Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Decware Audio Forums
04/21/14 at 09:20:57


Pages: 1 
Send Topic Print
MT Cold Feet (Read 2551 times)
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
MT Cold Feet
01/28/13 at 23:48:15
 
I was trying to decide between a MT and a SE34I.3. I ultimately decided to go with the MT because I didn't want to purchase a PreAmp right out the bat. I have a high output MC cart on my TT to an Audio Research PH-3 phono pr as my source.

While I just love the MT part of me thinks I should have went with the SE34I.3 instead. I am still within the window, any input is greatly appreciated.

They are connected to B&W bookshelves right now but will be connected to a crossover-less Mark Audio A12P towers that I am building currently.
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #1 - 01/29/13 at 00:00:36
 
I should also clarify, I absolutely love this amp. Just have part of me asking what if I chose the other one... I guess thats what you get. Best solution: Get both!

I mainly listen to Jazz(Miles, Sonny, Coltrane), Classic Rock(Tull, Springsteen, Morrison), Sinatra.

Considering the flexibility in source, the MT won. Steve voices his amps to sound similar, I do like the footprint of the MT better. It is dual mono blocks which is nice. PreAmp isn't out of the question with the MT either, might add some weight to it. Thanks again for the C&C!
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 6785
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #2 - 01/29/13 at 00:11:13
 
I guess you really can't go wrong, as all the love for the Mini Torii here shows. I loved my SE34.2 Integrated, which I know is not the same as the new model, but I loved it and only wished it had been more powerful, I needed more power.
Back to top
 
 

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+(2),Torii Mk III, PS Audio PWT+PWD MkII,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100, Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable IC: Evo and UL, Mapleshade:Double Heiix Samsonv2+v3 and 4"platforms,Herbie's IsoCups+Tendft
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #3 - 01/29/13 at 00:12:59
 
Lon

You make a good point. Impossible to go wrong with either of my two choices here. I keep flip flopping, go to the SE34I or stay with MT. I usually come to the same conclusion... enjoy my MT now. Decide to expand to a SE34I.? in the future. Maybe sell the MT maybe not. Either way it is an epic sounding amp!
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Rivieraranch
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1267
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #4 - 01/29/13 at 00:22:09
 
MINI TORII offers a greater ability to tweak and fine tune the sound; either swapping tubes or the treble circuit or the feedback control. You don't have any of that with the SE34.
Back to top
 
 

DECWARE CSP2+, TABOO MK III; SE84CKC; HR1; TRAPEZIUM DESKTOP SPEAKERS; TECHNICS SL1200MK5 turntable; Ah! Njoe Tjoeb CD player; MARANTZ 2226B, 2216B receivers; SENNHEISER HD-580 headphones
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #5 - 01/29/13 at 00:23:53
 
That is the truth... I popped in some 5881's into my MT and was blown away by how different it sounded. I think this is me being over analytical and second guessing the absurd amount of research I did. Smiley I should focus on building my new speakers and growing from there. That is why this is a hobby after all. Smiley Thanks guys!
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 6785
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #6 - 01/29/13 at 00:25:26
 
It doesn't need most of that. Smiley The Integrated is zero negative feedback, which I've always loved. An SET as well. And a treble cut circuit can be added (a really good option to add, as is the stepped attenuator).
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 01/29/13 at 00:28:39 by Lon »  

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+(2),Torii Mk III, PS Audio PWT+PWD MkII,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100, Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable IC: Evo and UL, Mapleshade:Double Heiix Samsonv2+v3 and 4"platforms,Herbie's IsoCups+Tendft
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #7 - 01/29/13 at 00:40:36
 
Lon,

Does the SEP sound have a much different signature than the SET of the integrated?
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 6785
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #8 - 01/29/13 at 00:45:29
 
Can't really tell you, haven't heard the Mini Torii. It's the one Decware amp that has never really appealed to me.
Back to top
 
 

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+(2),Torii Mk III, PS Audio PWT+PWD MkII,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100, Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable IC: Evo and UL, Mapleshade:Double Heiix Samsonv2+v3 and 4"platforms,Herbie's IsoCups+Tendft
  IP Logged
Fireblade
Seasoned Member
****


Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 691
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #9 - 01/29/13 at 00:46:27
 
The Mini-Torii has input & output voltage stage regulation, connected in series for a superb additional AC power noise filtering/conditioning.

The Mini Torii can be tweaked tremendously via tube-rolling, enough to change its signature and sound characteristics to suit listening environment, speakers, etc. to your own needs/tastes and still sounding marvelously.  Tubes are inexpensive unless you look for vintage rarities.

The Mini Torii has plenty of pep and dynamics at 4 Ohms speakers (my case), and can be even better with 8 Ohms speakers.

Although I had similar concerns when I bought mine, time has proven Steve's suggestion (and ultimately my decision) was absolutely spot on.  

For my particular needs, I'm not looking back!
Back to top
 
 

Laptop-Foobar2000-Wasapi Ev//WD 1.5Tb HDD//Audioquest Forest USB cbls//HRT MS II+ USB-DAC//Decware Silver Ref IC's//Decware Mini Torii SE//Kimber Kable spkr cbls//Decware DM945's//Velodyne DLS 3500//BJC SUB Cbls//Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf.//Jellyfish P. Cord
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #10 - 01/29/13 at 00:46:49
 
I suppose if you are not a decware noobie then Mini Torii doesnt make sense. It does make sense for me as I was able to get my feet wet and explore without the large Torii pricetag.

Still very happy with my decision.
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 6785
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #11 - 01/29/13 at 01:10:44
 
Fireblade wrote on 01/29/13 at 00:46:27:
The Mini-Torii has input & output voltage stage regulation, connected in series for a superb additional AC power noise filtering/conditioning.


I'm glad you're happy.

I will say though that though the voltage stage regulation does indeed change the sound of the amp (and makes it easy to change it over and over rolling tubes) I find that the "additional AC power noise filtering/conditioning" isn't that significant imo. Decware amps I've had with and without these stages greatly benefit from filtering and conditioning outside the amp.

One reason I stay away from the Mini Torii is so many tubes to roll. Too many for me and my tastes and needs. Another reason is I've not been impressed with the output tube types used in this amp in other amps.

Anyway, you're going to be happy with your Decware amp!
Back to top
 
 

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+(2),Torii Mk III, PS Audio PWT+PWD MkII,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100, Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable IC: Evo and UL, Mapleshade:Double Heiix Samsonv2+v3 and 4"platforms,Herbie's IsoCups+Tendft
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #12 - 01/29/13 at 01:24:41
 
Thanks Lon, very insightful, I see many great years with this Decware amp and many others. This is a journey not a destination.

Thanks again!

-Ron
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Fireblade
Seasoned Member
****


Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 691
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #13 - 01/29/13 at 01:32:06
 
That's just the thing, Lon: Everything improves with additional expensive power supply aids in audio systems. The point is, in the M-T (and the Torii for that matter), this potential improvement is reduced, at least to a level that still satisfies an enthusiast with a limited budget.

The investment difference can be applied in other, more pressing system needs. Other things being equal, those regulation stages acting as filters are great savings for a constrained budget amateur.
Back to top
 
 

Laptop-Foobar2000-Wasapi Ev//WD 1.5Tb HDD//Audioquest Forest USB cbls//HRT MS II+ USB-DAC//Decware Silver Ref IC's//Decware Mini Torii SE//Kimber Kable spkr cbls//Decware DM945's//Velodyne DLS 3500//BJC SUB Cbls//Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf.//Jellyfish P. Cord
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #14 - 01/29/13 at 01:38:06
 
Fireblade, well stated. Smiley I for one will be purchasing a better DAC and building a pair of full range speakers before I spend a bunch of a PS Audio power plant.
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Fireblade
Seasoned Member
****


Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 691
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #15 - 01/29/13 at 01:49:26
 
Thanks, Ron.  I'm personally lusting after the not too popular but incredibly resolving Resonessence 'Concero' USB/DAC.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 01/29/13 at 01:50:01 by Fireblade »  

Laptop-Foobar2000-Wasapi Ev//WD 1.5Tb HDD//Audioquest Forest USB cbls//HRT MS II+ USB-DAC//Decware Silver Ref IC's//Decware Mini Torii SE//Kimber Kable spkr cbls//Decware DM945's//Velodyne DLS 3500//BJC SUB Cbls//Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf.//Jellyfish P. Cord
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #16 - 01/29/13 at 02:09:08
 
Quote:
Thanks, Ron.  I'm personally lusting after the not too popular but incredibly resolving Resonessence 'Concero' USB/DAC.


Time to google Smiley
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #17 - 01/29/13 at 02:18:19
 
Oh that does look nice! I would *love* to get a hold of a Ayre Acoustics DAC. Next step is to build a nice pair of speakers for my amp. Right now the B&W's are not doing it justice.
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Fireblade
Seasoned Member
****


Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 691
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #18 - 01/29/13 at 02:25:27
 
QB-9 maybe?  Great reviews, a little out of my league right now.  

The most important element in your system will always be a good sounding pair of speakers in synergy with your amp.
Back to top
 
 

Laptop-Foobar2000-Wasapi Ev//WD 1.5Tb HDD//Audioquest Forest USB cbls//HRT MS II+ USB-DAC//Decware Silver Ref IC's//Decware Mini Torii SE//Kimber Kable spkr cbls//Decware DM945's//Velodyne DLS 3500//BJC SUB Cbls//Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf.//Jellyfish P. Cord
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #19 - 01/29/13 at 02:27:00
 
Truth well said, balance and matching are key to this journey.

All said and done I should have the range from 30 Hz to 20 kHz at 95 dB. Should be a huge step with from the B&W. Will also be a fun project!

QB-9 is far out for sure, but a good thing to look forward to. Smiley
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Fireblade
Seasoned Member
****


Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 691
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #20 - 01/29/13 at 02:30:38
 
Good luck with your project, sounds challenging but fun!
Back to top
 
 

Laptop-Foobar2000-Wasapi Ev//WD 1.5Tb HDD//Audioquest Forest USB cbls//HRT MS II+ USB-DAC//Decware Silver Ref IC's//Decware Mini Torii SE//Kimber Kable spkr cbls//Decware DM945's//Velodyne DLS 3500//BJC SUB Cbls//Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf.//Jellyfish P. Cord
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #21 - 01/29/13 at 02:33:13
 
Thanks Fireblade, I will post progress and pics. All in for materials and drivers will be about 400-500. Small price to pay compared to something like the Zu Audios.
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 6785
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #22 - 01/29/13 at 03:26:05
 
Well I just don't agree David. . . I think these regulation stages allow you to CHANGE the sound of the amp far more than they do any cleaning of the amp. Yes, you can turn that circuit off in earlier versions of the amp and it doesn't sound as good. . . but Steve wouldn't let the amp out sounding that way without the regulation stages, he would have altered the signature. Far more than a "cleansing" stage this is just another tailoring stage to the amp. . . one that I think (in the case of the Torii, which I am very familiar with) is not as essential as  you seem to think. I see these as an added expense for the benefit of twiddling the sound with tube rolling more than anything else. And a way to make Decware amps "different." A power regenerator, now THAT really makes a difference, to all components plugged in. Far more profound, imo. This is my experience with more than just one Decware amp with and without voltage regulation stages. Six amps in fact, four without.

Whatever.I know how stubborn we both are and it's not worth more time talking about. Glad you're happy, but the Integrated I had didn't have these stages, and DIDN'T NEED these stages to sound awesome.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 01/29/13 at 03:31:22 by Lon »  

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+(2),Torii Mk III, PS Audio PWT+PWD MkII,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100, Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable IC: Evo and UL, Mapleshade:Double Heiix Samsonv2+v3 and 4"platforms,Herbie's IsoCups+Tendft
  IP Logged
Fireblade
Seasoned Member
****


Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 691
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #23 - 01/29/13 at 10:38:58
 
Lon,

I don't want to argue the point any further, each one of us has his own opinion on the matter.  I just would like to quote from the Torii Decware literature in this site (Steve Deckert):

How do you get an amplifier to sound like it does at 2:30 A.M. (when the power is cleanest) during the day and virtually every time you listen to it?  Tube voltage regulation designed to filter instead of regulate.

First of all, the vast majority of tube amplifiers for sale do not even have tube regulation.  Not to mention the obvious... but just because an amplifier has tube regulation doesn't mean it's going to sound better.  Tighter and more control, yes.  Better? ...not often.  The classic shunt regulation so often seen in tube amplifiers that do offer it, often poisons the transparency with injected noise that must be further filtered.  The Zen doesn't need tube regulation to improve power supply performance. It features a dual mono design with oversize power supplies, one for each channel.  It's a brute force approach that delivers over 300 ma. of current when less than half of that is actually used by the circuit.

In this special amplifier the Voltage Regulation tubes are wired in series with the load. In that configuration they become a filtering device instead of a regulating device.  The VR tubes place a measurable vacuum gap between the load and the power supply.  This creates Ultra Clean Power because all of the the noise is filtered off.  (Noise from pollution in your local power grid that includes the harmonics that ultimately end up at your wall outlet and in your amplifier.)

This hash and grain that poisons virtually everyone's audio gear is eliminated in the Zen TORII.  It literally doesn't make the jump across this vacuum gap between the cathode and anode of the VR tubes.  Talk about black backgrounds, we could call it the grain eliminator or the liquidity insurance program, or just an unfair advantage over virtually all of our competitors.

This is one of the reasons why we know that unless you own and use a power generator, like the PS AUDIO power plant as an example, there is no way your present amplifier will sound as good as a Zen TORII (...assuming all else was equal and even that's unlikely.)  And if it wasn't enough to do it once, we employed this technology on every stage in the amplifier and independently for each channel.  That's a lot of GLOW from these beautiful tubes that don't even get hot or wear out!

You won't find tube regulation in the vast majority of power amplifiers, and none that use it in this critically important way.  Yet, impressive as it might sound it is only a small part of why the Zen TORII can achieve the unique sound quality that is has.


Unless Mr. Deckert has detracted from his beliefs at the time of designing the Torii, or if you are implying this is just marketing brain-wash, I bought the concept and my real-life results with the Mini supports this, with the blackest of backgrounds this amp is famous for.

Spending significant amounts of money in power aids will improve everything.  Best bang for your buck is something some people like me prefer.  Thanks!
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 01/29/13 at 11:00:50 by Fireblade »  

Laptop-Foobar2000-Wasapi Ev//WD 1.5Tb HDD//Audioquest Forest USB cbls//HRT MS II+ USB-DAC//Decware Silver Ref IC's//Decware Mini Torii SE//Kimber Kable spkr cbls//Decware DM945's//Velodyne DLS 3500//BJC SUB Cbls//Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf.//Jellyfish P. Cord
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 6785
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #24 - 01/29/13 at 11:27:45
 
Fireblade wrote on 01/29/13 at 10:38:58:
Lon,

Unless Mr. Deckert has detracted from his beliefs at the time of designing the Torii, or if you are implying this is just marketing brain-wash, I bought the concept and my real-life results with the Mini supports this, with the blackest of backgrounds this amp is famous for.

Spending significant amounts of money in power aids will improve everything.  Best bang for your buck is something some people like me prefer.  Thanks!


David, I do think that this is an evolution of the design that serves in part as a clever marketing move as well as a way to make the amps sound different, especially without a preamp (I love preamps) and a way to attract those who like to tinker and change the sound again and again. Better overall perhaps, that's subjective imo. It does make Decware amps stand out as different, an additional contribution to nice marketing. Again, I have Decware amps with and without these stages and thousands of hours of listening to them' that's what I'm basing my opinion on. Not web pages. I'm recounting my experience with Decware amps over more than a decade.

You say "bang for buck" is what you want, and you also say that you are seeking the ultimate sound from your system. Smiley If you really want to hear what your amp will do, one day investigate better power conditioning than these voltage regulators. Then you'll hear what the blackest of backgrounds is, etc.

Enough said. Again, choosing an MT or an SE34.2 . . . either is a great choice.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 01/29/13 at 11:50:37 by Lon »  

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+(2),Torii Mk III, PS Audio PWT+PWD MkII,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100, Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable IC: Evo and UL, Mapleshade:Double Heiix Samsonv2+v3 and 4"platforms,Herbie's IsoCups+Tendft
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #25 - 01/29/13 at 15:30:59
 
Well I fired off an email to Steve asking his expert opinion...
I was reading up on the Phono Pre that I have on order.
One of the main reasons I chose the MT over the SE34I was the ability to run without a pre-amp. Well the phono pre is only going to give me 0.5V out which is far too low for both.

That said if I need a pre-amp then there is no reason to get the MT and the CSP+ in my eyes. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

Hopefully a quick chat with Steve I will have my head straight and my decision made.
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Fireblade
Seasoned Member
****


Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 691
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #26 - 01/29/13 at 16:17:48
 
Ron, you better confirm this with Steve, but the M-T is supposed to have been designed to handle even the weakest inputs, like iPods and the like.  This is the reason why the M-T has the largest gain compared to all the other amps.

You can even replace (as I did for sound tuning purposes) the drivers from 12AU7 to 12AT7 or higher gain drivers, and still get great sound at  even higher gain.

I'm not familiarized with the specs of the phono-pre you ordered, but Steve will confirm this either way.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 01/29/13 at 16:21:27 by Fireblade »  

Laptop-Foobar2000-Wasapi Ev//WD 1.5Tb HDD//Audioquest Forest USB cbls//HRT MS II+ USB-DAC//Decware Silver Ref IC's//Decware Mini Torii SE//Kimber Kable spkr cbls//Decware DM945's//Velodyne DLS 3500//BJC SUB Cbls//Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf.//Jellyfish P. Cord
  IP Logged
Ron
Senior Member
***




Posts: 87
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #27 - 01/29/13 at 16:18:27
 
Thanks, I will be calling Steve for sure!
Back to top
 
 

Mini Torii; Custom Mark Audio A12P SuperPensils; Kenwood KD-2055 TT; Audio-Research PH3 Phono Pre
  IP Logged
Fireblade
Seasoned Member
****


Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 691
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #28 - 01/29/13 at 16:45:56
 
Lon,

I said 'bang for buck' but not ultimate sound!  I said 'the best sound (I can afford').  Not even you have the ultimate sound out of your system, I'm sure, nobody does.

The steep exponential curve of diminishing returns is a big barrier to get the ultimate sound. There are probably better audio components than Decware's out there, that are so expensive these are out of reach for 97% of enthusiasts, but that's hardly the point.

For the money spent in power aids at those levels, there are better bang-for-the-buck alternatives, like better sourcing and the like.  Money makes a difference if you know how to invest it.

I'm happy you feel you're done with your present systems, but your recipe (and mine) is not necessarily for everyone.  ;)

BTW, when Steve proposed the M-T to me, he used the voltage regulation/filtering stages as one of his main arguments in favor of it, saying he would not recommend an amp without this, unless one was able to invest in a power regeneration plant, ala PS Audio.  He never even mentioned the tube-rolling feature as a selling proposition.  
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 01/29/13 at 17:11:32 by Fireblade »  

Laptop-Foobar2000-Wasapi Ev//WD 1.5Tb HDD//Audioquest Forest USB cbls//HRT MS II+ USB-DAC//Decware Silver Ref IC's//Decware Mini Torii SE//Kimber Kable spkr cbls//Decware DM945's//Velodyne DLS 3500//BJC SUB Cbls//Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf.//Jellyfish P. Cord
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 6785
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #29 - 01/29/13 at 16:53:33
 
I wasn't quoting what you said in that post but earlier.

I won't go into your conversation with Steve. . . . If he were talking to ME he might pitch the tube-rolling. Nothing wrong with appealing to your listener.

I'll just agree to disagree with your idea of building a great system and where to invest, and again you're making judgments and assumptions about a power conditioning foundation you haven't experienced. In my opinion, the better sources etc. you climb to, the more that foundation is justified and needed.

Enjoy. I'm listening to "Curtis Live" and it sounds as it never has before. Great escape before I have to face the rest of the day.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 01/29/13 at 17:15:10 by Lon »  

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+(2),Torii Mk III, PS Audio PWT+PWD MkII,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100, Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable IC: Evo and UL, Mapleshade:Double Heiix Samsonv2+v3 and 4"platforms,Herbie's IsoCups+Tendft
  IP Logged
Fireblade
Seasoned Member
****


Knowledge comes, but
wisdom lingers.
A.L.Tennyson

Posts: 691
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #30 - 01/29/13 at 17:14:00
 
Enjoy it, Lon.  I know I'm enjoying my little amp and system more every day!
Back to top
 
 

Laptop-Foobar2000-Wasapi Ev//WD 1.5Tb HDD//Audioquest Forest USB cbls//HRT MS II+ USB-DAC//Decware Silver Ref IC's//Decware Mini Torii SE//Kimber Kable spkr cbls//Decware DM945's//Velodyne DLS 3500//BJC SUB Cbls//Tripp Lite 500 Isolation Trnsf.//Jellyfish P. Cord
  IP Logged
markv
Verified Member
**




Posts: 48
Re: MT Cold Feet
Reply #31 - 02/18/13 at 00:31:37
 
Ron -

I had the same concern about the ZP3 voltage.  However, Steve clarified the issue by saying that the cartridge voltage was the main item to consider.  I was looking at the Ortofon 2M Blue MM cartridge.  The voltage specs are > than the 1.0 v or 2.5 v required for the MT or SE34I.

Ortofon 2M Blue Phono Cartridge Specifications
- Output voltage @ 1kHz: 5.5mV
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Pages: 1 
Send Topic Print