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To say the least, the anticipation is building ... (Read 50895 times)
bassboy
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #225 - 05/01/06 at 15:44:59
 
As I mentioned before, playing with positioning can improve not only sensitivity but also frequency response.  I have a feeling that neither are going to be incredibly important to Randy, considering his taste in music and listening level.  I don't think his music goes really low and I don't think he's turning it up much.  I may be wrong...
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bassboy
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #226 - 05/01/06 at 15:58:56
 
But then there is the possibility of room reflections bouncing off the wall and being forced through the horn, as the throat is open to the room.  I don't know what effect that would have, it would probably be small but maybe facing the SO into the corner might be bad.  Who knows.  Not me.
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Randy in Caintuck
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #227 - 05/01/06 at 21:55:23
 
[quote author=DirtDawg  link=1139429263/210#217 date=1146453468]

Just like Dave, I gotta know. You will need weeks for the break-in and we all realize this, but the first watt question is just hangin' there. Please, throw us a bone! [/quote]

Howdy DD and Dave,

Where to begin ..... ???

To start with, as bassboy accurately observes, I did not have these speakers built for the same reason that many music lovers would want them.  Most of the music I enjoy is fairly simple acoustic stuff ..... with the occasional electric blues thrown in for a change of pace.  

What caught my attention at the 2005 DecFest was the incredible air and sense of the recording space that the SO Imperials added to the performance.  Make no mistake, if there is serious bass content in the music, the SOs will make it known.  I have a copy of Toccata and Fugue in D minor that Mike and I played while he was at the house ..... and even with 2 watts a channel it was pretty impressive.

But, back to the reason I had them built .....

Stand up acoustic bass simply sounds like stand up acoustic bass ..... and other "fundamental" instruments sound as they should, as well.

I recently bought a CD from CD Baby titled Brother Red -Kickin' It and cut #12 is a song called "Tears".  It's a Hammond organ, guitar, drum kit and vocals.  While "Mr. Red" is not the most polished vocalist in the world, he has great enthusiasm ..... and the sound of this cut with the Imperials in the system is the closest thing to a live performance I have ever heard.  The Hammond is growly, the vocals wonderfully 3-D and the cymbals sound real.  I was already impressed at how this sounded through the Parker Audio Behemoths, but the addition of the Imperials gave the same presentation on steroids.  The instruments and vocals were the correct size, but the ambience of the recording space removed the walls of my listening room.  Everything had a greater sense of palpability, as well.  Just to be sure, I disconnected the Imperials and returned to the listening seat.  Truthfully, there are no words that can describe the difference.

Mike remarked that he was most impressed with the range of dynamics with the Imperials hooked up ..... the effortless contrast between soft and loud as compared to other audio systems that he has heard.  Anyone who is an Eva Cassidy fan knows how she can go from a whisper to a wail ..... and the system now allows an appreciation of this that was not there before the addition of the Imperials.

Another thing that I find so incredible is the effect these speakers have on very simple music that seems to have no bass content.  At the DecFest, I was introduced to the music of Israel Kamakawiwo'ole ..... a huge, (recently deceased) Hawaiian man who played the Ukulele and had a voice like a bird.  I purchased the album "Alone in IZ World" and have been enjoying it immensely.  With the Imperials, it takes on a whole new scale because of the added sense of the recorded space.

As time passes, I will probably experiment with different placement ..... but I am enjoying the music too much to mess with it for now.

I haven't gotten around to trying it with the plate amp hooked up to the Imperials yet.  I can imagine that it will be interesting ..... but, again, what I am getting now is everything I could have hoped for ..... Smiley

No doubt, as the drivers break in, the sound will get even better ..... but if it never does, I don't care.

This whole situation makes me wonder what the smallest room would be that could benefit from one or two of these incredible speakers.  If someone knows the answer to that question, there might be a lot of plywood purchased in the months ahead by the owners of Decware amplifiers .....

Randy

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« Last Edit: 05/01/06 at 22:17:34 by Randy in Caintuck »  
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Lon
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #228 - 05/01/06 at 23:39:42
 
Randy, thanks for tantalizing us with some initial impressions.

I would want these for the same reason you do.  And I can imagine the great sound.  ENJOY!
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DirtDawg
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #229 - 05/02/06 at 00:32:05
 
Hey Randy,

What Lon said! Thanks, for the sneak preview.
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Steve Deckert
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If the 1st watt
sucks why continue?

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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #230 - 05/02/06 at 04:03:10
 
[quote author=bassboy  link=1139429263/225#226 date=1146495536]But then there is the possibility of room reflections bouncing off the wall and being forced through the horn, as the throat is open to the room.  I don't know what effect that would have, it would probably be small but maybe facing the SO into the corner might be bad.  Who knows.  Not me. [/quote]

actually sympathetic resonance is one of the issues this design addresses.  The Decware implementation of the original Imperials had that issue in my smallish studio/garage to the point where I seldom had to actually hook an amplifier to them.  They would add bass to anything playing in the room.

In the S.O. design, the woofer is in a sealed box isolated from the horn flare.  Both the mouth and the throat of the horn are exposed to the room.  This greatly reduces the sympathetic effect and makes it possible to use in smaller rooms.


Sound that enters the mouth of the horn simply nulls itself as it travels to the throat and exists bacdk into the room.  No pressure build up. And I think you will find that the resonance of the woofer excited by the same wavefront that entered the mouth is partially out of phase with what sound makes it backwards out of the throat adding further nulling to wave.

The horn flare is difficult to exite unless pressure is evenly developed at a right angle across the throat.  The only thing that can do that is the woofer.  The "carlson" shapped slot works nothing like a carlson horn.   I designed this slot to pre load the driver and move pressure evenly towards the throat.
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Steve Deckert
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If the 1st watt
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #231 - 05/02/06 at 04:25:14
 
BTW, Randy -

I've been enjoying your posts, especially the last one and pics of your new room.  I have to say that it is a real thrill designing cool audio gear when you can see the results repeated.  I'm very glad you like them.  I will have the plans available on the web site soon.

If we all take a big step back in time to when I first talked to you on the phone, can you imagine how crazy I would have sounded if I told you that 2 watts could drive a room full of speakers with a dynamic range and image exceeding - well almost everything...


I'm certain that if more people - people with no plans to buy more or different audio gear included - could hear this, their priorities would change on the spot.    And ironically while it may seem extreme I know people with speaker cables that cost more than this entire setup and regrettably their sound doesn't even come close.
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« Last Edit: 05/02/06 at 04:31:17 by Steve Deckert »  
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gexter
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #232 - 05/02/06 at 13:30:10
 
I am sold! but then I always was..
thanks Randy for your faithful and informative thread,
This design has captured me from the day I heard about it.
Well the corner horn too. the two designs I will never have but always want.

wonderful pictures, I really don't care if a couple are a little fuzzy.
You have no idea how enjoyable of a thread you have made.  :)
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Randy in Caintuck
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #233 - 05/02/06 at 15:31:38
 
[quote author=Steve Deckert  link=1139429263/225#231 date=1146540314]  I have to say that it is a real thrill designing cool audio gear when you can see the results repeated.  I'm very glad you like them.  I will have the plans available on the web site soon.

[/quote]

Steve,

I started this thread with these words .....

"Based on what I heard at the most recent DecFest, this will be the end of my audio journey ..... and I want to offer in advance my heartfelt gratitude to Steve Deckert and Bob (Zygi) for their help and inspiration in making these wonderful speakers available to the readers of this forum ....."

After hearing what these speakers have done for my system, I wish to repeat my gratitude.  I have to believe that anyone who can add the SO Imperials to their system will be thrilled with the results ..... Smiley

Best wishes,

Randy  

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change_out
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #234 - 05/02/06 at 17:38:15
 
I want to also say thank you to Steve and Bob. Seldom have I met such talented men who are so humble.

Yes, Steve my priorities changed on the spot from the moment I heard the Imperials. I did'nt want to audition any of the other gear, go to your room to hear your wonderful vinyl rig or really even do anything other than scheme out how to get a pair of these mighty speakers.

It was Friday night , at the fest, when Steve disconnected the plate amp from the Parker Crusader woofer and connected the Imperial to a single select. Randy was the first to his feet followed closely by myself. The output of sound was so enormous, not in volume but in width and depth, it was (as Randy describes) palpabale. All I could do was shake my head and change audio directions.

Many things can knock your socks off. Very few can suck the socks back on to your feet. The SO Imperials are most assuredly in the the later category!

Build them if you can or have them built-you will not be disappointed.

Tim

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jj420
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #235 - 05/02/06 at 22:31:39
 
I lurked this whole thread, and didnt say a thing...

I am still speechless, they are beautiful.

Thanks for the insiders view

JJ
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BIG_GEOFF
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #236 - 05/03/06 at 02:38:58
 
I have to say, those SO's are looking pretty sweet.  Looking really nice and finish.  Makes me want a pair, or maybe just one.  THats where im stuck, i have one imperial, and i want another one, and the SO is just soo tempting.   What do you guys think?  Add another imperial to the lot so i can ditch the mono and go stereo with a pair or stay mono and go with a SO to spice things up on the lower end?  Space is an issue so i can only go with one or the other for now.

-Geoff
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Rocket_Ronny
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #237 - 05/03/06 at 02:51:16
 
While I am sure they sound awesome, the WAF on those is very loowwwwww.

Steve, if you could capture 90 percent of what the Imperials do in a box that is at least 1/8 as big, then you would have something very marketable.

Only the hard core with dedicated rooms, and wives who are very accomidating, will end up going with those monsters.

Randy, better buy some roses and give a kiss to the miss, because she is one looonnnnggggg suffering woman.

Rocket_not ready to push the marriage that far_Ronny
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60ndown
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #238 - 05/03/06 at 02:59:56
 
[quote author=Rocket_Ronny  link=1139429263/225#237 date=1146621076]

Steve, if you could capture 90 percent of what the Imperials do in a box that is at least 1/8 as big, then you would have something very marketable.

[/quote]

wo32 4tw Grin
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Randy in Caintuck
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Re: To say the least, the anticipation is building
Reply #239 - 05/03/06 at 14:48:38
 
[quote author=Rocket_Ronny  link=1139429263/225#237 date=1146621076]While I am sure they sound awesome, the WAF on those is very loowwwwww.

Only the hard core with dedicated rooms, and wives who are very accomidating, will end up going with those monsters.

Randy, better buy some roses and give a kiss to the miss, because she is one looonnnnggggg suffering woman.

Rocket_not ready to push the marriage that far_Ronny [/quote]

Howdy Ron,

That is why I built a dedicated listening room in the basement ..... Smiley

Linda has the first and second floors of the house and I don't tell her how to decorate them ..... and I have my 16' x 26' space with the same courtesy from her.

She rarely comes into my lair and would rather be run over by a cement truck than sit and listen to music ..... Roll Eyes

However, my 24 year old daughter came over for a visit and a listening session and was duly impressed.  She thought that the room and the SO Imperials were "cool" ..... ???

That's my baby girl ..... Wink

Randy
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