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Newbie queries (Read 1454 times)
Mike Hughes
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Newbie queries
05/09/21 at 16:46:41
 
Hello all. Apologies for the long post to start. For various reasons Iíve had a somewhat erratic hi-fi journey of late. My original aspiration was for an all Naim CD based system. When I got there the limitations of my Epos ES11 speakers were surprisingly exposed (rolled off top end, one note bass) so I started a three year long journey towards new speakers. None of the traditional matches worked for me. Too much hi-fi. Not enough emotional involvement. I happened across Zu and was able to demo at length. A year further along I took possession of the first Soul Superfly in the UK.

Where Iím currently at is that I have moved from CD to streaming using an Innuos Zenith 3 into a Chord Hugo TT2. The streaming is locally only at present i.e. about 1,900 CD rips stored on the Innuos. This all goes into Naim amplification i.e. 200/202/HCDR/NAPSC and that in turn feeds the Zu.

This came about from increased dissatisfaction with my Naim CDX2/XPS2 source, which nobody has been able to resolve for me. That was allied with a general irritation at the sheer number of boxes and cable faffing involved in a Naim system so the problem if there is one is likely to be me. The CDX2 rocked but getting it to do that consistently post the move to Zu became a PITA and it became obvious that the impedance mismatch between amp and speakers was as much of an issue as the cable spaghetti management etc.

So, CDP has been sold. Accompanying power supply will go the same way once I get it back from my dealer (lock down means itís been there nearly 15 months). No regrets at all moving to streaming but big decisions needed to be made re: speakers and amps. One has to go. My conclusion is that the speakers are great and my Naim journey is over. I now need to source an amp to do justice to my source and speakers. Obviously difficult with shops shut in a pandemic so Iíve been doing a lot of reading andÖ here I am.

I have never owned a valve amp in my life. To some extent I fear them. Iím visually impaired and dealing with anything involving detail can be difficult. Iím not your man for DIY etc. I thought Mrs. H. was implacably opposed to valve solutions but it turns out she will accept if itís not going to explode, boil us to death, take up significant space or prove overly complex. Hmm.

So, the living room is 15.5 x 11.5 with the speakers less than ideally placed either side of a not in use fireplace. 50Ē Pioneer Kuro plasma above the fireplace and between the speakers. 3 seater sofa down one wall to the right as you face the speakers and 3 seater facing the speakers on the short back wall. Window on the long left wall. Hi-if currently on 2 columns of Hutter RackTime at the end of the sofa on the long wall i.e. between the right speaker and the sofa on the long wall. Household musical tastes are wonderfully eclectic. Aphex Twin through to Zappa with jazz, folk, blues, metal, classical, pop, hip hop, soul and much more in between. Iíve found I can cope with a much more relaxed sound than the Naim source but at present the Zu donít come to life until cranked up and the whole thing, thanks I suspect to the impedance issue, can sound great on some stuff and anaemic on other stuff. I want some mid range warmth; the full detail from the DAC (ugly looking thing but very good) and a lot more presence/power on things like drums and brass.

Everything I read is pointing me towards a Decware single amp solution. Some newbie questions then:

1 - does anyone have experience with an Innuos/Chord front end and how it might sound/work with Decware/Zu?

2 - I have read a number of reviews suggesting Decware for jazz/classical but not for rock etc. Iím not going for earth shattering volumes as my tinnitus would object but is there going to be enough to satisfy me at lower volumes? Not low, just moderate listening levels.

3 - I know which amp Iíd like but given the room size etc. what do people think would be the best fit? A 2 box solution is not where I want to go and ideally Iíd like to move to one column of Hutter not two.

Your thoughts are welcome.
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Geno
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #1 - 05/09/21 at 18:28:50
 
Hi Mike. Welcome to the forum.

In a room your size, with your speakers being so efficient, youíd be just fine with the SE84UFO. Thatís what I have in a slightly larger room, with slightly less efficient speakers, and Iím very happy with the available volume. More importantly, the quality of the sound is just wonderful.

That said, as much as I love my SE84, if I could go back and start over, Iíd get the 25th anniversary SE 84.  I had all of Steves available mods done to mine, but Iím sure it is still not nearly what the anniversary edition is.

Best,

Geno
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JohnWatson
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #2 - 05/09/21 at 19:39:07
 
I agree with Geno, the UFO 25th is wonderful and worth the price of admission and then some. †It is definitely the last amplifier I will ever own and should work well with Zu. My space is about the same and with Klipsch speakers the volume is more than enough. Smiley
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Mike Hughes
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #3 - 05/09/21 at 21:03:16
 
Thanks. That sits nicely with my own reading/thinking and goes a long way to answering my third question. Any thoughts on the first two?
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #4 - 05/09/21 at 21:21:55
 
OK, I'll throw a wrench into this thought process.

How about a Torii Jr for more or less the same money and the knowledge that you would never run out of power?

Oh by the way, welcome to our little family here.

I'm kinda the left handed, red headed, step child-black sheep of the family.
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Mike Hughes
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #5 - 05/09/21 at 21:47:54
 
Feel free to throw in wrenches.

Ah, well to be clear, the money wonít be an issue. However, as per my original post, the size will be and the Tori wouid be sat on some Hutter for which it is simply too big and the removal of which is a non-negotiable with Mrs. H. if Iím to get what I want Smiley Life is full of such compromises butÖ I also really like the Hutter and, much prefer the look of the Triode/Anniversary edition.

I also donít get any sense that the 25th anniversary would run out of power in my room. Am I wrong to think that?

Any thoughts/knowledge on my sources or the genres of music?

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JohnWatson
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #6 - 05/09/21 at 21:52:43
 
† †Re the second question, †low level rock and roll with sound great. †My experience is with the mini torii, the Rachael and the SE84UFO25th and all three will do it, but the 25th anniversary digs deeper into the recordings and tightens up the imaging. †It lifted another veil for me. †The torii jr. will give you more power but IMO, the UFO will sound better and you shouldn't need any more power than that. †At least that has been my experience and I am an audio lover, not an audiophile but it's hard to go wrong with any of the Decware products!
†Can't help with the first question, but I don't see why it wouldn't work well together.
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effluviography
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #7 - 05/09/21 at 22:20:13
 
Don't worry about the decware amps with rock. I love overdrive and fuzz. The amps pull out such texture from the distortion that it is aural heaven. I use a Mini-torii and a 84UFO (not 25th). If money isn't an issue, I'd go with the 25th anniversary model. Cheers, Scott
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Geno
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #8 - 05/09/21 at 22:29:08
 
I listen to all kinds of music - at present itís Jethro Tull. Earlier it was Fairport Convention, and this morning it was Art Blakey and Saint-Saens. These amps do well with all kinds of music.

Eventually you might consider one of the Decware preamps (I have the CSP3). It can take it to yet another level (and an extra bit of gain)
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Mike Hughes
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #9 - 05/09/21 at 22:39:40
 
Thanks. Good to know. I definitely wonít be in the market for anything beyond a single box. 8 Naim boxes has definitely taught me that less is often more.

The other question, which I inevitably forgot, is that of course I have two sources. Innuos/Chord and the Pioneer TV. Any issues running the TV through these amps?

At present Iím using a cheap analogue out. At some point thatíll become a digital out through the Chord DAC.
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effluviography
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #10 - 05/09/21 at 23:14:00
 
My partner, she likes to watch Youtube music videos on our TV via a Marantz DAC into the SE84. Works well. I've never run them analog to analog, I've always had optical to a decent quality DAC first and I haven't had any issues. Sounds surprisingly good, even with Youtube audio quality. And definitely loud enough.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #11 - 05/09/21 at 23:45:43
 
Hi Mike.
I have wrench to throw into the mix that may or may not be a problem.
I have a plasma tv (not a Kuro) as well as an Epson UST projector. There is a buzz coming through my speakers that is noticeable when using my plasma which is absolutely not there when using the Epson. The buzz is noticeable at my listening position of ~10-12 feet even at low volumes.
I have run a 100 foot extension cord to every outlet in my house and that buzz is still present.
I recently purchased and installed a Zen Line Conditioner and the buzz is still there.
I don't want you to either purchase or not purchase one of Steve's fine amps because of one person's experience and I'm hoping others on this forum will chime in with their direct experience.
I just don't want you to find yourself in a position deciding between two of the finest technologies on the market AFTER having taken delivery of a tube amp. Or not on the market in the case of the Kuro. And for what it is worth, I know how good that Kuro is.
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Mike Hughes
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #12 - 05/09/21 at 23:57:46
 
Again, good to know. I have a nagging suspicion that this sort of issue could arise and it would, potentially, be a deal breaker. Is your input into the amp pure analogue to analogies or is there a DAC en route?

Should I forget to say so may I take the opportunity to thank you all for your replies so far. Itís really helping me solidify my thinking on an amp better matched to the system as a whole.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #13 - 05/10/21 at 02:57:00
 
Hi Mike,

I have run Chord DACs into a Decware amp and can speak to impressions. In my case, it was Chord Mojo/Qutest/Qutest + Hugo M Scaler -> Decware Taboo.

I've found the Chord sound to be raw, soulful, and detailed with lifelike tone. The wonderful part about Valve amps, and Decware amps in particular, is how you can change valves and dial in exactly the sound preferences you like. Because the Chord sound is already so connected to the music, and has the right tone, I used different valves to inject more weight to the music, a little more smoothness, and more bass. Decware amps are known for their transparency, so through combinations of valves, you'll be able to find the configuration that results in the sound you're looking for (and it may be different for different genres of music).

Hope that helps,
Richard
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Abunadh
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #14 - 05/10/21 at 05:43:44
 
I use a bluray player to stream content which has been plugged into both a Schiit Bifrost 2 and a Border Patrol SE-i DAC. The buzz is there using both DACs and is present on the Border Patrol with and without the tube engaged.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #15 - 05/10/21 at 12:32:54
 
Abunadh, I had a buzz that I finally isolated to my cable tv coaxial into my DVR and then via coaxial into my DAC, and installed a filter on the cable coaxial and it went away. . . . If you are using cable that may be the reason you have the buzz (?)
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Mike Hughes
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #16 - 05/10/21 at 21:28:00
 
@morp yes thatís really good to hear thanks. Iím familiar with the Qutest having auditioned one before settling on the TT2. Latter us a little more laid back but also even more detailed.

With the Decware/Zu combination Iím acutely aware how both show whatís going on upstream so I want to be confident my source can withstand that kind of analysis andÖ itís sounding good.

I did have a fair old hum on my system at one point. Tried solving it with a filter, which is probably still there now I think about it. I took the headphone amp out and that largely sorted it.

So, in terms of the 25th anniversary edition, what sort of heat does it generate bearing in mind that in the Winter we donít need the heating on in the living room when the TV is on and in the Summer we canít risk watching the plasma given the heat already in the room?

Also, am I missing something? The sure suggests it only has 1 set of inputs. I need 2.
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gsanger
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #17 - 05/11/21 at 20:54:11
 
Are we still allowed to throw wrenches into your plan?

As far as your #2 question, easily 90% of my listening is to rock or metal (if we're being pedantic, I listen mostly to a little subgenre called Sleaze), and I LOVE the SE84UFO for it.  My speakers are the Klipsch RB-61 speakers, which are essentially an earlier version of the ubiquitous RP-600M speakers.   They're rated at, if I remember right, about 95 dB, but in-room, it's probably more like 91-92 dB.   They get plenty loud for near field listening, and when I tried that combo out in our lager living room, it got way too loud for my wife and for me before it ever started sounding strained or distorted.  

Anyway, with that combo, I really like what it does to rock and metal. Drums have a tremendous sense of "rightness", while still have good snap and punch.  The bass is has great texture, and guitars are rich in tone.  Vocals, too, are just superb.

I haven't heard Zu's personally, though from everything I have read about them, I am certain I would like them, and am planning to order a pair of Dirty Weekends with the next window.  So, if some good heavy metal is important, I think that will be a great combo.

As far as a wrench, I do think the SE84UFO benefits from a preamp in front of it.  I know you're opposed to "another box", so I'm not sure if there's a good solution there.  It's not that it sounds bad without a preamp, but theres just a bit more weight and punch with a preamp than without, and I find rock and metal really benefits from that, whereas simpler music (small combo jazz, singer/songwriter stuff, etc), tends to benefit from that more naked and exposed sound.

I do have a Slagle Autoformer that I have really enjoyed in front of my Decware, and I find it gives a lot of the same weight and punch as an active pre, while also maintaining an incredible sense of space and detail.  If you were willing to add a small box, I'd recommend checking out the icOn4 preamp - it's made in England, uses Slagle autoformers, and even comes with a remote (And if you spring for the 25th Anniversary amp, which yes, I'm fairly certain only has one input), you'll also get a few extra added inputs to switch between.  It's an extra box, but it's small, and might take your new Decware system where you need it to go.

Anyway, just my $0.02.  I love my Decware amp, and I think one could work real well for you, too.
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Mike Hughes
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #18 - 05/11/21 at 21:53:27
 
Good job selling me on the sound there abd feel free to throw in what you want. Iím not a massive metal fan but it gets played occasionally and goodness knows thereís plenty of electric guitar in my music collection generally.

One input would be a non-starter. Does that mean I need a switch or just a different Decware amp?
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #19 - 05/11/21 at 23:43:02
 
Quote:
Posted by: Mike Hughes      Posted on: Today at 21:53:27

...One input would be a non-starter. Does that mean I need a switch or just a different Decware amp?


If you want the 25th anniversary UFO (UFO25) you'll need a switch. The UFO, UFO2 and UFO3 have two inputs and upgrades that get you part way to the 25th. I have a pair of UFOs with the power supply bypass caps and the upgraded signal cap and they sound fantastic.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #20 - 05/12/21 at 18:55:36
 
Mike.. just wanted to chime in here as a newbie to the tube world. I received my SE84UFO in Jan 2021 to replace a NAD integrated and couldn't be more happier. I did have speaker hum while my REL sub was powered up. I did the extension cord outlet test among many other troubleshooting attempts. Rest assured when I called into Decware, Steve was able to provide a fix within 10 mins or so. He had me run a ground wire between the negative posts on the amp.. problem solved.

I also had a more difficult issue where the amp was lit up but no sound. Called in again and Steve immediately knew it was a fuse. I replaced the fuse (it was very easy to do).

 Just trying to put you at ease that Steve was wonderful to work with and after I got through these two minor blips all has been wonderful since. l also have tinnitus and the SE84UFO provides plenty of power for my needs.. best of luck !  Bob
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Mike Hughes
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #21 - 05/13/21 at 09:01:50
 
Cheers Bob. Iím fairly relaxed about any kind of hum. Ultimately thatís a practical issue and you work your way through a list of solutions until you find yours. For me the key things are reducing my box count (so integrated only); matching my speaker sensitivity (clearly going to be no issue there) and two inputs. The one input is a deal breaker.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #22 - 05/14/21 at 02:47:34
 
Hello Mike.

You say that two inputs for the amp is a requirement, but you also say this:

Quote:
Any issues running the TV through these amps?

At present Iím using a cheap analogue out. At some point thatíll become a digital out through the Chord DAC.


At which point you would then need only one input for the amplifier, the Chord providing for your two digital inputs. The waiting period for a new Decware amp should provide ample time to obtain whatever connecting cable needed for TV digital out to the Chord.

Another consideration (another wrench) is that the Chord Hugo TT2 manual states that in 'DAC Mode' the output is a fixed 2.5V (RCA), so then no volume control from the Chord, remote or otherwise. The SE84UFO25 has separate volume control for each channel, the other similar SE84 amps having a single VC. Remote VC is available on the Chord only in 'Amp Mode', which goes through the internal digital preamp, but this would run counter to purpose of highest sound quality. (Source selection would still be available by Chord remote either way.)

If two inputs for the amp are still needed regardless, in consideration of the SE84UFO25: If you could somehow find a way to fit in a 6"W x 2.5"H box somewhere, it would certainly increase flexibility and options. More faffing with cables at the outset, true, but that is a one-time event, and possibly saves further fuss in other ways for everyday operation. The ZSB (switch box) has option for a remote control, so then not having to deal with dual volume, e.g., or manual VC at all, after setting them manually at first.

After all that . . . Either the SE84UFO or SE84UFO2 (both w/two inputs, one volume knob) with 25th anniversary power supply mods are said to be a noticeable step above the stock versions in sound quality, the consensus I gather as their being closer to the SE84UFO25 than to their respective stock versions.

I hope it all works out for you in the end.
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Geno
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #23 - 05/14/21 at 03:42:31
 
Ed makes a good point. If the deal breaker is only having one set of inputs, then either variation of the SE84UFO would solve the problem. I bought mine stock 4 years ago, and when Steve started offering the anniversary mods, I sent mine in for the works. Made it a much better amp in every way. If I could start over again though, Iíd have gotten the SE84UFO2 to have the meters and the balanced input option.

Order one with all the extras, and you canít go wrong. And youíll save some money compared to the 25th edition.
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Mike Hughes
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #24 - 05/14/21 at 22:22:30
 
Thanks both. Yes, an obvious point and I still managed to miss it. Smiley Easy enough to feed a digital out from my Kuro or my Sky Q box to the DAC and then, as you say. One input is fine.

The point about the Chord modes is an interesting one. I started in DAC mode into my Naim pre. It was fine but the 2.5V reduced the travel on the volume so it was overly sensitive. 2.V is on the hot side for the Naim but otherwise okay. I moved to AMP mode and tried 1V, 1.5 and 2. 1 was awful, 2 gave me reduced travel once again and 1.5V is a nice balance of sound quality and sensible control over volume. At no point have I had any sense that using the Chord in AMP mode into the pre has reduced sound quality. The issue is more impedance mismatch between 4 Ohm amp and 16 Ohm speakers.

That then leads to me asking why you think using AMP mode might be less than optimum with the anniversary edition? Is it not in effect acting as a pre?

I should add that volume control and remote control are of little concern to me. Iíve no problem setting manually from the amp or DAC.

Following on from, that what range of voltages will the amp accept? Iím not sufficiently knowledgeable with regard to electronics to be able to necessarily deduce from a spec sheet.

Yes to all mods by the way. Lockdown has been kind to me and working from home has enabled regular saving for the first time in years so if thereís any restriction at all I guess itís me imposing a broad £4,000 limit as that would then be comparable to speakers, amp and DAC expenditure.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #25 - 05/15/21 at 06:52:01
 
Hi again.

Yes, I wasn't thinking straight in proposing that the Amp Mode was an infrior way of going about it because of the digital preamp. I said that as if it would be going into another preamp, for some reason, which is not the case here. It wasn't about inferiority of the Amp Mode itself, just the (incorrectly) assumed extra step.

I'm glad you've already been through the process via the Naim so you already have a starting point in understanding how to play the gain of the DAC vs. gain of the amplifier. I couldn't find the sensitivity of the Naim unit, but the UFO25 has sensitivity of 1.5V for full output. Don't assume that this means 2V or 2.5V from a source will overload the amp right away. The amplifier gain setting (volume) reduces the sensitivity as you turn it down from full. Also, all DAC output ratings, whether 2V or 4V or 6V, refer to max level, the average signal being ~13 to 15dB below whichever number (from what I've read).

Turning the amplifier down a bit should give you more room to control volume from the DAC. I see that the Chord has a Low Gain setting in Amp Mode, so with all that I think finding a good setting that's easy to use won't be a problem.

All Decware amplifiers with UFO output transformers have a switch to select 4 ohms or less, or for 6-16 ohms, easily accommodating the higher impedance of the Druids.

As for the mods on the 84UFO or 84UFO2, everyone having that says they're well worth the money. But since it looks as though you'll need only one input from DAC to amp once you have everything at the same camp fire, all the 84UFO25 owners will say "get that one!"

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Mike Hughes
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #26 - 05/16/21 at 18:12:51
 
Canít say Iím bothered about controlling the volume from the DAC. I am told there is a sweet spot but my volume desires change from album to album and the design of the Chord could be politely described as not especially user friendly. Iíd rather fix and forget and then control from the amp as I currently do.

Currently working my way through the full 17 pages of the anniversary build thread. Interesting. I suspect the position of my Superfly within my room will give me more 2D than 3D but I can live with that given the many other apparent gains.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #27 - 05/17/21 at 01:08:09
 
That works too. The concept of adjusting gain x vs. gain y still holds whichever end is chosen for volume control in daily use. The 'sweet spot' is not necessarily a precise thing as in +/- .5 dB at some exact setting. In practical use there should be a reasonably broad volume range wherein the overall sound quality is not noticeably different.
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Mike Hughes
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #28 - 05/17/21 at 09:14:04
 
Thank you all. Just a case of continuing to put money aside then until I hit the magic figure. I have a shortlist of both solid state and valve amps. The Superfly does work with solid state but was designed for valves and I have to say that in terms of my shortlist itís eased out ahead for me - bearing in mind that Iíve not been able to listen to anything in lockdown and may not be able to do so for some time. Iíve some persuading of Mrs. H. and the 16 year old in terms of both valves and looks but theyíve let the Chord into the house and acknowledged itís worth soÖ

Some further practical questions:

- Iím assuming you donít keep your amps on all the time from various things Iíve read? This will be new to me as a Naim owner where there is active encouragement to do the opposite. So, do you power down your sources at the same time?

- Iím assuming power up would be amp first then source?

- no-one has, as best I recall. answered mine of my earlier questions about heat. Any clues?

- bearing in mind the joys of Brexit and a pandemic, any known issues shipping to the UK?

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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #29 - 05/17/21 at 12:55:55
 
Mike,

If you are leaving the house turn off the tube amp. I leave all my sources on 24/7 unless leaving for a trip, or thunderstorm.

Turn the amp on last when powering up, turn the amp off first when shutting down. This is so any start up noise from the source components doesn't get shot through the speakers.

The UFO25th puts out a bit of heat not too much though. think 75-100w incandescent light bulb.

As far as shipping you would need to talk to Decware, I'm guessing there would be no issues.
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Archie
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #30 - 05/17/21 at 15:50:38
 
Quote:
Turn the amp on last when powering up, turn the amp off first when shutting down. This is so any start up noise from the source components doesn't get shot through the speakers.


To avoid this I always turn my amp volume to zero before powering up or down. †With all the capacitors on everything, I'd have to take half a minute to turn on/off everything slowly, in sequence, to avoid all pops and pulses.

BTW, I know a lot of people leave their equipment on 24/7 but the power waste (and cost) is significant.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #31 - 05/17/21 at 16:06:24
 
My room is like yours. 10' X 16". I use the SE84UFO3 mono blocks with a pair of Caintuck Betsy Baffles. I have never heard my music sound better. I have a different front end than you but I doubt that matters much.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #32 - 05/17/21 at 18:03:01
 
Yeah, so pretty much as I expected then in terms of order. Surprised anyone leaves a valve amp on all the time but then most non-believers are surprised the Naim is on all the time.

Given the likelihood of a hike in electricity costs Iím inclined to put the amp on maybe at the end of week each day - like many others Iím currently working from home - and my guess is that powering didnít the source (server/streamer) is going to be no issue compared to a noisy CDP etc.
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Mike Hughes
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #33 - 06/01/21 at 21:35:44
 
Watched the Andrew Robinson Decware review. Very impressive but I wasnít 100% clear. Was that a 25th anniversary review or something else?
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #34 - 06/01/21 at 23:09:22
 
Mike - Just saw your posts regarding the heat issue from Decware tube products. My .02 cents worth, I was concerned when I sold off all our previous gear and bought the Decware gear since it all lives in the coat closet in our living room (when your wife is an Interior Designer / Space Planner a rack of electronics isn't going in the living room). I was concerned about heat, but my other gear lived in the same space so I figured ''How bad can it Be??" I ended up with a digital thermometer mounted in the closet (just like the ones in our QC room at work). At the worst, in the Santa Cruz mountains on the hottest days (3 digits) it never went over 8į above the ambient temp of the living room (no AC, mid-80's) so I stopped worrying about it. Sources & pre-amp on first, amp on last with all master volumes down and turn off is all masters down, amp off first, pre-amp and sources next. No noise, no thumps just glorious music all the darn time. Love our Decware/Omega gear. Happy listening, Chris.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #35 - 06/01/21 at 23:20:08
 
Cheers Chris. Good description. Thank you.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #36 - 06/02/21 at 02:55:56
 
@ Mike Hughes

If you click on the Show More link in Andrew Robinson's review, it shows he is reviewing the SE84UFO2

Sam
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #37 - 06/02/21 at 09:24:49
 
Okay, so can someone tell me what I would choose between the anniversary and the UFO2? Given my room and proposed system what are the advantages /disadvantages of each?
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #38 - 06/02/21 at 13:43:20
 
Mike,

Off the top of my head, you will be well served with the 25th Anniversary. It has separate power supplies for all the gain left, right, and pre tubes which will provide clean power from even dirty mains. Sperate channel volume controls will work well in your difficult listening space. Get the tube complement option and you will be set with the tools to acquire a wonderful audio experience in your space.

When I eventually move to a condo this will be my go to amp!

John
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #39 - 06/02/21 at 23:30:57
 
Do I have a difficult listening space?
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #40 - 06/03/21 at 03:39:34
 
Not more difficult than most normal living spaces. The window on one long wall and sofa on the other will tend to mess with balance a bit. The fireplace might be a plus and TV not.

John
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #41 - 06/03/21 at 21:46:32
 
Yeah, thatís pretty much how I feel about it. Swings and roundabouts. Some gains and some losses. ďA roomĒ in other words.

Anyways, I am torn between the UFO2 and the anniversary.
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Re: Newbie queries
Reply #42 - 06/06/21 at 19:04:40
 
Both amplifiers have the same rated output power and the same basic circuit. The UFO25 is a 'souped up' version of the stock amplifier and the UFO2, primarily by way of a super hotrodded power supply, with capacitor bypass mods and then separate supply each to the gain tube and the two power tubes, and with addition of voltage regulator tubes.

In daily use, the only functional difference between the two is that the UFO2 has a single volume control for both channels, whereas the UFO25 has separate volume control ea. for L and R.

The listening experience is however, by almost all accounts, something quite apart-- the UFO25 being "in a different league", as they say.

If you haven't yet, you should avail yourself of the SE84UFO25 sub-forum, wherein a number of current 84UFO25 owners who have previously owned the stock 84UFO or 84UFO2 amplifiers speak of their impressions concerning the difference between the two.

Here is a 'starter kit' thread within that sub-forum:

https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1531362294

And a thread with your inquisition in the title:

https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1565277619

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