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WO32 construction: Part II (Read 16182 times)
goldenk10
Ex Member



WO32 construction: Part II
02/27/06 at 23:48:26
 
Ladies and gentlemen,

The WO32 is 95% complete. We worked last night until 1:30 am, but simply ran out of time. All that is left is to mount the "lid" onto the rest of the box. I am electing to have a fully removable lid so I can easily acess the inside of the box for maintenance and future repairs. I will post a bunch of pics detailing the process once fully complete.

Anxious to see what type of sound is produced, I dragged the box into my small apt room, aprox 10' x 14' and hooked up my Realistic STA-820 Reciever. I used NCH tone generator to run various frequencies between 100 Hz and 20 Hz. Even with the Realistic at 50% power (~15 W/channel), the sub was making the entire apartment shake. My roommate took one of my knives and set it on the enclosure...we proceeded to watch it "dance" during a 30 Hz sine run.

Even with the ol' low-power realistic, the sub was making me quite anxious to seal it up, and run it with a proper sub-amp.

Here are a few pics to whet everyone's appetite. Enjoy.



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60ndown
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #1 - 02/28/06 at 01:06:57
 
nice work,




Wink
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J_Rock
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #2 - 02/28/06 at 01:16:11
 
OMG 60's Vomit induceing pic.  Seriously the thing makes my head spin!


What subs are you useing?  I prolly could check the other thread but I wanted to bump your thread anyways. lol
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goldenk10
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #3 - 02/28/06 at 04:19:03
 
Thanks J,

I believe your question deserves a link, and a picture or two. If you really want the dirt on the drivers, check the previous thread, WO32 construction part I. I tested the T/S parameters before I threw them in the box.

Driver:

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=295-550

WO32 construction: Part I:

http://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=WO32;action=display;num=11403...

Pics:

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goldenk10
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #4 - 02/28/06 at 04:26:23
 
60,

I see what looks to be elements of a house wrecker, imperial top horn, and a couple other decware designs. What decware enclosure haven't you built? Kudos.
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60ndown
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #5 - 02/28/06 at 14:41:32
 
[quote author=goldenk10  link=1141087706/0#4 date=1141100783]60,

I see what looks to be elements of a house wrecker, imperial top horn, and a couple other decware designs. What decware enclosure haven't you built? Kudos. [/quote]

thats a 'photoshopped' pic of my db12 build. i have built the wo, wo32, hw, and 3 dbs.all of them excellent , but the wo32 is the best....... its accuracy is truely UNBELIEVEABLE you are obviously detail oriented, you will love the detail the wo32 gives you IF those drivers you used work in it?
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DirtDawg
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #6 - 02/28/06 at 15:40:12
 
[quote author=60ndown  link=1141087706/0#1 date=1141088817]


Wink [/quote]
This picture reminds me of my first beer. I had no idea that regurgitation could attain such a velocity. Considering the rather poor sectional density of rejected comsumables the range is quite remarkable, also
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« Last Edit: 02/28/06 at 15:43:09 by DirtDawg »  
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Zygi
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #7 - 02/28/06 at 15:58:16
 
Golden,


   Nice build, looking real nice. I have a few things I see which aren't just right......

   The driver does not need any screws to hold it in place. I.E. it should be isolated from both the baffle plates. When finished the plate holding the driver, (I forget the letters for the items) shouldn't touch the horn throat plate.  Theres a cleat at the bottom of the removable baffle with a slight angle cut on it. the baffle plate slides in behind this cleat holding the bottom in place while the top has two screw like you have shown in your pictures.

In one of the pictures your left hand is on the disc at the transition where the two horns merge, in the picture you removed the rest of the mitre which overhanges, it should be left in place.

 And very important, I can's see in your pictures, but I think its part "F" which look like a cross section of an airplane wing which is angled to match the beginning flare of the horn, that NEEDS to be installed. Big mistake if you forget it.

 Not trying to put you on the spot, or anything, it just look like your headed in the right direction with a good build. You've taken some good pictures and everyone can learn form this.


   Thanks for the pictures,
       BobZ.
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60ndown
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #8 - 02/28/06 at 20:41:43
 
oh oh!!?   Sad     Shocked      ???     Roll Eyes      :-/      :'(      ;)
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goldenk10
Ex Member



Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #9 - 02/28/06 at 20:45:35
 
Zygi,

Very keen observations. I tried to follow the plans as closely as possible, but also took some recommendations from the box builder/shop owner who was helping me. I am not trying to argue here, I just wanted to state my reasoning behind various construction decisions.

*On page 4 of the blueprints, 2 screws seem to go from the driver baffle into the wall making up the horn throat. So, wouldn't this be coupling the driver baffle to the wall of the horn throat?

*The cleat: based on the assumption that a friction fit is taking place between the cleat, the driver baffle and the horn throat wall, I would think that a substitute for the cleat would be reasonable. We elected to forego the cleat and instead, use two more bolts with lock washers and T-nuts. This way, the driver baffle is bolted to the horn throat wall panel. Time will tell if this was a wise decision.

*With regards to the mitre cut on the edge of the second fold with the velocity disc, I may have read the blueprints wrong. Page 4 of the prints has instructions to "soften edge". Looking from the top view of the prints on page 1, I think you are correct and I just plain botched this part. I chalk this one up to inexperience. Sad

*We did include part F. Even I in my n00bness was able to recognize that the outer panel and horn throat panels needed to be braced. We were using a brad nailer for most everything and one of these started to split. When in doubt, add glue? Tongue

The build started out with high QC, patient cutting and dry-fitting. By the end of an 8-hour assembly/construction session, my meticulous nature began to be ruled by fatigue and impatience.

*Also, another error in the build occured with the placement of the internal anti-reflection baffles in the sealed chamber. If you look closely, you'll notice one of the vertical semi-cirlce discs is mounted closer to the driver baffle than the other. I am not sure if this will have a dramatic effect on the overall performance of the box. Obviously, symmetry is desired...we will see.

Thinking back, I wish I had more time. Because this is a project for an acoustics class, staying on schedule sometimes supercedes producing high-quality workpieces. I am certain this is not the last box I will build.

I am having a blast getting a crash-course in acoustics an applying that knowledge while building the WO32.

Above all, I appreciate the constructive criticism you have so courteously offered. I hope to gain as much knowledge as possible from all the audio oracles that frequent the forums.
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Zygi
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #10 - 03/01/06 at 00:29:40
 
Golden,


---------------------------------------------------------  
*On page 4 of the blueprints, 2 screws seem to go from the driver baffle into the wall making up the horn throat. So, wouldn't this be coupling the driver baffle to the wall of the horn throat?

  Yes this would, maybe I worded it wrong. If the driver is Isolated from both panels then both panels could touch and the driver would still be isolated. Rather than mount the driver to the removable baffle (with screws) all that is needed is some speaker sealing caulk in the back side and the gasket on the front side where the driver meets the baffle horn throat.
------------------------------------------------------------

*The cleat: based on the assumption that a friction fit is taking place between the cleat, the driver baffle and the horn throat wall, I would think that a substitute for the cleat would be reasonable. We elected to forego the cleat and instead, use two more bolts with lock washers and T-nuts. This way, the driver baffle is bolted to the horn throat wall panel. Time will tell if this was a wise decision.

I don't feel leaving the cleat out is as big a deal as coupling the driver to the cabinet. However when built with the gasket sealing caulk, you'd have seen how valuable the cleat is. If you look at it another way, you'ed see that the cleat, once the upper screws are installled 1/2 the baffles energy is transmitted to the bottom of the cabinet not the horn throat wall.
------------------------------------------------------------

*With regards to the mitre cut on the edge of the second fold with the velocity disc, I may have read the blueprints wrong. Page 4 of the prints has instructions to "soften edge". Looking from the top view of the prints on page 1, I think you are correct and I just plain botched this part. I chalk this one up to inexperience.

When I first  started building speakers for Decware, I had a man from Chicago want me to build him two WO-32's. He sent the plans plus a calling card in case I had any questions. After I had removed the mitre from around the volocity discs, I happened to call Steve to ask another question, when I ask him if what i had done with the mitres was correct, and then to find out I was incorrect, I started another pair. I have two WO-32's myself. I added the mitres back on mine, but it was still something I couldn't knowingly let go out the door. I chaulked it up to inexperience as well. We've all been there.

------------------------------------------------------------
*We did include part F. Even I in my n00bness was able to recognize that the outer panel and horn throat panels needed to be braced. We were using a brad nailer for most everything and one of these started to split. When in doubt, add glue?

 In this case glue is all thats needed. Its self clamping, and a little extra tension on the two panels is a good thing.

------------------------------------------------------------

The build started out with high QC, patient cutting and dry-fitting. By the end of an 8-hour assembly/construction session, my meticulous nature began to be ruled by fatigue and impatience.

Thats happens to the best of us. Your build looks real good, its just the small things, the details, and that were it gets everybody. I don't have that luxury.

------------------------------------------------------------

*Also, another error in the build occured with the placement of the internal anti-reflection baffles in the sealed chamber. If you look closely, you'll notice one of the vertical semi-cirlce discs is mounted closer to the driver baffle than the other. I am not sure if this will have a dramatic effect on the overall performance of the box. Obviously, symmetry is desired...we will see.

These are meant to break up the back wave, non-symmetry in this case is a good thing.
------------------------------------------------------------


Thinking back, I wish I had more time. Because this is a project for an acoustics class, staying on schedule sometimes supercedes producing high-quality workpieces. I am certain this is not the last box I will build.

I hope this is not the last box you build. I'm glad you took the time to respond, in hopes that other people can learn from this.

------------------------------------------------------------

Above all, I appreciate the constructive criticism you have so courteously offered. I hope to gain as much knowledge as possible from all the audio oracles that frequent the forums.

 I was just trying to help, the worse case scenario when someone buys the plans is not building exactly as the plans spec. and then turn around and say the WO-32 sucks. I'm sure every piece in the WO-32 has a purpose and several versions were built to get it to the design it is today. Someday we'll hopfully be learning something from you.
  When you get out of school, take your knowledge from your courses, start thinking outside the box. What we don't know about audio, hasn't been tried yet.


     Good luck with your studies,
           BobZ.






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« Last Edit: 03/01/06 at 00:41:59 by ZYGI »  
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gexter
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #11 - 03/01/06 at 05:50:35
 
Nice work. No really, nice work goldenk10.

Your work and Bobs input is a start in rebuilding the information that was lost awhile ago.

If I was to notice anything that was not noticed before. I look at the thin gasket on the driver baffle board.
I would check it after you use it for awhile with some " full throttle runs"

Overall its beautiful work!

maybe my next one will look as good as yours  :)

G




Smiley Smiley
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goldenk10
Ex Member



Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #12 - 03/01/06 at 07:09:14
 
Thanks Zygi and Gexter,

The box was finally completed this evening. I chose to use a gasket seal on all the top surfaces, combined with coutersunk threaded brass inserts, machine screws and lock washers. I don't plan on removing the top often, but if I need to modify or maintain the enclosure, I can, without sacfrificing the integrity of the seal or MDF.

I will post pics soon. I'm not currently at home, and don't have access to my camera.

Anxious to listen to my new WO32, I placed it into my small 1993 Honda Civic trunk. ( basically filled the entire trunk.)

What followed was truly amazing. Three words. Thump, growl and snap. Obviously, many elements of my listening experience were not ideal, but after 30 mins of aimless driving and "butt-dyno-ing" the speaker, I can say I am pleasanty surprised.

Since the plans arrived my free thoughts have been consumed with this project, and it has been invigorating.

I have roughly 5-6 hours of CAD ahead of me tonight for another project (rotating aircraft wing fixture) so I can't afford to spend any more time evaluating it. Shame.

Ahead:

Full SPL frequency response and accompanying report.

Thanks for all the helpful comments and encouragement!
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60ndown
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #13 - 03/01/06 at 08:38:42
 
eerrrrrmmmm? steve d specifically states that the wo32 will not work in a car.
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goldenk10
Ex Member



Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #14 - 03/01/06 at 08:51:28
 
60,

I know, I know. At present, my amp is still on order from parts express. Should be here ~March 5th. It may well be fact that the WO32 isn't intended to be placed in a vehicle, and I make no claims otherwise.

My car sub amp is all I have that will power it right now. I have to transport the enclosure to and from the shop, so.....

:D

I plan to use the WO32 for it's intended purpose, home theatre and home audio. Nevertheless, the results in the vehicle were quite impressive. I was floored. My two friends who I picked up for joyrides shared a similar reaction.  

From another thread, I believe Jet_Lee uses both the WO and WO32 (and modified designs) in vehicles with positive results. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Also, I plan to try your orientation for home placement once my amp arrives. Approx. 4" off the floor, firing down with a blanket/tablecloth over the box? Seems it would be an interesting experiment worth trying.
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Jet-Lee
Ex Member



Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #15 - 03/01/06 at 15:05:19
 
That is an awesome build, Golden. I hope to rival your quality sometime in the near future.

I have had positive results with my enclosures in my car, because I lack somewhat(a lot) in the home theatre department. My current design is, by far, the best thing I've ever made. My WO32 was not a 32 though, it was 24, and still not made correct, so I cannot rate the 32, only my 24, which sucked. I also didn't have plans, only pictures.

I'm thinking of making a wall right behind my fold-down-able seats, placing the box at the very back of the trunk, and extending the horn to/through the wall.

I look forward to more of your builds, Golden.
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goldenk10
Ex Member



Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #16 - 03/03/06 at 23:50:39
 
More Pics, as promised.

I used threaded brass inserts shown in the first picture. Next, we applied some home depot weather stripping to the entire top surface, burned holes into the weather stripping so the screws didn't chew it up, used machine screws+washers+lock washers to have a fully removable top..... a convertible WO32. Please note in the second pic, do NOT cut the mitre off of the corner. I DID NOT MAKE THIS PANEL CORRECTLY!

Enjoy!



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DirtDawg
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #17 - 03/04/06 at 01:05:17
 
Looks good Golden,

Your lucky to get a blow by blow critique from the master builder. This thread will make it more clear for all of us future WO32 builders.

BobZ,

Thanks for all your time helping to work out the details. Your efforts will be helpful to everyone.
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60ndown
Ex Member



Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #18 - 03/08/06 at 14:01:05
 
looks 2 me like there is still a small detail missing in the 2nd bend? and re-size them pics.

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gexter
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #19 - 03/09/06 at 08:38:32
 
60

how about a little fabric and trimming excess and some fleck paint or something. a vacuum and a can of flat black would even help.

but hows it sound ?   the drivers in the deck more specifically
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M3
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #20 - 03/09/06 at 16:02:54
 
[quote author=60ndown  link=1141087706/15#18 date=1141826465]looks 2 me like there is still a small detail missing in the 2nd bend? and re-size them pics.

[/quote]
Do you sealed off all the trunk?  ;D
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60ndown
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #21 - 03/10/06 at 00:16:37
 
[quote author=gexter  link=1141087706/15#19 date=1141893512]60

how about a little fabric and trimming excess and some fleck paint or something. a vacuum and a can of flat black would even help.

but hows it sound ?   the drivers in the deck more specifically [/quote]


the 8s in the deck supprised me alot, the 12 is excellent and is well established as a hard to beat sq woofer that can get loud, after listening to it for a year i connected the 8s and well, im fitting the 8s in my new ride.they have almost the same performance as the single 12 except they are 'snappier' faster, more articulate. im not sure if the 12 fireing thru the seat foam was being affected (aperiodic?) negatively.? maybe it would get a little more of the speed magic the 8s have if it were allowed to play directly in to the listening area with no seat foam in from of it. im sure i will give it a chance but for now im going to try and get the 8s right up front. even have a 2500 wrms amp in the mail for em Grin

http://www.onlinecarstereo.com/CarAudio/ProductDetail.aspx?ProductID=13472

$400 used form a guy on the net, i hope it arrives and works?
if the first watt sucks, try the other 2499 Wink
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gexter
Ex Member



Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #22 - 03/10/06 at 02:18:59
 
[quote author=60ndown  link=1141087706/15#21 date=1141949797]


the 8s in the deck supprised me alot, the 12 is excellent and is well established as a hard to beat sq woofer that can get loud, after listening to it for a year i connected the 8s and well, im fitting the 8s in my new ride.they have almost the same performance as the single 12 except they are 'snappier' faster, more articulate. im not sure if the 12 fireing thru the seat foam was being affected (aperiodic?) negatively.? maybe it would get a little more of the speed magic the 8s have if it were allowed to play directly in to the listening area with no seat foam in from of it. im sure i will give it a chance but for now im going to try and get the 8s right up front. even have a 2500 wrms amp in the mail for em Grin

http://www.onlinecarstereo.com/CarAudio/ProductDetail.aspx?ProductID=13472

$400 used form a guy on the net, i hope it arrives and works?
if the first watt sucks, try the other 2499 Wink [/quote]

LOL   Smiley  

I like the results that you had with the 8". brings the WO32 to mind and thats what I really enjoy..
I have enjoyed my smaller subs when I do some lengthy listening  it may be in my Head but I find less fatigue and I can listen and enjoylonger

So many Ideas so little time...
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60ndown
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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #23 - 03/10/06 at 04:15:35
 
[quote author=gexter  link=1141087706/15#22 date=1141957139]

LOL   Smiley  

I like the results that you had with the 8". brings the WO32 to mind and thats what I really enjoy..
I have enjoyed my smaller subs when I do some lengthy listening  it may be in my Head but I find less fatigue and I can listen and enjoylonger

So many Ideas so little time...
[/quote]

yea my 32 is the best sub ive ever heard.
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turbobusa65
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Posts: 66
Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #24 - 05/11/07 at 02:42:53
 
Golden.... awesom job looks great! I noticed you had a bo-bo on your finger there in one of those pic's lol!!.............60............ W T F!! I thought I was having an acid flashback from that pic YOU posted!!! Please don't do it no more!!! LOL LOL!!!!
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speakerfreak7
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Posts: 88
Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #25 - 06/25/07 at 22:10:44
 
wow that's an awesome build. what amp did u order. i'm thinkin of buildin one and usin those subs also. so would u wire them in parallel for 8 ohms?
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Adrian
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'Adrian D.'

Posts: 250
Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #26 - 07/18/07 at 09:51:51
 
2 4 ohm drivers wired in parallel = 2 ohm final load.
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Too much bass never hurts, or does it ?
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speakerfreak7
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Posts: 88
Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #27 - 07/21/07 at 09:05:43
 
yea that is what i meant to say. my bad. anyways i starrted to build the wo32 today!!! got almost all the pieces cut. but i'm still not completely understanding how this "cleat" thing works? i have the plans but i'm still confused. i've read threw this forum and figured out some other stuff but i need help on th cleat. is there anymore helpful pics of it? do u think it there would be a noticable difference if i just screwed it to the horn? i'm gonna use the same subs that goldenk used.
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ZYGI
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HR-ONE

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Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #28 - 07/21/07 at 13:46:16
 
freak7

The cleat, along with two or more screws at the top of the mounting plates, isolates the driver from the box. The angle is cut to allow the baffle board to slide in behind the cleat when the driver is in the baffle assembly. If no driver present the board should slide in the slot between the cleat and cabinet with ease.

 In the picture above showing the velocity  discs, the projection mitered material on both sides of the disc should not be removed, is should be left in tact.

 One of the worst sounding WO-32's I've ever heard, was one built with the extra V-discs material removed and they had forgotten to install what I think on the prints as part "F" the little airfoil looking wing thing at the driver hole. I think that little piece, while a pain in the but to make and install is the single most important piece in the cabinet. Don't forget it!!!

BobZ
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« Last Edit: 07/21/07 at 13:46:59 by ZYGI »  

All Decware amps and sources, Turning Point Audio speakers
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speakerfreak7
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Posts: 88
Re: WO32 construction: Part II
Reply #29 - 07/21/07 at 19:28:11
 
thanks for the quick reply zigy. so it is screwed down at the bottom of the box right.  what do u mean by the "moutnig plates" there will only be 2 cleats total right? is it glued down too?  on the construction notes for b it says "This panel should be moretised so that the woofer has a flush mount. The moretise should run 1/8th inch deeper than the thickness of the woofers fram and gasket. Than it says to use a sticky bead of moretite rope calk? that's placed inbetween the woofer and the panel to hold it together right? and does moretised mean the same a dado? and thanks for telling me to use the F brace. i was gonna leave it out. it's only gonna be 3/4" deep right? with one side tapered down. it seems like it will split easily since it is so small. should it be screwed or t nailed? thanks again. oh wow i just looked the plans fot the cleat again and i think i get it now! i was totally confused on the little drawing. optical illusion! and i noticed that th V at the botoom, the panels are placed on the outside of the lines rather than on the inside like the WO. y is that?
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« Last Edit: 07/21/07 at 19:31:35 by speakerfreak7 »  
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