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ERRs Have Arrived! (Read 25920 times)
Lon
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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #15 - 07/25/11 at 16:49:14
 
Great to hear Greg! Can't wait to read your further impressions of the system!
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Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
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Pale Rider
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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #16 - 07/25/11 at 17:17:21
 
You'll appreciate the humor here Lon: my Ultra and first Torii are ready to insert in the system, but I have no ICs! I have been running off HDMI here at home for long enough that all I have for ICs are a few junk Radio Shack cables, maybe an old Monster, and they all look like they have oxidized. I don't even want to let their "syphilitic white trash selves" near my Decware. So, I may have to break down and buy some cheap ICs to tide me over until my Decwares are built.
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Decware: Ultra | Torii MKIII [2] | SE84ZS | Taboo MkIII Sources: Synology 1812+ | Baetis Revolution | PWD DAC MKII | Lumin Network Player | Mytek 192 | Oppo 105 DSP: DEQX Mate | Emotiva Outputs: ERR [6] + Servo Subs | LCD-2 & other cans
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Lon
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"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7576
Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #17 - 07/25/11 at 17:29:12
 
Greg, if interested I could send you a few pair as loaners,I have available a set of the the "pre-Silver Reference" Decware ics, a pair of TARA Labs Reference and a pair of Audioquest "Mamba II". . . Let me know. You can PM me if you'd like. I'd get them in the mail express this afternoon if you'd like.
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« Last Edit: 07/26/11 at 15:18:49 by Lon »  

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
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Pale Rider
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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #18 - 07/25/11 at 17:33:29
 
Lon, you are a gentleman, and very generous, but no need. Thanks much, though; you proved again what a great little community we have here.
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Decware: Ultra | Torii MKIII [2] | SE84ZS | Taboo MkIII Sources: Synology 1812+ | Baetis Revolution | PWD DAC MKII | Lumin Network Player | Mytek 192 | Oppo 105 DSP: DEQX Mate | Emotiva Outputs: ERR [6] + Servo Subs | LCD-2 & other cans
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Lon
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"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7576
Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #19 - 07/25/11 at 19:19:05
 
Well those cables are just sitting idle, I wanted to make them available if you wished. Yes, we have a nice group here. We all value the Decware build and sound and we're music lovers!
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Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
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Juan Antonio
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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #20 - 07/26/11 at 15:14:54
 
Pale, I agree with you. I think it is hyped on the webpage, specially in terms of room treatment. These speakers need a really good sounding room like a conventional speaker to sound at their best. Nevertheless, they are quite easier to set up to sound right, specially in soundstage and stable imaging, that is absolute true and I agree with that.

You've intrigued me, Pale. Which were those expensive speakers you owned for much more? Just curiosity.   Smiley


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« Last Edit: 07/26/11 at 15:16:41 by Juan Antonio »  
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mac5u
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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #21 - 07/28/11 at 00:44:41
 
Quote:
Pale, I agree with you. I think it is hyped on the webpage, specially in terms of room treatment. These speakers need a really good sounding room


From the website:  
Imagine not having to worry about exactly where you place the speakers.


And best of all the Decware Radials will do it in virtually ALL rooms, large or small, including yours and without additional room treatments!


So, how much hyperbole are we really talking about?  I am curious because Steve was really taken to task recently over at another web site about over-the-top narratives on his web site.

I was really beginning to zero in on the ERRs, partially because I can't treat my listening room too much and also because of claims that they worked pretty well near walls.  I can't have a speaker pulled too far out into the room -- maybe 18 - 24 inches.  


One thing unclear to me, Greg, is if you plan to listen to two-channel music or if this will be strictly (or mostly) HT and maybe multi-channel music?  

Juan  -- Is it harder to integrate multiple pairs of omni speakers rather than a single pair?

Have to admit, I am a little bummed by this recent info.
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Pale Rider
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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #22 - 07/28/11 at 01:58:44
 
M, I want to be clear: I think the ERRs are everything they are hyped to be. Most things in life do not live up to their hype. Sex, well, let's be honest, sex lives up to its hype. And so do the ERRs, at least IMHO. I am absolutely thrilled with the speakers, and I haven't really put them in harness yet.

My wife, who has younger ears with no tinnitus, thinks they are stunning. While they are of course affected by the room and their placement in it, I find they have a huge sweet spot, and are less affected by such factors than other speakers I have heard.

Order a pair, you will fall in love. I only wish I had two separate rooms for HT and audio. If I did, I would have ordered 4 pairs of ERRs.

P.S. Juan, I have owned a number of more expensive speakers, including Acoustats, Ohms, Infinity, Martin Logans, Carver Amazing, Quads, and Jack Caldwell ribbons ( my faves until now).
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Decware: Ultra | Torii MKIII [2] | SE84ZS | Taboo MkIII Sources: Synology 1812+ | Baetis Revolution | PWD DAC MKII | Lumin Network Player | Mytek 192 | Oppo 105 DSP: DEQX Mate | Emotiva Outputs: ERR [6] + Servo Subs | LCD-2 & other cans
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Lon
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"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7576
Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #23 - 07/28/11 at 03:28:32
 
Glad you're really enjoying the ERRs so far. I agree that they're top notch. I just have become addicted to the Radial sound and would keep buying Decware or Turning Point Audio designs if I have the choice.

Mine have been sounding better and better as the weeks go by. Amazing me even now when I should be used to them!
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Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
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Juan Antonio
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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #24 - 07/28/11 at 20:40:28
 
Mac5u, the hyperbole is a bit deserved, not totally, but well. You will need treatment for the bass and highs as any other boxy speaker to have very great sound, that is unavoidable. Are the ERR's better for the average room? I'd say yes, of course, in terms of soundstage/imaging only.

I don't have multiple set of omni's but It seems to be the best option and far easier to set up multiple speakers to create an ultimate HT though. It's what Pale has done. Just having a single pair I can perceive that these speakers must be extremely terrific in a surround theater set up (4.0 or 5.0). The location and 3D sound in a movie must be thrilling.

As Pale says, order a pair, don't worry. You have to know that the sound is very laid back. The sound is never coming to you, never in your face. It's all there and deep between the speakers, behind the speakers, rendered ambient sound coming from everywhere (sometimes even behind you). It's a bit rare at the beginning, you will understand easier the instrument placement if you close your eyes. No matter if you approach to the speakers very near, the sound is never in your face and claustrophobic.

They are warm and don't expect them to have tilted-up highs, just the opposite. The highs are flat and correct, but I think they could be a little more extended, I perceive them to be a bit rolled off in the very top end. I don't mean they can't go very very high, I just mean that some very high sounds need more dBs in that range. That is my own perception.

Pale, having owned those hi-end brands tells a lot about the high value of Decware. A very good feeling to say the least.

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« Last Edit: 07/28/11 at 20:44:55 by Juan Antonio »  
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Pale Rider
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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #25 - 07/28/11 at 21:03:55
 
I think Juan hits it on the head here. As you can tell from some of my speaker choices, I am a big fan of planars. I love the transient response, and something about ribbons in particular really satisfies me. Now, at my age, I probably could not discern the extent of the rolloff. When I check my hearing, I can tell that I am rolling off at about 16-17k.

I have my ERRs set up so that unless you choose to move a chair and plop yourself right in front of the tweeter, the ribbons are all slightly off angle to all the major listening positions in the room. This probably contributes to a slight "softness" on some of the highs. I think I will get a better sense of just how much once the Ultra is plugged in, and I can switch back and forth between 2-channel and multi-channel. It is interesting to watch/listen to Blu-Ray discs like Moonlight Acoustica and Goldberg Acoustica. Those discs give you a choice between "stage" and "audience" listening positions. And it does make quite a difference. The visual cues provided by the disc inform me that the ERR soundstage rendition is very credible. Moving the speakers so the tweeters are more directionally focused at the listener does not cause shoutiness, or over-emphasis of treble, but it does seem to slightly affect instrument location, without increasing or decreasing "air."
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« Last Edit: 07/30/11 at 16:26:13 by Pale Rider »  

Decware: Ultra | Torii MKIII [2] | SE84ZS | Taboo MkIII Sources: Synology 1812+ | Baetis Revolution | PWD DAC MKII | Lumin Network Player | Mytek 192 | Oppo 105 DSP: DEQX Mate | Emotiva Outputs: ERR [6] + Servo Subs | LCD-2 & other cans
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mac5u
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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #26 - 07/28/11 at 22:15:48
 
Thanks, JA.  I should have written above that I realize there isn't a single pair of speakers ever made that could not benefit from some form of room treatment.  For me, the issue has always been how much, and to that end, omnis -- Decware, Ohms, etc. have always appealed to me because I think I value imaging and soundstaging at least as much as I value rich mids and good bass.

I rarely listen for extended periods in any sweet spot so the diffuse-sounding nature of the omni is very desirable.  

JA -- what kind of music and listening levels are typical for you?  How do they sound at either low volumes or really high volumes?

So yes, I need to try a pair.  Ideally, I can have both Decware and Ohms concurrently to compare side-by-side.  The difficulty in that scenario is the power requirements for those two are significantly different.  While Ohms can probably be driven fairly well with tubes, they really deliver when feed high current, or so I have read.  So maybe it will come down to a choice of amplification?

PR, what version of Ohms did you own?  As always, I anticipate reading about how your multi-ERR/Zen Ultra story unfolds.
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Lon
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"Love without
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worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #27 - 07/28/11 at 22:20:46
 
mac, some tube amps put out lots of current. The Torii for example.. . Smiley

In my case I really find the ERRs sound very good at low volumes, which is very important to me.
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Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
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Pale Rider
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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #28 - 07/30/11 at 02:41:04
 
I had the F. Like Lon, I value low level quality, and I also like to crank them up. The ERRs are very nice either way.
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Decware: Ultra | Torii MKIII [2] | SE84ZS | Taboo MkIII Sources: Synology 1812+ | Baetis Revolution | PWD DAC MKII | Lumin Network Player | Mytek 192 | Oppo 105 DSP: DEQX Mate | Emotiva Outputs: ERR [6] + Servo Subs | LCD-2 & other cans
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Juan Antonio
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Re: ERRs Have Arrived!
Reply #29 - 07/30/11 at 13:59:08
 
Hi mac5u,

My taste in music is very wide except for mainstream popular music. Rock, blues, classical, jazz, symphony orchestra, ...

My typical listening levels are 80 dBs (the average) and also very satisfying low levels. You know, my hearing is really really good, both in wide range and dynamically. I even surpass above the maximum threshold of 0dB by 5dB at 4kHz (left ear) and 2kHz (right ear).

I think live music is not as good sometimes with these speakers. Because of the ERR's have a kind of "diffuse" sound, adding more reverb and stuff typically found in live records don't work as good as studio records. OF COURSE, this is due to the involved acoustics added of our room as well. To enjoy live recordings, a good treated room is, unfortunately, more important than playing studio recordings.

"I rarely listen for extended periods in any sweet spot so the diffuse-sounding nature of the omni is very desirable"

MMMmm, no. This speakers, at least in my opinion, must be listened in the sweet pot to enjoy the tweeter and then high frequencies. You must sit down to do that or at least bend the tweeters if you stand up (bending these tweeters are not practical and easy) . It's wide in the horizontal plane, but it's very limited in the vertical axis. Even in the horizontal axis it starts to roll-off when it is a little off-axis. (Pale mentioned it above). And because these tweeters produce the highest registers soft and quiet in my experience, most probably you would want quite more highs most of the time.

The restriction of the ribbon tweeter in the vertical plane is a good thing, most probably due to the need to avoid interaction between the tweeter and the radial membrane and the reflections in ceiling and floor.

I also think these speakers sound better at low level SPL. Hehe, well, that is most probably because of the handicap of room acoustics, amplifier, speaker distortion, auto-defense of our ears called stapedius reflex) and so on. The typical.

Excuse my english, specially in using preposition (in/on/at/of/for/by,...).

I just hate it!! Instead, in spanish we use "in" (translation: "en") as "in/on/at" for everything. It's the same meaning depending on the context. The use of "on" and "at" is killing me and drives my crazy.

Lon, I see you use the word "amigo" correctly. Sometimes I've seen people saying "mi amigo" (my friend). You know, we don't say "my friend" in conjunction. We say: ¡Hola, amigo!. Just that.  ;)

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« Last Edit: 07/30/11 at 14:04:59 by Juan Antonio »  
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