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changing capacitor values on ERR (Read 510 times)
tom collins
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changing capacitor values on ERR
03/25/14 at 16:19:15
 
Guys:  Before I bother Steve, I thought I would see if you all have some suggestions.
Frankly, I love everything about the ERRs but one thing.  On some vocalists, Cat Stevens and now Shelby Lynne, the range of their voices is congetsted and almost cupped-hands like.  Does anyone have any experience in having changed the values of the Caps that are the crossover on this speaker?

Thanks.

Tom
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ZYGI
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Re: changing capacitor values on ERR
Reply #1 - 03/27/14 at 01:18:52
 
Tom,

Are you saying congested or might it sound more nasal like?

Zygi
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tom collins
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Re: changing capacitor values on ERR
Reply #2 - 03/27/14 at 22:26:08
 
deeper, throatier, recessed is the best i can describe it.
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will
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Re: changing capacitor values on ERR
Reply #3 - 03/30/14 at 02:05:25
 
Tom,

I don't have the ERR but have played with HR-1s. I ended up with minor cap value changes from 3.3 to 3.4 using a Mundorf Supreme 3.3 with a K40Y-9 .1uf wired parallel, taking the range of the tweeter a little lower; and added a .1uf K40 bypass cap from the hot speaker wire terminal in, and bypassing the resistor and main cap so it directly connects the amp to the tweeter, heightening the high highs a bit.

I also really liked the character of Mundorf M-Resist Supreme resistor. Since it was so smooth and solid, it felt less bright, so I compensated using a 2.7 resistor rather than the 3.0 wirewound I had been using.


I tried a number of different caps, and particularly for the bypasses, NOS PIO Russian K40Y-9 really excelled. As an example, some auricaps of the same value sounded unnatural and hard...electronic...whereas the PIOs are smooth and musical.

With the then stock Clarity SA caps, I probably would not have gone with the bypasses as the Clarities were brighter feeling per value than the Mundorfs, but with this Mundorf, the smooth musicality of the K40s bring a balance to the sound that is very real sounding, with more subtle detail, smoothly bringing out textures and ambiance and all very well.

Between the caps and resistor, I made the speakers a bit brighter, but they don't feel bright to me because of the balance and synergy this arrangement gives. The highs are more detailed, without a sense of being overly bright. Beautiful. In retrospect, I think what was happening as I explored (over some months) was that I was optimizing the detail character as much as the quantity, and the deeper I got, the more fascinating the tuning subtleties became.

In my system/room this made the speaker much better... to me anyway.

Maybe you already tried this, but before caps, I was wondering about resistors. It might be interesting to just run a straight copper wire instead of the resister to get a sense of what fully increasing the tweeter's volume does related to this issue....maybe a less resistant resistor would help.
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« Last Edit: 03/30/14 at 02:06:19 by will »  

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Lon
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Re: changing capacitor values on ERR
Reply #4 - 03/30/14 at 02:13:17
 
I missed this thread first time around. I agree with Will, try a resistor change. Or I also wonder. .. how old are your tubes (if you're using a tube amp). That sort of recessed and rough vocal sound I have heard when my power tubes had sort of gone past their prime. . . . That was what first came to my mind. I have ERRs that I now have in my parents' system where I do most of my listening. I haven't played around with capacitors, Bob set mine up with me in mind, knowing my experience with the three other sets of speakers he built me before the ERRs, and I think he got that part just right for me. But I have used a number of resistor values and a lower value may also be a fix, especially if your power tubes are in nice shape.
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tom collins
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Re: changing capacitor values on ERR
Reply #5 - 03/31/14 at 23:34:00
 
thanks for your well reasoned replies.  i will consider this.  the tubes are very fresh and i have 3 sets with all 3 displaying the same quality.

tom
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Lon
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Re: changing capacitor values on ERR
Reply #6 - 04/01/14 at 00:32:26
 
Good, it's not the tubes then. Playing with resistors is a good start.
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Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+PWD MkII,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
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tom collins
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Re: changing capacitor values on ERR
Reply #7 - 04/04/14 at 19:03:45
 
incidently, i tried something else with these.  i wondered if the lowness of the mid/woof could be partly responsible since they are so far below ear level.  i brought in some standard  bricks and put them under the speaker.  the stage is definitely taller. i think but am not yet sure about the other problem.  i recently changed rooms and sit much closer, so now it is a greater angle for the sound to reach my ears when seated. i think the bass may be a little more defined as well.
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