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1st DB10 build (Read 5359 times)
therooboy
Ex Member



1st DB10 build
08/20/06 at 09:15:44
 
Hi All,

Being a bass player for over 26 years I loooove bottom end  :) (no rude comments please!). I am thinking of building a DB10 for my car to compliment my 7x10's, which do have a fair wack of bottom end, but nowhere near enough for my liking. From what I've read, the DB10 should be fabtastic if carefully built and tuned.  As a bass player, my sound is 'percussive' and I love slappin'. The kind of music I like to listen to varies, but I like fast and accurate bottom end with a balanced amount of low bass. SQ is always important. I'm not into doof-doof music, though I can appreciate a system that I can feel coming from 3 km's away.

Anyways, I have read most of the posts in this forum and have picked up heaps of tips - thanks. I have a couple of questions I would like to put out there. I want to run the DB10 in the boot (trunk for you yanks). Will the DB10  interact with the underside of the 7x10s to the extent that I will need to box them off? Can I box them off if they are made for a free air application? Also, to obtain a little lower bass, can anyone comment on the advantages of a DB10 in clamshell configuration? Or would increasing the volume in the sealed area utilising a single driver be better for slightly lower bass?  ???

Thanks in advance and long live bottom end!
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Adrian D.
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #1 - 08/20/06 at 16:08:16
 
hi and welcome to the forum
any sub will interfere with the speakers in the rear shelf if you don't have a small box for them.
if your sub works in small sealed boxes, the db will make it shine.
some of the best info you can get on the db is on the old db forum, where steve used to reply rather often.
imo stick to the plans if your sub won't use up a lot of space from the sealed part.
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« Last Edit: 08/20/06 at 16:08:46 by adi_ro »  
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60ndown
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #2 - 08/21/06 at 02:56:08
 
id sujjest disconnecting the 7x10s and running only front speakers (doors/dash) and build a death box. the kind of bass you can get from the db is amazing if you have never heard great bass in a car.............loud., its so accurate and plays so low it makes you wonder what you have been missing all these years. speakers in the rear of a car are generally not a good idea and good/accurate bass without a good enclosure is hard to achive. build a db (maybe even the db2 (for a 12" woofer) get a good amp to power it and try with and without the rear shelf speakers.either way your in for a real treat. Grin
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therooboy
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #3 - 08/21/06 at 03:53:28
 
Hi Adrian and 60,

Thanks for you suggestions. I'd like to keep my rear shelf speakers if possible as I don't want to have to spend another $200+ on new speakers. They weren't 'cheapies' when I purchased them 3 years ago and I doubt they'd fetch much on ebay. I'm going to be up for around $600 to build the DB10 inclduing a decent amp and its starting to get expensive if I have to get new front speakers as well. I dont think I can fit the 7x10s in the doors!

I notice the prices in the US are a lot cheaper than here in Australia Cry  - the result of a much bigger market due to a lot more people! I would get stuff from the US but when weight starts getting uo there, shipping can cost as much as the product which then brings it on par with Australian prices. For example, from a store, I can get the Infinity ref1040w for AUD$165 which is about AUD$65 below RRP. On Australian ebay, you can get it shipped for $180. On us ebay, you can get it shipped (within the US) for around USD$70 which is about AUD$92. I saw it online in the US for around USD$60. You get the picture!

So I think I will keep the 7x10s for now and as you suggest 60, I'll suck it and see, and go from there. I am anticipating an excellent sound from the DB10 as I have read what people are saying. It's like a good steak cooking on the BBQ, making my mouth water waiting for that steak to finally arrive on my plate!
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60ndown
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #4 - 08/21/06 at 04:12:43
 
fairdinkum Wink
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Adrian D.
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #5 - 08/21/06 at 12:45:00
 
keeping the 7x10s and not houding them will most likely mess up the sound from them and probably kill them.
i know how it is to see such low prices in the us and wonder why stuff is so expensive locally. check al the rules. maybe it'll be cheaper ordering directly from the us.
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J_Rock
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #6 - 08/21/06 at 15:31:37
 
The talk about removing rear speakers is generally for the purpose of pure SQ cars.  Alot of people claim that rear speakers simply mess up ythe imaging that can be accomplished with well placed front speakers.  If you want to keep them- which it sounds like- thats perfectly fine.  I still have my infinities in the back playing loud.

But- you will find they tighten up and play with less distortion when they are boxed in.   The result of the air spring behind them helping them stay moving smoothly.  Even with free-air woofers, the only difference I have experienced from boxing them in is a loss in low bass performance.  But this loss is at the bottom end- right where your new DB will begin its frequency range.

I would box them in to keep the subs pressure waves from pushing on them too.  Theres nothing worse for a large speaker like your 7x10s then moving all the way out to their XMax, then being pushed further by the subwoofer.

So not only will you protect them, they should tighten up in accuracy- all resulting in alot cleaner mix with the new DB.


As far as building the DB- you are exactly right.  If you take your time and tune it very carefully you will be rewarded with loud, low, clean, wonderful bass.

All of this is from what I have experienced with Decware Boxes- I have built some WOs, Several DB1 and DB2, and like to think I have experience with Steve's best designs.

Hope I helped ya out, and Good Luck!
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60ndown
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #7 - 08/21/06 at 20:53:36
 
[quote author=J_Rock  link=1156065344/0#6 date=1156170697]I have built some WOs, Several DB1 and DB2, and like to think I have experience with Steve's best designs.
[/quote]

build a wo32 Grin
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J_Rock
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #8 - 08/21/06 at 23:11:40
 
I am not going to build a WO32 until I have a place to put it, right now the only room I can load up with speakers has plans for some mains and 2 TL subs.  Once I have room though- you betchya.
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therooboy
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #9 - 08/25/06 at 13:34:15
 
Hey thanks for eveyones 2 cents. If I could fit the 7x10's in the front, I would, but they are just too big for the doors. Putting then in the dash might obstruct some of that all important road view. However, this may only be a problem when actually driving...

J_Rock - about the box design for the 7x10's. Considering I wont be caring about the bottom end from these, can I just make the smallest possible enclosure needed? I'm guessing yes as enclosures a purely there for the lower end of the sound spectrum?

My first experience with going beyond a speakers xmax was about 9 years ago on stage doing a gig in a local pub in Melbourne (of whcih I did around 1250 in 6 years - sorry, I'm getting toward 40 and I think I'm hagning on to any piece of a simpler time I can!). Anyways, it was the last song of the night and the song called for the use of an envelope filter. We were doing that rock end-of-song muso thing when we all play as fast and hard as we can and finish on a final big note. Just before the final big one, I lost the bottom end on my biamped system (4x10 Hartke top, single 15 EV bottom). Since it was the end of the night I didn't care too much. The next day I checked it out. There were no visible signs of damage and when I pushed on the cone, there was no evidence of a melted coil at all - smooth as a babies backside. I plugged it in and it sounded like a transistor radio speaker! I couldn't for the life of me work out what was wrong. Eventually, I turned it over and noticed a faint line that ran the entire way around the cone near the suspension and below the dust cover. So the thing had maxed out and the small part of the cone  still attached to the motor, decide it was parting ways with the rest of the cone and just pushed straight on through and said hello to the back of the dust cover! Cry time for a JBL E140!

Thanks again for everyones posts here and throughout this site. There are nuggets everwhere to be found. I get a bit sick of usenet with the one-up-manship and off topic chatter that never comes back to the op's original question etc - can be quite unfriendly. Theres a good vibe on these forums so I commend you all and keep up the good spirit!
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jj420
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #10 - 08/25/06 at 22:42:53
 
You can help contribute to the good vibe by providing a few pics for us during your build.
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J_Rock
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #11 - 08/26/06 at 06:30:39
 
I would suggest building a box the entire way across the package tray of the vehicle, with enough depth to clear the magnets.  Alot of the time these boxes are really hard to make though, because the trunk torsion bars are in the mix and get in the way.  But generally- like you said- any size will work its only critical when aiming for low end extension.

Another thing you will notice is that the people on this forum thrive on pictures- so they ask for them all the time. lol.

Do you have your sub and amp picked out?  If not- give these guys a price range and your location, they should come up with a few suggestions.
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therooboy
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #12 - 08/26/06 at 08:00:53
 
It's getting more expensive! I did think about the torsion bars and there's not much room there. Its also got an even underside to the parcel shelf so it's probably beyond my experience to make something that goes the entire width (or anything for that matter).

I'm actually thinking of getting a kitchen manufacturer to cut the pieces for me as I haven't got the equipment nor the experience to do this. Eventhough it looks fairly simple, I've never really been a handyman - more of a problem solving/artistic type. I plan to do the assembly so there should be some pics of this and the installation.

I have picked a driver, the Infinity REF1040w. I can pick it up locally for around AUD$160 (~$120 USD). They actually retail for about AUD$220.  The thing I like about getting it locally is it would include a manufacturers waranty with a local point of return if problems arise. I haven't picked an exact amp although I have been very pleased with my Coustic 241SE for the price. Actually, its a bridgeable model capable of 240 watts @ 4 ohms with built in high and low pass filters variable @ 30-300Hz & 18dB/Oct. It's also got a bass boost control @ 45Hz and 0-18dB so it can be used as a subwoofer amp. Do the class D mono-blocks have a great(or any) advantage over AB switching types for subwoofer use? Any suggestions? I'm in South Eastern suburbs of Melbourne, Australia. I'll chuck another shrimp on the barby, and crack a cold one for ya's if ya can help an old cobber out - cheers mate!
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Adrian D.
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #13 - 08/26/06 at 12:50:29
 
only advantage of class d is, imo, is better efficiency.
you chose a good combo. infinity works really nice in the db-10.
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« Last Edit: 08/26/06 at 12:50:41 by adi_ro »  
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60ndown
Ex Member



Re: 1st DB10 build
Reply #14 - 08/26/06 at 14:02:48
 
you could always go to a car audio store and have them install for you.wont be a decware design but it might be easier and cheaper in the long run? sometimes they even have used equipment? it should be installed correctly and sound good if they know anything.or at least call them and ask how much$$ for a basic amp n sub install. the origional bazooka tubes are very good, and cheap, nowdays.and fit almost anywhere.

http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?cgiurl=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2Fws%2...
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« Last Edit: 08/26/06 at 14:03:21 by 60ndown »  
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