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DEX-pona (Read 56674 times)
Palomino
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DEX-pona
03/12/15 at 13:09:04
 
Anybody planning on going to Axpona?  Raven and I will probably go on Saturday.  I thought it might be fun for some Decwarians to meet up to peruse the offerings.
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Lonely Raven
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #1 - 03/12/15 at 13:57:48
 

IN! Oh wait, you mentioned me already...oh crap, I just realized in my meeting this afternoon we are discussing a business trip for training in April. I hope the days don't overlap!

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ProggRob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #2 - 03/12/15 at 17:22:29
 
Hey guys, I'm new to the forum but I joined the Decware club last April (SE84CKCS).  I live in Naperville and Saturday is my birthday, so I'm definitely going and would like to join you so long as I can grab some birthday beers at some point.  I also have a friend who recently purchased a Rachael that is interested too.  Let me know!

Rob
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Baetis Revolution II -> HFC CT-1E Digital Cable -> Denefrips Terminator -> Black Cat Setsuna XLR -> LTA Ultralinear Integrated -> Black Cat Setsuna SC -> Betsy Alnicos
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ProggRob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #3 - 03/12/15 at 17:24:55
 
And yes, I still celebrate my own birthday.  ;)
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Baetis Revolution II -> HFC CT-1E Digital Cable -> Denefrips Terminator -> Black Cat Setsuna XLR -> LTA Ultralinear Integrated -> Black Cat Setsuna SC -> Betsy Alnicos
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Palomino
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #4 - 03/12/15 at 22:12:21
 
Love to have you.  You are also invited to join CDaPs (Chicago Decware Appreciation Society).  We are at record membership, but can probably squeeze in a few members.

If enough people are going to Axpona, I may try to have something at my house afterwards (I am in Lisle near Benet Academy).  Maybe Raven can wrangle the a Decware Direct Stream to demo out of Steve for the weekend.

This would, of course, have to be sanctioned by the high command at the Palamino house.
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ProggRob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #5 - 03/12/15 at 22:19:57
 
Sounds like fun!  I am not far from there at all, near Washington and 75th.  As we get closer let's arrange a time and place to meet and share contact details.

I'm considering a DAC upgrade and it is between the forthcoming Schiit Yggdrasil and the Decware DSD.  An audition would be amazing.

Rob
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Baetis Revolution II -> HFC CT-1E Digital Cable -> Denefrips Terminator -> Black Cat Setsuna XLR -> LTA Ultralinear Integrated -> Black Cat Setsuna SC -> Betsy Alnicos
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Palomino
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #6 - 03/12/15 at 22:22:18
 
I have a Schitt Bifrost Uber if you want to give it a whirl.  Might give you an idea of the family sound.  Is Yggdrasil their long awaited "statement" DAC?
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ProggRob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #7 - 03/12/15 at 22:51:09
 
Palomino, I have had the Bifrost, Bifrost Uber, and now Gungnir.  I have a pretty good hold on their "house sound"!  :)  The Yggdrasil is their statement and supposedly will be released by end of March (last I read) but it has been rife with delays so who knows.  Schiit and Decware are two companies I have mad respect for so choosing between their DACs is like trying to pick between chocolate and vanilla; love them both.
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Baetis Revolution II -> HFC CT-1E Digital Cable -> Denefrips Terminator -> Black Cat Setsuna XLR -> LTA Ultralinear Integrated -> Black Cat Setsuna SC -> Betsy Alnicos
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Power: TWL 7+ and Digital, UberBUSS, Furutech Outl
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Palomino
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #8 - 03/12/15 at 22:56:42
 
My Chord DAC might be good to listen to as well.  It bested the Bifrost Uber by a good margin.  Stone-of-tone says the Direct Stream bested the Chord though...but I would maintain he needed a linear power supply on the Chord to make the final judgment!

Lonely Raven also has a PS Audio Direct Stream which I have liked as well.  Maybe some time we could get together for a dac-comparo.
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ProggRob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #9 - 03/13/15 at 00:55:39
 
Another great idea!  I can do this anytime just need a couple weeks notice.  I have two young kids (2 and 4) that dictate schedules.  What are your speakers, Palomino?
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Baetis Revolution II -> HFC CT-1E Digital Cable -> Denefrips Terminator -> Black Cat Setsuna XLR -> LTA Ultralinear Integrated -> Black Cat Setsuna SC -> Betsy Alnicos
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Lonely Raven
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #10 - 03/13/15 at 04:19:43
 

Is it bad that I'm really excited about another Decware owner 15 minutes away from me?

Seriously, we need to get together. Palomino has his room and gear tweaked out really well and continues to improve it (with considerable enabling from me).

My room is OK, but it's not a dedicated room, so it's far from what it could be...though my new diffusers...   Wink

So yeah, we should really have a meet up way before Axpona.

Speaking of which, back on point - my training doesn't overlap Axpona so I'm good for that weekend.

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ProggRob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #11 - 03/13/15 at 13:47:44
 
Well I don't know about Palomino but I welcome enablers in my life!  I seriously eat, sleep and breath music and audio.  

I have a dedicated room in my basement tweaked to the nth degree.  I'm sure it's not perfect since all of my achievements were born in a vacuum independent of any experienced audiophile (I started audio on a whim in late 2011), but rather 1500+ of hours of personal Internet research over the last 3.5 years.

So yeah, I'm pumped too and there's nothing wrong with that!  Any bonafide audiophile would do but Decware owners are special.  Why?  Because we know what no one else does... can't do much better!

Whatever and whenever you guys want to meet is fine, and I'll throw my house in as a potential.

Rob

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Baetis Revolution II -> HFC CT-1E Digital Cable -> Denefrips Terminator -> Black Cat Setsuna XLR -> LTA Ultralinear Integrated -> Black Cat Setsuna SC -> Betsy Alnicos
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Palomino
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #12 - 03/13/15 at 14:25:06
 
Avoid Raven.  Your life and bank account will never be the same  ;D
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Palomino
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #13 - 03/13/15 at 14:57:49
 
He starts out innocent enough..."check out my modded Zen amp, Nice, sound, huh?"

The next thing you know, he putting a P10 power supply in your system and blowing your mind with a ZMA (insert evil laugh here).

You wake up one day and you have 3 Decware amps, 4 sets of speakers a room lined with sound treatments and you're frothing at the mouth building QRD13 diffusers in you garage on the weekends.

it's a downward spiral...
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ProggRob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #14 - 03/13/15 at 14:59:30
 
That's progress, my friend.  Onward and upward!
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tlarwa
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #15 - 03/13/15 at 15:58:41
 
As the 3rd member, former Naperville-ian, and the lone WI representative of the CDaPs, I am in for AXPONA on Saturday as well.  My buddy is coming with me too.  And oh yeah, I have a dedicated listening room as well  ;D  None of that digital malarky for me though ... it's all analog, all the time.

Palomino, get a new chair yet?
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Lonely Raven
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #16 - 03/13/15 at 16:24:51
 
Quote:
have a dedicated room in my basement tweaked to the nth degree.  I'm sure it's not perfect since all of my achievements were born in a vacuum independent of any experienced audiophile (I started audio on a whim in late 2011), but rather 1500+ of hours of personal Internet research over the last 3.5 years.


Yeah, you and I will get a long just fine!

Quote:
Posted by: Palomino      Posted

Avoid Raven.  Your life and bank account will never be the same  ;D

He starts out innocent enough..."check out my modded Zen amp, Nice, sound, huh?"

The next thing you know, he putting a P10 power supply in your system and blowing your mind with a ZMA (insert evil laugh here).

You wake up one day and you have 3 Decware amps, 4 sets of speakers a room lined with sound treatments and you're frothing at the mouth building QRD13 diffusers in you garage on the weekends.

it's a downward spiral...
Posted by: Palomino      Posted on: Today at 08:25:06


You have no idea how proud this makes me - I'm giggling like a schoolgirl over here.  ;D
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ProggRob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #17 - 03/13/15 at 18:44:39
 
Ok, well we need to arrange a time now.  I'm thirsty for a DAC-off.  Is there an initiation or hazing process to join CDAPS?
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Palomino
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #18 - 03/13/15 at 20:30:08
 
I can't do this weekend - MUST FINISH DIFFUSERS.

Maybe next weekend.  I could even host.

In terms of the initiation right, you do own a black, hooded robe, right?
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beowulf
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #19 - 03/13/15 at 21:44:01
 
Quote:
Palomino said,
He starts out innocent enough..."check out my modded Zen amp, Nice, sound, huh?"

The next thing you know, he putting a P10 power supply in your system and blowing your mind with a ZMA (insert evil laugh here).

You wake up one day and you have 3 Decware amps, 4 sets of speakers a room lined with sound treatments and you're frothing at the mouth building QRD13 diffusers in you garage on the weekends.

it's a downward spiral...


Haha ... I almost snorted beer through my nose when I read this! Grin
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Dave1210
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #20 - 03/14/15 at 23:19:59
 
Hey Guys...my buddy and I will be going to Axpona.  We are driving up from Cincy and will be staying by the airport and going to the show all 3 days.  

BTW...my buddy just joined the Decware family.  He recently ordered a Torii to drive his Zu speakers.

Would be great to meet up!
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Palomino
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #21 - 03/15/15 at 16:44:32
 
Ok we'll figure out a place/time to meet.

Rob, left you a VM.  We are getting together today at 1:00 if you want to come by.  Give a call and I'll give you directions.
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Palomino
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #22 - 03/16/15 at 20:55:32
 
Raven did come over Sunday and brought a bunch of diffusers and helped me figure out a software issue I was having that was harshing my sound (and my mellow).

Room sounds pretty good now.  Three 24X48 diffusers up front, two on the side at the secondary reflection points and 1-2 in the back.

We experimented by swapping out my two, recently built QRD13 diffusers for my old "curved" sound scatterers.  Soundstage completely collapsed.  Definitely sold me on the value of real QRD diffusers.  Also showed that even though mine are a home build, they do indeed enhance the sound.

Rob, we'll catch you before Dex-pona.  I think my room is sensitive enough now to show DAC differences for sure.
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Lonely Raven
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #23 - 03/16/15 at 23:38:36
 
Quote:
I was having that was harshing my sound (and my mellow).


And this is why we get a long...I totally get this phrase.


I was amazed at how swapping out those two QRD diffusers we designed and you built simply collapsed the sound.

I'm glad that we also hear the improvement of Micro Detail and Dynamics that I caught at my place( before I mucked up my sound field moving things around).

Now we just need you foaming at the mouth while building a couple more pairs of QRD 13, tear down all the crap on your front wall and replace it with absorbers/diffusers, take some measurements, and design some nice helmholtz bass traps! Easy Peazy! LOL



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ProggRob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #24 - 03/17/15 at 05:39:14
 
Man, I am really bummed I didn't make it over!  Sounds like you guys did some serious work.  I instead got to watch my team lose in OT.  Sound treatments would have been more fun.

I'll have to come up with a list of "problems" to troubleshoot just in case I get you guys into my listening room!!  I do have various GIK panels I move around.  There are two corner traps on the front wall and two 244 bass traps in the rear right corner; the rear left is open to another room.  I float around two other 244 panels with built in scatter plates and haven't decided where to put them.  I waffle on what I think sounds best, because sometimes I feel like putting them at first reflection points sucks out too much treble energy.  The sound is definitely more focused and tight, but perhaps a bit duller.  I guess I need to bring in the experts Wink
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Lonely Raven
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #25 - 03/17/15 at 16:50:08
 
We're not experts by any stretch - but here is our methodology that seems to work pretty well.

Typically we go in blind. I'll pop over to Palo's house, and he'll plop me in the hot-seat and just play some pre-queued tracks. Then he'll look at me expectantly. I say the first thing that comes to mind - for example, when he finally got his room balanced with absorbers and psudo-diffusers, I said "the reverb in the recording is contiguous". His words were "I now have a wall of sound", but we meant the same thing. The soundfield was connected left to right, and you could hear the *room* that the recording was made in, more than the room we were sitting in. It was a huge leap for his system, and it was exactly what he was hoping I'd hear - no prompting, no hints, just set me down and let me say the first thing that comes out. Steve has taught me to trust my instincts and trust myself - I tend to be right far more often if I'm not second guessing myself or keeping my thoughts to myself.

The other method we do, say one of us brings a new piece of equipment over to try out. We listen to a couple well known tracks on the current system as a reference (whatever  system that may be), then we introduce the new gear and we each take the hot seat for a couple songs. At the end we compare notes. I'd say 80% of the time we say pretty much the same thing. I might say the treble is etched, Palo might say treble is harsh. But we both spot a problem with treble (for example) being the key.

If we find a problem we work backwards from there. In this most recent case, something was off in Palomino's playback software (we were afraid it was a hardware issue). Once we got that figured out, the system was crushingly good.

I understand acoustical concepts and the gear pretty well, Palo is really good at actually implementing my ideas. It helps that he has a dedicated room to focus on. I've also heard some amazing sound before, mostly at Decware - so I have some high reference stored away in my head and each time we get a small step closer to that reference sound. Someday I hope to supersede that Reference Sound I heard at Steve's place 17 or so years ago. I have the gear, that's for sure, I just need the room!

Even with all the books I've read, and brilliant people I've followed in forums, I think I learn the most from our CDAPS meets where we listen and try to wrangle out the best sound we can with the gear we have, and just bouncing ideas off each other. So we welcome more people and more rooms into the fold - it's only going to help us all in the long run.

And yes, I'm the Enabler Extraordinaire  :)
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Palomino
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #26 - 03/17/15 at 17:27:00
 
+1

It really helps to have somebody to listen and verify.  I didn't want to bias Raven coming in this past weekend, but I knew I had an issue.  I may have given a hint saying that I "have a good soundstage going, but I have other issues," but that was it.  He listened and I believe his eloquent descriptor was "sounds like crap."  Then we worked to fix it.

On another occasion, he had a pair of speakers he bought and really wanted to keep, but had an issue with them.  He didn't tell me anything and I sat down and after one song told him those speakers, while more expensive, took him backwards.  He agreed and that was that.

We'd love to get your opinions as well.
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ProggRob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #27 - 03/17/15 at 18:05:58
 
Well, I have a lot of opinions.  Unfortunately I have had no one to share them with, so it plays out as sort of an inner monologue.  A 2nd (or 3rd) opinion would be nice.  

It's really weird (and a bit unnerving) for me to think of it, really, the potential of experienced audiophiles listening to my system.  I think I previously stated I have 1500+ hrs of research under my belt.  I assure you it's far more than that.  The end result of all this time and money is something I'm completely astounded by (**pats self on back**).  But, plopping someone down in the hot seat and waiting for an opinion would be the longest 10 mins of my life!  

I'm still pissed I missed Sunday.  When's the next one?

Rob
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Baetis Revolution II -> HFC CT-1E Digital Cable -> Denefrips Terminator -> Black Cat Setsuna XLR -> LTA Ultralinear Integrated -> Black Cat Setsuna SC -> Betsy Alnicos
Bass: 4x Hawthorne Augies w/ 2 Rythmik amps
Power: TWL 7+ and Digital, UberBUSS, Furutech Outl
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Palomino
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #28 - 03/17/15 at 18:32:43
 
Yeah, it can be brutal.  Especially if you are not expecting it.

I don't know when the next meeting will be.  I am out of town next weekend.  Maybe we come to your place to hear your room the weekend after next?  We usually do Sunday Afternoons.  Definitely before Axpona.

tlarwa, I just saw your post.  We'll need to figure out a time to meet up.

No chair yet.  I prefer to be as uncomfortable as possible when listening.  I don't want to lose my edge Wink
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Palomino
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #29 - 03/18/15 at 22:12:03
 
So many exhibitors, so little time.

Dave, any suggested speaker companies?  Some of the usual suspects there.  Any gems?
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Lonely Raven
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #30 - 03/19/15 at 00:27:43
 

If we can, I'd like to spend a little more time in the $100k and up rooms than we have in the past. They seem to have more space and seem to be able to get away with more in the room. I still believe our systems smoke most of what's at Axpona, so I'd like to sample some "half the cost of my house" systems and see what we might be missing (if anything).

I'd like to stop by and say HI to Paul at PS Audio room (assuming they are there), and check out the Zu Audio speakers again now that I have a better understand of them. Plus that McIntosh/Logan room was pretty impressive sounding last year - I'd like to see if they can pull that off again.

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Dave1210
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #31 - 03/19/15 at 01:26:40
 
Pal...below is my list of speakers...
-Audio Kinesis
-Vapor Audio
-Salk Signature Sound
-Acoustic Zen
-Daedalus Audio
-Legacy Audio
-Zu Audio
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beowulf
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #32 - 03/19/15 at 01:33:37
 
Can I add a couple more ...

  • Harbeth ~ models = 40.1 or 30.1 or Super HL5 Plus (I know these aren't very efficient, but I have heard lots of good things about these).
  • Salk Sound ~ models = Exotica
  • Volti ~ any model Wink
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Dave1210
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #33 - 03/19/15 at 01:34:30
 
Great adds Beowulf!
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beowulf
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #34 - 03/19/15 at 03:14:39
 
@ Dave, those Audio Kinesis have some trippy designs ... I would love to check those out!
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ProggRob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #35 - 03/19/15 at 05:45:23
 
I agree on the Audio Kinesis.  Love the way they look!  I'd like to see Volti as well, which may be paired with Border Patrol and Triode Wire Labs.  Triode Pete is a great guy and I have a lot of his stuff.  

Last year I hit up the High Water Sound room and didn't know until afterward how many fans Jeff Catalano has.  Definitely the coolest exhibitor at the show.  Would like to give his room another shot assuming he's there.

Agree with LR on the megabuck rooms.  When I went into the Constellation/Kharma room last year I felt like I had just met a celebrity....  Totally starstruck by those Constellation monos.
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #36 - 03/19/15 at 06:14:15
 
@ ProgRobb ~ +1!  You guys have to check out High Water Sound!  They carry a bevy of exotic tube friendly speakers and cool stuff.

Horning Hybrid, Cessaro, etc.
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #37 - 04/03/15 at 20:29:50
 
Hey All- if you check the AXPONA website you can see which exhibitors are in which rooms, but you can't see it the other way around.  Doesn't make sense to me, so I put together a file that shows exhibitors by room.  See attached.

Rob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #38 - 04/14/15 at 05:42:30
 
Bump.  For anyone going to AXPONA check out my previous post.  This may help navigate the show a bit better.
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #39 - 04/14/15 at 11:19:34
 
I'd expect we will have a flurry of activity closer to the date.  I'd like to see if we can coordinate a meetup.  I am just not on top of the audio market the way you guys are and figure I can learn a thing or two following you around.
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #40 - 04/22/15 at 18:08:44
 
OK, its closer to the date.  

Rob, Raven and I will be meeting up and getting there around the time the show opens on Saturday.  Rob is our tour guide as he knows the gear vendors well and has his handy spreadsheet goin'.

I think it would be fun to meet up and compare notes like over lunch or something.  Dave, I will shoot you my cell phone number via PM.  tlarwa, you should have it already but I will send again.

Anybody else, let me know.
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #41 - 04/24/15 at 23:36:33
 
So I have visited the web sites of the suggested speaker manufacturers.  So far Daedalus has my highest level of interest.  Sensitivity + craftsmanship.  I'll look for some reviews.
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #42 - 04/24/15 at 23:39:59
 
They are beautiful.  I can't wait to hear Daedelus.
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #43 - 04/25/15 at 22:14:42
 
Palomino, Raven and I are having a post-show beer and recapping what we heard.  I'm going to do my best of list later this evening, and Raven might play the snarky side and do his worst of.  More to come.
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #44 - 04/26/15 at 13:31:08
 
Well we did a quick spin through Axpona but don't think we cheated ourselves in any way.  I will wait for Raven and Rob to wax more poetically about what we heard, but I'll offer a few thoughts and paste a particle list of good dynamic music we heard.

For me, basically there were two rooms that really engaged me.  First was the Volti room running boarder patrol amps and the second was the harbeth room running Vinnie Rossi's new all-in-one, I guess I'd call it.  Both these rooms produced real music for me.

Lots of jazz played and a fair amount of the familiar stuff but I did pick up a dozen or so tracks that I later got from iTunes.  Despite being MP3s they sounded pretty good last night after dinner.



Unfortunately, we did not link up with any fellow Decwarians except Ivar, who I have met at the last two Decfests.  This was just in passing as we were walking down the hall.  He shared our enthusiasm for the harbeth and volt rooms.

My final thought after spending the day listening to high end stuff is that ladies and gentlemen, hug your Decware amp tonight before your go to bed tonight.  You are blessed to have such a great amp.
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #45 - 04/26/15 at 15:35:15
 
Good Morning Everyone,

As promised, I'm going to do my "best of", but I'm also in the mood to do a "worst of/biggest disappointments" list.  First, I want to point out the prevalence of bass issues.  Seriously, with all these genius audio minds can't anyone figure out a way to eliminate this?  EVERY ROOM had room boom, with few exceptions.  The rooms that seemed to handle it best also happen to be on my "best of" list.  After a couple rooms I had to try to evaluate systems outside of this issue, trying to pretend like it wasn't happening.

Without further ado:

Best Of
1. Pure Audio Project / Grant Fidelity Room

I guess there should be no surprise in it for me as a proud OB speaker owner, but this room really took the cake for me.  Open sound, well balanced and no bass issues!  They sounded more coherent than my Hawthornes due to the full-range 8" Tang Band driver, and had me dreaming of inserting a full-ranger into my baffles one day.  Tom and Eric had already decided how they were going to build a pair by the time we got back to our cars.  Speakers were $3,500 and the Grant Fidelity amp was also $3500.  Cheapest room at the show?  If not it might have been awfully close.  As they turned up the volume, the sound just got better unlike any other room.  To top it off, they played my Porcupine Tree request.  Bravo!  

2. Volti Audio / Border Patrol / Triode Wire Labs

They didn't play music that I like and there was a tiny bit of boom here, but my God, the realism and tone were just awesome.  I don't think any other design can compete with horns in this area.  Are the Voltis worth $25k?  I think you can come damn close for far less, but in absolute terms I didn't hear anything yesterday that could compete.  In general I preferred the horn systems to your typical box.  I also felt the Classic Audio room had potential but it didn't beat the Voltis.

3. Harbeth / Vinnie Rossi

I thought about putting this room above the Volti Room based on price-to-performance factors, but overall I feel it belongs here.  Vinnie Rossi has a place in my heart due to my ownership of a Red Wine Audio Signature 15 early in my audio career.  I was surprised to learn yesterday he is abandoning electronics under this moniker and taking his new self-titled project forward, and I can hear why!  His all-in-one box really did everything well and paired wonderfully with the Harbeth HL5s.  I had never heard Harbeths in person, but had read about their glorious midrange.  I agree with that assessment.  Buttery smooth.  I did notice a bit of truncation in the highs, but couldn't have cared less yesterday.  He also played a CDApS favorite demo track in Sara Bareilles "Yellow Brick Road" which allowed for mental comparisons to our own systems.  For a show rig, it compared very favorably!  

4. Vivid Audio / Lumin / Convergent Audio Tech

I had never heard Vivid but they have been one of the most intriguing speakers for me.  Yesterday's performance will not diminish my enthusiasm.  If I had to own one "modern sounding" speaker, the Vivid Giyas would be it.  Talk about detail, air and tonal accuracy.  In spades!  Not sure Tom and Eric were as impressed, but I was having a lot of fun in this room.

5. Merrill Audio / Sadurni

Go ahead and Google Sadurni Staccato speakers.  Now imagine them in a room about 13' - 14' wide.  Then imagine this 108db/w/m speaker being biamped with 800w of Class D power.  Yeah.  Givin the vastly undersized room I felt the organizers at Blue Smoke did really well with their demo, giving us some very cool and dynamic material from Nils Lofgren to strut these horns' stuff.  It was the best treated room at the show, with diffusers on both sides and a Hemholz resonator in the back.   Again, I think I'm alone in my love here but at least the guys got some diffuser ideas.

Worst Of

1. Zu Audio Omen Def Mk II

Sean.  Are you deaf?  Your rig sounds broken.  And on Day 2?  C'mon!!

2.  Zu Audio Druid Mk V

Sean.  Please give me one redeeming quality about what I'm hearing.  Far better than the Omen Def room, but still deserving of penultimate status as Worst Of.  At least we got some free t-shirts.

3.  Magico / Aesthetix / Clearaudio

Ok, this room didn't actually sound bad, but I cannot see why anyone would spend one-tenth of the money this system cost for this sort of performance.  Am I wrong to expect to be blown-away when I walk into a room with over $500k in components.  If I am, I like being wrong.  There was another guy walking out of another Quintessence Audio room across the hall with Dynaudio speakers, and we all heard him say "that was horrendous!".  Yeah, very disappointing, sir.

I echo Tom's statements, hug your Decware amps.  One thing was hammered home for me yesterday.  You DO NOT need to spend a FRACTION of what these systems cost for drool-worthy, I can't believe what I'm hearing sound.  This should come as no surprise to the Decware crowd, we all seem to love value.  But for me, I've never been an "anti-high end" type of guy.  Hey, I'm a capitalist.  I'm not going to sit back a spew venom  because something costs $10k, or $25k or whatever.  Vote with your wallets, people.  But I think I'm a half-step closer now to believing that even in the pricing stratosphere you need to do a lot of work to separate the wheat from the chaff.  There are some truly breathtaking components that justifiably cost gobs of money (see Volti, Vivid Audio) but in most cases I think it's a matter of catering to those with more money than patience.

But hey, the people watching was fun too!  Maybe Eric will entertain us and judge some people in his next post.

All-in-all a great birthday present to myself.  I had a blast.

Rob
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #46 - 04/26/15 at 17:05:38
 
Pishaw, make me sound all judgy. I'm not like that, I just observe and report.  :)

I agree that the big ticket rooms sounded the worst. I'm terrible with names, and I didn't keep notes, so I'll just leave the best and the worst to  the rest of the CDApS members. And for the most part I agree with you guys, except I didn't think the Druid's sounded bad. Though I have to say, trying to strike up a conversation with Sean - he came off as a dick who didn't have time for me. So I wasn't about to go out of my way and point out his Definition speaker room sounded like crap. With all that airspace and time, there really is no excuse for that! Whereas Vinnie Rossi was humble, appreciative, and just a joy to talk to. Reminded me a lot of another one of my favorites, Paul Mcgowen.

As to the snarky side - some of my observations: I'm not sure these guys who are presenting are getting it - they take themselves way too seriously, and these younger audiophiles are just laughing at them. It's even worse to see them fumbling with technology that they are supposed to understand and be showing off. They also aren't getting the hint when more and more of the attendees are saying "please, no more slow jazz, lets here some ROCK". No, it's not a joke! We are being serious! Expand your demo selection! Make it FUN! Props to the one vendor who played some Tool once we requested something harder. I still don't think he was taking us seriously, but he was cool enough to play along. Zu Audio has always been at this level of cool; that and the fact that they make cool colors on cool looking speakers has always made them stand out for me. Their hot T-shirt girl, rubber-stamping shirts was a nice addition.  :)

My observations of the attendees this year: Pony Tails seem to be coming back into vogue. Brianne jokes that it's so the hair doesn't block the sound waves. LOL. Still, it's the same, old fat white guys (hey I resemble that remark!) with disposable income (yeah, no so much me)  were the dominant factor. Last year we saw large roving groups of middle eastern guys, but this year instead I saw groups of black folks going  from room to room. I chatted some up and they were wishing for some funk and soul to be played - they too were bored with slow jazz thing, and I wholeheartedly agreed with them. Then we had the hipster crowed with their esoteric audio related T-shirts, skinny jeans, and hot girlfriends in tow looking bored. Lastly, I saw an uptick in women audiophiles! YES! I overheard some talking, and they were just as geeky and into music and the gear as the rest of us. This is awesome to see, and I wish I had more time to chat them up.

Why do I care, and observe who attends these shows? Well, I observe because it's in my nature - but I care because diversity is good. Plus, the different groups have different needs and wants that could shape the future of audiophilia. Vinyl is *in* with the hipsters and younger generations - it's cool again. Hence lots of these great albums being (re)released in vinyl lately. Streaming and MP3 playback (for better or worse) is a result of changing demographics. So my paying attention keeps me appraised as to what's going on, and what might be going on. While I don't own an audio company or really have skin in the game, but I have friends that do. So it might be helpful if I say "hey, don't discount digital music and networking it all - it's what's "in"". That little nudge can keep them from getting left behind.

Being the absolute best Victrola designer and manufacturer is great...until Victrola aren't relevant anymore...
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #47 - 04/26/15 at 19:05:00
 
I think one reason for playing 'slow jazz' as demo material is that there's a better chance of determining accuracy using that music than electric instrument based music such as rock, funk. . . . I've heard systems that sound great with rock that sound really inaccurate with jazz and classical. . . . Guess it doesn't matter if you always listen to one style of music, but if you have a very accurate system for jazz or classical rock can still sound amazing.

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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #48 - 04/26/15 at 19:14:57
 
Thanks Tom, ProggRob an Eric. I read all of your posts here. I do appreciate your time, your ears and your thoroughness.

I am intrigued about the Pure Audio Project Trio15TB! My under hung neodymium, run in full range drivers with Mundorf's at 4.5 cross, are really blowing me away in my Adagio's. Albeit, not open baffle. So, to read this here on their site, tells me a lot about what I'm hearing in my recently modified Adagio's and about their Speakers you guys heard and were impressed with.

"- Full ranger driver: Tang Bang W8-1808 Neodymium full range driver. The W8-1808 neo full range driver incorporates a higher Qts for open baffle design. An underhung voice coil and carefully balanced paper cone contribute to smooth response with exceptionally low distortion. An ideal driver for single-ended tube amp systems".
&......."Mundorf brand brings quality. The crossover is custom designed for Trio15TB".
http://shop.grantfidelity.com/PureAudioProject-Trio15TB-Open-Baffle-Speakers-pai...

If I could pull the lever on a pair now, I would, to put up against what my Adagio's are now doing with MOD. I know the 15TB's would be keeper's too!

Next year I'm going! The last two years I've had other commitments.

***PS? I remember when Steve could no longer get Tang-bands. Is this now a different, or once again available Tang-band?***
(Nice proof reading on their site. NOT. They have Tang bang).






Listening Room:
Room Treatments from Michael Green & Home Brew
Sony as Transport ****(DVP-NS57P)****
Illuminati D-60 Digital Coax IC
Decware DSD DAC / Recorder (@ -20 Ref Level @ 16/176.4)
Kimber Select KS1030 IC RCA
Decware CSP3 w/Jupiter Caps (NOS/Platinum/Telefunken 6922/E88CC for input tube)
Kimber Select KS1030 IC RCA
Decware Zen Mystery Amplifier (NOS/Platinum/Matsushita / National PCC88 / 7DJ8 in A12 an B12 inputs)
Kimber Select KS3033 Speaker Cable
Kimber Select KS3035 Speaker Cable (rotated in)
Acoustic Zen Adagio (Modified)
~~OR~~
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Decware SE84CS (NOS Svetlana SV83's from 1980's-not the New Sensor knock-offs) ...when SE Pentodes run in Triode/Decware Style...needs to be in the System!



*****Acoustic Zen Adagio's x-over's Modified/Full Range with Mundorf MCap Supremes-on Tweets/4.5 cross
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Re: DEX-pona
Reply #49 - 04/27/15 at 07:42:23
 
Thanks guys for a great report, I really loved reading about the gear.  I'm also glad that 2 of the rooms I requested (Harbeth and Volti) got a good response as it seems like I'm on the rigt track.  Although I doubt I would ever be able to afford the Volti's unless I hit the lotto, but some Harbeth models are within reach.  I've heard it mentioned that if you like the Harbeth Super HL5 plus, the smaller 30.1's are even better (and less expensive), but you would just need to incorporate subs with them.

I remember Steve saying that the Torii wasn't a good pairing with the Harbeth's, but I would think with their spec'd sensitivity that the ZMA could rock those ... even though I've heard guys running these with some Audio Note 10 watts SETs though.

Question:
Did you guys happen to hear the Audio Note UK room?  I read on another forum that the speakers were very unimpressive for the cost.  The thing is the speakers are really hyped up on that other forum, but for some reason I just don't think they are as good as everyone says they are ... which is strange because I've never even heard them. Grin
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