Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Decware Audio Forums
07/26/14 at 02:18:04


Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print
Power Cords (Read 1707 times)
ihmeyers
Verified Member
**




Posts: 12
Power Cords
08/07/13 at 21:17:40
 
Anyone here have experience with Steve's power cords?  They seem reasonably priced when you consider what top of the line power cords go for today.  I remember paying $400 for a power cord 15 years ago which was considered outrageous in the day.  Now it seems $400 buys you a middle of the line cable from the top cord companies.

Thanks in advance.

Ian
Back to top
 
 

A man's gotta make at least one bet a day, else he could be walking around lucky and never know it.
  IP Logged
jsm71
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 100
Re: Power Cords
Reply #1 - 08/07/13 at 23:27:26
 
While I'm waiting for my Torii III I thought I'd try a power cord.  I was using a Pangea AC9 on my solid state amp.  It was ok and I assumed it was allowing reasonable current flow given its 7 gauge rating but I wanted to give Steve's DHC1 a try.

I've been using it close to two months now and it took over a month to really open up and show how transparent the sound could be.  With my SS amp it may be a little too bright but on the Torii I'm guessing it will be a much better match.  I haven't played around with too many PCs.  I do have a Shunyata model on my power conditioner and that works well but it wasn't recommended for amps.  The DHC1 is considerably better sounding than the Pangea if that helps.  No contest.  It is extremely transparent sounding and it lets higher frequencies come out much more.  I have tweeter controls on my speakers and I may have to dial it down just a bit.  I was thinking about that just last night.  

My only complaint is I would like some length options other than just 5 feet.  I had to do some switching around to use it.  The Pangea was 2 meters and could reach a different outlet.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7165
Re: Power Cords
Reply #2 - 08/09/13 at 01:50:52
 
The Decware cord is a very good cord for the money.

I started using PS Audio cords some years back, and when the Perfectwave AC-12 became available I looked for one at a good price (still expensive) and found it blew away any cord I have ever used. I think it's the PCOCC wire used in different guages and shapes, it just make any component I've connected it to "be all it can be" and quite naturally at that. I've found as many as I can used, severely discounted etc. and only need to find two more to completely wire my main system with them. I was once skeptical of power cabling, but I'm sold on these expensive and amazing cords. . . . Try one if you can is my recommendation.
Back to top
 
 

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+PWD MkII,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
  IP Logged
marky
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 500
Re: Power Cords
Reply #3 - 08/10/13 at 00:05:23
 
Well Ian I`ve never purchased a power cord, ever. That is until I started buying Decware amps. 4 amps 4  Decware power cords and the ic`s to join everything up. As I use a good power plant I could have just used the standard cords and thought `well the powers clean so the power cord wont or shouldn`t introduce any distortions`. There is something appealing though with the chunky cords, and what they`re made with, so the budget allowed it and I have no regrets. I cant and probably wont compare them with other cords. It`s all down to improving my front end now as the amps, cords, and ic`s have a synergy I can forget about. I can roll a couple of tubes for a new flavour.

ps the Decware power cords and ic`s promote the `silver` theory of open, airy more fluid sound, and thats what you hear. Not lighweight
at all. One day I might get round to replacing my Townshend Isolda
sp cables which are copper ribbons. They sound very neutral and deliver the `silver` component very well, so no rush.

pps. the PS audio cords Lon enthuses seem very low in price
on e-bay. I wonder if some might be fakes.

Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 08/10/13 at 00:38:28 by marky »  
  IP Logged
Douger
Verified Member
**




Posts: 23
Re: Power Cords
Reply #4 - 08/11/13 at 17:30:17
 
I have been using Steve's PC's for most of a year and am quite happy. A friend brought a pair of Lossless Signatures for a listen,
and they were audibly better, slightly clearer bass, but cost $1149 each...
Steve's cords are a bargain!
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7165
Re: Power Cords
Reply #5 - 08/14/13 at 12:04:54
 
mark,

Yes, there are fakes out there. I never buy one from Hong Kong or China, and am very careful and inquisitive when buying one.
Back to top
 
 

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+PWD MkII,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
  IP Logged
maddog07
Seasoned Member
****


seeker of truth

Posts: 214
Re: Power Cords
Reply #6 - 08/14/13 at 16:31:23
 
I try not to get too caught up in the voodoo science, snake-oil and fairy dust of the "wire" biz.  However... I have tried a few of the “specialty" power cords.  And as bad as I wanted NOT to hear a difference, unfortunately I did.  And I perceived the differences to be an improvement.
Like another forum member reported above, I have settled down to PS Audio power cords.  They do bring out more low level “rez”, details and “dynamics” to my ears – more clear – more “there” there, blacker backgrounds, less hash, haze and noise.
I don’t go any further up the crazy chain than the Perfect Wave AC-5 (which I buy when I can find them used).  The AC-5 is about as big and bulky as I think is feasible to deal with, lest you risk damage to the IEC jacks of the equipment unless you support the power cord somehow – which I do anyway on some components, depending on how the cord lays.  Once you get to such massive power cords, they will lift/move smaller components.

I like the PS cords even if I didn’t think they sounded better, if for no other reason than the “connectors”.  Take a look at the prongs/contacts… these are not stamped brass, or gold plated stamped brass.. but milled from solid chunks of metal.  And then plated and polished to prevent oxidation and tarnishing.  And if you do a little research, you will discover that the wire is welded to the plugs internally, not attached with a screw or soldered – welded.  And then the whole thing is sealed in a molded plug.  I have searched and searched and searched – if you can find a power cord with a better made plug/connector on it – I’d like to know about it.  It doesn’t matter if you buy wattgate, marinco, Oyaide, blah, blah, blah…. Gold plated, platinum plated, rhodium plated, silver plated… they all have stamped brass contacts to start with, with holes in them and wire attached with screws…maybe soldered.  Now, having said and observed all this – Does it matter?  Can you hear a difference?  That is for each individual to decide for themselves.  Remember.. hearing is a perception and partially psychoacoustic, i.e. if you "think" you hear it - then you do - period - end of debate.

I plan to try one of Steve’s and one of Cullen Cables to see how they sound or “if” they sound.  I also have one of Wire World’s Electra 5’s, which I bought out of curiosity, since its wire and braid design is “different” than most others, just to see if it did in fact sound different.  I haven’t had time to actually A/B it to anything yet, as too many other things have been changing in my system recently.  I’ve got to get my system settled in and become familiar with the systems normal sound before I can get down and do any comparing of the minutiae of power cords.  This is my .02 cents on the power cord subject…
Back to top
 
 

Decware Torii MK3, Wyred4Sound DAC2, Theta Digital Miles, Emotiva UMC-1, Emotiva XPA-5, Aesthetix Calypso, Marsh P200b, Martin Logan Vista, Audio Nirvana 12" Alnico's, PS Audio PW P5, Goertz, Kimber, Nordost and DIY wires, PSA pwr cords, I'm outta room..
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7165
Re: Power Cords
Reply #7 - 08/14/13 at 16:34:08
 
m, I agree about the connectors. If you like the AC-5. . . you'd love the AC-12. Hope you get to hear one one of these days. Or maybe not, as when I had one in my system I couldn't be happy with any other!
Back to top
 
 

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+PWD MkII,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
  IP Logged
beowulf
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 743
Re: Power Cords
Reply #8 - 08/14/13 at 21:23:31
 
Anybody had the chance to listen to the Shunyata Power Chords?  Specifically the ones with the ΞTRON technology?  There's a video on youtube showing the technology and how it works compared to a square wave.  It's pretty interesting and even Paul McGowan (PS Audio) mentioned it on one of his musings, so it caught his attention as well.

While they are not inexpensive, IMO the entry level ΞTRON cables are reasonably priced in comparison to a lot of other manufacturers out there.  The entry level ΞTRON Viper runs about $595 for 1.8 meter and the next step up (sexier-garden-hose) ΞTRON Cobra runs $995 for the same length.  But at least there's some science and patented work behind it in comparison to a lot of snake oil and hype that a lot of the others use.

I would be interested in hearing them in comparison to other cables of popular choice such as PS Audio, Kimber, LossLess, Nordost, etc.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 08/14/13 at 21:25:02 by beowulf »  
  IP Logged
maddog07
Seasoned Member
****


seeker of truth

Posts: 214
Re: Power Cords
Reply #9 - 08/14/13 at 22:02:53
 
watched the video - couple of points:
his demo showed the effect of their devices on a 10,000 hz square wave.  A power cord is tasked with passing only one frequency 60 hz AC(in the US - 50hz in Europe).

one of the first thing any power amp does is convert the incoming 60 hz AC to DC... then smooth it with capacitors.

Shunyata is not the first hi-end wire company to "market" on the concept of passing perfect square waves... the late great John Dunlavy had a line of IC's and speaker wire that laid claim to this and were actually sold with the lab measurement results of the testing of each and every pair.  Nordost also has taken this approach at various times thru the years.  And.. Alpha-Core(Goertz), a transformer design and building company as its main business, also bases their high-end speaker cable on passing nearly perfect square waves...at multiple frequencies.
There is no doubt that most of the products flowing out of boutique wire companies have some kind of "effect" on the sound.  The questions are: 1) does the demonstrated "effect" on the signal translate into a "difference" in the sound coming out of your speakers, 2) is the "difference" accurate or just "different", and last but not least, 3) do you perceive the "difference", if any exiss as an improvement?

I am not an electrical engineer.  But I have seen demo's of wire that can pass perfect, as measured on a scope, square waves at multitudes of frequencies.  This is not a "new" revolutionary accomplishment by Shunyata.  I would surmise, that if they have invented a "device" that improves the capability of a given piece of wires ability to pass square waves, that there is an inherent design flaw in the wire they are using to start with.

but as always - the proof is in the "listening".
Back to top
 
 

Decware Torii MK3, Wyred4Sound DAC2, Theta Digital Miles, Emotiva UMC-1, Emotiva XPA-5, Aesthetix Calypso, Marsh P200b, Martin Logan Vista, Audio Nirvana 12" Alnico's, PS Audio PW P5, Goertz, Kimber, Nordost and DIY wires, PSA pwr cords, I'm outta room..
  IP Logged
beowulf
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 743
Re: Power Cords
Reply #10 - 08/14/13 at 23:41:51
 
Hi mad dog, thanks for the feedback and interesting points to ponder and also bringing my attention to some other manufacturers who have already worked on similar designs.

But I'm not sure how you would believe that the cable is flawed though?  As all I'm seeing is their use of micro-circuits that are capable of isolating magnetic and electric waves thus running them independently through the wire.  So it's not actually the wire itself measuring perfect (or close to perfect) the micro-circuits are the ones having the effect on the wire.

So a cleaner signal in can't be bad, however does it make it sound better?  I have to agree with you that better measurements don't neccessarily = better sound.  We can take that from Paul McGowan as well when he was touting his latest amp and when he brought it to an amp shootout it got it's but kicked by a 10 year old tube amp Grin
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 08/14/13 at 23:47:22 by beowulf »  
  IP Logged
maddog07
Seasoned Member
****


seeker of truth

Posts: 214
Re: Power Cords
Reply #11 - 08/15/13 at 03:09:24
 
because I have seen with my own eyes, speaker cable that will pass perfect square waves at many frequencies.... you don't need a "micro processor" added to a piece of wire to make it able to pass perfect 10k square waves.  So... my conclusion is, that Shunyata started with a piece of wire that couldn't pass a 10K square wave in their demo, added their new super-sonic, space-modulated, revolutionary micro-processor to the cable and amazingly it somehow improved the shape of the 10k square wave.  They've created a solution for a problem that doesn't actually exist.  Use a properly designed cable for the intended purpose to start with and you don't have to invent "gizmo's" to fix imaginary problems.  Its like politicians, inventing problems where none exist, so that they can then tax us to provide solutions.  When the answer is, just don't create the problem to start with.  My point being, you don't need a micro processor added to a length of wire to make it pass 10k hz square waves.  You just need a properly engineered cable for the intended use, in this case, to pass frequencies in the human ear's audible range accurately.
Back to top
 
 

Decware Torii MK3, Wyred4Sound DAC2, Theta Digital Miles, Emotiva UMC-1, Emotiva XPA-5, Aesthetix Calypso, Marsh P200b, Martin Logan Vista, Audio Nirvana 12" Alnico's, PS Audio PW P5, Goertz, Kimber, Nordost and DIY wires, PSA pwr cords, I'm outta room..
  IP Logged
beowulf
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 743
Re: Power Cords
Reply #12 - 08/15/13 at 06:00:36
 
Quote:
maddog07 said,
you don't need a micro processor added to a length of wire to make it pass 10k hz square waves.


I see, so why on Earth would Shunyata be doing this if the problem is already solved and has been solved for a long time?  Maybe, they are hoping nobody notices Grin

Even McGowan (a long time cable manufacturer himself) mentioned them in his recent blogs, you would think he would know that this was solved also.  Doesn't make sense, something to ponder though. Huh
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
beowulf
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 743
Re: Power Cords
Reply #13 - 08/15/13 at 06:05:21
 
Quote:
maddog07 said,
you don't need a micro processor added to a length of wire to make it pass 10k hz square waves.


I see, so why on Earth would Shunyata be doing this if the problem is already solved and has been solved for a long time?  Maybe, they are hoping nobody notices Grin

Even McGowan (a long time cable manufacturer himself) mentioned them in his recent blogs, he wasn't touting them as good or bad or anything, he was just saying that Shunyata figured something out, but that doesn't mean it sounds good.

BUT you would think he would know that this equation was already solved a while ago.  Doesn't make sense, something to ponder though. Huh
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
maddog07
Seasoned Member
****


seeker of truth

Posts: 214
Re: Power Cords
Reply #14 - 08/15/13 at 15:59:43
 
surely you know the answer to your own question.....
there is no other area of "the hi-end" where marketing hype is so prevalent and the profit margins so high.  One could go so far as to say a lot of it is down-right predatory in nature.  I suspect fraud could be proven in many cases.  Nowhere else in all of our hobby does "caveat emptor" apply more.  The next most rampant fraudulent area is in the marketing of vacuum tubes being NOS tubes... of which, many actually aren't.  And even if they are, they are not necessarily “better” as the marketing types have somehow managed to instill as “a given”.  And managed to get some people to pay absurd prices for them – rare they may be – better is not only debatable but in many cases can be proven to be an untruth.
I have seen and heard Shunyata products in demo’s, displays, etc. but I have never actually owned any or had them installed in my system as there are no dealers in my area.  So it would be impossible for me to make any kind of judgment, subjective or objective.  But I am skeptical that any difference would be an improvement over tried and true cables that are designed upon long-standing and well-known laws of physics and electrical signal transmission theory - and I’ll leave it at that.  And I’m not about to purchase something this expensive sight unseen and  unheard, that has, at best, a completely “subjective” effect and is surely system dependent as well.  So all I can say is, if they make a difference in your system, that you perceive to be an improvement, and the improvement is worth the cost to you, then it “is”.  So please report back to us your impressions when you hear some Shunyata Etron cables in your system – I am anxious to hear the impressions people have of this new technology involving the passing of audible frequencies thru wire.

Back to top
 
 

Decware Torii MK3, Wyred4Sound DAC2, Theta Digital Miles, Emotiva UMC-1, Emotiva XPA-5, Aesthetix Calypso, Marsh P200b, Martin Logan Vista, Audio Nirvana 12" Alnico's, PS Audio PW P5, Goertz, Kimber, Nordost and DIY wires, PSA pwr cords, I'm outta room..
  IP Logged
Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print