I'm starting this thread because I've been exchanging PMs with Urbs who is close to getting a Decware Amp, a Rachael, but is now having doubts after someone has told him that the Music he listens to most...Rock and Country...is not suited to Tube Amps and that he should buy a SS Amp.  I've told him he should not order his Racheal until he is 100 % sure.  I've advised him to speak to Steve and do more reading .

I thought I'd throw out this question to those who listen to more Rock than I.  Help this confused music lover with some of your experiences...Lon, Syd, Acetone, Lonely Raven, Pal and all the rest...set this Boy straight. I don't care if he ends up buying a SS Amp,  I just don't want it to be because he was misinformed.

I'm going to copy part of his latest PM and my complete response, below. Come on boys, let's rally behind Urbs.  Mark.

"I'm getting confused Mark.  I listen to a lot of Rock and Roll.  New old even some heavy stuff.  I also listen to old ass country 60's-80's the best.  I like a lot of different stuff to be honest.  Having said that someone asked me what I listen too the most.  I said rock and roll.  This particular person feels that my listening taste does not suit tubes.  They feel that I'm a gadget guy like the idea of tubes but my music flavor isn't tube flavor.  Do tubes only appeal to the classic, jazz, contemporary type music?"

My reply..."So I would assume the guy you talked to hasn't heard a Decware Amp and uses a Sand Amp setup with multi-driver speakers with crossovers.  I think you should hold off on ordering a new amp until you are 100% sure.  Do some more reading.  The person you talked to may be thinking of the thick, slow and syrupy Push Pull tube Amps of the past.  Decware Amps are Clean, Transparent and Fast.  Steve himself listens mostly to Rock, I think. Read some reviews of various Decware Amps, you'll see the reviewers are listening to a variety of Music.  I think you should talk to Steve and tell him your concerns.  He doesn't want a customer to return an Amp, so he'll tell you exactly what he thinks.  I think the return rate is less than 3%.

Lon and I post the most on the "What's Spinning" thread and he listens to lots of Classical at his Dad's house and Jazz or Rock at his apartment.  I like Jazz (80%), Rock/Blues (17%) and Classical (3%) but if you scroll through the thread you'll see a lot of Rock and Blues.  I would guess most people on the forum listen to Rock but don't post as much as Lon and I.

I think the Zu Audio products are marketed to the Rock crowd but believe me they work great with all music.  Remember this hobby is a Marathon not a Sprint so it's ok to take it slow. I'm sure there are some SS amps that sound very good, some here have second or third systems with a SS amp. So if you do go the SS route, it wouldn't be a big deal.  I would just hate for you to never have experienced tubes as Steve at Decware does them.  Mark."

Mark makes a very good point in that a lot of perception of persons are either of the old "thick and rich" school of tube amps, or the high end SET amps from 300B and 245 etc. tubes. Their perceptions aren't even accurate in most instances for those type of amps, and the Decware amps are nothing like they may think they are.

As Mark notes I am mostly listening to classical with my Dad and jazz and a bit of other genres at home. I don't listen to a lot of rock but when I do I don't feel "cheated" at all, the Torii amps are definitely capable of rocking out and with the right speakers the 2 watt amps can be scary with rock. My fiancee mostly listens to country old and new (I'm quite tolerant of it though it's not my favorite flavor) and the 2 watt amp I have in her system pairs really well with her speakers to produce really vivid acoustic guitars, fiddles, pedal steel, Teles and more. These amps will do any music proud if matched properly and set up right

So continue with your investigations and keep thinking of Decware.

And by the way. . . ask many rock persons what sort of instrument amp they'd like, tube or solid state?

Urbs,

Tubes can't rock? HA! Bring whoever told you that over here. We'll tie him to the listening chair and rock him until he says, "Uncle! Uncle Steve!".

I listen to primarily rock/blues/r&b/Motown. I have an older Torii (MK 2.5) now, but I've had some of Steve's smaller amps here, as well as tube amps from other companies, and I could and can get all I need out of the music. As a matter of fact, I've never enjoyed playback as much as I have since I discovered tube amps about 7 years ago.

If you can swing it, a listening pilgrimage to Decware would be worth your time. I went for the first time in the summer of 2010, and it made a believer out of me. Now I can't imagine not having some Decware sweetness in my stable.

Good luck in your audio journey.

Randy

Urbs
I had the Rachael and returned it for the Torii mk3. To this day I think it was a poor decision. I have Zu Audio Omen Def and it sounded great. I just felt I needed more, yet I didn't. Actually I want to eventually get another one. By the way I primarily listen to rock and a bit of jazz.

I think you may have "information overload."  It is very difficult to test SS, tube amps and speaker combinations.  There is just too many to choose from. If you decide on Decware and a speaker, just settle in and give it time.  Time!  Listen to the music and not the equipment.

See Urbs,  I told you the fellas here would help out.  I'll keep an eye out for a slightly used ZP3. I recently got Greg12 into a current model with bee's wax caps just like mine...$1395 plus shipping from Decware...for $995.  I think he's happy. https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1423664351

All my Amps, ZP3 and CSP3 were purchased new but I'm not opposed to a good deal on used gear as long as you understand the down side.  Before I got the ZP3 I was using a DJ Art Phono Pre for a short time.  It's dirt cheap and sounds good...no where near the ZP3 but it will let you enjoy your LPs without wasting money better saved for the ZP3 down the road.  For less than 50 bucks, it's simply incredible. I bought mine from Sweetwater...great customer service and free shipping on all orders.  Read about it and of course read some reviews...this one's a no brainer if you already decided on the Rachel.  Why waste a penny more on gear that will end up in the closet soon anyway.  But please understand the DJ Art won't let your Zu Souls and Rachel reveal their best...for that you need to join the big boys with the ZP3 for Vinyl. Read about it on the site.  This forum has decades of info...a great resource, use it!  Mark.

PS...I forgot,  I bought my 2008 Zen Signature Monoblocks used from a Decware member that just showed up on the forum a few minutes ago.

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/DeeJayPre

Once I bought my first Decware amp in '97. . . I've tried other brands now and then, and had to use one for a while when I sent one Decware amp in. . . . There's no real substitute for me, Decware amp all the way, all the time available, in each system.

Congrats on the Rachel order!

Ah, it's a natural then! Rachel . . . Rachel is going to be predisposed to like it.

A beautiful name too, a truly Biblical name.

Well, I'm coming up on two decades since I first heard of Decware and talked to Steve on the phone. . . and bought the 27th amp he ever made. It's been an interesting and expensive journey! I love my system. . .it's my pride and joy and I know you're on the start of your journey and will soon have a pride and joy of your own.

Urbs- I have had my Rachael and ZP3 since last October, they are well broken in by now. Last Thursday I received my Omega 7XRS speakers, hooked them up and gave a short listen before leaving for the evening. My wife listened to a few CD's and some TV. Friday I had the cd on repeat and the amp on all day, so be Friday night we had almost 20 hours. I came home and listened to all kinds of records (Old Genesis, Porcupine Tree, Fixx, Johnny Cash, Yes, Jeff Beck) and then Saturday they cooked all day while I was painting up stairs. My wife and I did another listening fest Saturday. YES  Decware can ROCK but it goes way beyond that. Until I got my single driver, crossover less speakers I was not hearing my Rachael to  her best. Decware is in a class by it's self and those who hear it for the first time get it, and get it good. Happy listening, Chris...can't wait until I get home because we are now getting near 50 hours on the speakers.