Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Decware Audio Forums
10/20/14 at 05:45:08


Pages: 1 ... 4 5 6 7 8 
Send Topic Print
ZCD impressions (Read 43789 times)
Doorman
Seasoned Member
****


"pouring from
the empty into the
void"

Posts: 425
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #75 - 09/03/08 at 16:07:41
 
Mine is  continuing to improve after some 4 months. Recently, the soundstage took quite a "leap". It was always very well developed side to side, but the placement of instruments and voices front to back has jumped by no small ammount.
(Bearing in mind my previous player was a Jolida 603)
Don
Back to top
 
 

Decware SE34I w/ CCE mod, ZCD, Heybrook/Linn/Clearaudio, Hagerman,
Goertz/Wireworld/cat-5/MarkAudio Alpair 10.2 drivers
(eN) in DIY Mar-Ken cabs
  IP Logged
ZENCDUSER
Senior Member
***




Posts: 67
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #76 - 09/03/08 at 17:07:29
 
Doorman,
I fogot to add that part about the soundstage.  I was away for a week and had my system turned off at the isolation transformer.  When I turned it on I noticed a slightly deeper and wide soundstage that persisted over several CDs.  I checked my left speaker, thinking I had left the connections reversed (I sometimes reverse a speaker connection on albums and CDs, which often widens the soundstage at the expense of tight base).  The connections were not reversed.
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
tybee
Verified Member
**




Posts: 28
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #77 - 09/14/08 at 00:24:37
 
Can anyone comment on the type of dac in this player?  Is it non-oversampling, oversampling, or upsampling?
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
opnly_bafld
Ex Member



Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #78 - 09/14/08 at 04:23:54
 
I believe the dac is 16 bit/ 8 times oversampling.

Lin
Back to top
 
 
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7668
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #79 - 09/20/08 at 16:17:17
 

Okay, a little update.  I put the ZCD back in the system, and it's sounding. . . better. Still a bit more forward and "tart" than I'd like ultimately.  But improved. I'm going to use it a while and see if the fatigue inducement still happens. The fact that now all my input tubes are 6N2Ps is a factor in raising the listenability I believe.  Their "lushness" has helped.  Also I've toed the speakers out quite a bit, directing the ribbon tweeter off to the sides. . . .

There's a touch more detail and dynamics here than with the NAD 585 player, but the NAD has a wonderful warm sweetness that I know I'll miss. (And I'll miss playing my SACDs).

This is without the ZBox in the system.  I'm sending my ZBox back to Steve if he'll agree (I've asked DeVon about this) to add an input and a selector switch, and look into a hum problem I've been having with the ZBox for a few weeks now.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 09/21/08 at 14:03:17 by Lon »  

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,
PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7668
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #80 - 09/23/08 at 16:41:41
 
Okay, i'm continuing to try to get a handle on this player.

I can see why Randy would sell his front end in favor of this one, especially as I think Randy loves a tight and focused sound more than I (I admit to liking more a relaxed and laid back sound, sounds more like actual music than reproduced music to me that way). This machine with Steve's mods really give you the real deal on the disc.  Which often is not a good thing in my case; I have thousands (literally) of discs that could use more sweetening than this machine will allow.

I've discovered that the listening fatigue I had experienced the first weeks with this machine has somehow dissipated.  The six weeks of running constantly under my bed must have accomplished that.  

In comparison to my other favorite sources, this machine remains a bit more "forward" than I'm apparently comfortable with, and there is less bass presence* than I'd like.  I've rolled tubes and these features remain within the tonal changes that tube rolling brings about. . . . I think this machine is very neutral and is showing me the problems that I have with my system and room.  I do tend to shelve down the ribbon tweeters in my RL2s a lot, and the geometry of my large room must be hampering me.  I'm not really able to add room treatment and I'm not changing speakers soon it appears so. . .I'm trying to get used to this as I don't want to add a subwoofer (don't think that's the cure) and I really do want to like this ZCD machine.  It's a quality playback device, no doubt of that!

I've ordered a fresh tube of my favorite tube and I'm sending my ZBox back in for attention (and the ZCD DOES sound better with the ZBox than without).  I'm going to keep spinning discs and listening and "acclimating" myself as best I can.  I really WANT to love this thing! Smiley

* well, maybe there's less bass presence. Maybe there's just something that's fundamentally different in the way this player interprets things than the DVD player sources (DEC685, Sony ES Blu-Ray player, NAD T585) I've been using and used to.  DVD players always seem to present cds in a certain way that is a tiny bit smoother, warmer, than dedicated cd players, at least to ME in my system.  I do miss a tiny rounding, a tiny bit of warmth that I think I'm used to and just isn't there with the ZCD and shouldn't be if it's a "coloration" of a DVD player. . . . The Decware products are just so clean and clear, I mean the ZCD, the CSP2, the SE34L Monoblocks just don't color the sound. . . maybe I'd be happier, get that touch of warm sweetening I seem to be missing, with a more classic sounding tube amp, Eddie V's, a revamped vintage one, etc. with the ZCD giving me the unvarnished truth on the disc?  Something to ponder I guess.
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 09/23/08 at 17:06:30 by Lon »  

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,
PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
  IP Logged
Doorman
Seasoned Member
****


"pouring from
the empty into the
void"

Posts: 425
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #81 - 09/24/08 at 03:43:01
 
Lon: Are you still using the blu-ray player also? I agree the ZCD does give a rather "sharp" presentation- I love the detail and soundstage, but I know what you're saying.
Don
Back to top
 
 

Decware SE34I w/ CCE mod, ZCD, Heybrook/Linn/Clearaudio, Hagerman,
Goertz/Wireworld/cat-5/MarkAudio Alpair 10.2 drivers
(eN) in DIY Mar-Ken cabs
  IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7668
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #82 - 09/24/08 at 13:06:17
 
Oh yes, my Decware system is my entire entertainment system in the living room-dining room area and I'm using the Blu-Ray player for Blu-Ray and DVD discs. . . comparing it to the ZCD on occasion the last few days as well.  It is smoother and warmer and a bit more laid back than the ZCD. . . I could easily live with just it, but the ZCD continues to improve and has more "depth" as far as stage and image.
Back to top
 
 

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,
PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
  IP Logged
Randy in Caintuck
Seasoned Member
****


Tube be ... or not
tube be ... it's a
no-brainer.

Posts: 409
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #83 - 09/27/08 at 22:25:46
 
My ZCD continues to improve as well.
I have been tweaking the system to optimize the sound.  I am currently running the SO Imperials from a pair of plate amps fed from the speaker taps on the Decware Select and think that I have the crossover frequency and gain level just about perfect.  With the SO Imperials hooked up there is certainly no lack of weight in the lower frequencies .....  

One additional thing was also added to the mix.  I built a box filled with lead shot and sand that sits on top of the ZCD and adds a nice amount of mass to the player.  I experimented by adding and removing shot and sand until the "tuning" sounded right to my ears.

Everything now sounds even more solid and focused than before ..... especially the bass.  So ..... the "sandwich" consists of Mapleshade Iso-blocks, a maple slab, HeavyFeet, the ZCD, the shot and sand box and HeavyHats as the cherry on top.

The stock feet were also removed from the ZCD to allow optimal positioning of the Mapleshade HeavyFeet.

Here is a photo of the setup (I really must get a better camera) :



Sounding good .....  

Randy
Back to top
 
 

CEC TL-2 belt drive CD transport
Camelot Uther / Anagram DAC
Decware Model SE84C+ amplifier
Greenvalve Audio Type 10 amplifier
Parker Audio Troll Magnus speakers
"Mini Me" OBs - with Hawthorne Augies, Wild Burro Betsy drivers and Heil AMTs
WWW   IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7668
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #84 - 09/28/08 at 00:46:52
 
Looks nice.

I've never liked the sound of sand and lead but then I may not have gotten the tuning right ever.  I have decided I prefer Herbie Audio Lab Isoball footers to the Mapleshade brass AND Isoblocks so I use those under components and platform, and have the CSP2 sitting on top of these on top of the ZCD (the ZBox is by now back at Decware).

Sounding good.  Still not completely satisfied, but may be in the near future if the ZCD keeps improving.  Of course I don't have (and wouldn't be able to in this house) SO Imperials, a definite "deficit"!

Happy listening as you heal my friend!
Back to top
 
 

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,
PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
  IP Logged
Randy in Caintuck
Seasoned Member
****


Tube be ... or not
tube be ... it's a
no-brainer.

Posts: 409
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #85 - 09/28/08 at 20:19:37
 
Hi Lon,

Thanks for the encouraging words ..... they mean a lot .....

In the past, I have had mixed feelings about shot and sand.  In some situations it improved the sound, in others it degraded it.  For whatever reason, in this application it has been beneficial.  The SO Imperials definitely change the overall tonal balance of my system.  While the Parker Audio Behemoths dig down pretty low, they don't produce a lot below 50 hz sitting seven feet from the front wall.  The Imperials help to give the sound a "nice foundation" .....

I have also experimented with a "stock" power cord, the Decware power cord and one that was made for me by Parker Audio.  There is no comparison.  The stock cord lacks "sweetness" and some tonal complexity compared to the other two power cords.  I'm still curious as to how much of an effect your ZCD power cord is having on the sound of your player.  Of course, you are happy with the sound of the stock power cords on your other players ..... go figure .....

Best wishes,

Randy

Back to top
 
 

CEC TL-2 belt drive CD transport
Camelot Uther / Anagram DAC
Decware Model SE84C+ amplifier
Greenvalve Audio Type 10 amplifier
Parker Audio Troll Magnus speakers
"Mini Me" OBs - with Hawthorne Augies, Wild Burro Betsy drivers and Heil AMTs
WWW   IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7668
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #86 - 09/28/08 at 21:19:14
 
Randy,

None of my other players have stock cords.  I have PS Audio XStream cords of two types and Decware power cords on all my other units.

I have a sort of IEC converter I can wire in to use other power cords and probably will.  I'm trying to get a handle on the sound of the unit just as it is. . . and decide if I'm ultimately going to keep it forever (I probably will) and will then splice in t hat IEC plug and use a PS Audio cord on the machine.  I believe that power cords DO make a difference. I regret not ordering this machine with the IEC option!

As for the additonal mass and weight for the player, I really find that using the big brass Mapleshade footers necessitates adding some sort of weight to most components.  I haven't found that necessary with teh Herbie's Audio Lab Isocups, which is nice.
Back to top
 
 

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,
PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
  IP Logged
Randy in Caintuck
Seasoned Member
****


Tube be ... or not
tube be ... it's a
no-brainer.

Posts: 409
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #87 - 09/29/08 at 01:26:42
 
Quote:
None of my other players have stock cords.  I have PS Audio XStream cords of two types and Decware power cords on all my other units.


Well ..... that's what I get for presuming.  I went back and found the place where you said that upscale power cords were being used on your other front end components .....

That makes a lot more sense to me based on the results I'm getting.

I may just have to try the Herbie's Audio Lab Isocups.  I find myself agreeing with your findings much more often than not when it comes to these things .....

Take care,

Randy
Back to top
 
 

CEC TL-2 belt drive CD transport
Camelot Uther / Anagram DAC
Decware Model SE84C+ amplifier
Greenvalve Audio Type 10 amplifier
Parker Audio Troll Magnus speakers
"Mini Me" OBs - with Hawthorne Augies, Wild Burro Betsy drivers and Heil AMTs
WWW   IP Logged
Steve Deckert
Administrator
*****


If the 1st watt
sucks why continue?

Posts: 2425
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #88 - 10/06/08 at 23:38:26
 
Lon,

I've been following your comments on the ZCD and have been a little surprised and I guess disappointed that the adjectives "forward and tart" or "lacking warmth or smoothness" have remained a consistent theme in all of your posts.  Usually when something like this happens I get to read a post about "finding the culprit" and all is good... so I have to wonder why it's not happening here.

After pondering this for some time, I wondering if the difference between output of the various players is causing this impression.  I would be willing to bet that if I made the output level of the ZCD adjustable so you could find the sweet spot with your CSP2 that we could make the player sound considerably warmer.  

If I was at your house right now, I would probably be experimenting with the CSP2 output level controls on the back vs. the volume control on the front to find where everything sounds and works best for the warmest sound.  Then if that didn't work, drop the output level of the ZCD.  This can be also be done by using a 12AU7 in the ZBOX and adjusting the output level control to about 1/2.



Steve
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 10/06/08 at 23:45:40 by Steve Deckert »  
WWW   IP Logged
Lon
Seasoned Member
****


"Love without
guts is
worthless!"
Philip K. D*ck

Posts: 7668
Re: ZCD impressions
Reply #89 - 10/07/08 at 00:20:37
 
Steve, I have in fact last week seriously reduced the gain on the CSP2 and that has helped tame the sound quite a bit.  There are endearing qualities to this player.  Though I reiterate, the tart, dryness and forwardness is in comparison to the other players. . . I wouldn't say that it is that way as distinctly outside of direct or simultaneous comparison.  It exhibits these characteristics more so than the dvd and Blu-Ray players as a source.

I made a fairly significant change in speaker placement, and I have been tube rolling (I've been using a 12AU7 or 12BH7A in both this player and the ZBox; the 12BH7A I seem to prefr and it seems to have about the same output as a 12AU7) and seem stuck on the 12BH7A as giving me the most accurate sound (I use recordings I made of bands I was in recorded in my then garage apartment as a guide).

I'm getting used to the player. . .and I'll keep it in system and probably splice in an IEC recptacle and try a few power cords, yours and a PS Audio XStream.  Not really eager to send it back for modification. . . I hate having components in the mail and out of my reach. Smiley

Thanks for the attention. This is a very fine player. Whether it's exactly what I would dial in for myself and my archive of recordings, not sure, maybe.  Interested to hear how it sounds with the ZBox now that I've moved speakers and gain settings. (Hopefully, YOU have my ZBox at this time, for modification).
Back to top
 
« Last Edit: 10/07/08 at 00:26:15 by Lon »  

Decware:ERR,HR-1,ZP3,CSP2+,Torii Mk III,PS Audio PWT+DS,
PowerBases,PPP,AC-12 pcs, Denon DBP-A100, Denon DCD-A100,Rega RP3 +TTPSU,white belt+Exact2, VooDoo Cable:Evo,Ultra Linear, Iso-PodMapleshade:Double Heiix Plus.Samsonv2+v3 +4" platforms,Herbie's Iso-Cup
  IP Logged
Pages: 1 ... 4 5 6 7 8 
Send Topic Print