Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Decware Audio Forums
12/14/17 at 21:04:07 





 



Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 
Send Topic Print
Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet? (Read 32710 times)
mark58
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 4621
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #100 - 03/04/15 at 12:12:54
 
Syd,  as usual you're way ahead of me.  I paid for mine on Saturday but for some reason ebay/paypal didn't use the 200+ cash in the account or my Credit Card as they usually do...they paid with an E Check from my bank that wasn't debited until Monday and who knows how many days it will take to clear to the seller.  In other words, my tubes haven't even shipped yet.

I'm eager to hear your impressions.  Mark.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/04/15 at 12:40:48 by mark58 »  

"The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not moved with the concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, deceptions, and spoils;
The motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Hell. Let no such man be trusted." William Shakespeare
  IP Logged
Syd
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1383
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #101 - 03/04/15 at 14:00:50
 
If we`ve got the same seller he`s excellent Mark. Sent me an e-mail to say they`d shipped and a positive note with it.
I let them warm up for an hour and then remembered I should play a cd on repeat. Turned the sound off, started the cd and hit repeat.
I tentatively increased the volume untill I could just hear it, but then gave it a quick burst for 2 seconds. Sounded better than I could imagine, that is, no distortion due to being new. I turned the volume back down and left the room feeling +ve. I`ll be listening to them through burn in.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/04/15 at 14:01:25 by Syd »  

Decware: Rachaels x 2 bridged, C. SP2+, ZP3, ZMC1, DSC i/c`s, DHC-1 pw/cbl`s Michell Orbe + SME V + M.Benz LP s , Nakamichi LX5, Lowther acoustas DX2`s, WE 16g sp/cbl`s, Isotek mains sub
  IP Logged
mark58
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 4621
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #102 - 03/04/15 at 14:16:19
 
Syd,  I did buy from the same seller as you and Will.  If anyone still wants these tubes he's relisted the Quad ad.  Mark.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/6P3S-E-6L6-6L6GT-Matched-Selected-Quad-Gold-Grid-NOS-N...
Back to top
 
 

"The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not moved with the concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, deceptions, and spoils;
The motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Hell. Let no such man be trusted." William Shakespeare
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 2962
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #103 - 03/04/15 at 18:43:26
 

I bought some from the same seller as well. He didn't have any quads up, so I bought two pair. I figure if I don't love them in the ZMA, I have a few guitar amps that will enjoy them.  :)

Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
Archie
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 688
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #104 - 03/04/15 at 20:39:07
 
Quote:
Syd,  I did buy from the same seller as you and Will.  If anyone still wants these tubes he's relisted the Quad ad.  Mark.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/6P3S-E-6L6-6L6GT-Matched-Selected-Quad-Gold-Grid-NOS-N....


Thanks for the link.  I jumped on the band wagon and ordered a quad at $69 delivered.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/04/15 at 20:40:54 by Archie »  
  IP Logged
mark58
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 4621
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #105 - 03/04/15 at 21:01:46
 
You're welcome, Archie.  Mark.
Back to top
 
 

"The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not moved with the concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, deceptions, and spoils;
The motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Hell. Let no such man be trusted." William Shakespeare
  IP Logged
Syd
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1383
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #106 - 03/04/15 at 21:20:16
 
Initial impressions. Very clear, bass a little polite but good. Lots of detail. Long way to go before they bloom.
Back to top
 
 

Decware: Rachaels x 2 bridged, C. SP2+, ZP3, ZMC1, DSC i/c`s, DHC-1 pw/cbl`s Michell Orbe + SME V + M.Benz LP s , Nakamichi LX5, Lowther acoustas DX2`s, WE 16g sp/cbl`s, Isotek mains sub
  IP Logged
Syd
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1383
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #107 - 03/05/15 at 18:41:51
 
I took a TFK 12au7 out of the ZP3 which I had put in to attenuate the bass a bit, before these tubes came along, and put the previous Mullard back in. Balance restored. Eerie
I`ve put a Brimar in now. Nice

Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/05/15 at 18:48:57 by Syd »  

Decware: Rachaels x 2 bridged, C. SP2+, ZP3, ZMC1, DSC i/c`s, DHC-1 pw/cbl`s Michell Orbe + SME V + M.Benz LP s , Nakamichi LX5, Lowther acoustas DX2`s, WE 16g sp/cbl`s, Isotek mains sub
  IP Logged
mark58
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 4621
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #108 - 03/05/15 at 19:18:37
 
Syd,  are you talking Mullard 12AU7?  and a Brimar what?  rectifier...5R4GY?    And were talking just the ZP3? With new Russian tubes in the Torii. Mark.
Back to top
 
 

"The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not moved with the concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, deceptions, and spoils;
The motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Hell. Let no such man be trusted." William Shakespeare
  IP Logged
Syd
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1383
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #109 - 03/05/15 at 19:42:28
 
Mark, the Mullard 12au7 seemed good but I thought I might as well try the Brimar 12au7 and it was a good fit, bit more organised.

Just had a big moment. Sonny Rollins sax went distorted and so did Jim Halls guitar. I was twiddlng valves, replaced the Brimar for a miniwatt. Put it down to the new tubes burning in. Turned the record over, big lump of fluff on the needle. That was a relief.
Put the Brimar back in.
Started out with Crimson because I wanted to check the bass. The Mullard overdid it a bit.
Staying on jazz for now.
Instruments are coming out of a blacker background so it seems a bit wierder than normal. I can hear the ambience trying to get through.

Also the volume is deceptive. First thing I did was to turn  it up to compensate for the bass.  I`m still slightly higher than the EL34`s but yesterday I was getting close to maxing out. The CSP2+` pres were on max and volume around 85%. Now the CSP`s pre out is back 2 notches and the pre in back 1 notch with volume at 65%.
There was a distance aspect at first, like you were a way back and `looking` further to see the music.
It`s shifting and getting closer.

Oh thats nice. Side one of KOB sounded thin. Side two started and I just turned the volume up just a shade and everything came together.
lol I still dont know Coltrane from Adderly. I allways guess. First solo first track Coltrane ?
Flamenco Sketches, the way Davis just hints at the theme is awesome.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/05/15 at 21:51:59 by Syd »  

Decware: Rachaels x 2 bridged, C. SP2+, ZP3, ZMC1, DSC i/c`s, DHC-1 pw/cbl`s Michell Orbe + SME V + M.Benz LP s , Nakamichi LX5, Lowther acoustas DX2`s, WE 16g sp/cbl`s, Isotek mains sub
  IP Logged
Syd
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1383
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #110 - 03/06/15 at 19:20:54
 
A 10hr loop of Aphex Twin today. Imagine being tied to the chair through that.   :-[

The tubes have 20 hrs on them. Hendrix Isle Of White : The bass is monumental Drums snappy, delicate, with air, the snare is vibrating at times, Hendrix guitar is very detailed. The next 80 hrs should be good.

Mark, your `60s and `70s sets........
Think mine are `81, if that the date written on them.

Troubador JJ Cale : Love JJ, lots of clever layers. I do like the new presentation. I dont like to say it but I`m connecting in a +ve way, expecting new details.
Syd.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/06/15 at 19:22:27 by Syd »  

Decware: Rachaels x 2 bridged, C. SP2+, ZP3, ZMC1, DSC i/c`s, DHC-1 pw/cbl`s Michell Orbe + SME V + M.Benz LP s , Nakamichi LX5, Lowther acoustas DX2`s, WE 16g sp/cbl`s, Isotek mains sub
  IP Logged
mark58
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 4621
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #111 - 03/06/15 at 19:39:11
 
Syd,  that's correct, my two quads are 60's and 70's sets.  The seller acknowledged yesterday that he had gotten notice of the payment I made on 2/28.  So mine should be shipped soon.

Your impressions sound promising.  I'm also glad that they are sounding good with as little as 20 hours on them.  Mark.
Back to top
 
 

"The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not moved with the concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, deceptions, and spoils;
The motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Hell. Let no such man be trusted." William Shakespeare
  IP Logged
Syd
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1383
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #112 - 03/06/15 at 20:22:32
 
Yes they`ve definitely turned a corner Mark. It`s good not to faff around and just enjoy. I thought they might be underpowered but my settings are now back to normal and the volume level is where I like it. They are drawing 40 ma.

Back to top
 
 

Decware: Rachaels x 2 bridged, C. SP2+, ZP3, ZMC1, DSC i/c`s, DHC-1 pw/cbl`s Michell Orbe + SME V + M.Benz LP s , Nakamichi LX5, Lowther acoustas DX2`s, WE 16g sp/cbl`s, Isotek mains sub
  IP Logged
bvictor
Verified Member
**




Posts: 46
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #113 - 03/06/15 at 22:44:18
 
Hey guys,  just back to this thread.  Syd, sounds like you are liking the 6P3S-E's so far.  I'm glad to read it.   I'm still digging the Shuguang Treasure 6CA7-Z's.  They're more pricey than the coin base 6P3S, but wow, great right out of the gate from the moment current hit them.
Back to top
 
 

DECWARE: SE34I.2, HDTs; CSP2, TABOO, Zen Styx, RL 1.5s; Mystery Amp, ZDAC-1, Klipsch KLF-30s; Bridged Raches with Klipsch Forte IIs and Monoliths
  IP Logged
Syd
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1383
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #114 - 03/07/15 at 00:22:58
 
Hi bvictor, just read a great write up for the Shuguangs. Bet they look nice in the Rachael and well worth the money. I wish all power tubes were decorated. If only they could have forseen them being on show back in the day Smiley
The 6P3S-E`s are a follow up to some tubes some of us bought for the CSP`s, a 6n1p-E, Russian made as well. They are excellent and a low price. Both have those small dish getters with a dimple ( flying saucers ) The 6P3S-E have 2 getters. Bit of a long shot, they have had good reviews and are shaping up on the right track.
I read about the detail your Shuguangs are capable of. Now that would be something if the 6P3S-E`s could get somewhere near.
Syd.

Oh, I see you have the ZMA. So you have 4 Shuguangs.
lol this is the ZMA thread. I got hijacked into here. Honest. Smiley
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/07/15 at 00:27:14 by Syd »  

Decware: Rachaels x 2 bridged, C. SP2+, ZP3, ZMC1, DSC i/c`s, DHC-1 pw/cbl`s Michell Orbe + SME V + M.Benz LP s , Nakamichi LX5, Lowther acoustas DX2`s, WE 16g sp/cbl`s, Isotek mains sub
  IP Logged
Archie
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 688
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #115 - 03/18/15 at 00:20:40
 
I received the matched quad of 6P3S-E Russian tubes today (under 2 weeks from the Ukraine -- not bad!) and I thought I'd share my first impressions.  They bias on my ZMA at a max of 60 mA whereas my cryo'd Gold Lion KT-66s biased at a minimum of not much less.  The quad seems matched well and very stable.  The seem to play much louder that the GLs but the bass seems a bit light.  I think Syd mentioned that his were a bit bass light too.  I'll keep them in for a while and see if they bloom on the bottom end.  I do like the increase in volume though.  For $69/quad they seem like a great bargain.  My GLs were $189/quad.  They will probably end up as a back up to my GLs.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Syd
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1383
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #116 - 03/18/15 at 10:57:52
 
I could write a lot about them Archie, they went through a number of changes. The bass was light then warmed up but got in a muddle behind the drummer, like he had a cloak over him. 20 hrs gave them a listenable take but something was missing. 40 hrs and they got involving. I`m on about 50hrs+ and wont be taking them out. They are just starting to deliver the goods. Last night was another milestone when I played H. Wolfs Lon. Sessions. I`ve been nailed to the listening seat for a while.
As always it`s a credit to Decware that I can monitor all the improvements with confidence.
And of course Mark who flagged them up.
They are on my saved searches so I can spot a `60`s set.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/18/15 at 11:10:10 by Syd »  

Decware: Rachaels x 2 bridged, C. SP2+, ZP3, ZMC1, DSC i/c`s, DHC-1 pw/cbl`s Michell Orbe + SME V + M.Benz LP s , Nakamichi LX5, Lowther acoustas DX2`s, WE 16g sp/cbl`s, Isotek mains sub
  IP Logged
Archie
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 688
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #117 - 03/18/15 at 16:29:06
 
Thanks for your comments Syd.  I'll be sure to give them a good burn in.  After  a few hours of listening I started to like them more.  And they do have a pretty strong blue glow!  :D
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 2962
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #118 - 03/18/15 at 17:00:29
 

Still waiting on my Russian tubes. Must be coming on a slow boat from...Romania or wherever.

Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
Archie
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 688
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #119 - 03/18/15 at 19:18:24
 
The ebay seller Yura, who goes by svetlana_ua was awesome.  Very communicative and on the ball.  Hardly took longer than ordering from Cyoset!
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 2962
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #120 - 03/19/15 at 03:42:25
 
Tubes showed up today. Good, sexy midrange. Smooth treble. But you give up bass and attack compared to KT66

Not bad for the money.
Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
Archie
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 688
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #121 - 03/22/15 at 20:41:41
 
LR, is your bass coming in at all with the new tubes?  Mine seems to be or I can't remember what I had with the GL KT66s.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 2962
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #122 - 03/23/15 at 18:07:59
 
Bass isn't bad, it's just not big and punchy like with the KT66. I think the attack on the KT66 is nicer, which also makes the bass better.

But for what I paid, these are pretty good tubes! And they haven't drifted after 30 hours of playback! I may have to keep these in storage, and pick up another pair for guitar amp use.

I'm already back to my stock KT66, and I put my GE Labeled Telefunkin (at least the sticker says Telefunkin on it - I have no idea what they really are). I have them in the PI section, and they really liven up the music. Everything sounds...I don't know, happier. Brighter and more airy without being edgy or piercing. I really need to figure out what these tubes are and buy a backup set! It's rare that a tube makes more than a slight difference in my system - so this is one I'd like to stock up on.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/23/15 at 18:08:33 by Lonely Raven »  
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
will
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1832
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #123 - 03/23/15 at 18:28:56
 
I don't recall how long the Russian 6P3S-E take to burn in, but generally for me 30 is not close for power tubes. Also I think it is always the bass that is slowest to define with the ones I have used in Toriis...EL34 and KT66/5881/6L6 types.

Not that the Russians will sound like the Tungsol KT66, they won't, but I guess you will need at least 100 to hear them fully. I have had some power tubes (when I was sort of counting) take over 200.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/23/15 at 18:30:38 by will »  

PSA P5/modified Brickwall/Shunyata Defender/more; MacMini/Audirvana>Jitterbug/Regen> modified Gustard x20pro DAC; DIY + Pi Audio PCs; DIY ICs + USB; Decware-Jupiter CSP3, Torii MKIV, HR1-all modified; DIY Speaker Cables; feet-Madscientist, Archie's, isocups, DIY
  IP Logged
Archie
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 688
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #124 - 03/28/15 at 17:28:45
 
When counting hours for the purpose of breaking in tubes, do the total hours count or just the hours the amp is playing music?  My amps seem to be on 2+ times as long as I play music through them.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
will
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1832
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #125 - 03/28/15 at 20:50:36
 
Archie,

Whatever it is...signal cable, amp, cap or tube, I always think of it as music time with all its electronic variations.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/28/15 at 20:51:09 by will »  

PSA P5/modified Brickwall/Shunyata Defender/more; MacMini/Audirvana>Jitterbug/Regen> modified Gustard x20pro DAC; DIY + Pi Audio PCs; DIY ICs + USB; Decware-Jupiter CSP3, Torii MKIV, HR1-all modified; DIY Speaker Cables; feet-Madscientist, Archie's, isocups, DIY
  IP Logged
Archie
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 688
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #126 - 03/29/15 at 00:48:42
 
Thanks Will. That's what I figured but I was hoping it might be differnt with tubes.  I am liking these Russian 6P3s-Es.  After a few more weeks I might try my GL KT66s again to see if I'm missing anything.  Sure doesnt' seem like it.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
lLance
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 164
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #127 - 03/29/15 at 16:21:26
 
I am trying out some EL34's this morning in my ZMA. They will only bias to about 38-39 on the meters. I know Steve says best between 40-50. Will this cause any problems? Hard on transformers?
Back to top
 
 

ZMA, ZTpre, VPI Scout 1.1 & Soundsmith Zepher Cart, Janszen zA2.1 Speakers, PS Audio DSD, Berkeley Audio Alpha USB, PS Audio P10, Win 8 & J River app, Morrow Cables Triode Wire Labs #7 & Lessloss PC, voodoo AES
  IP Logged
will
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1832
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #128 - 03/29/15 at 18:29:17
 
Archie,

Sounds good. I am listening to the GL KT66 in the MKIV now. I really like that tube. For me, though I like tube sets with different overall tonal characters, my "requirements" for sound balance have become so specific, I really am glad to have selection of nice rectifiers, VRs, inputs and power tubes. You Mystery folks have two inputs and power tubes, right? Less tubes to have to own, and less adjustment potential too. But then the bias must be a nice tuning tool.

I recall the manual saying that the OA3s are not to be changed to another regulator type, like OB3 in the Mystery. But since the VR is in front of the inputs, and the input/phase tubes drive the power tubes, it would seem to me a tube that might be fun to explore. I have a number of OA3s, and they all shift the Toriis in their own ways...different. I wonder what Steve would think of trying different OA3s? If the amp ships with those pictured, they look like black based RCAs, really nice tubes, but also they have a particular flavor that is its own within the tube type.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 03/29/15 at 20:39:24 by will »  

PSA P5/modified Brickwall/Shunyata Defender/more; MacMini/Audirvana>Jitterbug/Regen> modified Gustard x20pro DAC; DIY + Pi Audio PCs; DIY ICs + USB; Decware-Jupiter CSP3, Torii MKIV, HR1-all modified; DIY Speaker Cables; feet-Madscientist, Archie's, isocups, DIY
  IP Logged
Archie
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 688
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #129 - 03/29/15 at 19:11:57
 
lLance,

As always, when in doubt, contact Steve.  However, I've talked to him about bias before and I think we need to worry about the higher settings and not the lower.  My transformers run hotter with higher bias.  I'm running at 52 mA right now because that's as low as I can go on my Russian 6P3S-E tubes.  Steve runs his bias CONSIDERABLY higher but he admits that as the factory, he can repair his amp if he damages it.  He suggested that we could run maybe as much as 1/3 higher bias but only for a couple of hours at a time.  My transformers seem to run at about 120 F and I think their design point is over 140 F. I did install a small fan behind my ZMA to blow air over my transformers since I figure if heat was the enemy, I'd dissipate some of it.  And it helps warm my room in the winter!
 :D
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
will
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1832
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #130 - 03/29/15 at 20:44:17
 
From the Mystery Amp manual:

"This amplifier is designed to operate with a 50ma bias on each output tube.
Running higher bias currents for any length of time will overheat the power supply
transformers and could cause pre-mature failure. We recommend no more than
60ma per tube at any point. Running less is not an issue for the power supply but
doing so will reduce the power output of the tubes and change how they sound.
Some will use this technique as an esoteric voicing tool."
Back to top
 
 

PSA P5/modified Brickwall/Shunyata Defender/more; MacMini/Audirvana>Jitterbug/Regen> modified Gustard x20pro DAC; DIY + Pi Audio PCs; DIY ICs + USB; Decware-Jupiter CSP3, Torii MKIV, HR1-all modified; DIY Speaker Cables; feet-Madscientist, Archie's, isocups, DIY
  IP Logged
lLance
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 164
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #131 - 03/29/15 at 21:33:24
 
Thanks Will and Archie
Back to top
 
 

ZMA, ZTpre, VPI Scout 1.1 & Soundsmith Zepher Cart, Janszen zA2.1 Speakers, PS Audio DSD, Berkeley Audio Alpha USB, PS Audio P10, Win 8 & J River app, Morrow Cables Triode Wire Labs #7 & Lessloss PC, voodoo AES
  IP Logged
FarmBoss
Verified Member
**




Posts: 41
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #132 - 05/05/15 at 00:49:18
 
Stone,

I have been working my way through the input sections, starting with the phono stage (using RCA triple Mica) then the preamp (http://www.upscaleaudio.com/amperex-7308-vintage-gold-pin/).  

Taking a bit of your advice I bought a pair of the nationals and put them into the preamp slots of the ZMA.

Mostly I listen to Classic 70's hard rock and big band.  I never felt I had understood the term "relaxed" before, but I totally felt that the nationals transformed the ZMA so I was experiencing the relaxed sound.  Great highs and a really wide soundstage.  The downside I experienced was that with rock I lost a lot of the PRAT.  It seemed this is a trade off that works fine with music with singers and the big band sound but is not acceptable with say ZZ Top.  

Granted I only have 10 hours of burn in on the nationals but I moved them over to the preamp in the output stage to burn in.  They actually sound pretty good there and I get a lot more PRAT out of the entire system.  I may leave the there but I will revisit moving them back to the ZMA after some more seasoning.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
stone_of_tone
Seasoned Member
****


Listen Often/Listen
Deep

Posts: 2632
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #133 - 05/05/15 at 02:41:17
 
Good to hear FB. I really like them in the ZMA Inputs A12 an B12. But I need to try them in the Outputs of the Pre with 6N23P's back in the A12 an B12 tomorrow. Cool.
Back to top
 
 

Sony as Transport
Illuminati D-60
Audio Alchemy DTI-Pro
Audio Magic Mystic Reference I2S
Audio Alchemy DDE 3.0
Kimber Select 1030
Zen Select #76
Kimber Select 3033
Polk Audio LS-90
Tri-config/TipToes & Vibropods underneath Speakers
360 degree Rm Treats
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 2962
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #134 - 05/05/15 at 03:27:26
 
Quote:
Great highs and a really wide soundstage.  The downside I experienced was that with rock I lost a lot of the PRAT.


The lack of PRAT is why I didn't like the nationals. Good sound, but I lost something that the ZMA does well.

IMHO - I'm going for air and detail with silky top end. I'm still looking for that.

Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
stone_of_tone
Seasoned Member
****


Listen Often/Listen
Deep

Posts: 2632
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #135 - 05/05/15 at 14:02:45
 
I have no lack of PRAT, especially with my Modified Adagio's. However, I use a Telefunken: http://www.upscaleaudio.com/telefunken-e88cc-6922/
for my Input Tube/CSP3 ....that is so in command of orchestrating the 6N1P-EV's from Steve-the Output Tubes of my CSP3.....it works well driving into the National's.

I have two of the Telefunken and worked them as a Pair in the Outputs of the CSP3 and Inputs on A12 an B12 of my ZMA. But, need it as the Master and Commander as an Input Tube on the CSP3 only.

I do need to put the Nationals, as I mentioned, as a pair Out-putting from my CSP3 though. I have not tried that combination.
Back to top
 
 

Sony as Transport
Illuminati D-60
Audio Alchemy DTI-Pro
Audio Magic Mystic Reference I2S
Audio Alchemy DDE 3.0
Kimber Select 1030
Zen Select #76
Kimber Select 3033
Polk Audio LS-90
Tri-config/TipToes & Vibropods underneath Speakers
360 degree Rm Treats
  IP Logged
stone_of_tone
Seasoned Member
****


Listen Often/Listen
Deep

Posts: 2632
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #136 - 05/08/15 at 14:58:26
 
I've had the 6N23P's back in the A12 an B12 positions for a couple days now, with my CSP3 of course with the Tube compliment detailed above.
As great as the 6N23P's are and I will enjoy over the weekend before taking them out..........I need/enjoy more of the top air extension and deep, deep bass the Nationals produce being driven into by my CSP3. Awesome to Tube Roll!  Solid State sucks!

I am glad I have a Cryoset Quad of the 6N23P's in my On-deck Circle. Enjoy them enough to rotate in for sure.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 05/08/15 at 15:14:07 by stone_of_tone »  

Sony as Transport
Illuminati D-60
Audio Alchemy DTI-Pro
Audio Magic Mystic Reference I2S
Audio Alchemy DDE 3.0
Kimber Select 1030
Zen Select #76
Kimber Select 3033
Polk Audio LS-90
Tri-config/TipToes & Vibropods underneath Speakers
360 degree Rm Treats
  IP Logged
stone_of_tone
Seasoned Member
****


Listen Often/Listen
Deep

Posts: 2632
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #137 - 05/10/15 at 13:32:26
 
A pair of Ediswan CV2492 / 6922 from Upscale are coming in. I will put them in the A12 an B12/ZMA. I can't contain my lust for this Tube any longer. The textured midrange is supposed to be something. I will report back in a month or two on these babies.
Back to top
 
 

Sony as Transport
Illuminati D-60
Audio Alchemy DTI-Pro
Audio Magic Mystic Reference I2S
Audio Alchemy DDE 3.0
Kimber Select 1030
Zen Select #76
Kimber Select 3033
Polk Audio LS-90
Tri-config/TipToes & Vibropods underneath Speakers
360 degree Rm Treats
  IP Logged
stone_of_tone
Seasoned Member
****


Listen Often/Listen
Deep

Posts: 2632
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #138 - 07/22/15 at 14:04:01
 
I finally put my Ediswan CV2492 / 6922 from Upscale in my A12 an B12 slots of my ZMA. I have 10 + hours on them from last night and today. No hype in my opinion from customer reviews for this tube!  I like! I will see what I think of them 100 hours from now.
Back to top
 
 

Sony as Transport
Illuminati D-60
Audio Alchemy DTI-Pro
Audio Magic Mystic Reference I2S
Audio Alchemy DDE 3.0
Kimber Select 1030
Zen Select #76
Kimber Select 3033
Polk Audio LS-90
Tri-config/TipToes & Vibropods underneath Speakers
360 degree Rm Treats
  IP Logged
stone_of_tone
Seasoned Member
****


Listen Often/Listen
Deep

Posts: 2632
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #139 - 07/23/15 at 17:46:21
 
I don't mean to create confusion by using the Owner's manual number positions for the Input Tubes of the ZMA (A12 & B12). I do it, so others do not confuse them with the phase inverter tubes positions. I will just refer to them as the Input Tube positions going forward. We OWN the ZMA.  

I have enjoyed rolling 5 pair of tubes through the Inputs of the ZMA:
The shipped with 6N23P's
NOS Sovtek 6922's (True NOS)
NOS Platinum National 7DJ8's
http://www.upscaleaudio.com/matsushita-national-pcc88-7dj8/
NOS Platinum Telefunken 6922"s
http://www.upscaleaudio.com/telefunken-e88cc-6922/
NOS Platinum Ediswan 6922's
http://www.upscaleaudio.com/ediswan-cv2492-6922/

The Ediswan's are breathtaking in what they are providing to the Output!  
Stunning midrange texture while maintaining top and bottom end extension.....is NOT hyperbole!

Expensive, yeah~and worth it. Highly recommend the Ediswan's with the rest of Steve's Tube compliment shipped:
Tung-Sol KT66's (Bias at: 48 mA)
NOS 0A3 JAN Sylvania USA (or USA RCA NOS 0A3)
6N23P's as inverter's.

I use the NOS Platinum Telefunken 6922 as my Input Tube in my CSP3. Talk about the Master & Commander Tube for my 6N1P-EV's shipped from Steve with the CSP3......clarity/transparency...provided to ZMA.




Listening Room:
Room Treatments from Michael Green & Home Brew

Sony as Transport (DVP-NS57P)/Sandwich weighted for Isolation
Illuminati D-60 Digital Coax IC

Decware ZDSD DAC / Recorder (@ -20 Ref Level @ 16/176.4)

AURALiC Vega D/A processor.....coming!

WBT-0102Ag RCA Kimber Select KS1030
Decware CSP3 w/Jupiter Caps (NOS/Platinum/Telefunken 6922/E88CC .....for Input Tube)
WBT-0102Ag RCA Kimber Select KS1030

Decware Zen Mystery Amplifier
***NOS/Platinum/Ediswan's CV2492/6922 in my A12 an B12 positions***

Kimber Select KS3033 Speaker Cable
Acoustic Zen Adagio - Black Pearl (Modified)
M-CAP® Supreme Silver / Gold & Oil.....pending this Fall!

Acoustic Zen Adagio's x-over's Modified/Full Range with Mundorf MCap Supremes-single Cap to each Tweeter/4.5k cross
(Gutted: 3kHz/18dB/Octave, Linkwitz/Riley Crossovers....with all crappy parts = gone)

XLO Pro Power Cords to CSP3 an ZMA
PS Audio P3 Power Plant / Pangea AC-9SE from wall to P3
(Transport, ZDSD an CSP3, Regenerated/120 ~ Multiwave off...ZMA on High Current Output)




Decware SE84CS (NOS Svetlana SV83's from 1980's-not the New Sensor knock-offs) ...when SE Pentodes run in Triode/Decware Style...needs to be in the System!
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 07/23/15 at 18:36:13 by stone_of_tone »  

Sony as Transport
Illuminati D-60
Audio Alchemy DTI-Pro
Audio Magic Mystic Reference I2S
Audio Alchemy DDE 3.0
Kimber Select 1030
Zen Select #76
Kimber Select 3033
Polk Audio LS-90
Tri-config/TipToes & Vibropods underneath Speakers
360 degree Rm Treats
  IP Logged
stone_of_tone
Seasoned Member
****


Listen Often/Listen
Deep

Posts: 2632
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #140 - 07/31/15 at 19:10:31
 
Over 70 hours on the Ediswan's. Love um'.
Back to top
 
 

Sony as Transport
Illuminati D-60
Audio Alchemy DTI-Pro
Audio Magic Mystic Reference I2S
Audio Alchemy DDE 3.0
Kimber Select 1030
Zen Select #76
Kimber Select 3033
Polk Audio LS-90
Tri-config/TipToes & Vibropods underneath Speakers
360 degree Rm Treats
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 2962
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #141 - 07/31/15 at 21:32:46
 

I've got some noise coming from my Nationals. I think I'm going back to the stock tubes.

Last I had my Amp at Decware, Steve said my tubes are looking tired...I probably should just go with a fresh set all around. I'm pretty sure I've got close to 1000 hours on the amp by now.
Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
stone_of_tone
Seasoned Member
****


Listen Often/Listen
Deep

Posts: 2632
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #142 - 08/01/15 at 17:45:09
 
Oh yeah, I have one KT66 wavering slightly. Nice, we can see that with a ZMA and its most bodacious meters! I bet I have 1500 hours plus on my ZMA.

I will replace the quad KT66's, put in my new matched cryoed/quad 6N23P's from Cryoset....get a feel for the original sound again before returning my Ediswan's back to the Input stage.

I think my 0A3's are still hardy?
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 08/01/15 at 17:45:43 by stone_of_tone »  

Sony as Transport
Illuminati D-60
Audio Alchemy DTI-Pro
Audio Magic Mystic Reference I2S
Audio Alchemy DDE 3.0
Kimber Select 1030
Zen Select #76
Kimber Select 3033
Polk Audio LS-90
Tri-config/TipToes & Vibropods underneath Speakers
360 degree Rm Treats
  IP Logged
Archie
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 688
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #143 - 08/02/15 at 00:58:56
 
I was under the impression that the tubes generally lasted more into the 5 digit range.  What can we expect to get out of our ZMA tubes?  What's a "tired" tube look like anyway?  I know we can see the health of the power tubes from the meters so I'm refering to the others.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
lLance
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 164
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #144 - 08/02/15 at 17:25:22
 
I just replaced a quad of Gold Lion KT66 from Cryoset in my ZMA with the exact same tubes. This new quad of Gold Lions don't seem to bias like the last pair. Can't get them below 62ma. This will be a problem I think. I see you guys talking about the Tung Sols, maybe I go back and try them again.
Back to top
 
 

ZMA, ZTpre, VPI Scout 1.1 & Soundsmith Zepher Cart, Janszen zA2.1 Speakers, PS Audio DSD, Berkeley Audio Alpha USB, PS Audio P10, Win 8 & J River app, Morrow Cables Triode Wire Labs #7 & Lessloss PC, voodoo AES
  IP Logged
Archie
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 688
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #145 - 08/02/15 at 19:55:07
 
lLance, you wore out a quad of the GLs already?  Mine bias to about 56.  Steve told me that he goes into the 80s but that he runs the system hard at that point.  You can ask him but I doubt there's and issue at 62.  The transformers might run hotter but I think I read that they are good for around 145 degrees.  When I was biasing at 60 with the stock Tuns Sols my trans were under 125 degrees.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
stone_of_tone
Seasoned Member
****


Listen Often/Listen
Deep

Posts: 2632
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #146 - 12/16/15 at 15:18:51
 
Added a pair of Upscale Audio NOS Platinum Cryogenic Ediswan's for CSP3 Outputs (see tube sig's below). With them running into my ZMA Ediswan Inputs........no looking back!

Highly recommended. If you get them and don't like them....I will most likely buy them from you..... . PM me, I'll check back in a month or two. I would not mind having an Insurance pair (or two), 4 to 5000 hours down the road to replace one or both of the pair's I'm running.  







Listening Room:



Room Treatments from Michael Green & Home Brew

Sony as Transport (DVP-NS57P)/Sandwich weighted for Isolation

Illuminati D-60 Digital Coax IC

****Shunyata Research ZiTron Alpha Digital Power Cord****
{you need to experience the next level it can take your DAC}

Decware ZDSD DAC / Recorder
***************************************************************
W/Steve's Output Transformer's/kicking to the curb quite a few superb DAC'S!
***************************************************************
(@ -20 Ref Level, 0.0 Input volume and @ 16/192)
{also @ kept/-20 Ref Level & -.5db or -1.0 Input volume Level}


WBT-0102Ag RCA Kimber Select KS1030

Decware CSP3 w/Jupiter Caps
(NOS/Platinum/Telefunken 6922/E88CC for Input Tube~NOS/Platinum/Ediswan's CV2492/6922 for Output Tubes & 5U4G-C Rectifier)
****************************************************
10 of 10 for Input tube & 9 of 10 voltage for Output tubes
Volume adjustment usage at 25% to 35% of usable volume
****************************************************

WBT-0102Ag RCA Kimber Select KS1030

Decware Zen Mystery Amplifier
(NOS/Platinum/Ediswan's CV2492/6922 in my A12 an B12 positions~6N23P-EV's for Inverter Tubes~JAN Sylvania 0A3's & Tung-Sol KT66's)
ZMA adjusted at 25% to 30% of usable volume

***************************************************
Kimber Select KS6063 Speaker Cable 8ft WBT-0681-Ag Spades
***************************************************

Acoustic Zen Adagio - Black Pearl (Modified)




Acoustic Zen Adagio's x-over's Modified/Full Range with Mundorf MCap Supremes-single Cap to each Tweeter/4.5k cross
(Gutted: 3kHz/18dB/Octave, Linkwitz/Riley Crossovers....with all crappy parts = gone)

XLO Pro Power Cords to CSP3 an ZMA
PS Audio P3 Power Plant / Pangea AC-9SE from wall to P3
(Transport, ZDSD an CSP3, Regenerated/120 ~ Multiwave off...ZMA on High Current Output)

PS=the: NOS/Platinum/Ediswan's CV2492/6922 /Inputs = ZMA are breathtaking.............. .

NOS/Platinum/Telefunken 6922/E88CC for Input Tube/CSP3 ~ not taken for granted neither......... .
NOS/Platinum/Ediswan's CV2492/6922 for CSP3 Outputs = Stellar!
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 12/16/15 at 15:22:54 by stone_of_tone »  

Sony as Transport
Illuminati D-60
Audio Alchemy DTI-Pro
Audio Magic Mystic Reference I2S
Audio Alchemy DDE 3.0
Kimber Select 1030
Zen Select #76
Kimber Select 3033
Polk Audio LS-90
Tri-config/TipToes & Vibropods underneath Speakers
360 degree Rm Treats
  IP Logged
stone_of_tone
Seasoned Member
****


Listen Often/Listen
Deep

Posts: 2632
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #147 - 12/22/15 at 15:42:21
 
I went back to my 6N1P-EV's as Output pre tubes for my CSP3. Double Ediswan's was to much of a good thing (Edi's out to Edi's in of ZMA).

But, an absolute must for my System is the NOS Platinum Telefunken I'm running for Input of my CSP3 and THE NOS Platinum Ediswan's for Input's of my Zen Mystery Amp.

I have NOS Cryogenic 6N23P-EV's (the good ones), from Cryoset....before they went extinct....and love them...and will switch them in ZMA Input's now and then going forward. .....but, the Ediswan's are my FAV's for Input's for my ZMA!!!!

....and of course now, I have a tucked away pair of NOS plat/Edi's....for 5000 hours from now.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 12/22/15 at 15:44:13 by stone_of_tone »  

Sony as Transport
Illuminati D-60
Audio Alchemy DTI-Pro
Audio Magic Mystic Reference I2S
Audio Alchemy DDE 3.0
Kimber Select 1030
Zen Select #76
Kimber Select 3033
Polk Audio LS-90
Tri-config/TipToes & Vibropods underneath Speakers
360 degree Rm Treats
  IP Logged
Lonely Raven
Seasoned Member
****


Jack of all Trades,
Master of None

Posts: 2962
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #148 - 12/28/15 at 19:46:00
 

Stone, my power tubes are really tired - what are you using for power tubes on the ZMA?

Back to top
 
 
WWW Lonely Raven   IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 13013
Re: Anyone Tube Roll with the ZMA yet?
Reply #149 - 12/28/15 at 20:20:28
 
LR, if I can make a suggestion I'd recommend considering the TAD KT-66 from cryoset.com I've had these for more than 2,000 hours of really great playback. Very balanced tube frequency wise, dynamic. I've had the Tung-Sol and Gold Lion KT-66 but the TAD are better in my amps.

http://www.cryoset.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=394&osCsid=96kba50l4...
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 12/28/15 at 20:25:27 by Lon »  

HR-1,ZP3,ZTPRE,Torii MkIII,ZBIT,ZROCK2,Taboo MkIV;PS Audio:Soloist SE,DMP+DSD,P10,PowerBases,AC-12 pcs,Mapleshade:Dbl Helix+,SamsonV2+V3;CambrAudi CXU;Rega RP3,TTPSU,Groovetracer upgrades,Exact2;VooDoo Cremona +Amati,Iso-Pods;MD90-T SE tuner,Oppo PM-1,Audeze LCD-2
  IP Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 
Send Topic Print