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https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl AUDIO FORUMS >> Analog Tape >> Where does cassette tape fit in? https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1516329173 Message started by Steve Deckert on 01/19/18 at 02:32:53 |
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Title: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by Steve Deckert on 01/19/18 at 02:32:53 I am presently trying to see how much of the magic of master tapes I can capture on a cassette tape. I already know it will be enough to justify the effort, but what will the final analysis hold when the two are compared side by side? Stay tuned. |
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Title: Re: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by SonicSeeker on 01/19/18 at 18:25:23 I am curious to what you find. |
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Title: Re: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by Steve Deckert on 01/20/18 at 04:33:33 Since I had some type II tape, I thought it would be interesting to see what could be done on it since it is fairly inexpensive. It is a +5dB tape and no more. It took about 5 tries to get the levels low enough not to saturate the tape on peaks, but when reviewing the final result my thought was "hmm, if you can get type II tape to sound this good..." So I have ordered some metal type IV tape which is fairly expensive to really expensive. I believe it is +8dB tape so I will do another identical recording on that when it gets here as see what happens. The type II didn't have the precision of a 15IPS Reel, but the flavor of tape came through loud and clear and there was no noticeable tape hiss. The sound quality was very good. Steve |
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Title: Re: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by SonicSeeker on 01/20/18 at 16:10:21 That is interesting. I can still hear the sounds associated with loading and playing cassettes even though I have not had them for years, fond memories. |
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Title: Re: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by Lon on 01/20/18 at 16:14:48 Type 4 really was an upgrade, I think that a lot of the 15 ips quality should come through. Interesting experiment. I lived with cassettes for some time. . . there's more sound quality possible there than many might think. |
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Title: Re: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by Syd on 01/20/18 at 17:05:42 I've still got my 3 head Nakamichi in the system and occasionally give it a run out. I used to record new lp's on it to play while the album was on frequent rotation thus guarding against infrequent ticks and suchlike. Not big on metal tapes, type 11 ferrics , TDK's were the stocks then a tape called Thats appeared and became my favourites. ( maybe ferric is metal but then you had the chrome which was audiophile quality I suppose and I wasn't that far down the road then as far as getting the very best ) The old tape in tape outs have gone now so I really want a Decware switch box to get back in the old groove :) Makes sense with so many new vinyls being of precarious quality. Maybe good metal tapes as well.... Many Dolbys have come and gone, there is b and c Dolby as well as an MPX filter on my LX-5. You have to play back with the same setting you recorded on. That's the theory. In practice you record flat and if there's a hiss on playback you try the filters. I record flat and play back flat as the hiss is so minimal. I remember that my reel to reel had tape hiss. Great analogue from the Nak, Warmish and good at reverb The MPX button has me raising one eyebrow. I should take these aids more seriously. |
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Title: Re: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by Steve Deckert on 02/17/18 at 19:37:17 I got the metal cassette tape recently and made another identical recording of a master tape and compared the two. While the regular tape was good I couldn't say it was any better than an LP. The metal tape is noticeably better making it as good or better than the LP. Problem is that blank metal cassette tapes cost more than reel to reel tape, plus you need someone to make copies onto cassette for you. For this reason it just makes more sense to purchase a reel to reel machine. Steve |
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Title: Re: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by Steve Deckert on 09/22/18 at 03:17:02 Rather than start a new topic, I thought I would just update this conversation with a recent observation... I have a nice sounding Nakamichi Cassette Deck and I took a FUJI metal cassette tape and recorded some test tracks from master tapes and then gave it a listen. My first take away from the playback was that the sound of tape was there in spades. It was big, dimensional, deep, high density music. The imaging and believability were great, it had something special. I very much enjoyed it. For me, when I can make the front end of my listening room melt into a 3D soundscape with tangible weight and impeccable tone and timbre I'm there. The cassette tape in its highest quality does it in spades, no problem. And it is that very thing that draws me to any format. It's numero uno. Secondly, if you can get numero uno right, is dynamics and everything else. So what I am saying is that while 320 Nano-weber-meters or higher 15 IPS 1/4 inch tapes are great, you can get the fundamentals of tape from even a high grade cassette machine. Some 30 years ago I used to have a Sony ES CD player that was pristinely detailed and imaged well. I would copy the CD's to metal cassette tapes and play the tapes back and it would just embarrass the original CD... getting something out of nothing, or was it there all along and the tape just decodes it? Behind the whole analog vs. digital dogmas are the fundamentals -- which are magnetic coupling vs. no magnetic coupling. The cartridge or the tape head are magnetically coupled to the source. That's one degree of separation but with ten degrees of control...and of course the unmistakeable sound difference between the two... This is the reason why I have the balanced output of my DAC magnetically coupled through a transformer which is then magnetically coupled through a second transformer feeding a balanced preamp to restore lost energy and jack things up a bit to feed a final transformer that feeds the amplifier. This makes digital sound analog like, but without the inherent noise of tape or records. It's a win win situation. Still, for anyone truly into their stereo, tape is a unique experience (a mechanical one) with a unique sound well worth having some enjoyment out of. Again, you can buy a good cassette deck (and spare belts) or a small reel-to-reel machine for under 500 bucks, collet a few 7.5 IPS 2 track or 4 track tapes (depending on the tape machine you get) and then go on eBay and get vintage tapes and amaze yourself with the results... it's a lot of fun. The down side of tape is that with all mechanical experiences come challenges. A brand new in the box cassette deck from 1979 awaits it's first tape... you excitedly (and stupidly) get one of your best $30 cassette tapes and pop it in the machine... you press play, you wait... no sound but wait, you can hear something happening... you press stop and try to eject the tape... no go. Tape machine ate the tape. No way to get the tape out without cutting it apart. Machine gets opened up to remove tape and belts have turned into black ink. 400 paper towels later and a pint of alcohol later you put fresh belts on it, clean the heads, demagnetize it and you're good to go. You see, this is why our children have no appreciation for things. Even music, you had to work for -- back in the day. Hell, in order to drive a car you had to know how to drive. Now we have self-steering cars so you can masterbate on the highway while you text your facebook fans and listen to MP3's. So you see, tape is more than just about tape. It's about preserving patients, hard work and quality to effect an appreciation for the result -- a joy and a quality factor that is not obtainable without those prerequisites. Steve |
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Title: Re: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by Jeff of Arabica on 09/22/18 at 04:19:37 Steve Deckert wrote on 09/22/18 at 03:17:02:
;D By far the funniest damn thing I have heard/read all month. My stomach is hurting! |
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Title: Re: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by Archie on 09/22/18 at 18:21:43 I know that every generation seems to criticise the next for skills lost but times are getting ridiculous! I had a conversation with my plumber yesterday. It seems that some new boilers require a router connection to function. They automatically send status information so that a repairman can show up at your door without you even knowing you have a problem. Sounds good? When asked for the location of the house water shut off, most homeowners point to the gas meter! :P |
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Title: Re: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by Dominick on 10/28/18 at 06:38:57 Just to pickup on this thread, I recently resurrected my old Sony tape deck from my parents house. This motivation came from me finding my old tape collection in my closet back when I was in high school. There were not only full albums, but also homemade tapes that I made when I used to convert my CDs to cassette to play back in my car. At the time I always spent extra money and purchased the type IV metal cassette tapes and the sound was very good. I spent many hours sitting in my room recording a CD to a tape. I used to monitor and balance out the left and right channels on the fly if one channel would stray during the recording. Talk about fond memories. |
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Title: Re: Where does cassette tape fit in? Post by rhdrico on 12/26/19 at 00:10:30 Tape machine ate the tape. That's why I had the Pioneer cassette decks, cassette is on the front, like on a reel to reel. It never "ate" tapes. P.S. I "mastered" playlists (from records) to 1/2 track. Then copied to cassette for my car stereo listening. 10 years ago I threw out my cassettes and went to cds (for car listening). |
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