Forums - Loudness imbalance in speakers:

jpv

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Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers:
Reply #30 - 11/27/12 at 15:34:26

Mark,
When you set up the system you need to keep in mind symmetry.
To get good balance and imaging both sides need to be the same.
Putting in a fales wall would help as long as you are sitting between the speakers. Can you take pictures of the entire space or draw the layout. That would give us a clearer idea of what you are dealing with.
John

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« Last Edit: 11/27/12 at 15:52:15 by jpv »

VPI Scoutmaster, Grado Sonata1, Counterpoint pre amp and amp (modded by Altavista Audio), Proac sp. and home made subs. Lots of room treatment. Anti-cable sp cables, Decware IC, ZKit 1.

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Mark

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Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers:
Reply #31 - 11/27/12 at 15:53:52

John: I used to have a full floor layout diagram... I'll see if I can find it... Short of that, I'll add more pictures if I can't find the layout diagram...

I do think a simple cure would be to at least have individual output pots on the Zen CDP... That would give me L/R volume control of at least my CDP, which is what I use the most... (m.)

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If a rabbit defined intelligence the way man does, then the most intelligent animal would be a rabbit, followed by the animal most willing to obey the commands of a rabbit. -Robert Brault, writer (b. 1938)

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will Seasoned Member Posts: 801	Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers: Reply #32 - 11/27/12 at 16:28:37 Mark, I recall your interest in 944s. I can't say for sure, but from experience with mine, up against the wall, without some symmetry, and without room to tweak their toe and placement, they would very likely be very challenging.
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jpv

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Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers:
Reply #33 - 11/27/12 at 17:01:17

Mark,
While dual vol. controls will fix the channel inbalance it will not fix how it sounds. The one closer to the wall will have a diff. sound then the one away from the wall. How much it effects it only you can tell.
Just for a test try the corner and see what it does, then try moving out into the room, them maybe the opposite wall. It will show if it is a placement issue.
My system is very sensitive to placement and it took a lot of work getting it right. I am luck I have a listening room (the wife gets the rest of the house

) and I could do the stuff I suggest.
John

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« Last Edit: 11/27/12 at 17:01:53 by jpv »

VPI Scoutmaster, Grado Sonata1, Counterpoint pre amp and amp (modded by Altavista Audio), Proac sp. and home made subs. Lots of room treatment. Anti-cable sp cables, Decware IC, ZKit 1.

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will

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Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers:
Reply #34 - 11/27/12 at 17:05:41

I wonder if, with the right speaker stands and rack table if you could not work around the baseboard thing being a problem?

I agree with John that corner placement could be your best solution. Even without the frequency combing and amplification that appears to be happening, and after manually balancing the channels somehow, soundstage is so dependent on symmetry and minimized reflection issues. It seems corner placement is probably the easiest way to do both at the same time...evening everything, and dispersing reflections most quickly from all the walls bouncing them around.

There is one of Steve's papers that discusses corner placement fully. Worth a look.

Edit:Sorry, responded before reading Js last. I am slow!

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« Last Edit: 11/27/12 at 17:08:51 by will »

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will Seasoned Member Posts: 801	Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers: Reply #35 - 11/27/12 at 17:10:46 Agreed, other end test, but also that a test in the center of the long wall is still worth the research.
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marky

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Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers:
Reply #36 - 11/27/12 at 17:51:40

Mark, the first thing I would do to make sure it was the wall proximity.
Just remove the sp cables from sp`s. Put the speakers on the floor centre room, connect up again. You should hear a balanced sound, ruling out amp probs.
Nice looking speakers, I`ve seen mini floorstanders as big.
The white finish on the amp and light blue sp cbls are very cool.

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Mark

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Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers:
Reply #37 - 11/27/12 at 18:15:18

Thanks, all... I know a very good woodworker, and he even offered to let me use his shop if I want... I'm going to work up some drawings for some speaker stands... That way, I'll more easily be able to experiment with speaker placement in the room... Moving the console table around in such a small apt. is not really going to work for me...

I do like the speakers a lot... I'll have to work up a stand design that still has a rather small footprint, but yet is sturdy enough to prevent toppling...

This done, I will be able to try the corner and/or bring out the speakers a bit, and/or anything else that has been suggested on here... At this point, I'm almost 100% sure it's the extended wall and near corner that is causing the problem... So, Ill work from there... Thanks... (m.)

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If a rabbit defined intelligence the way man does, then the most intelligent animal would be a rabbit, followed by the animal most willing to obey the commands of a rabbit. -Robert Brault, writer (b. 1938)

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orangecrush Seasoned Member Posts: 149	Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers: Reply #38 - 11/28/12 at 01:49:16 My room is not good either, but you can minimize problems by listening in a near field equilateral triangle.
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Rivieraranch Seasoned Member Posts: 1109	Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers: Reply #39 - 11/28/12 at 02:02:12 You might think me an ass, but if I were in your position I would seriously consider remaking that whole space to accommodate listening; instead of bending over backwards and contorting sideways to try and tweak everything to fit into a clearly unsuitable layout.
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Fireblade

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Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers:
Reply #40 - 11/28/12 at 02:07:19

Mark,

I was in a similar situation and opted for the speaker stands and the difference was abysmal. My speakers need to be away from walls and obstacles to perform at their best, so I put the stands well into the room and the sound is great.

In addition, the speakers sharing the same table with the amp does not help the amp's sound, especially a small one like yours (even with anti-vibration devices, I presume).

That decision was the best I could have made after choosing my Decware gear. The height of the stands ought to be about 26" or close to that, depending on your ears' height at the listening position.

Good luck!

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will Seasoned Member Posts: 801	Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers: Reply #41 - 11/28/12 at 04:02:54 I would say the height of the stands should be whatever is necessary to put the tweeter at about ear level from your listening seat.
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will Seasoned Member Posts: 801	Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers: Reply #42 - 11/28/12 at 14:49:08 But I have never used horns. What is the theory of speaker height with horns...probably different and more flexible?
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Mark

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Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers:
Reply #43 - 11/28/12 at 17:23:13

There's some leeway with the horn mouths, but the drivers sound best at ear level... That would be no problem if I made the stands...

I will have some room to bring the speakers out if I do away with the table in front... I don't use it much anyway... Even if I get the MG 944s, I'll be able to bring them out...

I will have to get new speaker wire... And that's going to cost as well...

Oh, well... You can't take it with you... Or can you?... (m.)

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If a rabbit defined intelligence the way man does, then the most intelligent animal would be a rabbit, followed by the animal most willing to obey the commands of a rabbit. -Robert Brault, writer (b. 1938)

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will Seasoned Member Posts: 801	Re: Loudness imbalance in speakers: Reply #44 - 11/28/12 at 18:19:54 Sounds like a good solution x-ing the the table! Speaker cables are a slippery slope in my experience, different ones having soooo much impact of the sound. What are you thinking of?
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