Forums - tube rolling or not !

jameskk

Seasoned Member

Posts: 206

tube rolling or not !
08/13/12 at 13:53:01

I indulged my self into tube rolling my se84c+ to the tune of somewhere betwween 800 and 1000 dollars in power tubes , input tubes and rectifiers. Now it was my choice to do so and alot of fun in the process.I want to let everyone know ,especially new owners of equipment , that ,if you do this , go back to the tubes that came with the unit. somebody has real good ears out there in east peoria ,because you will get a lesson in why such tubes are in the amp,and why they were chosen . . So if you think your getting better sound with a input tube or rectifier , or a power tube , its just a comprimise . so keep the original tubes handy . make sure you listen for long periods in between also. break-in is essential!!!

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Lon

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"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 23450

Re: tube rolling or not !
Reply #1 - 08/14/12 at 15:08:07

Very good advice and observation. I think the stock tubes are great ,with the exception of the Ruby rectifiers I've received with most amps. I just can't hang with those and always replace them. And I've fallen in love with supercryo'd 6N1P tubes from cryoset.com and use those as inputs; just got another three for my upcoming CSP2+ (it's "on the bench" right now at last!)

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HR-1,ZTPRE,ZBIT,ZROCK2,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod,Taboo MkIV;Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD,P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls,Reference spkrcbls;Mapleshade SamsonV3;VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects, IsoPods; headphones:Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1

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jameskk Seasoned Member Posts: 206	Re: tube rolling or not ! Reply #2 - 08/14/12 at 16:49:17 hey you'll have to get some beyerdynamic 770 pro's to make that preamp complete. those headphones are fantastic . anyway you'll love the preamp. and just had my eyes open with the stock tubes like I said . so does the liquid nitrogen give them a better sound? molecular alignment!!!!!!?????????
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Lon

Seasoned Member

"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. Dick

Posts: 23450

Re: tube rolling or not !
Reply #3 - 08/14/12 at 17:15:03

I don't know if it's the cryogenic treatment or just the choice of tube, but these tubes sing in the Toriis I have and the preamp (I have a CSP2 in the old Zen steel chassis; I'm upgrading to the CSP2+) as no other 6N1Ps quite do, and that's my input tube of choice for my system.

I'm not a headphone fan, and won't be using the CSP2+ with headphones. I had my CSP2 built without a headphone jack, though I didn't do that with this new one. In the late 'eighties I spent a lot of time recording bands that I played in and a few others and monitored/mixed with headphones and I just plain got burned out on them. And I prefer the sonic dimensions of speakers to that different perspective on headphones. I don't ever really have to be "quiet" and listen on headphones, I don't use portable devices etc. so they're not in the rotation.

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HR-1,ZTPRE,ZBIT,ZROCK2,SEWE300B,CSP3-25mod,Taboo MkIV;Rega RP3 all GrooveTracer mods;PSAudio:PST+DSD,P15,NPC,PowerBases,AC-12 pwr cbls,Reference spkrcbls;Mapleshade SamsonV3;VooDoo:Cremona+Amati interconnects, IsoPods; headphones:Sennheiser HD800S,ZMF Ori,Oppo PM1

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Rivieraranch Seasoned Member Posts: 2126	Re: tube rolling or not ! Reply #4 - 08/15/12 at 00:00:41 Getting all jammed up with expensive tubes defeats the purpose of this gear. I believe the mission was to design gear around inexpensive unheralded tubes that sounds fantastic.
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Lon Seasoned Member "Love without guts is worthless!" Philip K. Dick Posts: 23450	Re: tube rolling or not ! Reply #5 - 08/15/12 at 01:25:16 Not sure that really was the purpose. . . .
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jameskk

Seasoned Member

Posts: 206

Re: tube rolling or not !
Reply #6 - 08/15/12 at 11:02:24

I never thought I could put together a system for this amount of money ,and get sound that rivals the best equipment out there. i smile with utmost joy when i turn my "2" watt amp on ,and be right in the room with the musicians. Hense the ZEN of it all. the unbelievable part is you can be in a different room 40 ft. away from the system and hear that great sount.uncanny........

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jameskk Seasoned Member Posts: 206	Re: tube rolling or not ! Reply #7 - 08/15/12 at 12:08:44 You two guys sound like you've done the same thing as i . Spent alot of money on tubes ,only to find small or no differences. maybe we should get a database together to alert people ,or educate people to the good the bad and the ugly tubes out there .
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Rivieraranch Seasoned Member Posts: 2126	Re: tube rolling or not ! Reply #8 - 08/15/12 at 12:13:47 That sounds nice but nobody would believe us. Hunting down "holy grail" tubes, buying and hoarding them stokes the ego. Unfortunately you can get caught up in that.
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Lon Seasoned Member "Love without guts is worthless!" Philip K. Dick Posts: 23450	Re: tube rolling or not ! Reply #9 - 08/15/12 at 13:07:26 It's so hard because tubes sound different in different circuits/components. And we all hear things differently, and our rooms are different, etc. The wonder of these amps is that they let us hear so much. A good and a bad thing (for me at least!)
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jameskk

Seasoned Member

Posts: 206

Re: tube rolling or not !
Reply #10 - 08/15/12 at 19:27:47

and as i continue to buy tubes mostly input and rectifiers . I figure they are not going to go down in price anymore because they are not made anymore. at least the ones made in usa,and europe. one such tube ive found a contender is the 5ar4 made in china. somehow i never thought this tube would sound good, i might be giving a secret away , but it sounds terrific so far in the zen select. right out of the box. i'll give it a few weeks then go back to the stock tube to verify , what can i say it's fun. poor,poor tube sockets. ;D

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