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Roon assistance (Read 2445 times)
Dominick
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Still like that old
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Roon assistance
06/12/21 at 03:55:51
 
Guys,

I can’t hold out any longer....I want Roon!  With my home reno starting very soon,  my vinyl rig and CD’s are in storage. So for now I only stream Tidal and Qobuz.  I plan to use my laptop to run the core.   I just cloned my HDD and swapped it out for a larger 2TB SSD.  

For a Roon endpoint, I will probably use my Google Chromecast Audio, but I may be buying a used Sonore UltraRendu with an Uptone LPS.  Fingers Crossed.  I have an external OWC NAS drive, with close to 2TB of music that I can pull from.  I run Audirvana on my MAC, but I guess I’ll install it on my Windows Laptop.

Besides creating a separate partition to install the Roon core, is there anything else I need to do in order to avoid any hiccups.  

Any input, advice, or tips would be greatly appreciated.

Dom  




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Rasp. Pi 4 [Roon], Schiit Bifrost True Multibit DAC, ZBIT, ZROCK2, My Audio Cables Ultra Silver+, ZSB, CSP2+ 25th, DAG Cables, DHC1, Torii MKIV 25th /2 White Zen SE84C+ 25th mono’s, Rega P2 Turntable,Rega Fono MK5, Velodyne Dual Firing Sub, ERR’s [Bubbinga Wood]
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kulafu
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Posts: 206
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #1 - 06/12/21 at 14:06:36
 
As you research and evaluate your options, consider a Pi based stream/renderer for your DAC.  I have used a Bluesound Node 2i as a streamer for my Denafrips iniitially but was limited to toslink and Coax.  I looked in to the PI2AES pi based streamer and it was a much better option for me sonically and with multiple connnections:  AES/EBU, toslink, coax, usb and I2S.  There is a link here for PI2AES to help you evaluate a Pi based streamer.  Not sure what OS the Ultra Rendu uses but I have read that this is a great unit but no experience with this.  HTH.
Bob
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Donnie
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Re: Roon assistance
Reply #2 - 06/12/21 at 14:45:45
 
I was always hearing how great Roon is so I started doing some research and I don't understand why I would need it.

It looks to do what my JRiver does, but for a whole lot more money.

Maybe I'm missing something, as I am apt to do.
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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

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Re: Roon assistance
Reply #3 - 06/12/21 at 16:39:21
 
Donnie..I’ve gone back and forth as well.  I’m looking to consolidate my musical experience into one platform while having the ability to access to my hard disk collection.  Right now I think I’m going to do a monthly subscription to see if the experience is worth the cost.  With my turntable and cd Collection in storage… I figured this would be a good time to experiment. I was toying with the idea of buying a NUC but I’m trying to be frugal.  A hundred dollars to upgrade my laptop to a solid-state drive was no big deal to give Roon a whirl.

Dom
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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1132
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #4 - 06/13/21 at 01:18:42
 
So I totally caved and bought the yearly subscription.  I installed it on my laptop, added Tidal and Qobuz subscriptions, and was up and running in like 15 minutes.  It found my Google Chromecast TV where I have the audio output piped into my DAC via optical.  The nice part is that the TV not only displays the album cover and the song’s stream, but my daughter loves that the song lyrics come up on the majority of the songs.

I’m still getting used to the interface, but I have to say I’m really digging it!!  Now I’m working on transferring my collection to my laptop to access.  

With me redoing the house, I like how I can tie in various endpoints and have different music playing in different parts of the house.

Dom
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Rasp. Pi 4 [Roon], Schiit Bifrost True Multibit DAC, ZBIT, ZROCK2, My Audio Cables Ultra Silver+, ZSB, CSP2+ 25th, DAG Cables, DHC1, Torii MKIV 25th /2 White Zen SE84C+ 25th mono’s, Rega P2 Turntable,Rega Fono MK5, Velodyne Dual Firing Sub, ERR’s [Bubbinga Wood]
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Lonely Raven
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Re: Roon assistance
Reply #5 - 06/14/21 at 00:59:20
 

Roon is good. That 15 minutes to get up and running is what you're paying for. The interface is clunky, but the information and lyrics and all that is great!

I liked it so much, I bought the Lifetime subscription. It streams to my Directstream DAC with the Bridge II interface, and I have it going to my TEAC DAC directly with USB.
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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1132
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #6 - 06/15/21 at 07:29:33
 
Eric....yeah the interface is a bit clunky.  Not bad...but not what I would have expected for the price.  I do like the features and the music recommendations are spot on. Right now I am running it on the cheap with accessing the Google Chromecast TV and my Chromecast audio, but I i’m hoping to buy a better quality endpoint to tie into my DAC.

Dom
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Rasp. Pi 4 [Roon], Schiit Bifrost True Multibit DAC, ZBIT, ZROCK2, My Audio Cables Ultra Silver+, ZSB, CSP2+ 25th, DAG Cables, DHC1, Torii MKIV 25th /2 White Zen SE84C+ 25th mono’s, Rega P2 Turntable,Rega Fono MK5, Velodyne Dual Firing Sub, ERR’s [Bubbinga Wood]
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TEF18252
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Re: Roon assistance
Reply #7 - 06/23/21 at 19:14:08
 
I just wrote a reply and got dinged because it had a hyperlink. Have to post two times.
New here, just ordered a SP phone stage
Anyway, I love Roon. I use primarily RasberryPi Endpoints. Pie2AES, with and without audio hats, Allo DigiOne Signatures and a couple others. easy to setup, if I can do it, anyone can. I also have RasberryPi displays attached to do rudimentary control and realtime display of what is playing at a particular Endpoint. I also play Sirius, web version SQ is far superior to the satellite, radio stations ,and my digitized music on my NAS drive. It is really not that expensive to connect any and aloo of your classic systems as I do.
The user interface is way cool and the AI for continuation of listened music is really incredible. Additionally, I use a Roon Entrypoint to listen to my vinyly anywhere an endpoint is. The possibilities are endless, sound quality is not comprimised by the connections and playing all or independent is a feature of Roon.
Their support forums are also informative and helpful, along with all of the YT videos out there.
I will post links to some of these advanced features after
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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1132
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #8 - 06/24/21 at 17:18:50
 
Thanks for the info.  I currently use my Google CCA as my endpoint and I’m happy with the results for the price...but I know I can do better.  

I’ve been using my Torii MKIV as double duty for audio listening as well as for watching movies.  This means that when I want to watch a movie I have to unplug the optical cable from my DAC and reinsert another optical cable that comes from the TV output.  

With that being said… I don’t want to keep stressing out the optical connection on my DAC, so I’ve been looking for a USB solution for audio listening.  

I just pulled the trigger on a Raspberry Pi 4B with the Argon One V2 case.  Once I get it set up I will hear how it sounds.  According to Schiit Audio...... JASON feels that the upgraded USB processor actually sounds better and cleaner than the optical input.    I’ll see what sounds better to my ears… and if need be I can always add an AQ Jitterbug to try and help clean things up.  

I plan to run Ropiee XL since I want the ability to tie in Airplay.   I’ve been doing a lot of midnight reading on the raspberry pi forums, so I think I have a decent handle on it.

Dom
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Rasp. Pi 4 [Roon], Schiit Bifrost True Multibit DAC, ZBIT, ZROCK2, My Audio Cables Ultra Silver+, ZSB, CSP2+ 25th, DAG Cables, DHC1, Torii MKIV 25th /2 White Zen SE84C+ 25th mono’s, Rega P2 Turntable,Rega Fono MK5, Velodyne Dual Firing Sub, ERR’s [Bubbinga Wood]
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Lon
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Re: Roon assistance
Reply #9 - 06/24/21 at 17:25:38
 
Dom, have you considered an Optical switch? I've never used one but I have used a powered HDMI one and I had feared possible audio and video degradation but the darned thing works flawlessly and there is no perceivable degradation of signal.
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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1132
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #10 - 06/24/21 at 23:31:32
 
Lon,

Yes I have considered an optical switch.  I currently use a powered HDMI switch like yourself.  I have not experienced any signal degradation in video or audio quality so I have no complaints.

I am pursuing the USB route for a few reasons.  First is that I want to stream music with a hardwired signal. My Google CCA is a WiFi only device.  I hate WiFi as a general rule due to the EMF pollution that is injected in our lives.  Second....when my MAC was next to my DAC for a short period of time....I really like the sound that it produced through the USB input [ this was before I got my Torii ] and I want to explore it further.  My new Schiit Bifrost DAC has a totally redesigned USB input, that is claimed to be better than their digital input stages.  Third... once my home in renovation project is complete… I will need to add a few other Roon endpoints to my house.  I am giving the Raspberry Pi a try since it’s something I have been wanting to tackle for a while, so I just seemed like a good opportunity.  

Once my renovation is complete and I gain some cash, I will pursue the Sonore Ultra Rendu with the Uptone LPS for my main system, and then move my other lower cost endpoints to other parts of the house.  Talk about a digital journey!

Dom
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Lon
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"Love without
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worthless!"
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Posts: 23305
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #11 - 06/25/21 at 00:59:33
 
Alright, cool. I have tens of thousands of discs, really love them, and am not at all interested in streaming which was why I thought of the switcher for optical.
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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1132
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #12 - 06/25/21 at 06:24:29
 
Lon,

Yes I do love playing my discs as well.  I only have about 1000 CD’s but they are currently packed up and in storage.  A few years ago I took on the arduous tasks of taking bit perfect copies of them that are currently stored on my RAID drive.  I imported that collection into Roon, so at least I have access to them at will.  .

I have to say....I have always been enamored by your disc collection, especially all of your Japanese imports.  I have to ask.....besides th music itself...what draws you into the imports?   Is it the variety of the artists or is there something more......like how they are mastered?  Sadly I do not own any Japanese imports, but I have been intrigued for quite some time.  Are there certain Japanese labels that you like over other?  

Dom
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Rasp. Pi 4 [Roon], Schiit Bifrost True Multibit DAC, ZBIT, ZROCK2, My Audio Cables Ultra Silver+, ZSB, CSP2+ 25th, DAG Cables, DHC1, Torii MKIV 25th /2 White Zen SE84C+ 25th mono’s, Rega P2 Turntable,Rega Fono MK5, Velodyne Dual Firing Sub, ERR’s [Bubbinga Wood]
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Lon
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"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 23305
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #13 - 06/25/21 at 06:56:07
 
To me, at my age and with the number of discs I have, it just doesn't make sense to rip and store discs, just time better spent with other tasks. When I have had others demonstrate to me a network or streaming system the sound wasn't better, which would be a motivator I guess. I'm going to keep spinning discs.

As for discs from Japan, there are two reasons I seek them out. First and foremost, Japan has a peculiar system of disc release. It ignores the international market for the most part and has a captive small market to feed, and they can produce, print and distribute a given number of discs they beliee will sell (the labels seek input from shop owners as to how many they would order). They then print and distribute and are less likely to warehouse and advertise over time and can plan the next "batch." The audience is perhaps far more slanted towards JAZZ than the US, and I am a jazz fanatic. Japan releases far more back catalog than any other market does and so to continue studying and enjoying jazz most often titles that I want are often only released in Japan. The second reason is mastering and pressing. Japanese versions when there are available US or European versions to compare to me, on my system, more often sound superior than otherwise. As our systems are so revealing I find myself seeking out the best sounding version, and more often than I probaly should, a newer transfer with better mastering and pressing of titles I bought many years ago that I really love. I can sell or trade or give away older versions which helps feed the "need" to upgrade titles.

I'll freely admit I have over three decades gone way over the top in my collecting and I would not wish my particular situation and drive on anyone else. It started in earnest 31 years ago when I quit smoking and did so in part by putting all the money I would have spent on cigarettes aside and buying discs with that money . . . and blossomed from there as the labels begain reissuing in droves jazz titles I wanted to investigate, that were in the books I was studying and talked about by the online groups I had become a part of. Also I married at this same time and stopped playing music in bands, also moved into more serious employment, and sought from the audiophile methodology and the study and acquiring of music a replacement for the visceral and immediate reward that playing with others brought. Long story short. . . I built myself into a situation where I need to keep a storage unit so my wife is happy and I can't seem to stop collecting. I need to curb and reverse this behavior this decade, wish me luck.
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Lon
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"Love without
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worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 23305
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #14 - 06/25/21 at 07:10:50
 
To follow up regarding labels: in a sense the Japanese market is dominated by the "big three" of Sony, Universal and Warner as is the rest of the world of music. But there is one independent label I do always follow the releases of: Solid Records. They have over the last decade methodically reissued entire smaller labels of the past such as Bethlehem, Enja, Mainstream, etc. --- licensing them from the majors who are not reissuing them themselves now that they have over the decades absorbed them. Their versions are often more complete or unadulterated than the sporadic ones the majors release and are done with the latest analog to digital mastering and fairly exempt from the "loudness wars." Otherwise I follow the jazz releases of the majors in Japan, concentrating on reissues from the Columbia, Blue Note, Impulse and other jazz catalog--Japan frequently releases titles not on cd before, and series of newer remasterings and formats of the "chestnut" titles that I like to upgrade. I generally for new issues use www.cdjapan.co.jp a very good company to do business with as far as price (their "points system" helps defray shipping) and customer service and shipping.
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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1132
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #15 - 06/26/21 at 06:57:22
 
Lon,

I had no idea that the Japan releases were focused on Jazz...which is what I have been listening to most of the time in the past few years. Like yourself...I started collecting CD’s when I was in my 20’s.  I had memberships to Columbia Hluse, BMG, and a third one that I can’t remember right now.  When digital music was introduced..I became a download junkie just for the fun of it, utilizing Napster, bit torrent, etc etc.  

Unfortunately it came at a price of downloading mp3 files due to the faster download speeds due to limited household bandwidths.  I was better served sticking with CD’s.  

I kinda figured that the mastering and pressing was a factor.  I know the Japanese are super passionate about their music, so no shocker that the mastering/pressing  is superior.

Thank you for the information on the Japanese labels.  I’m going to look into it further, and buy some to try out.  My Torii has been sounding very good recently, so much to where I can’t stop playing music and even get a bit down when a day passes when the amp isn’t turned on.

It’s currently almost 2 AM, and I’m still listening to music.  😀

Dom








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CAJames
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lane."

Posts: 1588
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #16 - 06/26/21 at 17:41:52
 
Quote:
Posted by: Dominick      Posted on: Yesterday at 06:24:29

... A few years ago I took on the arduous tasks of taking bit perfect copies of them that are currently stored on my RAID drive...


I'm curious how you did that, from the CD drive on your computer or ???

A couple years ago I ripped the few dozen SACDs I own because I was tired of the laser wearing out in my SACD player, and that was a colossal PITA. I'm somewhere in between you and Lon with my CD collection (closer to you), and while I'm not keen on ripping the whole collection it would be nice to free up some room on my shelves. I've done a small number of discs on my PC, but like Lon that is not how I want to spend my time. If that's how you did a thousand discs that is an impressive accomplishment.
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Donnie
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Re: Roon assistance
Reply #17 - 06/26/21 at 20:25:10
 
It really isn't that big of a deal to rip your CD's.

I just throw one in the CD drive on my computer and the software takes care of the rest. It isn't like you have to stand there and stare at it while it does its thing.

My JRiver software is set up so that when I put a disk in it automatically does it. You can do a dozen a evening easily. Mine even ejects the CD out when it is done.

A couple of weeks and you are done.

I know that I've done at least 50 in a day before without spending too much time with it.

Just do what is in front of you that day and pretty soon that mountain of work becomes very manageable.
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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

Posts: 1132
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #18 - 06/27/21 at 06:48:25
 
Yes… I did it from the CD drive on my computer.  I used XLD copier at that time.  I basically did it on my spare time while I was doing chores around the house. I would put a disc in, made sure the meta-data an album cover are all there, and copied the CD with the output of two separate files… one for AIFF and one for Flac.  The Flac file was used strictly for archiving onto my RAID drive, and the AIFF file I would use for playback.

I only did a handful of discs a day at my leisure, it took me probably close to six months by the time it was complete. It was actually not that big of a deal because I didn’t sit in front of my computer the entire time and wait for it to rip.  

Dom

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Rasp. Pi 4 [Roon], Schiit Bifrost True Multibit DAC, ZBIT, ZROCK2, My Audio Cables Ultra Silver+, ZSB, CSP2+ 25th, DAG Cables, DHC1, Torii MKIV 25th /2 White Zen SE84C+ 25th mono’s, Rega P2 Turntable,Rega Fono MK5, Velodyne Dual Firing Sub, ERR’s [Bubbinga Wood]
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Lon
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"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 23305
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #19 - 06/27/21 at 13:50:35
 
Cool. At that rate would still take me 15 or more years to rip my collection, and I don't even have anything I can do with the ripped files right now. Wink I think I'll stick with my disc playback!
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HR-1,ZTPRE,ZBIT,ZROCK2,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod,Taboo MkIV;Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD,P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls,Reference spkrcbls;Mapleshade SamsonV3;VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects, IsoPods; headphones:Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1
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CAJames
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lane."

Posts: 1588
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #20 - 06/27/21 at 15:14:45
 
Thanks guys.

I agree the actual ripping aspect isn't a deal. I guess the thing I struggle with is the metadata. I have mostly classical music, and (in my experience) the metadata is all over the map. Even for difference discs in the same set, say the 9 Beethoven symphonies on 5 CDs, one disc title is the work, one the conductor and another the orchestra. And some are in Japanese. So it isn't really the ripping I object to, it is futzing around with all the files afterwards to get them organized. And that feels like work.

It just seems like it is a whole lot easier, and enjoyable in its own way, to go to the shelves and browse.
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[FOOBAR2000 | Jay's CDT2 MRK3] -> Denafrips Terminator 2 + Gaia
Sumiko Pearwood -> Mapleknoll Athena -> Luxman SUT -> Maple-tree Phono 3E
Woo WA22 -> 2x UFO25s, balanced monos
Omega SAM , Hifiman Arya, Senn HD-650
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Geno
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Re: Roon assistance
Reply #21 - 06/27/21 at 15:47:35
 
No doubt that it’s easier to just leave them on the shelf, and play at your leisure, but I’m afraid that as time passes, our CD’s will start to fail. How much time, I guess depends on each CD (I’m not really sure about all of the factors that will affect this), only time will tell.

All I know for sure is that I have had a handful fail (will not play, or play very garbled). I take great care of mine, and anyway what I’ve had happen is not skipping - just a terrible break up of the sound.

As of yet, I have only ripped about 15% of my collection, and going forward, the problem might not be real bad, but I’m afraid what could happen.

I could have ripped a few while I typed this...but I’m lazy Smiley
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Lon
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"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 23305
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #22 - 06/27/21 at 16:26:19
 
That's interesting. I've been buying cds since '87 and I have had CDRs go bad but not one single cd. And I've recenly replayed some of the very first that I have ever bought--no problems at all. When I have had suspicion that a disc had failed, I've always found it's the player that is the issue.
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HR-1,ZTPRE,ZBIT,ZROCK2,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod,Taboo MkIV;Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD,P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls,Reference spkrcbls;Mapleshade SamsonV3;VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects, IsoPods; headphones:Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1
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CAJames
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Posts: 1588
Re: Roon assistance
Reply #23 - 06/27/21 at 16:59:54
 
Yeah, I bought my first CDs in 1985 and they are still fine. I've never had a CD go bad, but I have had several lasers go bad in the succession of CD/SACD players I've owned. That is really my motivation for ripping, to get away from reliance on lasers.
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Donnie
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Re: Roon assistance
Reply #24 - 06/27/21 at 22:41:30
 
I've thought about the process of ripping CD to your computer and the obvious came to me.

When you grab a CD, rip it then. You have the disc in your hand, when you take it out of your CD player put it in your computer. Ta da, the next time that you want to listen to it , there it is!

As far as the metadata, isn't that what Roon is famous for? Isn't that what you are paying the big bucks for?

You are free to keep your disc or give them to someone else to enjoy.

For whatever reason I don't feel the need to have piles and piles of things that I really don't need to keep.
Simplify your life by decluttering your space!

He who dies with the most CD's doesn't really win. You are just leaving a mess for someone else to clean up.
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Re: Roon assistance
Reply #25 - 06/27/21 at 23:25:53
 
Good for you Donnie. As for me, I don't even have a PC, nor a lap top with a cd drive. I'm happy with my discs and the great sound I get from my systems. . . have not heard anything that sounds better nor do I want to buy something else.

Win, lose or draw, when I'm dead I'm dead.
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CAJames
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Re: Roon assistance
Reply #26 - 06/28/21 at 00:30:05
 
Quote:
Posted by: Donnie      Posted on: Yesterday at 22:41:30

...He who dies with the most CD's doesn't really win...



Agree to disagree.  

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[FOOBAR2000 | Jay's CDT2 MRK3] -> Denafrips Terminator 2 + Gaia
Sumiko Pearwood -> Mapleknoll Athena -> Luxman SUT -> Maple-tree Phono 3E
Woo WA22 -> 2x UFO25s, balanced monos
Omega SAM , Hifiman Arya, Senn HD-650
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Archie
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Re: Roon assistance
Reply #27 - 06/28/21 at 02:34:46
 
I don't really do CDs but I do do vinyl and books.  I would never substitute the physical media for digital.  I guess it's another way to divide up the world -- "virtual" vs physical.  I like cash too!   Cool
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