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Graphene Contact Enhancer (Read 2569 times)
Hankster
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Graphene Contact Enhancer
03/08/18 at 18:26:38
 
Has anybody heard or have experience with this product.  Kind of stumbled on a topic on Audiogon, and am curios if this product works.

Thanks for any input or experiences positive or negative..
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Henry S. Kurtz
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will
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #1 - 03/08/18 at 19:32:01
 
Hey Hank,

If you are referring to MadScientist graphene contact enhancer, I really like it. Improving contact in a very neutral and complete sounding way, I can't think of a thing wrong with it.... except that it is messy to deal with, the liquid full of very fine black graphene. Also, the very small container's cap is a bit tedious to open but seals well without threads. This may be better now, don't know.

But it sounds great. My previous favorite enhancer was Cardas, which is really good, a good cleaner also, but I find the graphene helps signal transfer/integrity better...very, very nicely I would say. A little goes a long way too!

I have used it on cable ends and connectors, tube pins, internal wire connectors in my DAC.

If you try it, use it carefully as instructed. Too much is too much sound-wise...too clarified as I recall anyway. Related, it will likely sound stronger at first, taking some time to settle, but the very thin coating is important.
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Archie
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #2 - 03/08/18 at 20:01:15
 
Any idea where to get it in the US?  I'm not seeing it anywhere.  What's a good second choice?
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will
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #3 - 03/08/18 at 21:02:57
 
Archie,

I once saw a reference on some forum to a US distributor, but then that guy closed his storefront I think. He may still be selling it though. I would email the mad scientist folks and ask if there is a US person who has it. Aside from that, mine came pretty fast from New Zealand and not brutal on post. I got a few other things though.

Compared to those I have tried...SilClear Silver, Deoxit  Gold and Cardas Contact Conditioner, I thought the Graphene Enhancer was a notable improvement. I never got SilClear to work to my liking here, maybe could not get it thin enough...but always heard something veiled and off along with the benefits...long time ago to recall though. Deoxit Gold is a decent enhancer, but I found it dull if you do not wipe/polish right after application, then it was good. Cardas works very well and is easy to use, less touchy than the other two, a good cleaner, and I liked what it did with the sound better too...more of the good things Deoxit did if I recall. So from this limited exposure, I would recommend Cardas as a second choice.

I think the idea of these is to clean, fill imperfections and provide a more even contact with good quality, nano particle signal transfer materials. Graphine being a super good conductor if used correctly, is I suspect what sets the graphene ahead of the others. And Madscientist seems to have gotten the medium right to bring out the graphene's best.

If I recall correctly, when I was testing the Graphene Enhancer, I tried it first just on signal cable ends and connectors. After it settled a bit I found it more than an enhancement, but where do you draw that line.

I found this in a note I sent to Bob, the maker after testing it:

"I would call this contact enhancer a serious audio world breakthrough, something that you can hear notable system upgrades from, but without any real signature! They just improve everything with utter balance here."
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Archie
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #4 - 03/09/18 at 00:00:06
 
Thanks Will, that's super helpful.
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will
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #5 - 03/09/18 at 00:10:56
 
You are welcome Archie.
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Archie
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #6 - 03/09/18 at 00:17:57
 
I found a place that sells the Graphene contact enhancer in the US.  It isn't cheap though.  They have 2ml, 5ml and 10ml sizes.  I assume this would be good for all electrical connections, i.e. tube pins and ICs.  Not knowing how far this goes or how often it needs to be reapplied, what size would be recommended?

http://madscientist-audio.com/presta/22-graphene-contact-enhancer

Actually, it comes from New Zealand afterall.
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will
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #7 - 03/09/18 at 01:24:35
 
Here is a little more write-up on it, under the "Tweaks" section of the main pages: http://madscientist-audio.com/graphene_ce.html

I think a 2ml tube, without spilling it, and using it efficiently, might last several full treatments in a system like mine (possibly more). The tube is very narrow (easy to fall over) and difficult to open, making it easy to spill without care. Mine is about half gone, but I spilled it before I figured this out. I have used it on signal wire connection/ends two or three times, on all input connections once or twice, and on all tube pins probably several times in total when you add up some rolling. I have three IC pairs, (one xlr connecter pair at the DAC and hardwired to my Zbit, a RCA IC pair Zbit to CSP3, and a RCA pair CSP to Torii) and have 16 tubes between the CSP3 and Torii. Also, I am currently using adaptors on all three rectifiers and the four Torii power tubes, so more tube pins. I have not gotten around to treating power cord contacts yet.


Since I like it for contact enhancer, using a small amounts each time, and for what appears to be a better bottle setup, I would probably get the small capped bottle (5 ml) if I were to buy more. But I think you could get good use from a small 2 ml vile. It really does take very little to get the job done. The little vile has an internal plastic "applicator," that as MS says, is less than ideal for application, but I find that I can just about treat all my signal wire connections with just the amount that comes out on the "applicator" by dabbing it onto a little foam applicator (comes with it) for applying to the cables ends, then gently spreading, cleaning, and taking off excess with a tissue. I do use bananas and low mass RCA connectors...not a lot to treat there, but I do think a little can go a long way.
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ginny
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #8 - 03/09/18 at 15:25:21
 
In my search for speaker cables i came across a company called Cerious Technologies.

They use Graphene in their speaker and IC cables.  Has anyone ever used or heard these cables? Their Graphene Matrix line of 8' speaker cables  are massive @ 25 lbs per pair.

http://www.cerioustechnologies.com/cables/lcInterconnects.html

-Mark
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Archie
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #9 - 03/09/18 at 16:52:38
 
I sent them an email and here is the reply:

Quote:
We don't currently have a source in USA but negotiations are ongoing. It only takes about a week to get to the USA.

You need to use this stuff very sparingly, so 5ml will be plenty to treat say 100 or more tubes, and have some left over for contacts, etc. Maybe 2ml would be enough even, but the 5ml bottle is much easier to use..

There's a user sheet we send out with it, but basically you apply then it's best to use a tissue absorb any excess (like blotting paper). The ideal amount you can't even see, but if you try rubbing with a tissue you will see the black still coming off. To remove completely, use alcohol (eg meths, isopropyl, etc).

Cheers
bob


I'll probably balance the shipping with the product cost and order enough for a long while.
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Hankster
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #10 - 03/11/18 at 20:35:40
 
Thanks for the relies, that's good to know since it sounded to good to be true, apparently there's truth in it use.  I saw that on Audiogon's website.  If anyone is interested in the URL here it is.  http://www.madscientist-audio.com/graphene_ce.html\

HSK
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Henry S. Kurtz
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Archie
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #11 - 03/11/18 at 21:00:01
 
I haven't heard back from them about the product shelf life.  If you make inquires, could you ask them about it?  It might make the most sense to get the 10ml if it doesn't go bad.
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busterfree
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #12 - 03/11/18 at 21:51:22
 
Quote:
In my search for speaker cables i came across a company called Cerious Technologies.

They use Graphene in their speaker and IC cables.  Has anyone ever used or heard these cables? Their Graphene Matrix line of 8' speaker cables  are massive @ 25 lbs per pair.

http://www.cerioustechnologies.com/cables/lcInterconnects.html

-Mark


There is a long thread about them on another forum.

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/new-cerious-technologies-upgrade-graphene...
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will
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #13 - 03/12/18 at 02:01:20
 
I was just doing some DAC modification, and finishing, I treated the IEC inlet and the HiFi Tuning silver fuse ends. Quite noticeable...clarity and signal power, especially micro and macro dynamics noticeably better....faster!

In terms of how much might be needed, I looked at my emails and found I got mine in early July last year. So I have been using it for about 8 months, about 1/2 a 2ml vile now gone.

The other day, to retest it, I did all the signal wire ends all together, I think for the second time. Also, I did all the tube pins at once one time. But as I put in new tube adapters, or new tubes, or adjust cables (power, ICs, speaker) I have been developing, I generally remember to treat new (or changed) things progressively as I made changes as well as broader system treatments. There are a few power cables I have not treated...but for the most part, the whole has probably been treated a couple times and more with cable rolling and tube rolling.

If careful to be efficient, and not changing things too much, waring some off....say treating everything over each 6 month period, looks like a 2 ml vile could last a year or more in a system like mine.

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Archie
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #14 - 03/12/18 at 17:09:39
 
Will, does it seem that this stuff will keep indefinitely in the closed (but not sealed) bottle?
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will
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #15 - 03/12/18 at 18:46:37
 
Hey Archie.

This never crossed my mind. I have some contact enhancers that are 10 years old.

But I can't say for sure if this would last like that.

Why not email and ask again?

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Archie
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #16 - 03/13/18 at 00:27:37
 
Good idea.  I just did.
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Archie
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #17 - 03/13/18 at 17:11:33
 
Quote:
This keeps for years - the base is chemical/mineral, not soy based like some I know about. It does separate slightly after a day or two but you just need to shake it..

Cheers
bob
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Archie
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #18 - 03/14/18 at 00:45:22
 
I just ordered a 10ml bottle.  $95.25 delivered.  Not cheap but I've been putting off this kind of thing too long.
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will
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #19 - 03/14/18 at 20:34:56
 
I hope you like it as much as I do Archie. Smiley

Will
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dvl
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #20 - 03/22/18 at 18:11:19
 
Ok, you guys got me interested so i sent away for some. i got the small tube. I think it works exactly as Will has described. i really like what it does to the sound, clarifying, without getting over to a more etched sound. Very nice.

Here's the thing that's been making me question my sanity. With the contact enhancer they included two small discs. Mad Scientist calls them Black Discus. These are just samples, not the full size. i read the instructions that came with them, tried them in different places, doubting the entire time, but then actually heard an improvement.  

Just to check myself, i put a 17 year-old in my listening chair. He plays guitar, drums, piano, is in musical theater at his high school, so he likes music and listens to it a lot. i picked a song he likes and we tried out the little discs. He could hear the difference too, without any prompting from me.

Has anyone else tried these?

David
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will
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #21 - 04/02/18 at 23:19:36
 
Hey David,

I was inspired by a sample pair of madscientist discusses too, and now use quite a few. I tried the little samples on signal connections mostly, finding them to subtly clarify signal in space, also consolidating signal density a bit. Finally I ended up with them on the negative output binding post of the Torii.

Then, ordering some of each size, I was a little disconcerted. I think this is in part because my system is both revealing and seriously fine-tuned, making even subtle changes pretty obvious. The little samples worked about anywhere for me. As they increase in size, and with more used in the system, the discusses progressively impart more of their "signature," their particular way of clarifying and consolidating the signal. Some combinations can sound really good here, while in some other combinations and places, the same discusses can be too dense/intense for me. So I play around with them over time.

The little ones are still my choice in the signal path proper, and the bigger ones have mostly gravitated to power...cupcakes or sticks near audio circuit breakers and on the top center of my PS Audio P5, "can openers" on the chokes of the Torii and on specific power cable ends...Also, I made a power cable filter using sticks and "kegs."

When I got a PS Audio P5, even after lots of burnin, it was too colored and veiled for me. Having tried different feet, fuses, settings, and power cords, even PS Audio's AC12 did not bring out the transparency I needed. So I built a cable, geometry and materials designed to be very revealing...using combinations of smaller gauge, cryo'd silver on copper teflon wires, adding up to 9 gauge if I recall correctly. The positive and neutral bunches were twisted separately, and individually wrapped with ground wires. The two conductor bunches were damped and separated with cotton wrapping, finished with Rhodium ends.

It worked! I found it better in every way, more revealing, smooth, and transparent than PS Audio's AC12. But I could still hear the P5 a bit and wanted more. So after some email questions, I ordered madscientist's DIY power cable filter kit. I made a second cable just like the first, this one using a variation on madscientist's "Neo" filter setup, black discuss sticks and kegs built in.  

Feeding the P5, the filtered cable shared all sonic traits with the original, but was more clear and refined across the spectrum. Along with the right feet, a nice fuse, and some fairly radical voltage and phase settings on the P5, I was able to stop "hearing" the P5 for the most part! I still prefer my front end (computer, DAC, etc) with more transparent power filtering, but the P5 sounds good to me now with the amps, not really noticing it anymore.

My front end power goes through a modified "Audio Brickwall" with a Shunyata Defender filter plugged into it, also using some discusses on the cable end coming into it, on each end of the DIY computer power cord, and on power supply end of a MAC HC power cord I use for the Uptone USB Regen power supply.

This could easily be different with different system/room configurations, and different filtering/clarifying needs. But here, I still like smaller and sample size pieces for the signal path, and the bigger ones for power. And I find that as the system/room develops, I like to play with the discuss configurations now and then, adjusting sizes, placement, and combinations for a little better balance of sound.
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dvl
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #22 - 04/03/18 at 20:21:53
 
Will,

Interesting to read about your experience. The sample size discs have an effect no matter where i put them. Deciding if i like the effect is the work. In some positions, the can really bleach out the sound, making it brittle, bloodless. Other places they seem to do the right thing, making things more natural, giving the music a clear, natural flow. i even put one on the junction box to my turntable and it did all the right things without bleaching out the sound. i'm having a difficult time really describing what they do when it's good.

i just received some different sizes the other day and have not had time to try theme in different places, but am finding this particular tweak quite fascinating.

Thanks for sharing your experience.

David
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will
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Re: Graphene Contact Enhancer
Reply #23 - 04/03/18 at 22:53:51
 
David,

You are welcome.

What you are hearing is interesting. I think they sound like they clarify the signal for the most part, in most places here, consolidating signal density at the same time. I am not sure I have heard bleached out, but can imagine it, perhaps if over-doing what they do in a location? It will be intersting to try more along with the initial sample pair. I think they may have cumulative effects beyond just the addition of more.

Having them from the system circuit breaker, to the cord to the P5 regenerator, on the Brickwall and P5 power filters/distributors, a few front-end locations, and a few places on my amp, they are throughout here. At that point in my explorations I thought this beginning to end distribution may have given a nice completeness, a sort of integrated synergy of discusses throughout being a good thing for balancing the effect musically.
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