timing is like a perfect storm…if his review drops before Axpona (which I think it will), then there will be an increased interest at the Wathen booth.
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Innuos Pulse-Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE R2R-Ic0n4 Autoformer Passive Pre-Sarah 300B SET Amp-ZBIT-Project Carbon Debut TT-Schiit Mani Phono-GIK Room Treatment-Caintuck Audio Magnum Baffles—Li Audio Fast 15 Drivers-P.I. Audio MajikBuss & Puritan PSM 156 Conditioners
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Low325
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Posts: 18
Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #895 - 03/18/23 at 17:56:27
 
Did somebody say 300b?

This is my first post and I have read through this entire thread.  I’ve been looking at other output tube alternatives, (WE310A) for my next/complimentary amp, but ultimately decided to place myself on the waitlist a couple weeks back.

Like many of you, heard of Steve and his posse some 20 years back in other DIY forums, but never dipped my toes into owning low powered SET.  This was when I was trying to figure out how to get some Edgarhorns (RIP Dr B.E.!) in my bachelor townhome…back then I just couldn’t fit them so I let that ship sail and decided to absorb domesticated life Smiley.

Fast forward and sort of settling down onto that certain corner in 2 channel listening, decided to add some glow to the night sessions with tubes.  Even though I know the wait will be incredible, but already so fruitful with Steve providing almost play-by-play-like knowledge and updates, I picked up a one of a kind, Dynakit ST70 for nostalgia with all the original black cat caps, match quad EL34s - beautiful vintage sound Wink. This will have to tie me over till my # is called for my WESE300B.  Very happy to have gotten the nudge to push me over the fence on this…

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[Theoretica Applied Physics BACCH-SP adio]
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JBzen
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Posts: 1377
Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #896 - 03/18/23 at 18:08:08
 
Welcome Lowell! I am on the edge of changing my order to Sarah thru Sarah Cool

John
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Kamran
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Posts: 939
Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #897 - 03/18/23 at 19:26:47
 
Welcome Low325!  You’re not alone with getting a stand in amp, while waiting for your respective Decware order. I’m in the same boat.  This forum is a great place to make connections, learn, and make tweaks to get your rig ready for the big day!

John—I am super excited that you’re finally considering Sarah—swing it!
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Innuos Pulse-Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE R2R-Ic0n4 Autoformer Passive Pre-Sarah 300B SET Amp-ZBIT-Project Carbon Debut TT-Schiit Mani Phono-GIK Room Treatment-Caintuck Audio Magnum Baffles—Li Audio Fast 15 Drivers-P.I. Audio MajikBuss & Puritan PSM 156 Conditioners
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JBzen
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Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #898 - 03/18/23 at 20:49:49
 
Don’t get to excited there is probably 3 years to change my mind again and again and again…… Smiley
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AMC CD8b>XO3>Cambridge CXN2>ZDAC>ZBOX>braided silver/occ> Zrock2>CSP2+>SE84 milflex copper 25th>9AWG silver/copper braid>lii Crystal 10 in Huijgen cabinets. Ortofon 2M Black>JVC QL-F4/Otari MX5050B2>ZP3. Isolation. AC filtering. Room treatment.
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Catfood
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Posts: 8
Re: DECWARE 300B Amp development thread
Reply #899 - 03/18/23 at 22:56:38
 
At the rate they're going, 3 years probably is a reasonable estimate.

And, during those 3 years the Sarah may undergo additional changes, and there may be another 2 or 3 new models to choose from.
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