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Which input tube for a splash of seduction? (Read 35036 times)
will
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #150 - 08/17/11 at 19:04:50
 
Quote:
the number of 6922 "slots" in my amps, these present all sort of synergy opportunities.


Fun! Cool
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« Last Edit: 08/17/11 at 19:05:18 by will »  

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will
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #151 - 10/04/11 at 21:12:34
 
Gopher,

Having spent a fair bit of time with NOS RCA-GBs (straight, fat bottle) 5U4Gs, I think I can say that they would likely bring a "splash of seduction" to your Torii. I found some tall bottle ones labeled Sylvania, and some short bottle RCA label on ebay for 25 and 40 (shipped) and both seem to bring texture and open freshness to the midranges and more deep bass compared to the more "liquid" RCA 5U4G-STs. In my system/room, I actually had to slightly EQ out some bass (a very nice, and good sounding refinement feature of the Pure Music software player) and once done, these tubes have become a favorite for me. But I have a history of low bass issues with my Torii in this room.

Anyway, if your low bass is better controlled than mine, you might really like them???
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Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
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will
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #152 - 10/05/11 at 07:11:10
 
For what it is worth, I did some listening tonight and I find the tall bottle "Sylvanias" more organic and alive than the short bottles labeled RCA.
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« Last Edit: 10/05/11 at 07:12:06 by will »  

Mac mini, Tranquility DAC, CSP3, TORII MkIV, Morrow SP-7, HR-1s...VHaudio DIY, Grover, MAC ICs...PSAudio P5 and Shunyata Defender, PI Audio and DIY power cables, HerbiesAudioLab isocups and tube dampers...
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Lon
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #153 - 10/19/11 at 06:49:02
 
I had a hard time falling asleep this evening, and my girlfriend is at her house tonight, so I started futzing with the stereo and figured out how to add the CSP2 back in using an antique cherry end table that was my late wife's grandmother's, and a Mapleshade platform. I've got 6N2Ps in the CSP2 and one of my spare pair of RCA 5U4G rectifiers and I'm so far enjoying the added bit of warmth and dimensionality the CSP2 always delivers. It's a bit awkward to adjust (the table is behind the Samson rack and the TV stand) and I will have to work on footers, but I think this is going to be a nice setup at least for a while til I can afford another Samson rack, which I think is the ultimate solution to my situation.

It's all just warming up and getting good sound, I'm going to enjoy this tomorrow as it settles in. Thank goodness for music. It sustains a large portion of my consciousness these days.
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« Last Edit: 10/19/11 at 06:51:46 by Lon »  

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kana813
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #154 - 10/19/11 at 22:40:31
 
Lon,

Where do you set the volume level on the PWD, when your using the CSP2?
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Lon
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #155 - 10/19/11 at 22:44:24
 
I'm still experimenting. Right now I am using the volume control at 100 percent most of the time. I aggravated making judgments by doing some tube-rolling.
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« Last Edit: 10/19/11 at 22:46:05 by Lon »  

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Lon
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #156 - 10/20/11 at 16:08:10
 
Well, it was a fun experiment. . . but I've come to the conclusion that there are too many variables that I keep playing with, and that the PerfectWave DAC directly into the Torii is as good sounding. . . if not possibly a bit clearer sounding. I CAN get a bit of a more dynamic presentation with the CSP2 and a lot of dialing in, but there's a cohesiveness to the direct sound without the CSP2 that I think I prefer (although it may be that I have become so used to and happy with it I don't want to settle into a new sound). I've taken the CSP2 out.
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KimKman
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #157 - 11/02/11 at 07:24:21
 
Lon, you still have the CSP2 out of the loop with your Perfect Wave DAC?
I also have a PW DAC and leave it at 100% output to the CSP2 and then to my Torii MKII.  I kinda like fiddling with the CSP2 levels and the Torii levels to achieve slightly different results.

Think I will run the PW DAC direct for a few days though to experience the sound.  I know PSAudio recommends no preamp.
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Lon
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #158 - 11/02/11 at 12:08:45
 
I took the CSP2 out. I didn't feel it was adding enough to warrant the eventual cost of another excellent power cord, etc. And with it in the system I had a hum to chase down again and after months of hum-free I just didn't feel I had the will power to do so. Smiley Anyway, I found I could accomplish most of what I could with the CSP2 by altering the input gain on the Torii and the output of the PerfectWave DAC. And the DAC sounds so so good straight in, I've just left it like that. In fact, I'm probably going to sell the CSP2 so it doesn't spend months and months on a shelf again. My other system sounds great with a ZBox (mine has two inputs) going into the Torii Mk II, and I really don't need the CSP2 any longer.
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« Last Edit: 11/02/11 at 14:25:17 by Lon »  

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Pale Rider
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #159 - 12/19/11 at 00:11:51
 
I have tried the PWDAC both through my Ultra and straight into the Torii. Sounds great both ways. The PWDAC is very good as a preamp. But I like the flexibility of the Ultra, and I am about to start taking more advantage of its tube rolling.

Having said that, I think if I was only driving two channels, I would be very inclined to run the PWDAC straight to the Torii. And the reports of the PWDAC upgrade suggest even greater dynamics, along with the balance adjustability, making it even more suited to being its own preamp.
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Lon
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #160 - 12/19/11 at 01:23:04
 
I want you to keep your impressions of the upgrade to yourself when you form them. Smiley I don't want the temptation to upgrade! Just kidding.

I'm now using the CSP2 in the bedroom system, and just sold the ZBOX I was using there. I just had to put the CSP2 to use, and it sounds great in that system now that my DEC685 is being used as the source again. The ZBOX was going to be sitting on the shelf. I actually feel quite happy having sold the components I have the last few months, they're in use and they're enjoyed and they're not just holed away and MAYBE going to be used.

I think ultimately I'd love to have the new version of the CSP2 to use in my main system, and if I get in a money-making situation again I'll buy a second Samson rack, another PS Audio PerfectWave AC12 power cord and I know I would be very very happy. But the PerfectWave DAC is a very satisfying preamp in my system, and man I love the sound.
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Pale Rider
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #161 - 12/19/11 at 02:16:16
 
Like you, I like to see good equipment put to good use. That's why I am glad I found a home for the ZSTAGE. I love that little box, but I just don't know when I would ever put it to use again.
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Morganc
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #162 - 12/19/11 at 08:14:15
 
Hey guys,
   My new Torii is on the way and I should have her by the end of the week.  I wanted to take a survey and was hoping all of you pros out there would chime in.   As I'm good friends with Gopher, I hope he doesn't mind the hi-jack, but the topic is the same so I thought we could keep the ball rolling so to speak Wink.
  So if you could all chime in, I think this would help me make some choices:
1.  What is your favorite tube combination (not just favorite at each position, but synergistic favorites)?
2.  What kind of music do you prefer?
3.  Do you prefer detail over musicality....i.e. would you rather hear every detail imaginable at the expense of fatiguability, ear bleeding, etc?
4.  Does your room tend to be highly reflective, moderately reflective, or is it treated to the max?
5.   Do you use a pre-amp and if so which one?  
6.   What speakers do you have?

Thanks for humoring me here, but without knowing these answers above, it doesn't help so much.   Currently I have a bright tweeter in a highly reflective room that I am trying to either tame or replace the speaker.  
2.  I listen to all music, from rock to jazz and electronica.   I would like a tube combination that works well in all these settings.
3.   I prefer musicality, meaning i want to hear amazing dynamics, coherence, tonality, timbre etc and detail is much less important.  Listening fatigue is my enemy!   Lol
4. I have a highly reflective room with no treatment.  
5.   I have a Modwright Pre and also coming this week, a 2nd generation Dodd Battery Pre-amp.  
6.  My speakers are Zu Omen Def and soon (early next week) Tekton Pendragons.  

Thanks guys!
Cheers,
Morgan
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Pale Rider
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #163 - 12/19/11 at 11:11:44
 
Morgan:

Happy to chime in here, though I will observe at the outset that there are so many variables at work that you may still have some difficulty teasing out any meaningful commonalities. But I am game.

1. For tubes in the Toriis, I currently run Ediswann 6922 inputs, Shuguang Treasure 6CA7 outputs, RCA rectifiers and Raytheon regulators. I love this combo, but I will be shortly trying out Amperex 7308 PQ valves for inputs. All tubes except for the Treasures are NOS. I have some early 1970s Voskhods to try in both the Toriis and Ultra as well. On first test listen, those were quite nice.
2. All types, even some high energy hip hop in small doses. My preferences are for classic rock, large scale classical, e.g., Verdi's Requiem, jazz, fusion, the AIX Acoustica series, good live recordings of all types. For accuracy and tonality, I will turn to the Telarc John O'Conor Beethoven Piano Concertos and the Stereophile Robert Silverman Variations. Sublime.
3.  I am all about the music, but I believe that detail and soundstage are very important to musicality. I value micro dynamics and air that contribute to tonal accuracy. But I don't want the music to sound clinical. Precision in instrument and voice location is very important to me. I can listen to this rig for hours in end without fatigue.
4. Room: I have a mix of a very open room with odd asymmetrical angles, large absorptive furniture, partially reflective walls, and a large plasma display. There is a fair bit of window in the room, but with thermal and acoustic treatments. Overally, somewhat on the reflective side.
5. Preamp: yes, the Decware Ultra running National NOS 6922 valves, an RCA NOS 1964 black plate 54UG big bottle rectifier, and 0B3 regulators, if memory serves. The Nationals are about to be replaced with Siemens Halske 1960s NOS EC88 valves.
6. Speakers: 6 ERRs in a 5.0 configuration. Two of them serve as a center channel speaker with the ribbon tweeters directed at the plasma screen. They are powered by a Decware SE84ZS running in mono.  Bob is working Ina pair of Deathbix DBK212 subs to match the ERRs. They will be sloped in by a Paradigm X-30 and powered by a modified Carver M1.5T.
7. I don't think you asked about sources, but primarily my PS Audio PerfectWave DAC w/ Bridge pulling files from an NAS or Mac mini running eLyric Music Manager, all files AIFF. My transport is an Oppo BDP-95, but I may add a PE Transport just for two channel discs. As good as the Oop and its DAC are, they are no match for the PWDAC.  
8. You didn't ask about power, but I have two PS Audio Power Plant Premier units connected to the Power Port receptacle. All cords are either Decware power cords or PS Audio Statements.

Hope this helps.

Greg
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« Last Edit: 12/19/11 at 11:35:20 by Pale Rider »  

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Lon
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Re: Which input tube for a splash of seduction?
Reply #164 - 12/19/11 at 13:06:54
 
Hey Morgan, I'll contribute though I will echo that direct correlations are difficult; rooms and personal sonic tastes are huge factors.

Also, with the exception of the Ruby rectifiers (I've never been a fan, I pluck them out immediately) I think that the stock tube configuration is very good and I'd recommend spending time with that set up to see how the factory voicing is. . . .

1. For tubes in the Toriis, I currently run cryo'd 'seventies 6N1P for inputs, JJ 6CA7 or Winged C EL34 for outputs, RCA rectifiers (sixties I think) and the Raytheon regulators supplied (will eventually find something else to try).

2. I enjoy all types of music I guess, with my heart really being with jazz, blues and soul. I've been exploring classical music the last few years.

3. Musicality is the thing for me. I have a huge collection of recordings and I don't buy recordings that sound good exclusively. My goal, my search is to find a system that allows me to enjoy all the recordings. No easy feat. I'm getting there. . . .

4. My room is a living room and dining room space, long rectangular, and full of bookcases with cds, leather furniture, dining room table, drum set, a few guitar amps, hutch, guitars, etc. Mainly reflective I'd say.

5. In this system I most of the time did not use a preamp with the Torii, but I know use the PS Audio PerfectWave DAC as a preamp, and I usually have it set at 65 and up and the Torii volume all the way up. Get the clearest sound that way.

6. Half of this year I've been using ERRs and love them. A great match for the Torii! I've been hooked on the Decware Radial speakers and now can't imagine listening to another speaker type.

Like Greg I've been using PS Audio power items, I have one Power Plant Premier, and I have the PS Audio PerfectWave AC12 power cords on the PerfectWave DAC and PerfectWave Transport, and the Premier and the Torii, and I have PS Audio Premier SC cords on the TV and my Sony BDP-S5000ES Blu-ray player, and a PS Audio Statement feeding my DVR. I think power treatment and interconnect and speaker wire choice is important for a system and will determine many factors including accuracy of tonality and soundstage and imaging. I use Decware interconnects and speaker wire, and am very happy with them (though they take freaking long times to break in!)
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« Last Edit: 12/19/11 at 13:28:43 by Lon »  

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