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DIY Betsy’s (Read 10837 times)
Eldergod
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DIY Betsy’s
08/12/20 at 20:12:39
 
Hang on. Norah and I are having a moment.....

Okay. Sitting here enjoying maybe my 8th hour or so listening to my new diy Caintuck Betsy’s. If you’re not interested in my lengthy review below, no worries. Here’s the good stuff: if you have never listened to OB speakers or a solid full range driver with nothing between it and the amp sans some wire, get with Randy and acquire a pair. Wow. That’s it, you’re welcome.

For anyone else looking for more meat, let’s go. If it’s not obvious, I built these out of sheer curiosity to experience something new from a build and listening perspective. I’m fairly handy and maybe a bit dangerous around my humble shop, so I decided to build myself a ‘test’ (read: cheap!) pair. Shout out to Doug at Wild Burro for getting me the drivers so quickly. I’ve also had some correspondence with Randy from Caintuck, and he’s fantastic if you haven’t had the pleasure. He was incredibly gracious with answering questions I had in order to make these as close to the beauties he creates. The only real differences in mine are big box plywood and they are an inch and a half taller overall simply because it was less cuts because I’m lazy/impatient. Also, they are angled back approx. 10°. Finally, I added an 18”x18” peel and stick vinyl tile to the back of the plywood to help deaden resonances. If you’re interested in how this affected the panel, email me and I’ll send you the 20 sec. video I took comparing one with and one without. Finished them up last night around 6pm, and I have been transfixed on listening to these since. Devouring as much of my reference material as possible and here are my impressions:
The recording must best good or great. Anything not will absolutely SUCK if you are actually listening for listening sake. Some of my reference material - a few Mapleshade CDs (Euphoria is my fave), Gabriella y Rodrigo, Norah Jones, The Steel Wheels, some movie soundtracks (Last of the Mohicans, Braveheart), Jack Johnson, John Mayor, Tracey Chapman, Dire Straits, Pink Floyd, Bruce Hornsby, and some live Eagles. It’s been amazing hearing things in these that I can honestly say I’ve never heard. And things I haven’t either. They are so fast, I get the spaces in between the music, notes, breaths.... Here are some of the notes I took while listening, but I’m afraid they will be cliche at this point. Articulate, delicate, speed, floating/deep soundstage, vocals!, guitars!, clarity. Everything sounds RIGHT. Particularly vocals. Hence my initial comment above about the moment with Norah. Holy shit. Are these perfect? Of course not. And for all the obvious reasons, but they are so ridiculously amazing with appropriate material. At this point, I’m running these off my SS amp, bit am anxiously saving my pennies for an SE84UFO hopefully soon. I’m certain that will seriously elevate the experience. Well, there ya go. Hope that’s helpful to anyone on the fence around dipping their toe into what is certainly the deep end of the pool. Thanks for listening. I’ll drop in some pics shortly.
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SE84UFO2 w/25th mods, TEAC AI-2000, Pass ACA, Pro-Ject Carbon Black DC, Schiit Mani, Pioneer Elite PD-65, Gallo Reference 3.1, X-LS Encores, DIY Caintuck Betsy’s, Audio-Pro B2-40, PE SUB-800, Drop HiFiman HE4XX, Drop Senn. HD6XX, Bottlehead Crack
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Randy in Caintuck
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Posts: 965
Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #1 - 08/14/20 at 15:26:48
 


Hi Eldergod,

Congratulations on your project ..... and thanks for the kind words .....

There is truly something special about the Betsy driver in an open baffle.
They just get out of the way and let the music flow into the listening room.

Of course, you are correct that there is no "perfect" loudspeaker, but if the real objective and priority is MUSIC, the Betsy driver can satisfy your audio "sweet tooth" .....

Most folks who have enjoyed the audio hobby for a long time know that most of the music is in the midrange ..... and that is where the Betsy baffles shine.

You are also correct about the quality of recordings ..... 25 years in the IT industry convinced me of the GIGO principle ..... Garbage In - Garbage Out ..... a simple speaker with no crossover components makes this pretty obvious.

There is a Recommended Music section on my website with some CDs you might enjoy.

The Stockfisch CDs are consistently good.

Best wishes and happy listening,
Randy

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CEC TL5N belt drive CD transport
Cambridge Audio Azur 851N DAC / Streamer
Decware SE84UFO amplifier
Caintuck Audio Betsy Open Baffles
Caintuck Audio Lii Silver-10 Open Baffles
Caintuck Audio Lii 15 Open Bass Baffle
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Geno
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #2 - 08/14/20 at 21:47:39
 
Mr. Randy,

With all of the quality drivers you now offer, folks have lots of great options. There seems to be something for everyone. And the fact that you offer only solid hardwood baffles, refines each of those options.

I know that with all the choices, you've got to be as busy as you want to be. As the one who is responsible for the open baffle craze, you are deserving of highest praise!

Very best,

Geno
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(2)SE84UFO(Balanced Monoblocs) OR Sansui AU-222
Crown sub amp
Cambridge Audio CXN(ModWright) • ZBIT
SL-1210MK5(KAB Mods) Soundsmith Aida MKll cart • Darlington Labs MP-7
Otari MX5050-Bll2 R2R
ZLC Power Cond.
Lii Audio PT-10/W-15 in open baffles
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Eldergod
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Posts: 49
Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #3 - 08/15/20 at 13:21:27
 
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SE84UFO2 w/25th mods, TEAC AI-2000, Pass ACA, Pro-Ject Carbon Black DC, Schiit Mani, Pioneer Elite PD-65, Gallo Reference 3.1, X-LS Encores, DIY Caintuck Betsy’s, Audio-Pro B2-40, PE SUB-800, Drop HiFiman HE4XX, Drop Senn. HD6XX, Bottlehead Crack
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Eldergod
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #4 - 08/15/20 at 13:29:19
 
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Randy in Caintuck
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #5 - 08/17/20 at 15:45:47
 


Hi Eldergod,

Thanks for sharing the photos ..... very nice .....

Hey Geno .....

Thanks for the kind words .....

I was hoping that the current offerings would be the total Caintuck Audio lineup ..... but Lii Audio is sending me a pair of their new 6.5" drivers for evaluation.  They are very excited about these drivers, so it should be interesting .....

In addition, I found a nice Goldwood 12" bass driver with dual binding posts / voice coils that will permit a lot of flexibility for those who want a single bass baffle with multiple amplification options.

It has been several months since I have had fewer than six orders in the build queue, so you are correct ..... I am as busy as I want to be .....

I have had several species of previously unused hardwood sitting in my shop that I want to use for baffles, but haven't had time to get to them.
The plan is to complete the speakers with the exception of cutting the openings for the drivers.
I want to have a page on the website with photos and let the customer choose the driver that they prefer.

Maybe some day .....

Best wishes,
Randy

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CEC TL5N belt drive CD transport
Cambridge Audio Azur 851N DAC / Streamer
Decware SE84UFO amplifier
Caintuck Audio Betsy Open Baffles
Caintuck Audio Lii Silver-10 Open Baffles
Caintuck Audio Lii 15 Open Bass Baffle
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Eldergod
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Posts: 49
Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #6 - 01/17/21 at 13:06:43
 
Updated with finishes completed.
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SE84UFO2 w/25th mods, TEAC AI-2000, Pass ACA, Pro-Ject Carbon Black DC, Schiit Mani, Pioneer Elite PD-65, Gallo Reference 3.1, X-LS Encores, DIY Caintuck Betsy’s, Audio-Pro B2-40, PE SUB-800, Drop HiFiman HE4XX, Drop Senn. HD6XX, Bottlehead Crack
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Eldergod
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #7 - 01/17/21 at 13:09:07
 
Rear coated with Duratex.
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SE84UFO2 w/25th mods, TEAC AI-2000, Pass ACA, Pro-Ject Carbon Black DC, Schiit Mani, Pioneer Elite PD-65, Gallo Reference 3.1, X-LS Encores, DIY Caintuck Betsy’s, Audio-Pro B2-40, PE SUB-800, Drop HiFiman HE4XX, Drop Senn. HD6XX, Bottlehead Crack
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Geno
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #8 - 01/18/21 at 22:15:44
 
Nice job man! They look great!
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(2)SE84UFO(Balanced Monoblocs) OR Sansui AU-222
Crown sub amp
Cambridge Audio CXN(ModWright) • ZBIT
SL-1210MK5(KAB Mods) Soundsmith Aida MKll cart • Darlington Labs MP-7
Otari MX5050-Bll2 R2R
ZLC Power Cond.
Lii Audio PT-10/W-15 in open baffles
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Eldergod
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Posts: 49
Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #9 - 01/20/21 at 01:00:17
 
Thanks Geno! Wasn’t sure how’s they’d take the stain. Used a wood conditioner first, and was really pleased with the outcome. Pics don’t do them justice.
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SE84UFO2 w/25th mods, TEAC AI-2000, Pass ACA, Pro-Ject Carbon Black DC, Schiit Mani, Pioneer Elite PD-65, Gallo Reference 3.1, X-LS Encores, DIY Caintuck Betsy’s, Audio-Pro B2-40, PE SUB-800, Drop HiFiman HE4XX, Drop Senn. HD6XX, Bottlehead Crack
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Eldergod
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #10 - 01/23/21 at 21:15:20
 
Picked up a gently used Dayton Audio 8” sub to go along with the Betsy’s. Fits perfectly in one of the Kallax cubbies. Fills in the bottom octave nicely.
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SE84UFO2 w/25th mods, TEAC AI-2000, Pass ACA, Pro-Ject Carbon Black DC, Schiit Mani, Pioneer Elite PD-65, Gallo Reference 3.1, X-LS Encores, DIY Caintuck Betsy’s, Audio-Pro B2-40, PE SUB-800, Drop HiFiman HE4XX, Drop Senn. HD6XX, Bottlehead Crack
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Randy in Caintuck
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #11 - 01/25/21 at 04:14:06
 


Hi Eldergod,

Your speakers turned out very well ..... nice work .....

The Dayton Audio 8" powered subwoofer is great bang for the buck.
Quite a few of my Betsy baffle customers own one and the combo makes for a nice full range system.

The bass isn't earthshaking, but the smaller driver integrates with the main speakers much better than the 12" and 15" models (which are more suited to home theater, in my opinion).

The 8" driver is "quicker" ..... perfect for music.

Happy listening,
Randy

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CEC TL5N belt drive CD transport
Cambridge Audio Azur 851N DAC / Streamer
Decware SE84UFO amplifier
Caintuck Audio Betsy Open Baffles
Caintuck Audio Lii Silver-10 Open Baffles
Caintuck Audio Lii 15 Open Bass Baffle
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HaikutheFrogMan
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #12 - 11/14/21 at 14:19:19
 
Hi Eldergod,

I am hoping to build my own Betsy baffles influenced by the Caintuck design. I know I'm a bit late to the party, but I was hoping you could share a little more about your build process. I'm a newbie to DIY audio, so anything you have to share (materials, dimensions, things you would do differently in hindsight) would be greatly appreciated!

Some specific questions I have:
-Where did you get your binding posts and how are they mounted to the speaker base?
-When looking at the picture of your baffle before you applied the vinyl tile, it seems like you attached a very thin wood panel with a concave opening for rear of the Betsy driver. What is this and what is the reasoning for it?
-Did you apply a veneer to the front of your baffles or did you simply treat and finish the plywood?
-Can you share the video of your baffles with and without the vinyl tile?

Your DIY Caintuck Betsy's turned out beautiful! If you are willing to share your insights, I hope mine can turn out half as nice Smiley

Thanks,
FrogMan
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Eldergod
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #13 - 12/15/21 at 15:00:03
 
Hey Frogman!  Sorry I missed this until now.  I'll try to answer the specifics:
- Binding posts were honestly just a couple of cheaper ones from Parts Express I had laying around (I wanted to do this entire build as economically as possible).  They are screwed to a small scrap of wood I cut, and drilled holes through for the wire to connect.  I simply glued that piece to the base with Titebond.  It's not going anywhere.
- The speaker panel is as simple as it gets.  Just a 3/4" piece of Birch plywood from Home Depot, and an 18" square sheet of adhesive vinyl flooring attached to the back.  I routed a 1/2" quarter roundover on the back of the driver hole once the adhesive dried.  I did have to use some spray adhesive in addition to what was already on the back of the vinyl panel.  The vinyl made a HUGE difference in resonance dampening on the panel.
- No veneer.  That is the natural Birch finish.  I put some gel conditioning on it prior to staining to help with the consistency.  Birch ply is notorious for being splotchy.  Dura-Tex on the back and base.
- Sure!  I have a video of me tapping on one with and one without pre-production and would be happy to send it to you via text if you want to PM me your cell number.  I can't figure out how to post a video here.  YMMV depending on whether you think the resonance adds or detracts from the sound.
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SE84UFO2 w/25th mods, TEAC AI-2000, Pass ACA, Pro-Ject Carbon Black DC, Schiit Mani, Pioneer Elite PD-65, Gallo Reference 3.1, X-LS Encores, DIY Caintuck Betsy’s, Audio-Pro B2-40, PE SUB-800, Drop HiFiman HE4XX, Drop Senn. HD6XX, Bottlehead Crack
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HaikutheFrogMan
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #14 - 12/19/21 at 18:39:31
 
Thanks Eldergod! I see now that what I thought was a "very thin wood panel" WAS in fact the vinyl tile, and what I thought was the vinyl tile was actually a Dura-Tex coating. Can I ask why you used Dura-Tex? Dura-Tex seems expensive and I was curious if it provides any advantages over simple paint?

I'll go ahead and send you a PM.
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Eldergod
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #15 - 12/24/21 at 14:06:44
 
It is a little pricey, but I had some left over from another project.  Also, got your PM, and sent you the video to your email.
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SE84UFO2 w/25th mods, TEAC AI-2000, Pass ACA, Pro-Ject Carbon Black DC, Schiit Mani, Pioneer Elite PD-65, Gallo Reference 3.1, X-LS Encores, DIY Caintuck Betsy’s, Audio-Pro B2-40, PE SUB-800, Drop HiFiman HE4XX, Drop Senn. HD6XX, Bottlehead Crack
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michaelG
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #16 - 01/07/23 at 20:15:06
 
I plan to build the same very soon. the drivers are shipped and should arrive very soon.

I’m wondering about the driver cut. Should it be centered  or slightly off center toward the top?

regards

Michael
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DrewDays
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Re: DIY Betsy’s
Reply #17 - 02/07/23 at 03:42:46
 
Did you happen to make a mental note of the sound before/after the Duratex was applied? I feel like it might have drastically changed the sound. Taking notes for my own DYI project.

They look amazing. Great job!
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