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Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis? (Read 13077 times)
Gopher
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Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
09/27/12 at 05:23:40
 
My Torii is sold and long gone, but I recently discovered the cheap Shuguang rectifier, which is a Western Electric 274B clone, in my new amp (Melody AN211) and I'm very impressed with it.  It piqued my curiosity as to what it could have done for my Torii...   I bet things could be been voiced really nicely with them in play.

Are you guys using 'em?
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Lon
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #1 - 09/27/12 at 12:31:58
 
Steve sent me one of the Valve Art 274Bs (probably Shuagang sourced) with my CSP2+. I didn't put a lot of hours on it but I wasn't really happy with the sound in the preamp, too big and bold, didn't seem realistic to me with my reference recordings (recordings of bands I played in and recorded in my then garage apartment; well-recorded selections of acoustic instruments) and I went back to the 5Y3GT type for that preamp. I didn't have two, and haven't tried them in the Toriis.
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« Last Edit: 09/27/12 at 14:05:06 by Lon »  

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sberger
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #2 - 09/27/12 at 14:25:59
 
Not sure the 274B is acceptable in the Torii. No mention in the manual as there is for the CSP2. Maybe Steve can comment. I liked it a lot in the CSP2 but ultimately a 5Y3GT sounds better.
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will
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #3 - 09/27/12 at 15:21:19
 
Gopher,

I tried Valve Art 274Bs in my SE34I.2, and ended up with NOS 50's RCA...can't remember what it was about the 274B that I did not like as well. Like Lon, I think we are talking about the same tube? The Valve Art looks just like the Shuguang and is cheap. I have not tried them in the Torii. Listening with them now to Shakuhachi flute and they sound open, rich, and atmospheric, but this record has a hard time sounding bad.

I will check it out more and get back.

Thanks for your idea.
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will
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #4 - 09/27/12 at 16:51:48
 
So what do you say Mr. Steve Deckert??? Any issues with the Shuguang/Valve Art 274B in the Torii MkIII?
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sberger
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #5 - 09/27/12 at 16:58:23
 
Found Steve's thoughts on the 274B and his amps from July. Doesn't mention the Torii specifically but it would seem to apply. For what it's worth decided to drop my 2 Valve Art 274B's in the Torii this morning after this thread started and so far am really liking the sound. Big, full, and yes lush:

Decware amps typically use between 33 ~ 47uf caps as the first section of the power supply filter after the rectifier tube.

In the case of the SE34I.3 the value is 47uf.

So far all the 274B's I've looked at ( and I haven't looked at all of them ) would like to see less than 10uf as the first section of the power supply filter.  Going beyond the value could cause flashing upon startup.  That said, many people ignore the warning and use it anyway, claiming the sound is worth the potentially short-lived tube.

Steve
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Gopher
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #6 - 09/27/12 at 17:03:57
 
Awesome to hear, Steve!  It is cool to see you're having good results with my suspicion...  Kinda makes me want to buy an inexpensive Decware amp to revisit with that rectifier.

In my Melody AN211 the improvements I noted were in terms of tonal beauty, depth, dimensionality, microdetail and microdynamic shading--it just got luster, more beautiful and more emotional for me.  Bass impact could have taken a step back, but it is already great with my Zu Definition speakers.

I was thinking if those attributes could have been matted to the Torii I used to have, that would have made things really special.  It wasn't a subtle difference to me.

Here's a link I just googled: http://jeffsplace.me/wordpress/?p=2642  

Seems Jeff Day was really enjoying these things till he was cautioned against them.
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« Last Edit: 09/27/12 at 17:07:10 by Gopher »  
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sberger
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #7 - 09/27/12 at 17:19:54
 
Sounds like Steve is actually warning against 274B's in his amps(although not the pre's if he's shipping them with the CSP2+). While they do sound good in my Torii this morning I really don't want to risk them failing and taking the power supply with them. Been there done that. So unless I head definitively from Steve that using them in the Torii is ok I'm going to stick with my Tung Sol and RCA 5U4's.
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Gopher
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #8 - 09/27/12 at 17:37:49
 
Were you having flashing on start up that is causing you concern?  Just being careful?  Hmm...   I'll be interested in what Deckert chimes in.
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sberger
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #9 - 09/27/12 at 17:59:58
 
No flashing, but as it's been said, they can work for awhile and then potential disaster depending on what kind of caps are being used. I liked the smoking analogy in the thread that you provided the link for. So unless Steve says there is no problem with using them I'm not going to risk it. You would think that if he didn't specify in the manual that you could use them that alone kinda tells it like it is. But we'll see.
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will
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #10 - 09/27/12 at 18:43:10
 
I am trying them now and liking them also. With the tube set I have in, first impressions are good though not earth shaking. They seem big but open...classic sounding in their "tubey" presentation...liquid and smooth, with clarity, but also nice body across the spectrum.

It has been a long time, so I can't say for sure why I got them for the SE34I.2, but it seems I would have been chicken to try them without knowing they would not hurt the amp.

Steve's description for the SE34I.3 indicated to me not that they might blow the power supply section, but that the tubes might ware out fast.

Maybe the Decware penchant for seriously overbuilt power supply components will allow this tube as part of our tube play.

Hopefully Steve will notice this thread and let us know.

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sberger
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #11 - 09/27/12 at 19:39:51
 
Hope you're right Will and I don't care about blowing a few of the 274(mine are Valve Art, not Shuguang...different?) because at $15 per I really don't expect much but just don't want risk anything else being affected so until I hear from Steve gonna stick with the Tung Sol 54UG's I have lying around here and be more than satisfied.
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will
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #12 - 09/27/12 at 20:16:37
 
Good idea. Take the cautious approach.
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sberger
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #13 - 09/27/12 at 21:20:12
 
FWIW I haven't completely gone the conservative route. Just got in a shipment of Russian 1957 5c3s, another 5U4 sub and stuck those in. Lovely. Also big and bold. They came in with a pair of 1961 6n1p-v's that I picked up at the same time because of Lon's endorsement of that variety. Everything sounds great but needless to say hard to get the Torii to sound anything but these days.
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Steve Deckert
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Re: Anyone tried the inexpensive Shuguang 274B rectis?
Reply #14 - 09/27/12 at 23:26:48
 
The danger with any rectifier tube is most present during startup when the power switch is first turned on as evident by arcing inside the tube that you can clearly see.  Often an arc inside the tube will blow the fuse.

The expensive 274B's out there do not recommend us in amplifiers with more than 8 uf caps so that is why I have never been able to recommend them even though many customers use them anyway.

These ValveArt tubes do not exhibit the problem and my theory is that they are really just the same 5U4's that we've always used from Sugang, but just in a fatter bottle...  I can tell no difference other than the additional getter at the base.  

I am shipping the tubes with our new SuperZen's so if there is a problem I'll find out within 90 days.

Steve
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