ok, thaanks

Stefan,those look great! Is the ZBIT just modified with the wood panels? How does the sound of the ZROCK2 with mods compare to how it sounded before?

Lon,

 That's quite the problem... having so much DecWare Gear that you aren't sure where to use it! I'm hoping to have a similar dilemma some day, but it seems it will be far off.      
 Great to hear you are enjoying the change-ups, I am anxious to get my ZROCK2 and then the ZTPRE into my system, the wait is a kind of a conundrum in that the anticipation is something and the patience is something else (that I'm not too good at!).

Best,
Scott

I want my ZBIT and I want it now!
(in Q 10/6, with another 1.5 months to go/pretty much)

Oh, the pain .......the pain, I know guys!

We know it is always worth the wait.
https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1543979474

Great to hear Stone!  I too found that all of the new components needed some time to burn-in before reaching their full potential.  Most profound burn-in requirement for me was the screen grid resistor I added.  It was a hefty wire wound resistor that initially suppressed the top end sparkle I was used to hearing from the ZMA.  The sonic improvements came rather quickly and after a couple of days it was a different amp.  But, all in all I would say it continued to "season" over the following weeks.  

I think you will find replacing the large electrolytic to be a surprising improvement.

This 25th Anniversary Modified Experience is really something. This was a great year for Decware, a stride forward from excellence to out-of-this-wordliness.

I'm addicted to my ZTPRE driving the Monoblocks now, I love the consistent sound and how it makes all my sources sound their best without smoothing over or hiding anything. My next dilemma is to decide whether to send my Taboo Mk III or my Taboo Mk IV back for the Anniversary Mods. One or the other will be the heartbeat of my upcoming second system, the other will be the headphone amp for my main system. I guess in time I'll send them both back. . . .

I know you'll have a great day too, best to you and yours.

May all of us have a safe and happy new year and a year well-seasoned by great-sounding music.

Thanks for the update. Wow, sounds like a great new setup. I have a lot to look forward to when my ZROCK2 is built and shipped. And nice having the ZBIT as a transformer and a source selector.

Regarding the hum. . . when I first got my ZROCK2 it too had a hum. In my case it turned out to be cable placement related. I reconnected all the connections carefully paying attention to routing away from power cables and the hum went away. . . .

I can't help it. I want to just kick back and enjoy the music without futzing, but the transparency and dynamics of these amplifiers keep making me explore. A certain recording will suddenly show me an "avenue" to venture down and off I go.

I'm back to 5R4GWB rectifiers, these labeled Raytheon, which have a slightly richer texture and are a shade less bright than the Chathams I have, and I tried OD3W from Raytheon, Sylvania and Chatham and the Raytheon have a great synergy with these rectifiers. After some "gain" adjustments and time lit up I was very happy but there was just a hint of classic tube warmth that I was missing and it dawned on me to trade a Mullard 12AU7 for the Amperex 12AU7 that I have had in the ZROCK2 for quite some time. That did the trick, I'm getting a very dynamic and open sound--well seems I always have that but there's a hint more dynamic detail and the soundstage opened up a hair and moved back a hair. The Mullard does not quite provide the gain that the Amperex does, had to do some gain adjustments, but I'm now going to try to just leave things be! (Yeah right).

My pleasure lasted a brief instant. I was staring at the Sophia Electric Aqua 274B and remembering what I paid for them, and how excellent they are. . . I popped them back in, and started playing about with the regulator and ZROCK2 tubes. . . and ended up where I started! But knowing there's yet another possible combo available.

This is the first time that I think I understand what Steve was saying that the ZROCK2 without mods would be the weakest link if you have the modded amps (and I think he also meant preamp). I am not using the 25th Anniversary CSP3 right now, but the ZTPRE is so clear and clean and copacetic that I know it's not my weakest link. I'm eager to have my 25th Anniversary modded ZROCK2 built and in the system. I think there's a thin veil that can be rolled away when this happens. . . .

Every day I just marvel at the sound I have in my home. We're blessed.

LOL, me too. Lately I've been like the kid playing a video game...But Mom, just 5 more minutes! Just one more song...just one more...just. Oh crap it's 2am and I need to be up for work in 4 hours!

Had a serious Oh sh__! .....moment(s) last night and then had to duplicate to make sure I was not wrong (this morning)!

Prince's Piano & A Microphone, in its entirety last night was so real and palpable with these mod's and just better!

Next, I have waited for the Mod's to season in to play this one. Bruce Hornsby's Big Swing Face. This disc is just a plain disaster with mid-fi, because of its busy density (and my mid-fi Rig does not suck). ZMA with MOD's?! .....Totally engrossing with dynamic range so stunning ....I was pinching myself.

We are blessed to have this level of enjoyment.

Yes, I look forward to the ZLC in March (estimated delivery~where I sit in the que).

Till then, with these Mod's continuing to season and the ZBIT needing its time......all good.

Meaning: Classic Chris Robinson light it up ....the Mod's improved this too!
Got to have a good vintage Class A Pre for all Rock.

Jazz ....still get the closest Direct; that has made a leap too, with the Mod's.

Lon, referring to your enjoyment of the ZPTRE and CSP3 in the same signal path... and as you mentioned, you would think it wouldn't sound as good since introducing more components and cables in the signal path generally wrecks it,...  but it does : ).  It's like each tube stage is channeling the true intent of the recording through magical interpretation and it's cumulative.

Those who just tuned-in, when you look at a tube stage, specifically a triode which is what we are using, the tube itself has only three elements.  A high voltage plate, which is large with lots of surface area... a small heated cathode centered inside the plate emitting electrons once it gets hot, and a fine wire screen grid between the two that carries a small electrical charge - the signal - causing the electron flow between the cathode and the plate to very with the music. This means that the signal entering the tube is only operating a "shutter" that modulates the flow of electrons between the cathode and plate of the tube just a a window shutter can modulate the amount of light that enters a room.

If the signal is only operating the "shutter", then the electrons you "hear" are actually coming from the cathode and being collected on the plate and on to the next stage where the process repeats itself. Each time this process repeats itself it can either preserve, repair or diminish the fidelity of the original signal that started the domino-effect through the amplifier's various stages.  In this case as Lon describes, it does the best of the three, it repairs. Repairing outranks preserving.

Someone might wonder why they never read about this stuff anywhere else, and it's because the subject is reserved for only those audio products which are designed around transparency, like the whole Decware line as an example ; )

Getting back to the "shutter" analogy,  the Anniversary mods are about matching the signal capacitor feeding each stage with a plate-bypass capacitor of the exact same type.  In this case we use rather pricey cyro-treated beeswax caps from Jupiter Condenser, that go for between $40 and $90 for each cap. To put that in perspective the original Zen Triode Amplifiers used a very sought after green chicklet-sized polyester film cap that cost 18 cents each in 1991. So you can image how expensive it is to put one of these new beeswax caps on the plate of each stage but this is the only way you can be sure the speed and characteristics of the signal cap and the plate cap exactly match each other and therefor reproduce the signal through the stage with great resolution.

Additionally, these have to be backed up by even larger values which more than doubles the price for each stage. The reason for this is because the main filter caps in high voltage tube amps from Decware are large 47uf 500V German F&T electrolytic caps.  High frequencies require faster access to pluses of power from the cap.  Smaller value caps are faster than larger value caps. Getting cap values that compliment the bass, the midrange and the treble is what makes everything magical.  So we take the 47uf which are then bypassed down with a large film cap, usually around 3.3uf, and then either a .47 beeswax film cap, or a .33 high voltage film cap, followed by the .1uf that matches the signal cap. In some cases the speed is further enhanced by using a .022 beeswax cap, like in the headphone section of the CSP325 as an example.

Besides resolution, focus, dynamics and a haunting realness to the music, you will find the item just has more nuts.  A lot more.

Again bit's and pieces of this are no doubt scattered throughout this thread, but for those who don't like to read or can't remember, I thought I would summarize it agin hear since it is responsible for breaking the long held audio rule that a shorter signal path always sounds better... ; )

Steve

Steve,

Thanks from me also. I've read probably a hundred hours or more trying to learn more and comprehend how this all works and fits together. You brought it to me in what less than what, 700 words? I can't honestly say I have any understanding of how those electrons actually work, but then I struggle with Hot/Neutral/Ground in my breaker box.
 I got a "feel" for Mod and Cap stuff so I'm going to be content with that for now.
 I can't wait to start burning in the MKIV mods with the new ZTPRE and ZRock2 25th. I have no doubt the next few months and beyond will hold some great listening for me.
 It's amazing that the whole family of DecWare equipment that is already out there can be converted into totally new models basically by simply having them updated and modded. All new gear without the financial strain of selling an old and buying "new". Pretty cool, allowing people to purchase any of it without and have a clear path forward with the same stuff!
 OK, done, just a satisfied customer rattling on...

Best,
Scott

Steve,
First off, Thank You
 I was blown away yesterday when I called Sarah about another matter (her doing me a favor) she knew the amp had just come in and you were going to get to me about it, she went to check with you and came back and said you had both hands in there was working on it. My response was...no problem don’t bother him.
 I first off had this feeling, it’s going to be working just fine when you get it, even though we spent all that time on the phone trying to pinpoint something.
Don't forget, it also came in for the 25th mods with my original problem of blown fuses because of a bad rectifier tube!
 I agree with your assessment on Father Murphy, with me they have a Double Feature already in the can and are working on a sequel.
 I would challenge anyone to find a vendor that offers the kind of service and assistance that you do. It amazes me to think that it has been only 9 months since we had our first discussion on the phone and I ordered the Torii MKIV and then the ZBIT. What a great experience and it's only just beginning for me. I remember hanging up the phone not 100% sure what the heck I was getting into, not knowing how lucky I was to have ended up in the hands of someone who actually gives a shit (you) and how different it may have come out had the folks at ZU not recommended I look into DecWare!
  I now will be punching UPS tracking on the MKIV and the ZTPRE which apparently is waiting for the big brown truck.
Thanks Again.

Best,
Scott

Great Day INDEED!

I'm breaking in some new fuses and this has led to more tube-rolling.

I have had Audio Magic Super fuses in my ZTPRE and ZROCK2 for some time and I decided to complete the complement by adding them to my CSP3-25 and SE84UFO3 25th Anniversary Monoblocks. (Furutech fuses resided there beforehand). These fuses take about 100 hours to be all they can be and I'm about halfway through and they're stabilizing. They make a very very black background and heighten all the spatial aspects of the sound and the frequency balance shifts as they burn in. So I shouldn't roll tubes while they do so, but I do because it helps me get a handle on how they are influencing the components.

I have been playing around with a tube type Johnny suggested to me, 6N6P, and have a matched pair I've been using in the Monoblocks and the CSP3-25. Very nice tubes, but ultimately at least so far they fall behind the Amperex 7308s I've been using especially with the recorded sound of piano--the Amperex have a more complex, natural playback. And searching in my boxes of tubes I found a trio of Valvo E288CC tubes I used to use in my CSP2+ and popped those into the CSP3-25. This is a great fit. With Amperex 7308 in the Monoblocks--the resulting sound has focus and a very natural sound and is perhaps the most "holographic" that the amps have delivered (that's the fuses at work).

You just can't get bored with the 25th Anniversary Experience just a flick of a few switches away. You can roll tubes and tailor til you drop. Fascinating components.

You can only use the short ones. 3 amp as outlined in the manual.

You can use either I believe. I have always used slow.

yeeee haaa!!!!

I just "upgraded" my order from SE84UFO2 to the 25th with Zrock 2 plus mods. I hope to have it by Friday!! :: . LOL.

CSP3 in house after RCA repair, of coarse had the 25th anniversary mod done while in the repair shop..
I’ve had 3 - 4 days with it so far (approx 35 hours)..
First impressions,
1st) The Sound stage changed, ..?
Yea I know, I wasn’t expecting that..
With my ZMF headphones, the sound stage had a kind of “rainbow effect” to it , putting the singer/ center stage 2” above my head and the far right and left channels would wrap around to my ears..
NOW the singer/ center stage is inside my head , making a more Flat / even stage from ear to ear..!!
On the main speakers,
 Very similarly, the sound stage center had moved .. I would estimate that center image had moved approximately 3” - 6”  downward  from where it used to project from before ..!!
This in turn makes placement and separation of instruments more realistic and satisfying to me..

2nd) Most noticeable aspect to me is ,
 The smallest details are more prominent, making the volume level between all of the frequency’s more even across the board..

Happy Camper over here..

You guys are giving me gear envy....ugh.

Congrats on all the new gear and mods!

Thanks JOMAN, I'm second or third from the bottom of the Q so I got a while to go. I sent my UFO2 in for mods to help with the wait.
 I knew it was now or never for the 25th and life is too short to always be wondering "what if?". I think once the wife gets a taste, she will understand.