Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Decware Audio Forums
09/02/14 at 08:04:47


Pages: 1
Send Topic Print
using a sub woofer with SE 84c (Read 2192 times)
pann56
Verified Member
**




Posts: 44
using a sub woofer with SE 84c
04/29/10 at 16:42:03
 
is it possible to use a sub with this amp and how would i hook it up?
thanks.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
DirtDawg
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 173
Re: using a sub woofer with SE 84c
Reply #1 - 04/29/10 at 19:16:30
 
Yes, it can be done quite easily if you use a separate amplifier for your subwoofer (separate from the SE84C, I mean. Using an "active subwoofer,"  with a built-in crossover and amplifier in the same box is basically the same thing.). I have done this from time to time, myself.

The method I prefer is to take a secondary set of speaker cables from the speaker outputs on the SE84C and connect them directly to the "Speaker In"  inputs on the subwoofer amplifier. This input is sometimes called a  "High Level"  input, also, because it has enough resistance built in to the input to make speaker output level from your primary amplifier safe to use as an input signal.

I do it this way in order to preserve the "tube signature" voiced into the SE84C. It is the best way I have found to "marry the two amplifiers"  into one purpose.

Good luck and let us know how it goes for you.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 04/30/10 at 01:36:31 by DirtDawg »  
WWW DirtDawg DirtDawg NO! NO!   IP Logged
MikeS
Verified Member
**


Cui bono?

Posts: 22
Re: using a sub woofer with SE 84c
Reply #2 - 06/21/11 at 16:31:04
 
I can report that the method DirtDawg describes yields excellent results.
I believe it is the one Steve Deckert recommends.
Back to top
 
 

Rega Planet > Rega Io > Mapleshade-modded 1962 Heathkit (2x EL84/ch) > audiodata 90 dB/4 Ohm speakers

laptop > HRT MusicStreamerII > SE84 'B' > Back-loaded FE206EM horns & active 15" sub
  IP Logged
MarkBlair
Senior Member
***




Posts: 59
Re: using a sub woofer with SE 84c
Reply #3 - 06/23/11 at 19:10:24
 
Anybody ever compared the above method of integrating a subwoofer with the alternate method of using two pairs of interconnects from a preamp, sending one pair to the SE84C+ (as usual), and sending the other pair to the subwoofer?

I tried the originally mentioned method (extra pair of speaker cables coming from the SE84C+), but the alternate method I just described sounds better to my ear.

Also, has anyone tried the more extreme method of using an external crossover between the preamp and the two power amps (SE84C+ and subwoofer) -- effectively routing the bass to the subwoofer, and everything above that to the SE84C+ ?
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
ski bum
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 177
Re: using a sub woofer with SE 84c
Reply #4 - 06/24/11 at 18:01:33
 
Hello Mark-

"Anybody ever compared the above method of integrating a subwoofer with the alternate method of using two pairs of interconnects from a preamp, sending one pair to the SE84C+ (as usual), and sending the other pair to the subwoofer?"

-you miss out on the harmonic signature of the amp that you get on the high level / speaker output.  
-speaker outs will roll off the deepest bass below 30hz or so, where the line level output from your pre-amp or source will not.  Pleasantly round Decware tone, or deep, uncolored extension seem to be the choices.  

"Also, has anyone tried the more extreme method of using an external crossover between the preamp and the two power amps (SE84C+ and subwoofer) -- effectively routing the bass to the subwoofer, and everything above that to the SE84C+ ?"

-Extreme?  All AVR's have bass management, so it's pretty common, although I think it's too bad it's not more common in the two channel realm.  
-High passing the signal to the Decware will reap big dividends in the headroom department.  (As a bonus, it may filter out the hum which has bedeviled you, depending on how high you go with the crossover.)
-level matching, picking crossover slopes and freq, measuring response, eq'ing to tweak the results, oh, yay.  It's not as simple as it seems to go fully active; probably easier to screw it up than get it right.  
-as in the previous method, you don't get the amp's sonic signature going to the subs.

 
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Pale Rider
Seasoned Member
****




Posts: 1272
Re: using a sub woofer with SE 84c
Reply #5 - 06/25/11 at 17:14:39
 
Quote:
-level matching, picking crossover slopes and freq, measuring response, eq'ing to tweak the results, oh, yay.  It's not as simple as it seems to go fully active; probably easier to screw it up than get it right.  
-as in the previous method, you don't get the amp's sonic signature going to the subs.

Gotta agree with skibum there. I have done the fully active before, both 2-way and 3-way, with very good active crossovers, with and without sophisticated tone and EQ. Probably easier to screw up than get right, and an endless source of fiddling and tweaking (entertaining for some, I know). Bass management is a mixed bag on many AVRs, though the latest Audessey implementations I have heard sound pretty good. I am going to put a Rhythmik sub on my system, but I do not plan to use it in 2-channel unless the bottom end of my ERRs is disappointing. Of course, the Rhythmik is an active, amplified SW, so I will also need to decide whether to run it line level out of the Ultra preamp, or from the speaker out of the Torii. I expect to settle on the former, but I plan to try both.
Back to top
 
 

Decware: Ultra | Torii MKIII [2] | SE84ZS | Taboo MkIII Sources: Synology 1812+ | Baetis Revolution | PWD DAC MKII | Lumin Network Player | Mytek 192 | Oppo 105 DSP: DEQX Mate | Emotiva Outputs: ERR [6] + Servo Subs | LCD-2 & other cans
  IP Logged
MarkBlair
Senior Member
***




Posts: 59
Re: using a sub woofer with SE 84c
Reply #6 - 06/25/11 at 18:27:55
 
Thanks ski bum & Pale Rider -- some really good observations!  I think I like the more "solid-state" bass that I get by splitting the preamp output (to the SE84C+ and the active subwoofer).  So I don't really miss tube-style bass (but I sure would miss tube-style mid-range and highs!).

Regardless, it seems to degrade the overall sound a bit when I run two sets of speaker wires (one to the speakers and one to the subwoofer high-level inputs).  So perhaps that's why I prefer solid-state bass. Wink

Plus, my current setup sounds so good (splitting the preamp output -- and the SE84C+ hum is only noticeable when no music is playing) that I shouldn't really be exploring other options.

But I do like that a separate crossover could prevent me from possibly overloading the SE84C+ with too much bass signal.  However, with my nearfield monitoring setup, I guess that's not an issue.

But thanks again for your viewpoints on this!
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Pages: 1
Send Topic Print