Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Decware Audio Forums
08/22/14 at 20:49:29


Pages: 1 2 3 4 ... 8
Send Topic Print
CSP3 #001 - First photos (Read 14267 times)
Rizlaw
Senior Member
***




Posts: 78
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #15 - 08/27/13 at 14:57:46
 
deucekazoo,

Thanks for the tip. I may just look into that, although I wonder how well and how long such a spray job would last without peeling or flaking off the existing base finish?
Back to top
 
 

System 1: Computer/Linux OS > Audiophileo 2 > W4S DAC-2 > Woo WA-2 / CSP3 > Taboo III > Omega 3E / LCD-2.1/ Beyer DT-990/DT-1350
System 2: Yamaha PX-2 (Shure Ultra) / Oppo DV983H > Classe CAP2100 > Thiel 7.2
System 3: Fisher:R200/X202B > Magnapan MMG
  IP Logged
deucekazoo
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 199
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #16 - 08/27/13 at 15:41:57
 
That is why I mentioned the spray for wheels. Between brake dust and the elements the wheels see, you touching the knobs for adjustment should be nothing. Just make sure they are very clean and oil free before you paint.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
thegrobe
Verified Member
**




Posts: 25
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #17 - 08/30/13 at 07:33:45
 
That's a pretty cool idea to add some knobs on the shafts. That's something I'll keep an eye out for....just the right knobs as a finishing touch!

I got an e-mail today fast my CSP3 is "on the bench" so the agonizing wait is creeping along.... Smiley
Back to top
 
 

Jriver MC > Audiophilleo 2+PurePower > Audio-GD SA-2 DAC > Decware Zen Triode CSP3 > Decware Zen Taboo mkIII > Norse Audio Skuld 8 > HD800 (also: DH Labs Silver Revelation / SoundSilver Interconnects...And a few fistfulls of tubes!)
  IP Logged
will
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1180
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #18 - 09/05/13 at 02:30:11
 
Got mine today, and it already sounds amazing. Sort of mimicking the stock set, I am using a cryo'd Valve Art 274B, a cryo'd NOS Sylvania 7308 in front, and a pair of cryo'd 6N1Ps. I think this is the first new piece of audio gear that does not bother me in some way before burnin. Wow, I look forward to a couple hundred hours!

I am ignorant about the silver stepped pots....two near the front input tube and the other two, near each back 6N1P. Any advice on what exactly they do voltage-wise and perhaps thoughts on adjustments?

Thanks,

Will
Back to top
 
 

Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, modded Oppo 83, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7352
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #19 - 09/05/13 at 03:29:27
 
The 2+ is such a great preamp it is no surprise that the 3 is. Congrats.

I am sure one set of pots controls the input gain, the other the output (you knew that). I've played around with these a lot and it all depends on the sources they're connected to and the amp. I find that the input just one click back from all the way up and the output six clicks from all the way works best for me (allowing me just a bit more than the loudest volume I need on my quietest source, the DVR (through the PWD Mk II).
Back to top
 
 

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
  IP Logged
Lord Soth
Seasoned Member
****


I'm an American
BadAss!

Posts: 246
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #20 - 09/05/13 at 03:32:15
 
Hi will,

Congrats on your new "toy"! Wink

The main volume knob is the one right in front.

There are 2 sets of other knobs which control the left and right volume for either

1. Headphone Impedance
The CSP was designed for high Ohm impedance headphones.
For my 600 Ohms Beyer T1, I crank it to maximum volume.
If you are using a 300 Ohms or 80 Ohms headphone, the CSP will sound better if this is turned down.

2. Preamp Output
If you are using the CSP as a preamp, this will control the voltage output.

The items listed in 1. and 2. above should be adjusted in combination with the main volume knob in front.

Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Rizlaw
Senior Member
***




Posts: 78
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #21 - 09/05/13 at 17:08:54
 
Quote:
Will
Got mine today, and it already sounds amazing. Sort of mimicking the stock set, I am using a cryo'd Valve Art 274B, a cryo'd NOS Sylvania 7308 in front, and a pair of cryo'd 6N1Ps. I think this is the first new piece of audio gear that does not bother me in some way before burnin. Wow, I look forward to a couple hundred hours!


Will, congratulaltions on your new CSP3. You're using the same tube compliment that I'm using, except I have a Telefunken E88CC for the input tube. I tried an Amperex 7308, but I found the Tele sounded smoother, more detailed with a better 3D soundstage. I'm also finding that the Cryoset VA 274B seems to be holding up much better than the non-cryo'd VA 274B I originally got with my Taboo III (so far, after about 200+ hours, no arcing on both Cryoset VA 274Bs in the CSP3 and Taboo III).

So far, I have to say that I'm very impressed with the improvements in sound I'm hearing from the CSP3 over the CSP2+ (and I really, really liked the CSP2+). I'm still tormenting myself with whether Steve's silver  unshielded IC would make any meaningful difference over my current silver Audioquest Diamond ICs between my DAC and the CSP3 and the CSP3 and Taboo III.

I'm also impressed at just how much better my Beyer DT-990/600 sound through the CSP3 as opposed to my Woo WA2 (fully tricked out with all the options including Blackgate Caps). My WA2 cost 2x the CSP3 (fully loaded). Both are OTL designs, and yet, the CSP3 just sounds like it has more power, clarity and 3D soundstaging.  This audible impression also holds true, to a lesser extent, with my LCD-2 phones; they just sound better through the CSP3 and better still through the Taboo III (Lucid mode 1). I believe Lord Soth mentioned he was using T-1s with the CSP3, I'd be interested to hear his opinion of how they sound via the CSP3, since I was considering a new pair of Beyer T-90s (one step down from the T-1s).
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 09/05/13 at 17:09:56 by Rizlaw »  

System 1: Computer/Linux OS > Audiophileo 2 > W4S DAC-2 > Woo WA-2 / CSP3 > Taboo III > Omega 3E / LCD-2.1/ Beyer DT-990/DT-1350
System 2: Yamaha PX-2 (Shure Ultra) / Oppo DV983H > Classe CAP2100 > Thiel 7.2
System 3: Fisher:R200/X202B > Magnapan MMG
  IP Logged
Lord Soth
Seasoned Member
****


I'm an American
BadAss!

Posts: 246
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #22 - 09/05/13 at 17:39:35
 
Hi Rizlaw,

As soon as I receive my new CSP3 (Beeswax caps with stepped attenuator), I'll be able to compare it against the CSP2+ (non beeswax with stepped attenuator) which I'm currently pairing with my Beyer T1.

Will be using the same tube complement

1x Amperex E88CC Pinched Waist in Front
2x Siemens E288CC L/R
1x Brimar 5R4GY D Getter Rectifier

The 3D soundstage really opened up for me when I tried the E288CC in the CSP2+. This was a relatively new discovery for me.

To my ears, and as per Joe's tube lore, the E88CC Pinched Waist sounds the "best".
The only weakness was the slightly smaller soundstage, especially when compared against the Lorenz PCC88, which also deserves universal acclaim.

When I popped in the E288CC, there was a substantial expansion of the 3D soundstage and this complemented the weakness of the Pinched Waist E88CC.

To my ears, the CSP2+ with the Beyer T1 is perfect to my ears.

Just wanted to get another CSP2+, lo and behold, Decware just released the CSP3, so the timing was really fortuitous.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7352
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #23 - 09/05/13 at 17:56:02
 
Yeah, the CSP2+ is perfect to my ears and for my needs too and my only plan was in time to get the beeswax caps added.

And then lo and behold Steve sent around an email that he had three CSP2+ in white ready made to sell and one had the beeswax caps. I asked for stepped attenuators on it and should have it in a week or so. This will allow me to put one of my CSP2+ in my second system, and the trusty old CSP2 there in my Dad's system. I also just bought a used California Audio Lab cd changer (CL-10) for that system, these two additions should make a big difference. (I have to stop spending money!)
Back to top
 
 

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
  IP Logged
Lord Soth
Seasoned Member
****


I'm an American
BadAss!

Posts: 246
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #24 - 09/05/13 at 18:07:28
 
Hi Lon,

I'm glad to finally join your special "club" of owning more than one of these CSP sonic beauties.

The sound is just awesome when used as either a preamp or as a headphone amp.

Sometime further down the road, I might even consider getting one more for my office.

By that time, I hope that Steve comes up with a CSP4 with tube regulation and meters thrown in. Wink
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
will
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1180
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #25 - 09/06/13 at 00:35:37
 
Thanks all for your responses. This thing is great. When I commented earlier,  I was listening to the CSP3 with a Rachel I am auditioning. The synergy of the Rachel and CSP3 (with the tubes I had in) was crazy good. Beautiful, even with the CSP3 new. Dynamic yet very relaxed...dead quiet, very musical, but also very defined...gorgeous pacing.

Trouble is the Rachel is just not loud enough with my HR-1s, in my room, and for my tastes. It is awesome with easy music, but once there is a fair bit of bass energy and dynamics, I want to drive it to distortion.

So the big question...MkIV, or two Rachels Bridged? Both so good and so different! Now I am confused, but not about the CSP3!
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 09/06/13 at 06:13:16 by will »  

Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, modded Oppo 83, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
  IP Logged
will
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1180
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #26 - 09/06/13 at 16:57:21
 
After looking at Lord Soth's tube setup for his CSP2+, in my CSP3, I tried some 5R4GY, now enjoying a Chatham 5R4GWY. I have tried multiple 6922s in the second position, and they make a repeated, terrible electronic tick sound. Same happens with different rectifiers, and with 6922 or 6N1P in the front postion.

Any thoughts?
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 09/06/13 at 16:57:48 by will »  

Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, modded Oppo 83, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
  IP Logged
Rizlaw
Senior Member
***




Posts: 78
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #27 - 09/06/13 at 17:32:00
 
Will,

The second position (output tubes) for the matched pair of 6922s or 6N1Ps is, as Steve explained to me, very hard on marginal tubes because it's an SRPP circuit. My recollection is that Steve describes the SRPP in the CSP2+ design notes. You can also read about it here: http://www.freewebs.com/valvewizard1/srpp.html

Steve says you need "strong" tubes in this position. Even tubes that test good might not be strong enough. I had a similar problem with a pair of premo Telefunken E88CC from Upscale Audio. In the output positions of my CSP3 the Telefunkens caused very loud noises through my speakers for several seconds after turn-on and then calmed down. The same Telefunken pair worked fine in my other tube gear. When I returned my stock or cryo'd matched pair of 6N1Ps the problem disappeared.

I have had no issues with the Phillips 5R4GYS rectifier in the CSP3, nor with 6N1P, 6922, E88CC or 7308 tubes in input (front) position. Unlike the driver positions, the input tube position should present no problems for a working tube.

As I previously mentioned, in my CSP3 I am currently using:

Rectifier -        Cryoset Valve Art 274B
Output tubes - Cryoset matched pair 6N1P-EV
Input tube -     Telefunken E88CC

The CSP3 is dead quiet and sounds wonderful.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 09/06/13 at 17:40:20 by Rizlaw »  

System 1: Computer/Linux OS > Audiophileo 2 > W4S DAC-2 > Woo WA-2 / CSP3 > Taboo III > Omega 3E / LCD-2.1/ Beyer DT-990/DT-1350
System 2: Yamaha PX-2 (Shure Ultra) / Oppo DV983H > Classe CAP2100 > Thiel 7.2
System 3: Fisher:R200/X202B > Magnapan MMG
  IP Logged
will
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1180
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #28 - 09/06/13 at 20:05:21
 
Thanks Rizlaw.

Interesting. I did some checking with my most apparently NOS and carefully matched 6922s, and no luck. I wonder if Steve has adjusted some part(s) of the circuit contributing to the improvements you are hearing over the CSP2+. I recall that 6N1Ps draw more current, something like 600mah as opposed to about 300mah for 6922. I have no idea what this might mean...but I can't find any of my many 6922s or 623NPs that work in the output postions.

Kind of hate to be bound to one tube type there, but the rectifiers, input tube, and pot adjustments are clearly good for tuning...
Back to top
 
 

Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, modded Oppo 83, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
  IP Logged
Rizlaw
Senior Member
***




Posts: 78
Re: CSP3 #001 - First photos
Reply #29 - 09/06/13 at 23:28:10
 
Will,

Quote:
I wonder if Steve has adjusted some part(s) of the circuit contributing to the improvements you are hearing over the CSP2+.


Based upon what Steve previously told me over the phone and what I read others were told over the phone, the basic CSP3 has the same circuit layout as the CSP2+. However, the physical layout has changed resulting in some wiring being shortened and more space for the Jupiter Caps. The addition of the optional Jupiter Beeswax Cryo Caps, IMO, is what adds the major sauce for the improved sound over the CSP2+. The optional stepped attenuator also helps. I had a stock CSP2+ without these two improvements which I thought sounded great, but the Jupiter Caps and stepped attenuator take the CSP3 up a notch or two.

Quote:
. . . but I can't find any of my many 6922s or 623NPs that work in the output postions.


Since Steve designed the CSP3 to work with the 6922 and 6N1P type tubes, I imagine that the 6922s you have on hand are simply not "strong" enough for the SRPP output positions. I certainly don't know enough about tube electronics to say anything more. Your best bet would be to call Steve and ask him what he feels would work in a 6922 type tube. I do know that my NOS matched pair of Amperex 7308s worked O.K., as did a NOS matched pair of National (Japan) 7DJ8s. The only failure (from a turn-on noise perspective) was my Telefunken E88CC pair; the most expensive NOS pair I have. Cry

Edit: Just found the post Steve made in which he talks, briefly, about SRPP circuit in the CSP2+/CSP3:
Quote:
The CSP2 circuit consists of a gain stage with higher plate voltages driving a SRPP stage similar to the original MLB design.  The stages are direct coupled.  The SRPP stage drives the output capacitors.  The line level is taken directly off the outputs via a 100K precision trim pot.  The output impedance is about 10 times lower then the CSP so using line level outputs has no audible effect on the sound of the headphones.  

http://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1150678070

Today, I ordered 3 pairs of Steve's silver IC cables. Steve says I should hear another improvement with these new cables. So far, he's been dead on with what he says I will hear which each piece I've purchased, so I'm anxious to hear the new cables.

Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 09/06/13 at 23:41:59 by Rizlaw »  

System 1: Computer/Linux OS > Audiophileo 2 > W4S DAC-2 > Woo WA-2 / CSP3 > Taboo III > Omega 3E / LCD-2.1/ Beyer DT-990/DT-1350
System 2: Yamaha PX-2 (Shure Ultra) / Oppo DV983H > Classe CAP2100 > Thiel 7.2
System 3: Fisher:R200/X202B > Magnapan MMG
  IP Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 4 ... 8
Send Topic Print