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Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables (Read 11291 times)
beowulf
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Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
08/16/13 at 23:18:01
 
Hi all ... there's so many choices out there regarding cables that I thought I would get your feedback.

I need 10 feet minimum (bi-wiring N/A) and I can only spend $350 MAX.

Here is my equipment:

Amplification:

(a) Decware Taboo MkII and,
(b) Rega Brio-R.

The Taboo can take all kinds of connections, but the Brio-R is a pretty tight squeeze and I'm thinking only bananas would work there.

Speakers:

(a) Omega XRS Style Tower.

They are a new model that are not on Louis' website yet, but use the 7F driver which are around 94dB at 8 Ohms ... single drivers = no crossovers, etc.

Sources:

(a) Rega RP6 TT with Exact 2 Cart
(b) Rega Fono MM Phono Stage (the Brio-R has its own phono stage, but I use this with the Taboo MkII)
(c) Rega DAC with Musical Fidelity V-Link 192 USB/SPDIF converter (I'll be using my PC with JRiver MC 18)

Cabling:

(a) RCA Interconnects are Decware Silver Ref and Rega Couple 2.
(b) WireWorld Ultraviolet USB and SPDIF 75 ohm.

So far I have been looking at Dave's Cables and Reality Cables which for a 10' pair with spades on the speaker end and bananas on the amp end just under my budget of $350.

Are there any other hidden gems anyone can recommend that come in around $350?  Also does anybody prefer to run bare wires to both their amp and speakers?

Thanks everybody!
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« Last Edit: 08/16/13 at 23:23:23 by beowulf »  
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will
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #1 - 08/16/13 at 23:52:50
 
I don't know Dave's Cables, but did try Reality. Reality is a good concept (made by an audio head from personal interest, and tested in development by many audio heads with good ears), and value, but finally for me, the speaker cables were a bit too bold...too flow through...a bit in the face. Could just be me, but too much of a good thing is not necessarily the best thing. That said, they were highly recommended by a guy who's ears and mind I really trust. If your system/room is a little restrained, they might be just right. Or they may have changed since I tried them.

I feel a little uncomfortable recommending these since I have not had a chance to do a direct comparison since they have gotten more-or-less burned in, but I am happily using Virtue Audio Nirvanas. Check the sale price on the 3.5 meter pair http://store.virtueaudio.com/category-s/31.htm

$150

They do have a good return policy, so may be worth a try.

I used Decware Styx for a long time, then got tempted by Morrow, and since I was not satisfied with the SP4 (not enough wire, and therefore not enough body and bass), he sent me some SP6s "to make me happy". They were/are good, and prove that smearing with large cable is a real thing (Decware) though not necessarily a bad thing. I really like the Styx. If my memory is at all accurate, I might place the Virtues sort of in between the Morrow and Decware...warm but open, with great body like the Decware, and clean (little smearing) like the Morrow.
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Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
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beowulf
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #2 - 08/17/13 at 00:51:03
 
Hi Will, thanks for the feedback ... I'm glad you chimed in about Morrow as I was just on their website trying to read a bit about them.  The closest Morrow I could get into my budget is only the SP3 AND the SP6 is a huge jump in price at $1700 for a 10' set ... compared to that the Decware Styx are a huge bargain (if your memory serves us correct) and they can compete with the Morrows SP6.

Maybe I'll just use my Blue Jeans until I can find a used pair of Styx ...
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beowulf
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #3 - 08/17/13 at 00:59:17
 
What about Grover Huffman?  Anybody hear his stuff?
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Lon
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #4 - 08/17/13 at 02:44:59
 
Mike (tgarden) likes Huffman stuff, I bet he can give some info.
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Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
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will
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #5 - 08/17/13 at 03:30:06
 
The Morrow stuff is never "retail" if you look. Always some sort of "sale" or discount happening. Seems like I got the SP4 3m to try out for higher 400s, and to satisfy me, he sent over the SP6 at no extra cost. That was pretty good, and they do sound good though they took forever to burn in. I would not pay the 1478 a 3m pair show up at in the shopping cart though! Nowhere near. Interesting...I guess the VirtueAudios are too inexpensive for many to look at! Don't know how they do it, but they sound excellent. Wink

Grover Huffman has tempted me many times for ICs. Seems a lot of folks really like them, and the costs are reasonable for the reported sound! Have not looked into the spk cables.
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« Last Edit: 08/17/13 at 05:30:46 by will »  

Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
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beowulf
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #6 - 08/17/13 at 06:35:33
 
Quote:
will said,
Interesting...I guess the VirtueAudios are too inexpensive for many to look at! Don't know how they do it, but they sound excellent.


LOL I bet Steve D has that problem all the time!  I bet a lot of snobs dismiss his stuff based on price alone and then go buy $25K Shindo Labs products because they cost more so they must be better.

But me ... I'm a cheap bastard always looking for a bargain Grin ... I actually went to VirtueAudios website and emailed them a couple questions in regards to the difference between the Quadraphonic and Nirvana Models ... I just didn't report back on that as I was wrapped up in the Morrow thing.

How do you feel about Morrow's theory on solid core (their wire) vs stranded wire (a lot of other brands including Decware and, Dave's, etc.).

I don't know for sure but Reality Cables look like solid core wire as well, but they aren't saying!

Quote:
Reality Cables FAQ,
What is the "proprietary secret copper material" that you use in your cable
design?

We call it "secret" for a reason. All that we will say is that it is much better than your
typical "six-nines" or "single crystal" types of copper. It also is superior sounding to
any silver wire conductors that we investigated too. This is one of our many secrets
and we don't plan on letting the "cat out of the bag" any time soon. Sorry.



Can anybody tell me what the differences are between OCC vs OFC vs UP-OCC?  Dave's cables use the latter and I checked the costs associated with building a set and I think they are a pretty good deal for a 10' pair of 20 gauge UP-OCC with spades and bananas for $330.
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« Last Edit: 08/17/13 at 06:46:01 by beowulf »  
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Lon
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #7 - 08/17/13 at 07:39:25
 
I have a pair of Reality ICs. They match up very well with the PS Audio GCPH phono preamp I have in my second system. The cables tend to be a bit too forward for my tastes, and the GCPH benefits from their character, whereas elsewhere I didn't like the cables as much as others.

The cables that have most impressed me the last few years (not that I've tried dozens of cables) contain the "Pure Copper by Ohno Continuous Casting." I think there is something to this unique (and costly) casting process as all the cables that I have heard that use metal drawn in this process share a fluid detailed sound that is less edgy and etched in nature than many other cables.  I believe that these can be referred to as OCC and UP-OCC. Look up the Ohno process, fascinating machinery and results. I have not yet used any speaker cables with these metals (I'm still so very happy with the Styx) but I have used Evolution, Analysis Plus, Neotech and Ethereal ICs, coaxial and HDMI cables with these metals
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Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
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will
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #8 - 08/17/13 at 16:50:23
 
Quote:
But me ... I'm a cheap bastard always looking for a bargain


Smiley

Yes, the bargain hunter club is a alive and well!!!  

I am always reminded how thankful I am for these crazy audio heads that make great stuff at relatively reasonable prices!

I don't know Dave's cables, but I have tried a number of cables over time, and those with lower gauge, either the sum of many wires, or single wire, (that I have tried) sound lean to me. Silver, copper, or a combo, wire size so far makes a difference to me. This is not to say I can claim this as a rule, just my experience. The Morrow SP4 compared to the SP6 was an interesting corroboration of this notion...Same theory, same wire, just more wires with the SP6, and it made a notable difference with the Torii and HR-1s. The HR-1s do love unrestricted power though and I can't say, but imagine the single driver Omegas might work better with lighter gauge wire.

The Realities I tried were two strands of insulated solid copper twisted together. I understand that many wires were tested over time and very specific twisting schemes found for the specific wire. Also the wire insulator was chosen based on sound...all carefully tested until the sound was right for them. They were just not quite for me in this system...great range, delivery and speed, just a bit too clarified and bold for me. But then they apparently sound great in many systems.

Luckily, these makers are confident enough about what they make to have great return policies! Finally, taste and room and system will surely make one or another better in a specific setting, but I would guess all will be nice cables with characteristic qualities that might suit one to a T and not another. With these refined systems, how could it be any other way?

As to the Morrow (and others) wire theory...I have not thought a lot about the theory, but I had been listening to my Styx for months on end and when I put in the broken in Morrows, this was the first time I had really listened carefully for blurring or smearing....and some levels of this that I could hear with the styx had disappeared with the Morrows. This was aside from other sound considerations, but the Morrows did bring something together to the sound across the range.

Now is this a big deal...for some I would say yes, and for others...no. I think the Decware cables sound great even with some smearing. By comparison, for me, the Realities...they didn't have notable blurring, but they sounded a bit forward, clear, or bold to me, and though I liked the clarity on one hand, I finally preferred the softer, but still clear enough sound with the Styx. The Morrows, were warmish and very clarified, but in a pleasant, soft way, and quite good to listen to, but when I put in the Virtues, I liked the bigger/rounder/warmer sound by comparison, and I think not particularly smeared. In the end, I suspect I could be happy with any of these.

I will try to get time for direct comparison in the next several days or so. Trouble is, I have a cabinet with holes for wires...makes it a pain in the butt.
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« Last Edit: 08/18/13 at 00:14:37 by will »  

Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
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marky
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #9 - 08/17/13 at 19:57:09
 
Daves cables, yes he`s got quite a selection. I bought quite stiff
silver cable for jumpers and ended up getting 40ft on a whim. Maybe 1/4" thick, black, which he says are suitable for sp cbls. So I made a set up, along with the jumpers. They`ll need quite a bit of taming through burn in and perhaps, who knows. I`ve moved my amps over to the side wall so they wont reach now, I got them out today to have another listen.
`Spose I could bring the speakers a little closer together.
....and the jumpers never worked out..to darn thick really, became a pain trying to shape them. So I bought some  thin dedicated silver jumpers which worked out a treat.
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« Last Edit: 08/17/13 at 20:12:58 by marky »  

Decware: Rachaels x 2 bridged, CSP2+, ZP3, ZMC1, DSC i/c`s, DHC-1 pw/cbl`s. Roksan Radius/Nima/high def cabl & M.BenzLP , M/L aeon i`s, Townshend Isolda sp/cbl`s, Isotek mains sub
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will
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #10 - 08/17/13 at 23:30:43
 
Interesting. I looked at Dave's site after Marky's post...a number of options for sure. I was referring to the 20 gauge wire Beowulf mentioned earlier which Dave says is good up to a 50 watt amp. Not having tried this particular cable, I can't be sure, but no small gauge cable that I have tried had enough body with the Torii. Maybe the Torii is responsible...it is set up in its own way, and acts like a higher power amp by reports. Or maybe this cable has some extra good qualities...I don't know.

With the cotton insulation, I would not think they would take very long to burn in, and the lack of dielectric influence on the sound is compelling.

Nice looking stuff!
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« Last Edit: 08/17/13 at 23:44:35 by will »  

Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
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beowulf
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #11 - 08/18/13 at 01:43:00
 
Dave's a pretty patient guy to ask a lot of questions to as well.

Well, when I was trying to find reviews over a Audiogon for Reality Cables and Morrow Audio ... another vendor kept popping up called Clear Day Cables specifically their Shotgun series.  It's a solid core (double conducters with the Shotgun  design) of 24 GA solid core .999 soft annealed silver wire ... the price seems reasonably low as an 8' pair costs only $270 shipped (low of course relatively speaking ... not compared to Blue Jean Cables Grin).

Anybody heard of these guys at all?
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will
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #12 - 08/18/13 at 02:38:59
 
Clearday shotguns are one of the lower gauge cables that did not have enough body for me. Great guy, easy to deal with, and the cables had amazing clarity without being TOO hard. Maybe a little too clear for me...maybe not, not sure. But I would have needed double shotguns at least, and did not want to go there price-wise at the time. Now, since his prices have not gone up, and everyone else has, the double looks notably less bad. I found the basic sound of the shotguns compelling for sure...clear and a little warm too.

This all may be my system though, pretty different from yours with the Taboo. Again, a good return policy.
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« Last Edit: 08/18/13 at 02:41:38 by will »  

Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
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seikosha
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #13 - 08/18/13 at 02:42:44
 
I recently replaced the lowest version of Morrow with Paul's Clear Day shotgun cables.  I'm very happy.  These cables are more open and detailed in a natural way.
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beowulf
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Re: Suggestions 10' Speaker Cables
Reply #14 - 08/18/13 at 06:22:05
 
I've contacted Paul at Clear Day (very nice and down to Earth fellow) and he said he would send me a loaner pair of the Shotguns ... Paul recommended the Shotguns over the Double Shotguns due to the efficiency of my speakers and the fact that they have no crossovers to get in the way of things.

Pressing my luck I asked for a pair of the Double Shotguns too and I'm waiting to find out if he can send me a pair to demo so I can A and B them next to each other.

Just wanted to say thanks to all who have chimed in thus far. Cool
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