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The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode (Read 5273 times)
Mark
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Re: The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode
Reply #15 - 10/12/12 at 16:06:54
 
If anyone's interested, I do have a fairly objective test for fidelity-- and please don't roll your eyes on this one:  It's the resin on a bowstring... That's right... that 'pulling' sound you can only get if a single bowed string sounds right, assuming the recording is good...

I can pick it out right away, that is, if it sounds right... The BB 6DJ8 'D' getter gets it right every time for me on my system, that is the Zen triode with my Tang Band back loaded single-driver horn speakers... Admittedly, with a CD player as source...

Also, the piano... Any coloration is immediately apparent to me on my system... If the timbral accuracy and pitch isn't just right, I grimace... By the nature of the length of the piano strings, the bottom should bloom wide and full, the mids should be somewhat thinner and well defined, and the highs should be rather thin sounding...

On soundstage: A system's soundstage shouldn't sound any different than, well, a real stage... To my way of thinking, it shouldn't sound any bigger, or wider, than when you're listening to a live concert in a good venue...

It's all mater of scale... I don't want a 12 foot wide contrabass, or any other instrumentation sounding bigger than it really is...

(m.)
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If a rabbit defined intelligence the way man does, then the most intelligent animal would be a rabbit, followed by the animal most willing to obey the commands of a rabbit. -Robert Brault, writer (b. 1938)
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Lon
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Re: The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode
Reply #16 - 10/12/12 at 17:50:57
 
So much is dependent on source, speaker, room. . . it's good to have some sort of personal reference for fidelity.

I mainly use band tapes I made in my then garage apartment at the end of the 'eighties. I know the room (I lived in it), the players, the equipment, the mics and tape deck. This has been a godsend for evaluation for me. Otherwise I too listen for piano, and contrabass violin, two instruments I know well from playing and listening. And I  hate an enlarged sound stage, though that's almost as often on the recording as not in my experience.
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marky
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Re: The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode
Reply #17 - 10/12/12 at 19:36:54
 
I find that the more my system improves the more I`m drawn into the art of the...drummer. He has so many sounds emanating from his  kit, and I hear deft touches on the cymabals, quiet rolls, timbre, the psssssp of the h/hat that all sound clearer and more enjoyable. He seems to be the last player to be uncovered clearly.
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Les Lammers
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Re: The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode
Reply #18 - 10/12/12 at 19:39:42
 
Mark,

I understand completely. Once the sound is 'right' that is where tube rolling stops.

Les
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will
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Re: The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode
Reply #19 - 10/12/12 at 20:08:46
 
Quote:
Once the sound is 'right' that is where tube rolling stops.


Not for me! With a good selection of each tube type, I have loads of flavors of "right." In fact, VERY Right! And each change up shifts the presentation enough for a new and exciting period of deep and enjoyable listening...a musical experience that opens a new depth of enjoyment, partly due to the new awareness it sparks into the inner qualities of the music!

Cool
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« Last Edit: 10/12/12 at 20:14:07 by will »  

Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
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jameskk
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Re: The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode
Reply #20 - 10/13/12 at 12:20:48
 
get in your car , go for a ride  with the windows  down  come home and listen again . It will all sound different.
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marky
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Re: The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode
Reply #21 - 10/14/12 at 09:49:25
 
The penny has recently dropped for me that the used tube figures, ie 90/88 is the condition of the two halves of the stereo tube, and not some kind of overal score system which had me puzzled.  :) ( Funny `cause I studied valve cicuits at tech college, but it was that time when transitors and chips had precedence) Thankfully the used tubes I`ve bought are within a couple %.
Given the price differences between NOS and used tubes is there a cut off % figure beyond which you wont buy because of channel imbalance or you know your`ll hear the difference. Syd ..ps there have been and still are lots of t/funken au7/ax7`s on fleabay.
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« Last Edit: 10/14/12 at 13:33:46 by marky »  

Decware: Rachaels x 2 bridged, CSP2+, ZP3, ZMC1, DSC i/c`s, DHC-1 pw/cbl`s. Roksan Radius/Nima/high def cabl & M.Benz LP s , M/L aeon i`s, Townshend Isolda sp/cbl`s, Isotek mains sub
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jameskk
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Re: The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode
Reply #22 - 10/16/12 at 13:56:20
 
Ok now you got my attention, to bad it takes a 65 year old tube for the zen to sound its best ........
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Lon
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Posts: 7687
Re: The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode
Reply #23 - 10/16/12 at 16:21:07
 
I understand why will likes to keep rolling tubes. But I like to stop when I have a set that works best for most of my sources and recordings and just then swim in the music in that pool of sound.

It fascinates me how the input tube and rectifier tube interact, that seems to be the key to the whole game to me, with regulation tubes being important afterwards. I settle on an input tube and then work to find a rectifier that best complements it. I've really run into something that I hadn't expected rolling tubes in the CSP2+: one 5Y3GT sounds head and shoulders more "right" than others, or 5U4G types, the Valve Audio 274B (probably my least favorite of those tried) etc. Will be interesting to see how my other 5Y3GT tubes on hand sound in my upcoming ZP3.
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will
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Re: The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode
Reply #24 - 10/16/12 at 17:50:11
 
Lon, I understand your way too. Seems the difference is that your goal is on a specific path of refinement that works best with your large selection of music...and mine is a specific path too in terms of sonic goals, but provides for a range of sounds that work best with my selection of music. This "range" is actually pretty narrow in a macro sense, but within the context of subtle details, it has endless variations that I absolutely love.

I am also fascinated with the Regulator/Input relationship. I can definately imagine that the 5Y3GT is a synergistic tube in your CSP2+ within your system and goals. Especially for a pre it makes sense to me, comparatively, the tube type generally having a very open and spacious sound that is also warm and textural and not in the face in terms of broad or big dynamics, but pleasingly dynamic none-the-less. Seems perfect conceptually for a pre, and then the Torii can do its magic to a very pleasing CSP treatment...

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« Last Edit: 10/16/12 at 17:52:14 by will »  

Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
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Lon
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"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7687
Re: The 6 DJ 8 driver tube and the Zen Triode
Reply #25 - 10/16/12 at 18:39:02
 
Well, it's also the tube that the webpage says this preamp is designed around, which means it would be the tube I'd most be inclined to use. 5U4G and 274B seem to exaggerate image and sound stage in this preamp. I'm not into that. They also don't seem to have the tonal accuracy I want, which may be ic and pc related as well.

What gets me is that one particular tube clearly outshines the other 5Y3GT tubes I have. I've had it a long time, still has plenty of juice. I'm hoping to keep it in use a long time.
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« Last Edit: 10/16/12 at 19:13:04 by Lon »  

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,
PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
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